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Offlinelonestar2004
Live to party,work to affordit.
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Registered: 10/03/04
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'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System
    #5869670 - 07/17/06 03:40 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

5-year-old 'girl' starting school is really a boy!

Broward County schools' progressive policy on transgendered children will be tested by the admission to kindergarten this fall of a boy who believes that he's a girl.

BY ROBERTO SANTIAGO
rsantiago@MiamiHerald.com

NCLR
FAMILY ATTORNEY: Karen Doering specializes in defending the rights of people who are transgendered, gay, bisexual or lesbian.
On the Web | Equality Florida: Report Discrimination
On the Web | Children with Gender Identity Disorder
On the Web | Gay and Lesbian Medical Association
On the Web | Equality Florida
On the Web | International Association
One little girl entering Broward County kindergarten this fall is actually a boy.

Few will know this genetic truth, because the 5-year-old's parents and school administrators have agreed that it's in his best interest to blend in as a female.

Mental health professionals have diagnosed Pat -- not his real name -- with gender dysphoria, a condition in which a person believes that he or she is the opposite gender. After two years of examination, they have determined that he is not simply effeminate or going through a phase.

'Gender dysphoria can take place during a fetus' development in the womb,'' said noted gender specialist and sexologist Marilyn Volker, Ph.D., of Miami.

While this tyke is likely the youngest transgendered child admitted to a South Florida school, he is not unique. Both the Broward and Miami-Dade County school systems have policies in place to smooth the way for such students and their families.

Equality Florida, which advocates for Florida's gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender community, and PFLAG -- Parents, Families and Friends of Lesbians and Gays -- say the two school districts have the most progressive policies in the state.

Broward and Miami-Dade are among the most exemplary school districts ''when it comes to the rights of transgendered people,'' said Tobias Packer, South Florida Field Organizer for Equality Florida, who himself is transgendered.

Carole Benowitz, Florida state coordinator for PFLAG, agrees. Her adult son is gay.

Benowitz said that two years ago -- at a Broward high school she declined to name -- she was called in after a group of boys beat up another student, whom they believed to be an effeminate boy. In fact, the victim was transgendered -- a biological female who looked, dressed and behaved like a male. Benowitz was brought in to counsel the administrators, the students and the victim.

''People have an understanding of what it means to be gay or lesbian -- but when they hear that a person is genetically one gender but lives as another gender, that threatens a number of people because they don't understand what that means,'' Benowitz said. ``And that misunderstanding can make lives very difficult for transgendered children and their parents.''

''In addition to behaving like the opposite sex, a person with gender dysphoria naturally relates to the opposite sex,'' Volker said. ``They also have a persistent and recurring discomfort with their own external body parts and genitalia because it does not match their internal gender identity. Simply said, they were born into the wrong body.''

FEMININE LOOK

The soon-to-be kindergartner looks quite feminine, cartwheeling around the yard and playing with dolls. Pat says he hates his penis, and he refuses to wear boys' clothing.

He and his three older siblings -- two girls and a boy -- live in a middle-class Broward County neighborhood with their father, an attorney, and their mother, who has a master's degree in counseling.

Pat's parents had never heard of gender dysphoria until they took their child for treatment. He was insisting that he was a girl, and often tried to hide his penis between his legs.

After long consultation with a team of pediatric endocrinologists and therapists, then with school officials, the parents decided that it was in Pat's best interest to live as a girl.

''The school officials have agreed to continue working with the family and medical professionals to help create an environment that will maximize the child's ability to learn and grow within the school system,'' said family attorney Karen Doering, who specializes in defending the rights of people who are transgendered, gay, bisexual or lesbian.

Gender dysphoria -- called gender identity disorder by the American Psychiatric Association -- is commonly misunderstood today, much as homosexuality was 50 years ago.

Although the association has not taken a formal position, the scientific community is increasingly determining that it could be a genetic condition, not a mental disorder.

At the school, teachers and the principal are prepared. The child will use unisex bathroom facilities, will be addressed by a unisex name -- not Pat -- and has been asked to dress in gender-neutral clothing, such as shorts or pants and a shirt.

