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OfflineLOBO
Vagabond

Registered: 03/19/01
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Mind meld, anyone?
    #592626 - 03/29/02 09:35 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I dreamed that I consumed 4 g of cubies and 3 g of Syrian rue with a friend.
At one point of the trip I loss total sense of boundaries, my friend was inside of me or me inside of him, or we have become one entity, I had this dream several times with my wife, and the thing is that we all remember the experience the same way, I can't express in words how amazing this experience is, I wonder if any of you dreamers felt the same


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OfflineTannis
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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: LOBO]
    #592670 - 03/29/02 11:01 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I've had the experience while awake where I connect with another person's energy and can actually feel what they are feeling in their emotions and body.....this usually occurs when I am healing or protecting someone, or at times when I am banishing a troublesome spirit.......
It's like the two of us mixing and becoming the same person yet we completely remain two people who are "sharing each other".......


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero

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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: LOBO]
    #592720 - 03/29/02 12:13 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

People that consume rue often describe a telepathic like feeling. One of the early names for harmine or harmaline (the active alkaloids inside rue) had telepathy in the name before they figured out it had already been named by somebody else.


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Just another spore in the wind.


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: Seuss]
    #592883 - 03/29/02 03:56 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

In Huston's book "Cleansing the Doors of Perception", he describes his experience in the "Good Friday Experiment" where half of the seminary students were given psilocybin and half were given a placebo. While coming up on the psychedelic, he turned to a fellow student of whom he was sure was tripping as well, and said "Isn't this amazing?" The student to whom he made this comment had received the placebo and was not tripping.

So much for empathy / telepathy. Perception, misperception, who knows? Without a controlled test (I know everyone tires of this statement) we will have the same discussion 30 years hence and none will be the wiser. Anecdotes are interesting, but in and of themselves say very little.


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The proof is in the pudding.


Edited by Swami (03/31/02 01:44 PM)


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Anonymous

Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: Swami]
    #592961 - 03/29/02 05:48 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I am willing to take part in tests. It would be interesting, I think the subjects should be
people who believe telepathy could be accomplished so there wouldn't be any psychological
predispositions against it being possible. Skeptics and agnostics could monitor and control
the experiments.


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OfflineLOBO
Vagabond

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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: Swami]
    #593456 - 03/30/02 07:51 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I am not interested in control test or to scientifically validate the experience I just want to know if anyone experience what I did.
If you haven't experienced "mind meld" to give it a name I frankly don't know why you have to make a comment that denies it.


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OfflineTannis
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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: Swami]
    #593728 - 03/30/02 03:51 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I think you're right Swami, we will have this discussion 30 years from now ......but I'll add that I believe we will have it even if we could "prove" its existence.......differences in personalities I mean.....

I'm not interested in "proving" the existence of such.....I just want to help people and I've seen this happen.....
I can't possiblly take what I have experienced and prove it scientificially......I know what "I" experienced and I'm willing to share it with others......if this sharing helps them.......but to prove this exists is beyond me......I experience things every day that I can not explain but which provide me with accurate information that is useful to me and to others.......these come to me as "feelings" or as a "sense" of something......
How I actually can "feel" a pain in another person's body is something I don't fully understand. Could we line up ten people with only one person having a pain---and could I sense this? I don't know. But I believe there is more at work here than what we can produce in a lab. The people I help are people who are reaching out and who want help. That definitely seems to make some kind of connection.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: LOBO]
    #593793 - 03/30/02 05:24 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I am not interested in control test or to scientifically validate the experience
I have no interest in your lack of interest.

I just want to know if anyone experience what I did.
Yes, Huston did and found it to be misperception. Huston ONLY wrote one of the best-selling books about religion ever and was one of the psychedelic pioneers, right up there with Leary, Mentzer and Alpert. So his observations have no substance?

...I frankly don't know why you have to make a comment that denies it.
No one "has to" make a comment pro or con, but this is a free-form discussion.

For all the Swami detractors here, I do NOT tell people what they can or can't post, yet this is about the hundreth time that I have been censured. Why are the believers in esoterica so petrified of free-thinking?


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The proof is in the pudding.


