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Clean
the lense


Registered: 05/11/03
Posts: 2,374
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Re: How 9/11 was set up by the US Government [Re: QuantumMeltdown]
#5922328 - 08/01/06 04:03 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
QuantumMeltdown said: so its either your a Bush lover and believe it was terrorists who did it or your a Dem who thinks it was the govt.
Who are these mysterious Dems you speak of? The vast majority of Democratic state reps. won't touch 9-11. If they do invoke it in speach they' re either parroting the Bush version of events, or trying to win favor with someone.
And you're denying election fraud? do you ever read news?
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Prisoner#1
Even Dumber ThanAdvertized!


Registered: 01/22/03
Posts: 193,665
Loc: Pvt. Pubfag NutSuck
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Re: How 9/11 was set up by the US Government [Re: Irradiated_Feces]
#5922333 - 08/01/06 04:04 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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the actual even had little to no effect on me, the subsequent legislation has a lasting effect
also tied into the debate should be the illegal immigrant debates, with 30 million curretly residing here from more than 40 countries, I think theres a porousity problem with the borders, how would we stop the next 'terrorist' attack if we invite them in so freely
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Silversoul
Rhizome


Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
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Re: How 9/11 was set up by the US Government [Re: QuantumMeltdown]
#5922334 - 08/01/06 04:05 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
QuantumMeltdown said: We are very polarized right now politically as a country and the democratic party doesn't have many moderates with much popularity left so its either your a Bush lover and believe it was terrorists who did it or your a Dem who thinks it was the govt.
WTF? Name one Democratic senator who endorses the theory that the government was behind it.
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Prisoner#1
Even Dumber ThanAdvertized!


Registered: 01/22/03
Posts: 193,665
Loc: Pvt. Pubfag NutSuck
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Re: How 9/11 was set up by the US Government [Re: Clean]
#5922339 - 08/01/06 04:07 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Clean said: And you're denying election fraud?
there are elections?
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QuantumMeltdown
Space Monkey



Registered: 10/31/01
Posts: 4,962
Loc: Ft. Lauderdale, FL
Last seen: 5 months, 10 days
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Re: How 9/11 was set up by the US Government [Re: Silversoul]
#5922359 - 08/01/06 04:22 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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I wasn't really talking about the Dems in office right now but more of the Micheal Moores and Howard Deans, who have alot of influence over young people and get them to vote for the demorcratic ticket. These kind of people scare away alot of moderate democrats maybe their voting the other way isntead or voting independant.
-------------------- -QuantumMeltdown Total abstinence is so excellent a thing that it cannot be carried to too great an extent. In my passion for it I even carry it so far as to totally abstain from total abstinence itself. -Mark Twain "The time has come the walrus said, little oysters hide their heads, my Twain of thought is loosely bound I guess its time to Mark this down, Be good and you will be lonesome Be lonesome and you will be free Live a lie and you will live to regret it That's what livin' is to me That's what livin' is to me" Jimmy Buffett
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Silversoul
Rhizome


Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
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Re: How 9/11 was set up by the US Government [Re: QuantumMeltdown]
#5922375 - 08/01/06 04:32 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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To my knowledge, Micheal Moore has not officially endorsed the idea of government complicity in 9/11. He seems to be more big on the idea that it was incompetence, or that they were covering for the Saudis. And all Howard Dean has said on the matter is that he finds the theory "interesting." Even Noam Chomsky has distanced himself from the conspiracy theorists.
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p0ng
Stranger
Registered: 11/08/05
Posts: 435
Last seen: 6 years, 11 months
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Re: How 9/11 was set up by the US Government [Re: Silversoul]
#5922473 - 08/01/06 05:05 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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that website (in 2nd post) says there is no proof of interviews.... here is an hour of interviews with the professionals and experts.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1375208054676470714&q=loose+change
-------------------- Co-President of http://www.FantomFitness.com
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Viveka
refutation bias


Registered: 10/21/02
Posts: 4,061
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
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Re: How 9/11 was set up by the US Government [Re: Silversoul]
#5925081 - 08/02/06 11:21 AM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
It can't explain why WTC7 was the first steel-frame building in history to completely collapse by fire alone, and at free-fall speed, no less.
Fire alone?
http://www.wtc7.net/docs/June2004WTC7_Page_16_cropped.jpg
You'll have to copy and paste that link or it goes somehere else for some reason.
Edited by Viveka (08/02/06 11:29 AM)
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Silversoul
Rhizome


Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
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Re: How 9/11 was set up by the US Government [Re: Viveka]
#5925304 - 08/02/06 12:38 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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Even with that corner damage, it doesn't explain the way it fell. If that weakened it enough to make it fall(not likely), it should have fallen on its side, not straight down.
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Viveka
refutation bias


Registered: 10/21/02
Posts: 4,061
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
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Re: How 9/11 was set up by the US Government [Re: Silversoul]
#5925366 - 08/02/06 01:00 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Even with that corner damage, it doesn't explain the way it fell.
And you base that on...what exactly?
Quote:
If that weakened it enough to make it fall(not likely)
And you know this is not likely...how?
Quote:
it should have fallen on its side, not straight down.
"Conspiracy sites like to bring up the 'Symmetric Collapse' of building 7 and that the building should have fallen over to the south. They show grainy, dark photos of debris piles which were taken well after 9/11 and a debris pile with a grayish, smoky image of building 7 in the background. They deceptively show the north side which was relatively free of damage. As if the Tower should have reached over to the other side of the building and damaged that side to.
Here is what the debris pile looked like just after 9/11
Eerily, the north face is on the debris pile as if a shroud were laid gently over the dead building. It fell over after the majority of the building fell. This indicates the south side of the building fell before the north. It's almost as if the buildings last words were "[This] did it!..".
And now comes the most important and telling fact in this photo. Note the west side (Right side in this photo) of the north face is pointing toward the east side (Left side of this photo) where the penthouse was. What caused this? It would not be unreasonable to expect the building to fall toward the path of least resistance. The path of least resistance in this case would be the hole in the back of the building and the hole left by the penthouse. Since the penthouse was on the east and the 20 story hole in the middle, that would make the east and middle the path of least resistance. The conspiracy sites agree with this theory but say it never happened. They say the fact that it didn't happen helps prove controlled demolition. But you see it happen here... What will they say now?
"But the building doesn't look like it fell over, it fell "In it's own foot print" you might ask. That's because it is impossible for a 47 story steel building to fall over like that. It's not a small steel reinforced concrete building like the ones shown as *Examples* of buildings which fell over. Building 7 is more like the towers, made up of many pieces put together. It's not so much as a solid block as those steel reinforced concrete buildings.
This evidence supports the NIST contention that the building collapse progressed from the penthouse out as columns weakened by the fires. The slow sinking of the penthouses, indicating the internal collapse of the building behind the visible north wall, took 8.2 seconds according to a NIST preliminary report. Seismograph trace of the collapse of WTC 7 indicates that parts of the building were hitting the ground for 18 seconds. This means the collapse took at least 18 seconds, of which only the last approximately 15 seconds are visible in videos: 8 seconds for the penthouses and 7 seconds for the north wall to come down.
In the following image the east penthouse falls...
Now the west penthouse falls...
To put it simply, the building DID fall over backward and to the south-east. Just not like a steel reinforced concrete building would. Another telling photo is this one taken closer to the event date.
Note just past building 7 is a small amount of debris on the white building behind it. That building is to the north east corner of building 7. Note about 1/3rd of the east side of the building falling to the north in the photo below.
This suggests the building was split by the penthouse collapses most of the way down. One section went to the south-east while a smaller section went to the north. It wasn't that symmetrical.
Below are snapshots from a video taken from the northeast of Building 7 just as it collapses. Note that it has just begun to collapse and it is already tilting to the south.
Half way through and it's still tilted to the south. Note the west side of the building has come away from the west face around what used to be the 43rd floor. Light can be seen through the east face windows
Note the angle to the south has increased and so has the space between the west face and the rest of the building. The west face later lays on the Verizon building to the west. While it looks like it's about to hit the ground, it's still almost as high as the white building to the right. That makes it about 20 stories.
If the majority of the building fell to the south-east based on the resulting debris locations, as conspiracy theorist point out, it is evidence for a normal collapse by fire. I think they're right."
http://www.debunking911.com/pull.htm
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