School officials said this is standard practice in Broward and Miami-Dade for helping transgendered children fit in.

''The policies the districts have in place are progressive,'' Benowitz said. ``They both aim to ensure that transgendered students are treated like any other students, and take direct action when misunderstanding or violence take place.''

Leah Kelly, executive director of student support services and exceptional student education for the Broward school system, could not comment on any specific case.

``But I will say the Broward school system has admitted transgendered children before, and that it is a private matter between the parents, school administrators and the child.''

Discretion plays a great role in protecting transgendered children and the privacy of their parents, Kelly said. The objective is for them to blend in, she said.

Tony Valido, an educational specialist in the Miami-Dade schools Division of Student Services, said that Miami-Dade's approach to helping transgendered children goes one step further -- simply because there is a greater need.

MIAMI-DADE DIVERSITY

''Unlike Broward, Miami-Dade has a more diverse population of students,'' Valido said. That's especially true in high school, where there are a number of openly transgendered teens, mostly boys who believe they are girls.

Each Miami-Dade high school has a Sexual Minority Network where students who are gay, lesbian, bisexual or transgendered can turn to an in-house counselor or teacher for help.

That means advice on trying to fit in and understand who they are, said Valido, who added that there have been no reported incidents of violence or bullying.

The network has been in place for at least 15 years. Valido said that in the last few years, sexual-minority students have become more vocal.

''Sexual-minority students are coming out younger and younger, as early as 10,'' said Valido, who hopes the Sexual Minority Network will be expanded to middle schools next year.

It's not clear how many transgendered children are in the system. The U.S. Department of Education does not maintain statistics on the number of transgendered children in the school system, nor are schools asked to report it.

Some parents of transgendered children worry that societal revulsion, fear and anger could prompt someone to call a social-service agency, such as the Florida Department of Children & Families. A complaint that a little boy is being sent to school in girl's clothing could lead to accusations of abuse and neglect, they fear.

Those fears are not unrealistic, said Abbie Cuellar, an attorney specializing in child welfare issues.

''The parents must make sure that documentation on behalf of their child is ready and continuously updated,'' Cuellar said. ``Gender dysphoria is greatly misunderstood, and all it takes is one well-meaning but ignorant person to start making calls.''

But Gary Gershowitz, a spokesman for the Department of Children & Families in Tallahassee, said that parents of transgender children in Florida have nothing to fear.

''Documented gender dysphoria does not rise to the level of abuse or neglect,'' Gershowitz said. ``Anyone can call and file abuse for any reason. But in a worst-case scenario, a child protection investigator would look for signs of physical abuse or squalor, because it is the safety of the child that is of concern. If none is found -- and especially if there is documentation of gender dysphoria -- the case would be closed.''

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/15003026.htm

This poor kid is FUCKED....


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5869720 - 07/17/06 03:56 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

A 5 year old is pretty much only what his parents have made him.

How sad for him.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Offlined33p
Welcome to Violence

Registered: 07/12/03
Posts: 5,381
Loc: the shores of Tripoli
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5869732 - 07/17/06 04:00 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I started reading this line and I was thinking WTF?

Quote:

Broward and Miami-Dade are among the most exemplary school districts




Then i finsihed the sentence and i thought to myself, figures.

Quote:

''when it comes to the rights of transgendered people,'' said Tobias Packer, South Florida Field Organizer for Equality Florida, who himself is transgendered.




And yes that kid is fucked.


--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban

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Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: luvdemshrooms] * 1
    #5869773 - 07/17/06 04:09 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

A 5 year old is pretty much only what his parents have made him.

'Gender dysphoria can take place during a fetus' development in the womb,'' said noted gender specialist and sexologist Marilyn Volker, Ph.D., of Miami.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5869785 - 07/17/06 04:11 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

You know as well as I that there are differing opinions.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleHank, FTW
Looking for the Answer

Registered: 05/04/06
Posts: 3,912
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5869790 - 07/17/06 04:12 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

My heart goes out to this poor kid, what a horrible life he/she has in store. I can only imagine what I would have thought if my first school yard sweet heart turned out to actually be a boy. This child is a product of radical feminism, our perverted society, and of course the parents.

