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Offlinegeko127
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Growing Ephedra, -------->With pics.
    #5953144 - 08/11/06 06:40 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Helloo shroomers. :stoned:

Geko has been looking around but hasent realy seen anything worth while about growing ephedra plants.

Geko has only read that they like sandy well drained soil/dirt, So if there either grown or treated much in the sme way as bonzi tree's or a cactus, And ya can but growing media for bonzi tree's or a cactus(very grity/sandy), And once there going its would be almost imposible to kill them due to lack of water.

Geko can just picture the whole austrailn outback fully growing with ephedra,

(lol :laugh:, It would help stop soil erosion :grin:)


--------------------
LIFE IS A BITCH, AND THEN YOU MARRY ONE.

BUT SUCH IS LIFE !


Edited by geko127 (04/27/08 03:14 AM)


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OfflineSchwip
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: geko127]
    #5953165 - 08/11/06 07:27 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

My notes indicate that most Ephedras have similar growing conditions between the different specie.

They will thrive in Full Sun.....tolerate a bit of shade.

Sandy, well drained soil.

Cold tolerant up to zone 5 on the usada charts.

Which specie are you planning on growing?


--------------------
--------------------------------

" If the sky were to suddenly open up there would be no law. There would be no rule. There would only be you and your memories... the choices you've made, and the people you've touched. If this world were to end there would only be you and him and no-one else. "

..............

"MAN! You know there aint no such thing as left over crack!"



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InvisibleStroFun
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Re: Growing Ephedra *DELETED* [Re: Schwip]
    #5953226 - 08/11/06 08:06 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Post deleted by StroFun

Reason for deletion: Certain moderators/admins are responsible for me removing any inkling of a legit contribution...



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InvisibleEbb
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: StroFun]
    #5954403 - 08/11/06 04:37 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

it grows fine on ridges above central valleys where its very hot and good elevation


--------------------
I'm not foreign so don't hang up on me.
:crankey:


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Offlinegeko127
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: Ebb]
    #5955538 - 08/12/06 02:07 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Dosent it get fucking balls cold in the desert at night.

And what about just growing in big pots, Because geko is in an appartment, And fuck planting uot in the bush or some shit just to die from the elements.

But just starting them off to begin with is becoming a mission to find out about.

Geko was thinking of a mixture of Desert Sand, a small amount of good quality poting mix, And maybee a small amount of perlite or vermiclite aswell.
What do ya's think.


--------------------
LIFE IS A BITCH, AND THEN YOU MARRY ONE.

BUT SUCH IS LIFE !


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InvisibleEbb
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: geko127]
    #5955584 - 08/12/06 03:06 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

mix 2 parts sand with 1 part soil, and start your ephedra in that. I believe erowid states to start them in the early spring. when they get older they can be transplanted into a mix of loose soil and rocks. from what I understand, it would be like a hillside, where there was some erosion and it piled little bits of dried dirt and rock. loose with good drainage, and lots of rock to conquere!  :minigun:


--------------------
I'm not foreign so don't hang up on me.
:crankey:


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Offlinegeko127
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: Ebb]
    #5955621 - 08/12/06 03:29 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

What about nutrients, Geko was thinken some type of Hydroponic salution to start them and them progress with a time release fertiliser after there estabished.

And what about raising them under lighting, Because spring isent to far away hear so then they could be planted/transferd to larger out door pots or trays.

How big do the root system's get on ephedra plants roughly, OHH yea its Ephedra Nevadasis that geko will be growing, (or trying to grow).


--------------------
LIFE IS A BITCH, AND THEN YOU MARRY ONE.

BUT SUCH IS LIFE !


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Offlinengnyus
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: geko127]
    #5956742 - 08/12/06 02:20 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Sprout them in a standard mini greenhouse, they will grow ok throughthe winter under standard floure3scent lighting as long as you don't overwater, and give them plenty of sun in the spring, works for me!