Edited by Swami (03/30/02 05:45 PM)


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: Tannis]
    #593805 - 03/30/02 05:41 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I think you're right Swami, we will have this discussion 30 years from now ......but I'll add that I believe we will have it even if we could "prove" its existence.......differences in personalities I mean.....
Because we MAY have this discussion even if tested, therefore validation is worthless? Your logic escapes me.

I'm not interested in "proving" the existence of such...
So what? Many people would love to see just one mystical concept concretized. You have no interest because you have no curiosity or because you are afraid you will find your concepts to be vaporware?

I just want to help people and I've seen this happen.....
And there is ZERO possibility that you are making incorrect assumptions?

I can't possiblly take what I have experienced and prove it scientificially......I know what "I" experienced and I'm willing to share it with others......if this sharing helps them.......but to prove this exists is beyond me......I experience things every day that I can not explain but which provide me with accurate information that is useful to me and to others.......these come to me as "feelings" or as a "sense" of something......
I lived in Las Vegas for years. Most every gambler is superstitious and plays on their feelings. Their "feelings" funded the Paris, the Billagio, the Mirage, etc. etc. Are their feelings less valid than yours?

Could we line up ten people with only one person having a pain---and could I sense this? I don't know.
How can you not know, if your feelings are authentic?

But I believe there is more at work here than what we can produce in a lab.
Why would a valid phenomena not stand up to scrutiny? A lab? That word has connotations to it. How about someone's living room?

The people I help are people who are reaching out and who want help. That definitely seems to make some kind of connection.
Yes that type of connection works all the time, even when nothing is really happening. This is how fraudulent psychics make a living.



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The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: Swami]
    #593812 - 03/30/02 05:52 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Why are the believers in esoterica so petrified of free-thinking?

Because it is the IMAGE of free-thinking that is so desirable. Whatever image they initially percieved as being free-thinking (usually something in direct opposition with what they were raised to think) is what they are now trying to achieve. It's like brand recognition: Hippies wear tie-dye, punks wear studded clothing, jocks wear the latest sports shoe, ravers wear baggy jeans that could fit an extra person inside each leg, rednecks wear wrangler's, gangsta's? wear fubu or some other "thug" outerwear, burnouts wear plaid, and so on. The only difference in here is that instead of genre-specific clothing, we have genre-specific thinking...

"Free-thinker" conversation includes: astral projection, aliens, meditation (which is somewhat unfortunate, as this has much usefulness), hmm.. oh yeah, Terrance Mckenna-like "visions" (you know- reptiles, elves, ten-foot bunny rabbits and the like), telepathy, ideas ripped-off from eastern mysticism, religious alternatives to Christianity (and the other abrahamic faiths), blah blah blah....


Before any of you try to lay into me, think about it for awhile. Are you unconsciously grasping onto an IMAGE of free-thinking because you are afraid of the uncertainties that come with real free-thinking?


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: Sclorch]
    #593821 - 03/30/02 06:04 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

...burnouts wear plaid, and so on.
*In a whiney voice* But I like my lumberjack shirt...


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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineLOBO
Vagabond

Registered: 03/19/01
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Last seen: 11 years, 2 months
Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: Swami]
    #594318 - 03/31/02 07:44 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

"Yes, Huston did and found it to be misperception. Huston ONLY wrote one of the best-selling books about religion ever and was one of the psychedelic pioneers, right up there with Leary, Mentzer and Alpert. So his observations have no substance? "

Are you Huston, Leary, mentzer or Alpet? No If they were to give me a comment I will respect that because they did some research on the subject, but you did not even experience what I did so you are talking from some one else?s mouth.
My post was simple I wanted to know if any one experience the same thing that?s it.
And yes this is a free form-discussion, and I am just pointing out that you are making a comment not from your personal experience but from some one else?s.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: LOBO]
    #594556 - 03/31/02 02:01 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I am just pointing out that you are making a comment not from your personal experience but from some one else?s.
I did make a comment about the [lack of] authenticity of feelings from personal observation.

In three decades of psychedelic exploration, I have had more than a few mind-blowing experiences with other people. Yet, as amazing as they were, I believe them to all be internal states and not indicative of some mystical union with another human being. I backed up that observation with an indirect quote from Huston.