I think home schooling would be in his/her best interest.


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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InvisibleDiploidM
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Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #5869803 - 07/17/06 04:15 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

You know as well as I that there are differing opinions.

Of course, but your opinion that this is caused by the parents smacks of those who say things like that gays are made by their environment or that they chose to be gay instead of straight.

The truth is that more and more evidence is being found suggesting these things are based in biology, not environment.

Also, to refute your opinion, it's interesting to note that the parents are raising three normal siblings (two girls and a boy) side by side with the transgendered girl.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


Edited by Diploid (07/17/06 04:21 PM)


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Offlinelonestar2004
Live to party,work to affordit.
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Registered: 10/03/04
Posts: 8,978
Loc: South Texas
Last seen: 12 years, 9 months
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5869829 - 07/17/06 04:23 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

What happens if the little girl stops hating her Penis ( she figures out where she can put it)? Will she be a Lesbian?????


Edited by lonestar2004 (07/17/06 04:25 PM)


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InvisibleMushmanTheManic
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Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5869832 - 07/17/06 04:24 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Time for gender reassignment.


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Offlined33p
Welcome to Violence

Registered: 07/12/03
Posts: 5,381
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5869839 - 07/17/06 04:25 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I still have no idea why the implications of one's behavior/outlook change depending on whether it is the product of genes, environment, or something else.

Why does it matter where something is based. You either think its right, wrong, or in between. None of this changes the way someone is.

And I think even if the root cause of his genger dysphoria was genetics, his environment failed him. Genetics doesn't make a 5 year old hate his dick, tuck it in, and want to wear girl clothes.


--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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InvisibleMushmanTheManic
Stranger

Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5869851 - 07/17/06 04:30 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Gender dysphoria is not Tranvestism.


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Offlined33p
Welcome to Violence

Registered: 07/12/03
Posts: 5,381
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5869864 - 07/17/06 04:33 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

MushmanTheManic said:
Gender dysphoria is not Tranvestism.




Good job not even reading the article. Serriously, A+ work.


--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5869896 - 07/17/06 04:40 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

The truth is that more and more evidence is being found suggesting these things are based in biology, not environment.



Sorry, but there is no consensus.


Quote:

Also, to refute your opinion, it's interesting to note that the parents are raising three normal siblings (two girls and a boy) side by side with the transgendered girl.



Yes, and parents never ever never treat one child different than the rest.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleMushmanTheManic
Stranger

Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5869900 - 07/17/06 04:41 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

The truth is that more and more evidence is being found suggesting these things are based in biology, not environment.

:thumbup:

"The author reports on 37 children who are being raised by female homosexuals or by parents who have changed sex (transsexuals): 21 by female homosexuals, 7 by male-to-female transsexuals, and 9 by female- to-male transsexuals. The children range in age from 3 to 20 years (mean = 9.3) and have lived in the sexually atypical households for 1- 16 years (mean = 4.9). Thirty-six of the children report or recall childhood toy, game, clothing, and peer group preferences that are typical for their sex. The 13 older children who report erotic fantasies or overt sexual behaviors are all heterosexually oriented." (Emphasis added)


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InvisibleMushmanTheManic
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Posts: 4,587
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5869905 - 07/17/06 04:43 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

d33p said:
Quote:

MushmanTheManic said:
Gender dysphoria is not Tranvestism.




Good job not even reading the article. Serriously, A+ work.




:confused:


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5869913 - 07/17/06 04:45 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I still have no idea why the implications of one's behavior/outlook change depending on whether it is the product of genes, environment, or something else.

It changes because how society deals with this is in large part a product of how society believes it is caused.

If the kid is perceived as a pervert, she will be shunned. If the kid is perceived as an unlucky victim of genetics, she will be treated differently.

Not to mention the reaction of religious zealots who have a hard time accepting things like the idea that gays have no choice but to be gay any more than straights have a choice.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Offlined33p
Welcome to Violence

Registered: 07/12/03
Posts: 5,381
Loc: the shores of Tripoli
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5869921 - 07/17/06 04:47 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

MushmanTheManic said:
The truth is that more and more evidence is being found suggesting these things are based in biology, not environment.

