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splifner180
Student


Registered: 03/24/06
Posts: 1,288
Loc: USA, East Coast
Last seen: 1 year, 3 months
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Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS
#5887922 - 07/22/06 03:43 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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We've got a spirited debate going on about whether fruiting straight WBS yields potent shrooms.
I should mention I'm not at all hell-bent on being right. It's just that I asked this question a few months back (with an eye toward doing precisely that) and the unanimous concensus was that it could be done but the fruits would be very weak.
If everyone voting could just give a or a (then comment all you want). Please vote only if you have first-hand experience. Anyone is welcome to comment, though.
I'd make a bona fide poll but I don't quite know how.
tia - splif
-------------------- First Grow: Ecuador -> LC -> HPoo/Straw -> Monotub Build a Do-It-Yourself Magnetic Stirrer in thirty minutes with no money.
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Tippinthru
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Registered: 04/07/05
Posts: 1,131
Loc: "The Garden"...
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: splifner180]
#5887942 - 07/22/06 03:49 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Sure you can fruit straight wbs. Imho, same potency as anything off a pf cake.
Rye, however holds slightly more moisture. Consequently, imho, it works better.
The tray type kits sold in Europe, are usually rye substrate. That tells me something.
-------------------- Perfection is attained by slow degrees; it requires the hand of time... [
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EquilibriuM
dream stalker

Registered: 07/17/05
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: Tippinthru]
#5887982 - 07/22/06 04:01 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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The answer as Tippinthru has stated is yes. I posted in the other thread...
The fruit isn't weak, just under-watered.
-------------------- HELP!!!!!!!!!
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splifner180
Student


Registered: 03/24/06
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Loc: USA, East Coast
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: EquilibriuM]
#5888001 - 07/22/06 04:07 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Goddamn it. I would have tried this a long time ago if everyone didn't tell me the fruits would blow. =)
splif
-------------------- First Grow: Ecuador -> LC -> HPoo/Straw -> Monotub Build a Do-It-Yourself Magnetic Stirrer in thirty minutes with no money.
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RogerRabbit
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: EquilibriuM]
#5888007 - 07/22/06 04:10 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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In all my biological testing, I've found bunk shrooms and killer shrooms of every strain on every substrate. A good isolate will produce a nice product regardless of substrate. A good substrate will give you bigger and more product, but I've honestly never found a correlation with potency. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat "I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work." Thomas Edison
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liamtheloser
Advanced Idiot

Registered: 06/07/06
Posts: 1,453
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: RogerRabbit]
#5888028 - 07/22/06 04:16 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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I just cased straight WBS and I've got about 5 4 inch shrooms that aren't anywhere near maturity. And I was worried about the potency as well, so I poked a pin with my finger. About 10 minutes later it was green where i poked it, and about 3 hours later, it's now a dark blue.
I haven't eaten any of them yet, but if the bruising is any indication of the potency, i'd say that YES, fruiting straight wbs is definately worth a shot
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Hoss
Stranger


Registered: 06/13/05
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: liamtheloser]
#5888037 - 07/22/06 04:19 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
liamtheloser said: I haven't eaten any of them yet, but if the bruising is any indication of the potency, i'd say that YES, fruiting straight wbs is definately worth a shot
Actually, the amount of bruising isn't any indication of potency.
I think you'll be okay, though.
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decepticon
someone abovethe crowd

Registered: 07/10/06
Posts: 113
Loc: europa
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: Hoss]
#5888101 - 07/22/06 04:48 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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as stated above, water retention will be your problem with wbs.
you being told not to fruit directly from wbs was probably good advice.
use it as spawn to a bulk substrate.
if you intend to just fruit from grain though, use rye. Tippinthru had it right, it holds water better.
And don't forget, RR has a very valid point. what we should be discussing is not potency, it is yield. potency is mainly determined upon the strain isolate. first you isolate a good performing strain, then use it on several different substrates if you want to compare.
wbs will yield far less than an equal mass of a mixed bulk substrate. with wbs being the spawn. no matter if it is h/poo, compost, coir, straw, or whatever; you will benefit greatly in BE by using wbs as spawn and not just fruiting straight from it.
if you are going to anyway, at least mix in some hydrated vermiculite to help with water retention and case it.
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splifner180
Student


Registered: 03/24/06
Posts: 1,288
Loc: USA, East Coast
Last seen: 1 year, 3 months
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: splifner180]
#5888111 - 07/22/06 04:52 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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OK. Thanks to everyone who chipped in to set me straight; I stand corrected.
I think I'm still gonna continue using hpoo for the reasons explained. I get it for free so fsckit.
I think I'm also going to start cloning and stop doing multispores.
splif
-------------------- First Grow: Ecuador -> LC -> HPoo/Straw -> Monotub Build a Do-It-Yourself Magnetic Stirrer in thirty minutes with no money.
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decepticon
someone abovethe crowd

Registered: 07/10/06
Posts: 113
Loc: europa
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: splifner180]
#5888117 - 07/22/06 04:54 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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sounds like you are on the right train of thought now.
much luck to you.
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fastfred
Old Hand



Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: decepticon]
#5888150 - 07/22/06 05:08 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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I'd say you'll be lucky to have much success fruiting off WBS. it contams very easy. As far as potency, I've never tested the potency from WBS, but the yield is much lower, so either way I say it's a bust.
And bruising IS an indication of potency.
-FF
Edited by fastfred (07/22/06 05:09 PM)
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RogerRabbit
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: fastfred]
#5888204 - 07/22/06 05:27 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Boletes bruise and they're not active. Many cube strains don't bruise at all and are quite potent. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat "I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work." Thomas Edison
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Omnicracker
Crusted Trolltivator

Registered: 09/18/05
Posts: 1,421
Loc: Wal-Merica
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: RogerRabbit]
#5888747 - 07/22/06 08:03 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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the yeilds are weak with straight WBS, why even bother? it could be so much more with just a little shit.
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liamtheloser
Advanced Idiot

Registered: 06/07/06
Posts: 1,453
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: Omnicracker]
#5888753 - 07/22/06 08:05 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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that's a half pint of wbs cased with 50/50. the biggest one is a little over 5 inches tall. And there's more pins sprouting up everywhere... Could just be my first try casing straight wbs... luck? haha
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EquilibriuM
dream stalker

Registered: 07/17/05
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: liamtheloser]
#5888778 - 07/22/06 08:11 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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WBS fruits well, its just a pain getting moisture content right. Those little grains don't hold much water.
-------------------- HELP!!!!!!!!!
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fastfred
Old Hand



Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: EquilibriuM]
#5889516 - 07/23/06 01:10 AM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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> Many cube strains don't bruise at all and are quite potent.
As usual you are right RR. I should have mentioned that not all mushrooms that bruise blue are active. Psilocin does however oxidize to a bluish/green color. In some ways it's an indicator of potency, but not always. Psilocin doesn't survive drying and storage that well, so a higher psilocin:psilocybin ratio isn't always good.
As you know I'm quite interested in psilo chemistry. What active strains dont' bruise blue?
-FF
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hawksapprentice
Yearns to Snowboard


Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 3,195
Loc: Oregon
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: fastfred]
#5889567 - 07/23/06 01:53 AM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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So if it's not a consistent indicator of potency, then by logic you shouldn't use it as a guide to tell if your fruits are potent or not.
If someone were using a drug test for pre-empolyment screening and the test would 50% of the tims show inaccurate results then you probably shouldn't use that test right? Same applies to bruising on mushrooms.
-------------------- "I celebrate the Earth, my home, my mother, my grave, and as long as men are Man they must, if they would preserve the integrated being, do the same---[and preserve]--this rank casual hungry smelly sweaty lusting transitory body, my oozy pulpy liquid-bag-swollen body, bones, blood, hair glands, my bejeweled sex; I love and celebrate it all. never to let men forget that they are animals as much as gods---that is one thing I shall say." Edward Abbey
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fastfred
Old Hand



Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: hawksapprentice]
#5889643 - 07/23/06 02:44 AM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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> So if it's not a consistent indicator of potency, then by logic you shouldn't use it as a guide to tell if your fruits are potent or not.
That would only be true if you had a better method or you required 100% accuracy, neither of which is true.
-FF
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liamtheloser
Advanced Idiot

Registered: 06/07/06
Posts: 1,453
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: fastfred]
#5889659 - 07/23/06 02:54 AM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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I figure if I KNOW I'm growing cubes, and I KNOW they should have active chemicals in them, then I KNOW they should bruise blue or green... I'm sorry but that's a damn good indicator for me, not to mention it's been a damn good indicator for the entire history of my hobby.
It's not like I'm growing some unknown strain that I have no idea if it bruises blue or not... jesus.
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hawksapprentice
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Registered: 06/06/03
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Loc: Oregon
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: liamtheloser]
#5889772 - 07/23/06 05:37 AM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Thats not what he was claiming. He infered that the more it bruised the more potent it will be. As roger rabbit pointed out you can have shrooms that don't bruise and are very potent, and shrooms that bruise alot but aren't all that potent. That's what makes it unreliable as an indicator.
-------------------- "I celebrate the Earth, my home, my mother, my grave, and as long as men are Man they must, if they would preserve the integrated being, do the same---[and preserve]--this rank casual hungry smelly sweaty lusting transitory body, my oozy pulpy liquid-bag-swollen body, bones, blood, hair glands, my bejeweled sex; I love and celebrate it all. never to let men forget that they are animals as much as gods---that is one thing I shall say." Edward Abbey
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hyphae
born to grow


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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: hawksapprentice]
#5889828 - 07/23/06 07:29 AM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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WBS has worked great for me and for a time was the substrate of my choice being cheap and working so nice with bags. Potency was always top notch.
-------------------- Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is Gas Exchange vs. FAE "We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"
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FooMan



Registered: 02/02/05
Posts: 8,957
Loc: Earth
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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: fastfred]
#5889834 - 07/23/06 07:35 AM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Some of my best shrooms didn't bruise at all. Also, if you doubt that WBS will fruit well cased by itself, talk to Doc! I like spawning WBS to h/poo or coir myself. As far as WBS contaminating more than other grains, I've never noticed it.
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Quick WBS Prep
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trunksan
PsyChicken


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Re: Informal Poll: Fruiting Straight WBS [Re: FooMan]
#5890593 - 07/23/06 01:40 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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WBS can vary very much anyway, since it's a mixture of grains so I wouldn't say one can realy compare it to other individual grains.
WBS casings have consistently outperformed my straw casings (I've never bothered to use POO) in terms of yield.
That's all the info I can add to the conversation.
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