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HELLA_TIGHT
Madge the Smoking Vag


Registered: 08/19/03
Posts: 84,387
Loc: Afghanistan
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Re: Fat Americans [Re: Asante]
#5912044 - 07/29/06 01:17 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: Once you have been too fat for long enough it will become the weight tour body tries to achieve, its like a rubber band: stretch it for long enough and it wont shrink back to the small size it was because the stretching broke it.
So whos fault was it for getting fat in the first place?
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,795
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Quote:
The American Heart Association says: . although weight loss can be accomplished over short intervals, long-lasting effects are difficult to sustain. This is not really a failure per se, but it does relate to the important fact that once the overweight/obese condition has been in place for years, the brain regulates your metabolism around this weight (body fat) and tries to defend it against permanent reduction. This type of biological regulation may have been advantageous during periods in history when food was less available.
The AHA can do nothing but say "try, try, and try again". And they should say that. But the bottom line, by their own admission, is that once you have been fat enough for long enough, your body will do everything in its power to return to that obese weight and it will keep on doing it until your so-called willpower and all the beautiful motivations you have, will crumble to dust.
You cannot "turn off" genetic obesity. You can only suppress it, but suppress it you must until the day you die.
My bloodline was obese in the 1900s, the 1800s and probably in the centuries before that. Hopefully not anymore in 2100, but then it will be by medical intervention, because in some people, like my family, it is in fact a disease.
Read between the lines people!
Quote:
MayoClinic.com says: . The good news is that even a modest weight loss can bring health improvements. In many cases, you can accomplish this by eating healthier, exercising and changing behaviors. For people who don't respond to lifestyle changes, prescription medications and surgical techniques are available to enhance the weight-loss process.
Source
The BAD news is, if you read between the lines, that NOT ALL CASES can accomplish this "by eating healthier, exercising and changing behaviors", and for those poor individuals who cannot keep weight off this way there is stuff like amphetamine pills and stapling your stomach shut so that you can't even eat the amount of veggies the American Heart Association says you need.
Diet pills only work for a few people or else every obese person out there would be on them, and be obese no more.
As for surgery: google the treatments that are available, read the reports of people who had this done years ago, and ask yourself whether you yourself would want to do this if you were in that position.
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
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Silversoul
Rhizome


Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
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Re: Fat Americans [Re: Asante]
#5912135 - 07/29/06 01:52 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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So your body tries to maintain a weight you've had for years. Ok, but by that same logic, if you continually struggle to push the weight down, you can reach a new weight which your body will try to maintain. All this means is that it's a little harder to lose weight once you've kept it on for a while, but if you keep at it, it will get easier.
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,795
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I found no official sources that state that if you keep it off for long enough then it would stay off. How I'd wish for that to be true, but the information I got is that "the rubber band loses its stretch" so you will never snap out of it.
You can bet I researched the shit out of this. Once you're beneath the shallow promises, and read between the lines, there emerges the image that a growing number of people simply is fukt4lyfe and allthough they should keep on trying, should accept that there is no way out unless there's a breakthrough in medical science.
The large numbers of people BECOMING obese in the USA nowadays is definitely a matter for most of eating too much food that is too unhealthy. But once you're too obese for too long, it becomes a lifelong metabolic disease because you have in fact ruined your health forever.
Sorry to all the optimists, but thats the deal.
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
Edited by Asante (07/29/06 02:07 PM)
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Silversoul
Rhizome


Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
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Re: Fat Americans [Re: Asante]
#5912309 - 07/29/06 03:07 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: I found no official sources that state that if you keep it off for long enough then it would stay off. How I'd wish for that to be true, but the information I got is that "the rubber band loses its stretch" so you will never snap out of it.
What you've posted so far suggests that once your body gets used to a certain wait, it will defend itself against changes in that weight. You seem to take that to mean that once you put on the weight, you can never put it off(though clearly there are examples that prove otherwise - just ask Jared from the Subway commercials). However, what it suggests to me is that the same would be true in both directions. That is, a person who puts on weight and maintains it for a number of years may have more difficulty losing it, but by the same logic, a person could lose weight and work to maintain it until it becomes normal for their body. The stuff you posted has merely suggested that the body gravitates towards a state of normality, but that that state can change over time.
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Papaver
Madmin Emeritus?