:thumbup:

"The author reports on 37 children who are being raised by female homosexuals or by parents who have changed sex (transsexuals): 21 by female homosexuals, 7 by male-to-female transsexuals, and 9 by female- to-male transsexuals. The children range in age from 3 to 20 years (mean = 9.3) and have lived in the sexually atypical households for 1- 16 years (mean = 4.9). Thirty-six of the children report or recall childhood toy, game, clothing, and peer group preferences that are typical for their sex. The 13 older children who report erotic fantasies or overt sexual behaviors are all heterosexually oriented." (Emphasis added)




Not that im refuting what the author believed or was trying to prove but that study proves exactly jack shit. That "evidence" is gay(bad joke).


--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5869933 - 07/17/06 04:52 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

that study proves exactly jack shit

No scientific study ever proves anything. All scientific studies do is support or refute a proposition.

To date, there are many studies supporting the notion that gender identity and orientation are (at least in large part) a function of genetics. More are completed all the time. Very few (if any) go the other way.

How many studies reaching this same conclusion do you require before you will accept it as a likely truth?


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Offlined33p
Welcome to Violence

Registered: 07/12/03
Posts: 5,381
Loc: the shores of Tripoli
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5869969 - 07/17/06 05:07 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
that study proves exactly jack shit

No scientific study ever proves anything. All scientific studies do is support or refute a proposition.

To date, there are many studies supporting the notion that gender identity and orientation are (at least in large part) a function of genetics. More are completed all the time. Very few (if any) go the other way.

How many studies reaching this same conclusion do you require before you will accept it as a likely truth?




How about a study with a sample that doesn't make it statistically insignificant. I don't give a shit about the subject to be honest so i don't know about the claimed abundance of other studies. He choose to reference a study which in my opinion seems worthless. I'll look at actual scientific research on the matter and if they can make a case for it, then great. It would be interesting to know actually what causes it. But still it doesn't change a single thing.

Whether environment or genetics causes something shouldn't change your opinion about it.


--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


Edited by d33p (07/17/06 05:19 PM)


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InvisibleHank, FTW
Looking for the Answer

Registered: 05/04/06
Posts: 3,912
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5869971 - 07/17/06 05:08 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah, if people can be genetically predisposed to something like homosexuality, can the same be said for violence, or crime??

I thought it was environment(poverty) that caused much crime and violence. Liberals always contradict themselves.


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5870003 - 07/17/06 05:18 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Whether environment or genetics causes something shouldn't change your opinion about it.

I agree, but that doesn't stop religious zealots and homophobes from persecuting people like this little girl. Imagine if instead of to two progressive parents she was born into a 'preacher household'. If you think this little girl is in for a hard life, imagine how much worse societal ignorance could make it.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Hank, FTW]
    #5870012 - 07/17/06 05:19 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah, if people can be genetically predisposed to something like homosexuality, can the same be said for violence, or crime??

Wow, you're going far afield here. We're talking about a little girl born into a boy's body, not violent criminals.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleHank, FTW
Looking for the Answer

Registered: 05/04/06
Posts: 3,912
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870023 - 07/17/06 05:22 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

HAHAHA you missed my point completely.


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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InvisibleVvellum
Stranger

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 10,920
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870064 - 07/17/06 05:33 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
You know as well as I that there are differing opinions.

Of course, but your opinion that this is caused by the parents smacks of those who say things like that gays are made by their environment or that they chose to be gay instead of straight.

The truth is that more and more evidence is being found suggesting these things are based in biology, not environment.

Also, to refute your opinion, it's interesting to note that the parents are raising three normal siblings (two girls and a boy) side by side with the transgendered girl.




:thumbup:


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InvisibleVeritas
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Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004] * 1
    #5870094 - 07/17/06 05:38 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Gender and sex are not the same thing, and it is Western society's fixation on our gender behavior matching up with our genitalia that is the problem here--not the child in the article.