--------------------

You reap what you sow


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Offlinegeko127
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: ngnyus]
    #5958356 - 08/13/06 02:34 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Is there any spical thing to do like.
Soak th seeds in water over night.
Or do the seeds have to be planted a certin way like dope plant seeds are.
They do sound like a hardy plant once there growing.


--------------------
LIFE IS A BITCH, AND THEN YOU MARRY ONE.

BUT SUCH IS LIFE !


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Offlinengnyus
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: geko127]
    #5959204 - 08/13/06 01:32 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

I just planted them and kept the soil moist, but they took like a month to sprout.


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OfflineCptnGarden
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: geko127]
    #5959299 - 08/13/06 02:03 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

geko127 said:
Is there any spical thing to do like.
Soak th seeds in water over night.
Or do the seeds have to be planted a certin way like dope plant seeds are.
They do sound like a hardy plant once there growing.




you mean paper towel germination? I dont understand why ppl do this, ive lost hundreds of seedlings this way to stress, I just put my ganja in the soil and give a little water and they pop up in 3 days on their own.


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Invisibleshamantra
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: CptnGarden]
    #5959344 - 08/13/06 02:13 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Ephedra seeds germinate better if you soak them in hot water a few hours before planting them in a sand\soil mix, have the pots in a warm place. that was the advice given to me on shaman australis at least, I have germinated e. sinica and e. viridis this way and both spouted just fine


--------------------
note: english is my 3rd languange, please ignore misspelling and poor english, im doing my best :smile:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ug98TKkWKy0


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Offlinegeko127
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: shamantra]
    #5961421 - 08/14/06 12:57 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

How long did they take to sprout shamantra.

And seeing as were coming out of winter into spring, This would be the right time to plant them out.
Geko went and bought some cactus poting mix witch should sufice for all 6 of them.


--------------------
LIFE IS A BITCH, AND THEN YOU MARRY ONE.

BUT SUCH IS LIFE !


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Invisibleshamantra
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: geko127]
    #5961721 - 08/14/06 03:22 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

the first sprouts vame after a little after 2 weeks and kept coming for another 3 weeks so it can take anything between 2-5 weeks.


--------------------
note: english is my 3rd languange, please ignore misspelling and poor english, im doing my best :smile:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ug98TKkWKy0


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Offlinegeko127
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: shamantra]
    #5965347 - 08/15/06 07:31 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Ok geko went and soaked the ephedra seeds for a day and planted them in some of the cactus poting mix, And waterd them in.

On a side note, The seeds did feel softer and spongey after soaking them.
And geko is thinking of the future hear when it comes to buying some ephedra for what ever reaseon, COUGH COUGH Sniffel LOL.

But seing as the seeds came from a cool shroomer, There shouldent be any problems wit viabilty.
So now its back to the fucking waiting game for 3 fucking years, Untill there big enough to harvest and get alllllll them goodies out.


--------------------
LIFE IS A BITCH, AND THEN YOU MARRY ONE.

BUT SUCH IS LIFE !


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OfflineSchwip
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: geko127]
    #5965569 - 08/15/06 09:53 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

how does geko plan on removing the goodies? (if i may ask)

going for pure crytals or just crude?


--------------------
--------------------------------

" If the sky were to suddenly open up there would be no law. There would be no rule. There would only be you and your memories... the choices you've made, and the people you've touched. If this world were to end there would only be you and him and no-one else. "

..............

"MAN! You know there aint no such thing as left over crack!"



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Offlinegeko127
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: Schwip]
    #5967234 - 08/15/06 07:15 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Schwip said:
how does geko plan on removing the goodies? (if i may ask)

going for pure crytals or just crude?




Well yes Swiyou may ask :tongue:

First geko will dream of doing an ethanol extraction to gain crude goodies and the proceed with this,All of this writeup has been copyed from WD, AKA wet dreams, And can be found hear at this link, But ya might have to be a member to read the fourms :rolleyes:
http://www.wetdreams.ws :crazy2:


Annotation: The material contained herein is merely for informational purpose and is not to be

carried out unless written permission from local law enforcement is gained. The author takes NO

responsibility for what one does with this information. Before even reading the procedure below,

check with your local/state/national government to ensure that the law is not being broken.