Self delusion is a popular passtime. I had a male friend who was all hot for this woman. He was sure that had made some initial connection. Turned out that she was a lesbian and had no interest in my friend. Misperception and fantasy abound in us all. Feelings, no matter how powerful, are only indicative of our chemical / emotional state, not outward reality.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: Swami]
    #594605 - 03/31/02 03:08 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I believe them to all be internal states...
Yep.
He was sure that he had made some initial connection. Turned out that she was a lesbian...
This has happened to a comrade of mine. Also, a mild version of this happened to me... thank god I didn't make a fool of myself before I realized the truth, that would have sucked. Ever since, I take my instincts with a grain of salt.


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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OfflineLOBO
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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: Swami]
    #595236 - 04/01/02 07:25 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

First if you read my initial post I made no clamed that this was a spiritual or mystic, or telepathic phenomena.
I called mind meld because of lack other word.
Second, I only describe my experience, and wanted to know if any one else had this experience, more clearly could not be.
The rest you are adding to it.
And for last I am not trying to convince or prove to you or anyone else for that matter anything.
Peace.


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OfflineTannis
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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: LOBO]
    #595255 - 04/01/02 08:20 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks for saying that out rightly......
What I attempted to share in my posts was that...." yes I have had a similar experience and it has occurred even while not tripping and on a regular basis....."
I had hoped that the information I provided would be helpful to you and might give you some ideas of where look for more information........
As usual though, it seems that the information stream starts to turn into an arguement where its implied that you didn't experience what you know you experienced......


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OfflineTannis
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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: Swami]
    #595260 - 04/01/02 08:28 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

All I'm going to respond to is......I'm not a psychic.....I don't seek to bring people under my control.....I'm not "fraudulent".......I don't charge people money for services........I don't understand everything that occurs in my life.....and I try to share my experiences with others in hopes of assisting them in their lives.
Have a nice life.......


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: Tannis]
    #595295 - 04/01/02 09:33 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I'm not a psychic.....I don't seek to bring people under my control.....I'm not "fraudulent...
And nowhere in my post did I say that you were.

Basically people who want to believe in some healer or advisor will think that they are getting something out of it, whether or not the advisor had any real insight or wisdom. This is a fact. It is called self delusion.

I merely ask the same question over and over again. After 500 posts, I still cannot get a straight answer. How does one know if one is having an "authentic" experience?

A feeling is insufficent validation as it has been shown to be a faulty measuring device.

Have a nice life.......
Very sincere.



--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: LOBO]
    #595300 - 04/01/02 09:45 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I wonder if any of you dreamers felt the same
Seeks validation...

I am not interested to ... validate the experience
Rejects validation...

Whatever.

I only describe my experience, and wanted to know if any one else had this experience, more clearly could not be.
And I responded directly to your question by providing an experience that someone else had (Huston) where he thought his mind was linked with a fellow tripper. And he admitted that he was wrong in his assessment. More clearly could not be.

Seems your difficulty with me is that I don't agree with your conclusion rather than me being off track in my response.


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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineInsomniac
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Re: Mind meld, anyone? [Re: Swami]
    #596187 - 04/02/02 07:03 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

In reply to:

I merely ask the same question over and over again. After 500 posts, I still cannot get a straight answer. How does one know if one is having an "authentic" experience?




Woah! This is uncanny... a few hours ago me and a friend were expressing various thoughts on life and at one point I happened to ask that very same question. From reading your other posts I'm fairly sure I understand where you're coming from on this whole 'delusion' thing, and I even agree with you on many of your points, but I came up with a theory tonight.

If someone is deluding themselves than that would mean that there is some sort of ultimate truth that exists out there that they are ignorant of. Now let's for a second put this idea of an ultimate truth aside and say that we are absolutely FREE beings that just HAPPEN to be here (not for any specific reason) taking part in this phenomenon we call existence. Since ultimately we all create our own model of this existence through our subjective experiences, and since (as stated earlier) we are absolutely free, wouldn't that mean that we are free to choose to experience this life in any way that we feel is possible?

Remember this is just a theory so please treat it as such.


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Amazon Shop: Aldous Huxley, Syrian Rue, Terrence McKenna, The Doors

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