The history of a "third sex" or transgendered people goes back thousands of years:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_gender

*sigh* Humans can be such intolerant little buggers.


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OfflinexDuckYouSuckerx
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870101 - 07/17/06 05:40 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
Whether environment or genetics causes something shouldn't change your opinion about it.

I agree, but that doesn't stop religious zealots and homophobes from persecuting people like this little girl. Imagine if instead of to two progressive parents she was born into a 'preacher household'. If you think this little girl is in for a hard life, imagine how much worse societal ignorance could make it.




I just want to make sure I understand your POV here. After a few of your posts talking about modern science and how we are "learning new things", postulating that this boy was given this 'disorder' in the womb, after all of that scientific stuff that you posted, you now call a human with a functioning penis and testicles a "girl"? Is their some reason for this? Did the definition change recently?


--------------------
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OfflinexDuckYouSuckerx
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870104 - 07/17/06 05:41 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Gershowitz and Berowitz are two of the big names from this, anyone want to guess what race, or shall we say "tribe", is behind this latest push at filth?


--------------------
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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Veritas]
    #5870132 - 07/17/06 05:46 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Veritas said:
*sigh* Humans can be such intolerant little buggers.




I guess so.

IMO those so called "Progressive" parents should be in jail. (child in therapy since the age of three) :thumbdown:


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870135 - 07/17/06 05:46 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

xDuckYouSuckerx said:
Gershowitz and Berowitz are two of the big names from this, anyone want to guess what race, or shall we say "tribe", is behind this latest push at filth?



Um...These people are individuals, not some race or tribe.


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870140 - 07/17/06 05:48 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
IMO those so called "Progressive" parents should be in jail. (child in therapy since the age of three) :thumbdown:



Ya, how dare they have a child with a genetic abnormality and not be a bunch of close-minded bigots about it! :mad:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870143 - 07/17/06 05:48 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Don't be silly, obviously this action was the doing of the Nazi Party.  I mean, c'mon, Volker and Doering??? 

:rolleyes:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870150 - 07/17/06 05:49 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

you now call a human with a functioning penis and testicles a "girl"?

I call her a girl out of respect.

She says she is a girl despite the penis. I respect her enough to follow through with her wishes to be addressed and treated as a girl.

Recall that she's been though extensive medical analysis by this point. The medical consensus is that her psyche is that of a girl and that this is not a phase she will outgrow.


--------------------
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1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870152 - 07/17/06 05:50 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

The Mom has a Masters in Sociology and the dad is a lawyer.......explains a lot.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870157 - 07/17/06 05:51 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
Quote:

Veritas said:
*sigh* Humans can be such intolerant little buggers.




I guess so.

IMO those so called "Progressive" parents should be in jail. (child in therapy since the age of three) :thumbdown:




Yeah, if my toddler kept insisting that "he" was a girl, hiding his penis between his legs, and became upset about living in a body which society declares does not "match" the person inside, I would just give him a time-out & tell him to "GET OVER IT." 

Good parents know that they should crush any signs of non-normative behavior ASAP, and avoid counseling at all costs.  :rolleyes:


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InvisibleHank, FTW
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5870158 - 07/17/06 05:51 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
Quote:

xDuckYouSuckerx said:
Gershowitz and Berowitz are two of the big names from this, anyone want to guess what race, or shall we say "tribe", is behind this latest push at filth?



Um...These people are individuals, not some race or tribe.


'

If only that were true. The "z" says it all. Why do they push this shit, even if this boy is like this, why is it always these people making a huge deal about it. Now all little boys who have played with a doll, or liked something feminine, can have the option of calling themselves girls. Our future work force/military are gonna be useless.


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870159 - 07/17/06 05:52 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
The Mom has a Masters in Sociology and the dad is a lawyer.......explains a lot.



Yes. People in the social sciences tend to have fewer redneck tendencies.


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OfflineCatalysis
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870167 - 07/17/06 05:55 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

To date, there are many studies supporting the notion that gender identity and orientation are (at least in large part) a function of genetics. More are completed all the time. Very few (if any) go the other way.