So my friends, this will be SWIMethLab's touching-up for several personal reasons. That does not mean that SWIMethLab will not be around to check what's up with the kidz.

This work deals with the solvent extraction of fortified ephedra extract and following reduction to methamphetamine hydrochloride via 57% w/w hydriodic acid p.a. and 50% w/w hypophosphorous acid (H3PO2) as recycling agent in a long wet reflux session.

===========================================================================================

Let's start with the preparation of the alkaline aqueous solution for the extraction. For the extraction of 200g ephedra (which is said to contain 10% alkaloids) there has been prepared a solution of 1200-1250ml water which contain:

180g NaOH p.a.
60-70g Na2CO3
100-120g NaCl


The following pictures show the preparation of this solution on the hotplate with good magnetic stirring:





To this solution 200g of herbal ephedra extract have been added in smaller portions under magnetic stirring. Of course, after the aqueous solution has cleared up:





This mixture has been stirred untill it cooled down to room temperature while a seperatory funnel of appropriate size has been setted up:





Afterwards the ugly mixture has been transfered into the seperatory funnel and 250ml of TCM aka chloroform has been added.

Side Note for those having actually no access to chloroform:
"The first industrial process was the reaction of acetone (or ethanol) with sodium hypochlorite or calcium hypochlorite. The chloroform can be removed from the resulting sodium acetate or calcium acetate (or sodium formate or calcium formate if ethanol is the starting material) by distillation. The reaction mechanism is called haloform reaction, and is still used for the production of bromoform and iodoform."
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chloroform)

Looks like this:




Afterwards the aqueous solution has been extracted twice with TCM. The second pull used 150ml chloroform and the third on additional 100ml. One should think about recycling the solvent after the whole procedure with the help of distillation.

But you need to have patience for this extraction process because it lasts a while untill the layers seperated totally after shaking the solution not too gentle. This shaking is necessary because freebase ephedrine tends to dissolve in water well.

After all three pulls are finished they should be combined in the sep. funnel again.





Here you see the situation as it looks like after about 60-70ml of a 5-6% w/w Na2CO3 solution has been added. This solution is very effective in washing out some of the plant trash. So shake the shit like your life depends on it and don't forget the bottom layer is what you want. This step is going to be repeated once more. You will probably see something like this:





So at this time there should be at least three washes with distilled water each with about 50ml.

After those washes make sure to separate the non polar layer as good as possible from the aqueous layer and put it into a beaker. To this solution one has to add a little bit of dry K2CO3 or MgSO4 as drying agent. But the first one is prefered for amines. After you mixed it a little bit you should notice that the solution becomes clear. Good. So wait about 15-20 minutes befor you filter this solution by the way of choice.

============================================================================================

The now dry non polar solution is transfered into a beaker or something similar. While the stuff dryed you should set up a HCl gas generator of your choice. For SWIMethLab an apparatus working with H2SO4 is the first choice. But also HCl with CaCl2 should do the job.

This could look like this:





And after one gassed it could look like this:





So now it is time to filter again by vakuum as far as it is available. After the filtration by suction with a little bit more than one 200g extract one gets something like this:





Ah and don't forget to wash the now extracted alkaloids with fresh & dry acetone while it is still in the Buchner.

This stuff should be recrystallized at least one time in methanol and acetone or ethanol & tone. Afterwards one will see something like this:





============================================================================================

After a few days of work one ends up perhaps with 45g of ephedrine hydrochloride which crys for reduction. Hmmm... So after a few calculations with the Hi spreadsheet which is mentioned in several threads here at the board, one figured out that it is a good idea to use about 90ml of 57% w/w HI and 36,9ml of 50% w/w H3PO2 to react that shit in an apparatus that looks like this:





Or a little bit closer:





This is allowed to run at about 120-125°C for 24-36 hours after which this thread is to bee continued!