Registered: 06/01/02
Posts: 26,880
Loc: Radio Free Tibet!
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Re: Fat Americans [Re: Amatoxin]
#5912332 - 07/29/06 03:17 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Coming to a theater near you...
D.W. Griffith's The Girth of a Nation!
While you're enjoying our feature film, please remember to visit our snack bar to get a refreshing treat...
Let's all go to the lobby, Let's all go to the lobby, Let's all go to the lobby! To get ourselves a treat!
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ShroomOmatic
Ethno Apprentice

Registered: 10/14/04
Posts: 2,373
Loc: Sailing the Seas of Chees...
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They way I see it, people who are dangerously obese have a complete lack of will power and common sense. I guess some people abuse food because of emotional problems but that still isn't a good enough excuse. I think people need to just start getting more exercise, and quit making up excuses for their disgusting eating habits. In the wise words of Denis Leary "First day I wake up and cant see my dick, I stop eating!". It's that simple... just start eating better and get some exercise.
Currently I'm 6'5.5" and 245 lbs, which is my fighting weight for boxing.
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Edited by ShroomOmatic (07/29/06 03:27 PM)
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bobjones
...


Registered: 10/12/05
Posts: 999
Loc: Tx
Last seen: 8 years, 3 months
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Re: Fat Americans [Re: Amatoxin]
#5912373 - 07/29/06 03:27 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
With 64 percent of the U.S. population either overweight or obese, the problem is worsening
good lord...this is depressing on so many levels
-------------------- "Outside of a dog a book is a man's friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read" -Groucho Marx
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ChickenPotPie
Wanderer
Registered: 07/21/06
Posts: 138
Loc: Way out there
Last seen: 16 years, 7 months
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Re: Fat Americans [Re: bobjones]
#5912453 - 07/29/06 03:55 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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These are facts, although they don't want you to know it. Fat cells cannot be destroyed, only shrunk. This is why you see so much yo-yo dieting, Wiccian is close with that. HOWEVER, you can destroy fat cells through proper fasting, especially water. No, not fasting from your TV or sex, but not eating and entering into autolysis. In this stage your body will eat up and destroy what's not needed (be careful before you get pissed and think about what's REALLY needed) fat cells, goofed up proteins, etc. Most of what is also considered "fat" is impaction of the colon and the whole digestive tract, not to mention the retention of inorganic salt and the water that must surround it. I am a Christian, we are called to moderation and to fasting, REAL FASTING. However, I know a lot of you are atheist or agnostic, and that's none of my business however, I would suggest that if a person layed back, and told themselves the truth, they'd realize that as good as Arbys or Cheesecake may taste, in the wild, created by God for a purpose or just random circumstance, you shouldn't eat them because the crap is not good for you and it does not nourish the human species!! Nowhere in nature can you recieve life from death, and dead food impacts us, and kills us. Just my rant.
-------------------- -God made the weak things of the world to confuse the wise
Edited by ChickenPotPie (07/29/06 03:56 PM)
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Veritas

Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
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Quote:
Nowhere in nature can you recieve life from death, and dead food impacts us, and kills us.
Actually, the food chain is based upon "receiving life from death," and it seems to be working quite well for all but the most basic organisms. 
As for the fast food chain, I agree completely.
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MOTH
Wild Woman


Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 23,431
Loc: In the jungle
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Re: Fat Americans [Re: Veritas]
#5912630 - 07/29/06 05:19 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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I hate working out, but I do it anyway because I have an image of myself in my minds eye, and it's not a fat one. I used to be very slender at age 18, but when I become a recluse for 3 years, I gained a bunch of weight. Now I'm finally dropping it again, but it's taking time.
Just my thoughts...since I don't feel like being a fat American.
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MOTH
Wild Woman


Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 23,431
Loc: In the jungle
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Re: Fat Americans [Re: MOTH]
#5912657 - 07/29/06 05:30 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Also I've come to think of fast food as heroin. It helps deter me from eating it.
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Veritas

Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
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Re: Fat Americans [Re: MOTH]
#5912675 - 07/29/06 05:37 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Yes, I learned for myself that it was possible for me to become overweight (after a lifetime of being too thin), and that I DID NOT LIKE IT. I lost 40 lbs. and have maintained a healthy weight for 4 years.
That said, I will comment on the discussion in this thread re: weight loss.
Weight loss, for many overweight people, involves the difficult process of restricting caloric intake, increasing daily activity level, and breaking long-standing habits which led to their weight gain in the first place. This is tough enough, as I'm sure several members here would agree.
For others who become and remain overweight, these difficult measures may have little to no long-term effect on their weight. Anyone who has diligently followed a strict diet and vigorous exercise program & seen no lasting results from their efforts would feel that they were fighting an unwinnable war.
To chastize overweight people for their lack of willpower is pointless. To insist that everyone who becomes overweight can reduce their weight through diet and exercise is incorrect.
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MckennaManiac420
HEIL HOUSELER!

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 285
Loc: Drunk Male Prostitute
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Re: Fat Americans [Re: Mushouse]
#5912676 - 07/29/06 05:37 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Mushouse said: I once read a news article where a woman was too fat to fit into a human-sized CAT scan machine, so they actually hauled her to a zoo and they used a machine designed for an elephant (or other such large animal).
If I could find that article I would post it, but you will have to take my word for it.
that is fuckin hilarious
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MckennaManiac420
HEIL HOUSELER!

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 285
Loc: Drunk Male Prostitute
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Quote:
RandalFlagg said:
Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: I guess obesity threads in the Pub are like n*gger threads in OTD: either you come to listen to the vulgar choir of moral rejection, or you take part in it. The lack of empathy and the indiscriminate moral rejection of whole groups of people in this thread is sickening.
Let's get down to the meat of the issue:
1. People are way too sensitive nowadays.
2. People do not want to take responsibility for themselves or their actions.
3. People like playing the victim.
4. People are afraid to admit their faults and they like blaming these faults on exterior things.
What this world needs is more blunt people who can admit the truth and who can run their own lives. For example, I have many problems in my life. About 98% have been caused by myself. Do I whine about them occassionally? Of course...we all do that. Do I blame anybody else? No. I am my own person and I have a backbone.
brilliant
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eris
underground


Registered: 11/17/98
Posts: 48,024
Loc: North East, USA
Last seen: 4 months, 18 days
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Re: Fat Americans [Re: MOTH]
#5912712 - 07/29/06 05:50 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
EllemyshShade said: Also I've come to think of fast food as heroin. It helps deter me from eating it.
Heroin... 
That just make fast food seem all the better for me.
-------------------- Immortal / Temporarily Retired The OG Thread Killer My mushroom hunting gallery
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EmperorKuzco
somewhatfamiliar

Registered: 02/13/06
Posts: 252
Last seen: 16 years, 10 months
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Re: Fat Americans [Re: eris]
#5912903 - 07/29/06 07:08 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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In my opinion, obesity is a symptom, not the disease. I don't mean a physiological or pyscological disease either, I mean a societal disease. While we are arguing over the causes and remedies of over-eating:
-815 million people are undernourished -153 million children under age 5 are underweight -11 million children under age 5 die every year, over half of hunger-related causes
It struck me as I was reading this thread how it would sound to someone in a third world country who struggles everyday just to live.
Think about this: We can go to McDonalds and get a cheesburger for $1.07.
-1.2 billion people live on less than $1/day
I'm not quite sure what my point is, but when overweight people bitch about how hard it is to lose weight, I almost throw up in disgust.
ELCA World Hunger Facts
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,795
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Quote:
I'm not quite sure what my point is, but when overweight people bitch about how hard it is to lose weight, I almost throw up in disgust.
Thats because you're not sure what your point is. In countries like America it is typically the nations poor who are obese, because they simply cannot afford decent quality food, can't afford to go to a gym, and often lack the education to make informed decisions.
Junkfood, on the whole, is poor man's food. Obesity for a large part is a poor man's problem.
And you're blaming them for world hunger? Amazing.
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
Edited by Asante (07/29/06 07:24 PM)
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Amatoxin
Injected With A Poison