I call bullshit on that. Are you trying to say that there are no studies showing the psychological causes of homosexuality? I am quite sure that it has been exhaustively studied and several external factors have been identified.

I think most support the idea that homosexuality can be caused buy a combination of external and biological factors. Also, I think the term "genetic" is purposely misleading in this case because it makes it seem as though there is some gay gene on a chromosome that can be flipped on or off. I think nearly all researchers agree that it is not that simple.

For instance, the DSM lists schizophrenia and bipolar disorder as possible genetic causes of gender dysphoria (which is still considered a mental illness). So you see that "genetic" here does not necessarily mean the same thing as say, the difference between blue and brown eyes. Im not saying there is anything wrong with it. I also don't see why people have the need to try to rationalize homosexuality by attributing it to genes.

Anyways, I think that 5 years old is why to young to diagnose someone with such a complicated condition, although there is such a thing as childhood sexual dysphoria. This would be like a psychologist diagnosing a 5 year-old as an alcoholic because he likes the taste of cough syrup.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870170 - 07/17/06 05:56 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
Quote:

Veritas said:
*sigh* Humans can be such intolerant little buggers.




I guess so.

IMO those so called "Progressive" parents should be in jail. (child in therapy since the age of three) :thumbdown:




In a perfect world it would be you who would be thrown in jail. But I suppose that would violate your civil liberties.


--------------------


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Veritas]
    #5870175 - 07/17/06 05:59 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Veritas said:
Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
Quote:

Veritas said:
*sigh* Humans can be such intolerant little buggers.




I guess so.

IMO those so called "Progressive" parents should be in jail. (child in therapy since the age of three) :thumbdown:




Yeah, if my toddler kept insisting that "he" was a girl, hiding his penis between his legs, and became upset about living in a body which society declares does not "match" the person inside, I would just give him a time-out & tell him to "GET OVER IT." 

Good parents know that they should crush any signs of non-normative behavior ASAP, and avoid counseling at all costs.  :rolleyes:




Dude I have worked with 3 year old boys that put on girls dresses. I did not think it was unusual. The fucking kid was 3 years old. What the fuck do they know.

I guess I should have sent all those boys to therapy!


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Hank, FTW]
    #5870180 - 07/17/06 06:00 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

alpharedecho said:
If only that were true. The "z" says it all. Why do they push this shit, even if this boy is like this, why is it always these people making a huge deal about it. 




Quote:

Carole Benowitz, Florida state coordinator for PFLAG




Quote:

Gary Gershowitz, a spokesman for the Department of Children & Families in Tallahassee




Hmmmm...neither of these individuals were in any way involved with identifying this child as transgendered, nor were they involved in the parent's action to get school support for this situation.

Both were asked for comments on the situation by the author of the article.  Both gave comments.  Yes, this must be a conspiracy by the "z" tribe.  :rolleyes:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5870196 - 07/17/06 06:06 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Basilides said:
Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
Quote:

Veritas said:
*sigh* Humans can be such intolerant little buggers.




I guess so.

IMO those so called "Progressive" parents should be in jail. (child in therapy since the age of three) :thumbdown:




In a perfect world it would be you who would be thrown in jail. But I suppose that would violate your civil liberties.




Could I at least get some counseling for my 5 year old girl gender dysphoria phobe before i was put in prison????


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870199 - 07/17/06 06:07 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

1.  I'm not a "dude."  :grin:  (I don't have a penis, either.)

2.  This child's behavior went beyond occasionally wearing a dress.  The parents met with pediatric endocrinologists, therapists and school officials, all of whom came to the consensus that it would be better for "Pat" to be identified as a girl.

What other options would you suggest?  Should the parents just "wait it out" through Pat's childhood?


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870207 - 07/17/06 06:09 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
Quote:

Veritas said:
Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
Quote:

Veritas said:
*sigh* Humans can be such intolerant little buggers.




I guess so.

IMO those so called "Progressive" parents should be in jail. (child in therapy since the age of three) :thumbdown:




Yeah, if my toddler kept insisting that "he" was a girl, hiding his penis between his legs, and became upset about living in a body which society declares does not "match" the person inside, I would just give him a time-out & tell him to "GET OVER IT." 