So far, have fun...


EDITED:
A few interesting threads related to the topic in some ways...

HardCore discussion on ratios...

Similar to the thread above but not the same at all

Various extraction methodes of the so loved herb


[ Edited by: C_C_C on Jul 28 2006 07:25:05 AM ]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  C_C_C's sig 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Only those knowing of the past, will have a FUTURE...


--------------------
LIFE IS A BITCH, AND THEN YOU MARRY ONE.

BUT SUCH IS LIFE !


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OfflineSchwip
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: geko127]
    #5967645 - 08/15/06 09:09 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

two words

steam distillation.


--------------------
--------------------------------

" If the sky were to suddenly open up there would be no law. There would be no rule. There would only be you and your memories... the choices you've made, and the people you've touched. If this world were to end there would only be you and him and no-one else. "

..............

"MAN! You know there aint no such thing as left over crack!"



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Offlinegeko127
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: Schwip]
    #5968767 - 08/16/06 06:38 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Nooo nooo noooo, This is much better.

Ephedra alkaloids are in a natural freebase form in the plant metrial.
So if ya steam distill ephedra then ya would have to proceed with a fractionl distilation just to get the (yea you know what gego is typing about) goodies out.
The genius about this method is that 100% of the alkaloids are extracted and the yeild is fucking exelent.
It may involve some solvents, but then again not every shroomer has distilation equipment(proper shit)true.

Geko did see the pics of all of the write up and fuucckkkkk, Thats some holy shit fucking hell there big crystals.

So the proof is in the pics.


--------------------
LIFE IS A BITCH, AND THEN YOU MARRY ONE.

BUT SUCH IS LIFE !


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Offlinegeko127
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: geko127]
    #8186096 - 03/24/08 05:40 AM (15 years, 10 months ago)

:confused:Well fuck me right, This ephedra ban is bull shit :mad2:

But what the fuck can ya do about it:rolleyes:besides grow some :confused:

So far geko has looked around and hasent see fuck all growing information on growing the plant, Besides the usal bla bla bla likes well drained soil, full sun, and all theusal info on it.

And thats just it !

Its all the same information :confused:Well not the same but along the same lines :rolleyes:, Actuly it is most of tthe same information :confused:, Just worded diffrent that s all.:eek:

So now geko is turning to the community to see if there are any ephedra growing fans around the way.:crazy2:

How else could this plant survive with out a little help :rolleyes:
And a few years till a plant is worth taking trimmings off of :eek:

There must be better ways of growing it besides the usal, FFs growing weed gets them growing faster

Sorry if that was a bit dirrect, But as was mentioned it all the same information.


--------------------
LIFE IS A BITCH, AND THEN YOU MARRY ONE.

BUT SUCH IS LIFE !


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OfflineC_T
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: geko127]
    #8190677 - 03/25/08 08:56 AM (15 years, 10 months ago)

Nearly 2yrs between posts... You should have a handle on it by now?


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Offlinegeko127
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: C_T]
    #8197659 - 03/26/08 05:28 PM (15 years, 10 months ago)

well they are a tempremental plant :confused:


--------------------
LIFE IS A BITCH, AND THEN YOU MARRY ONE.

BUT SUCH IS LIFE !


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Offlinegeko127
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Re: Growing Ephedra [Re: geko127]
    #8332394 - 04/26/08 09:52 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

With A Pic :cool:

Hears an ephedra plant that geko that must be around 6 months old :cool:
[image]http://www.shroomery.org/forums/files/08-17/926813883-Picture_1.jpg][/image]Farken Update [image]http://www.shroomery.org/forums/files/08-17/926813876-Picture_2.jpg][/image]

Sorry about the crappy pic


--------------------
LIFE IS A BITCH, AND THEN YOU MARRY ONE.

BUT SUCH IS LIFE !


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