Registered: 03/27/05
Posts: 1,934
Loc: Not So Great Britain
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Re: Fat Americans [Re: Asante]
#5912976 - 07/29/06 07:29 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: Junkfood, on the whole, is poor man's food. Obesity for a large part is a poor man's problem.
Thats fucking hilarious!!! Your just making this up as your going along aren't you!?!?!?
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Sectioned Under The Mental Health Act Sat 20-10-07 to Thurs 01-11-07 for playing TECHNO music
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,795
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Re: Fat Americans [Re: Amatoxin]
#5913017 - 07/29/06 07:43 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Thats fucking hilarious!!! Your just making this up as your going along aren't you!?!?!?
Hilarious is it? Then lets laugh along with Science Daily and the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition:
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Researcher Links Rising Tide Of Obesity To Food Prices
Obesity in the United States is in part an economic issue, according to a review paper on the relationship between poverty and obesity published in the January 2004 edition of the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition. The article suggests that the very low cost of energy-dense foods may be linked to rising obesity rates.
The paper is by Dr. Adam Drewnowski, director of the Center for Public Health Nutrition in the University of Washington School of Public Health and Community Medicine, and Dr. S.E. Specter, research nutrition scientist at the U.S. Department of Agriculture Human Nutrition Research Center in Davis, Calif.
"It's a question of money," Drewnowski said. "The reason healthier diets are beyond the reach of many people is that such diets cost more. On a per calorie basis, diets composed of whole grains, fish, and fresh vegetables and fruit are far more expensive than refined grains, added sugars and added fats. It's not a question of being sensible or silly when it comes to food choices, it's about being limited to those foods that you can afford."
Energy-dense foods not only provide more calories per unit weight, but can provide more empty calories per unit cost. These foods include French fries, soft drinks, candy, cookies, deep-fried meats and other fatty, sugary and salty items. The review shows that attempting to reduce food spending tends to drive families toward more refined grains, added sugars and added fats. Previous studies have shown that energy-dense foods may fail to trigger physiological satiety mechanisms the internal signals that enough food has been consumed. These failed signals lead to overeating and overweight. Paradoxically, trying to save money on food may be a factor in the current obesity epidemic.
Many strategies for health promotion over the years have presumed that good nutrition was simply a matter of making the right choices. Drewnowski noted that access to healthier diets could be sharply limited in low-income neighborhoods simply because of the food environment and the nature of the available food supply.
"It is the opposite of choice," Drewnowski said. "People are not poor by choice and they become obese primarily because they are poor."
Drewnowski and Specter concluded that continuing to recommend costly foods to low-income families as a public health measure can only generate frustration among the poor and less well-educated. Americans are gaining weight while consuming more added sugars and added fats. They urge that issues of food costs demand attention.
"There is a need for governmental and policy interventions when it comes to the obesity epidemic," Drewnowski said. "The U.S. Department of Agriculture is addressing this issue with vigor. Government agencies and private foundations have identified childhood obesity as a priority area and are looking for ways to improve nutrition in the schools."
Obesity in the United States has become a social and economic issue that is resisting conventional medical approaches.
"Genetics and family history can predict whether you will become obese but then so can your ZIP code," Drewnowski said. "If poverty and obesity are truly linked, it will be a major challenge to stay poor and thin."
Source
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oh and errm, how about googling?
Web Results 1 - 100 of about 4,730,000 for poverty obesity.
I don't make these things up, its just that unlike almost anyone here I researched obesity.
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
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