Good parents know that they should crush any signs of non-normative behavior ASAP, and avoid counseling at all costs.  :rolleyes:




Dude I have worked with 3 year old boys that put on girls dresses. I did not think it was unusual. The fucking kid was 3 years old. What the fuck do they know.

I guess I should have sent all those boys to therapy!




Most males when they're that age do that, usually with their mother's clothes. There's a difference between that and a child who is consistently dysphoric about their gender identity. Get a clue.


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5870246 - 07/17/06 06:19 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

"Get a clue."


some of the young boys put on dresses AND played with dolls! Is that gender dysphoria?

Sorry i will never understand a 3-5 year old being diagnosed with dysphoria phobe.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870271 - 07/17/06 06:24 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

some of the young boys put on dresses AND played with dolls! Is that gender dysphoria?




It might be, it might not. If it is consistent, probably.


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5870285 - 07/17/06 06:29 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

When I was 5, I don't think I even knew there were other options besides a penis. I guess I've probably seen my mom nude when I was a little kid but I don't remember having the psychological ability and knowledge of the other sex to decide that I want to be a girl and hate my penis because I really want a vagina. I just played with whatever toys my parents bought me. You don't really do much soul-searching at that age, you pretty much do whatever people teach you because thats all you know.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Catalysis]
    #5870294 - 07/17/06 06:30 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

When I was 5, I don't think I even knew there were other options besides a penis.

Many kids aren't this slow.  :shrug:


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870301 - 07/17/06 06:32 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
When I was 5, I don't think I even knew there were other options besides a penis.

Many kids aren't this slow.  :shrug:




You must be pretty smart to have known what a vagina is while you were still in the womb.  I bet you are quite the ladies man.  :wink:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870307 - 07/17/06 06:34 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
When I was 5, I don't think I even knew there were other options besides a penis.

Many kids aren't this slow.  :shrug:




hahahahaha Catalysis if only had some "PROGRESSIVE" parents :crazy2:


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Catalysis]
    #5870317 - 07/17/06 06:36 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Catalysis said:
Quote:

Diploid said:
When I was 5, I don't think I even knew there were other options besides a penis.

Many kids aren't this slow.  :shrug:




You must be pretty smart to have known what a vagina is while you were still in the womb.  I bet you are quite the ladies man.  :wink:




If you knew anything of human biology, you would know that there is a fetal stage when the gender is physiologically undetermined (hence why males have nipples).


--------------------


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870343 - 07/17/06 06:41 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

What the hell is "dysphoria phobe"??  :confused: 

A phobia involves extreme fear of something...are you trying to say that "Pat" has a fear of male genitalia?

Dysphoria means "An emotional state characterized by anxiety, depression, or unease."  As Pat's gender assignment was a source of unease and depression, Pat was diagnosed with Gender Dysphoria.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5870345 - 07/17/06 06:41 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

If you knew anything of human biology, you would know that there is a fetal stage when the gender is physiologically undetermined (hence why males have nipples).




Right, and he is physiologically a male. I thought this was covered in the first sentance of the article.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Catalysis]
    #5870358 - 07/17/06 06:44 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Physiologically he is a male, but that doesn't mean there is psychological combobulation.


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."


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InvisibleHank, FTW
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870363 - 07/17/06 06:44 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah, if you had the luxury of having "progressive" parents, your life could be fucked up too!

There is nothing wrong with having an open mind, but I think the word progressive says it all. So when being trans gender is normal, what will be progressive from that point, where does the progressive ideology end?


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Hank, FTW]
    #5870393 - 07/17/06 06:50 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

So when being trans gender is normal

Why are so many people so hung up on the word 'normal'.

Normal is anyone who is happy. This little girl is currently happy, but that wont last long when she enters the real world and start running into 'normal' people like you who know better than she how she should behave. :sad:


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleHank, FTW
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870419 - 07/17/06 06:55 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Oh your so wise, and I am just an ignorant bigot. NORMAL IS BEING ABLE TO PROCREATE, THAT IS NORMAL. IMO


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Hank, FTW]
    #5870437 - 07/17/06 06:57 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Actually, according to the APA, if someone has a positive self image they are by definition psychologically healthy.


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870444 - 07/17/06 06:58 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

She hates her penis. That doesn't sound like happy nor normal to me.

Some of you liberals go overboard with positivity.


--------------------
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Offlinewilshire
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870448 - 07/17/06 06:59 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

this issue raises some good questions:

1. is it unethical to misrepresent your gender?
2. should the government be gender blind?
3. if the government does make distinctions on the base of gender, should they be based on what's between a person's legs or what's between their ears?

personally i don't have a big issue with what's going on here. so the kid thinks of himself as a girl and would rather have a girl's body. a little pathological maybe, but who's being harmed? i feel bad for the kid.

one part of the story mentioned that the child "hates his penis". if this were a female child who dressed as a boy, acted as a boy, wanted to be a boy, and hated her vagina, she wouldn't be reinforced like this boy. she'd be hailed as a victim of pervasive misogyny and given counciling to help her accept her identity as a female. when it's a boy who wants to be a girl, they don't bother with any of that. i think that's a valid prediction, and while i don't know the specifics of this kid's situation, or who these adults are, it worries me that they might be letting their biases get in the way of the kid's best interests.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Hank, FTW]
    #5870452 - 07/17/06 06:59 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Oh your so wise, and I am just an ignorant bigot.  :smirk:


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5870467 - 07/17/06 07:01 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Basilides said:
Actually, according to the APA, if someone has a positive self image they are by definition psychologically healthy.




thats the stupidest thing i've ever heard.


--------------------
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5870473 - 07/17/06 07:02 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

d33p said:
She hates her penis. That doesn't sound like happy nor normal to me.

Some of you liberals go overboard with positivity.




Get rid of the penis then. Problem solved.


--------------------


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5870484 - 07/17/06 07:04 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

She hates her penis. That doesn't sound like happy nor normal to me.

So what? Some people hate their hair color. So they change it. When this girl is old enough to make that decision, she'll have her penis removed and continue to live as happily as bigots will allow.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5870509 - 07/17/06 07:08 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

d33p said:
Quote:

Basilides said:
Actually, according to the APA, if someone has a positive self image they are by definition psychologically healthy.




thats the stupidest thing i've ever heard.




It's a primacy guideline that curbs subjectivity in psychological and psychiatric research. I.e., the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" rule of thumb.


--------------------


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870527 - 07/17/06 07:11 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
So when being trans gender is normal

Why are so many people so hung up on the word 'normal'.

Normal is anyone who is happy. This little girl is currently happy, but that wont last long when she enters the real world and start running into 'normal' people like you who know better than she how she should behave. :sad:




I'm still unclear as to when the definition of "boy" and "girl" were changed. If I said that I felt like I was really a lion and that I hated my human body, would you refer to me as the King of the Jungle, or the Lion posting on the other side of the computer?  HE has a penis, HE has testicles.  Maybe you could tell us how it's "normal" to call people like that a girl?


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5870542 - 07/17/06 07:12 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
Quote:

xDuckYouSuckerx said:
Gershowitz and Berowitz are two of the big names from this, anyone want to guess what race, or shall we say "tribe", is behind this latest push at filth?



Um...These people are individuals, not some race or tribe.




Oh yea no definatly. It's odd that the founders of the NAACP, the early and present "civil rights workers", the early feminist, the current feminists, odd that someone with a fucked up mind like mind could dare to draw a connection.

Even more odd that those people still want their own race/nation and will kill innocents to get it. But thats just my conspiracy theory, obviously if I knoew more I'd have a degree in sociology.


--------------------
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870549 - 07/17/06 07:13 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Normal is highly subjective. I think that's the whole point.


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5870550 - 07/17/06 07:13 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
The Mom has a Masters in Sociology and the dad is a lawyer.......explains a lot.



Yes. People in the social sciences tend to have fewer redneck tendencies.




Don't you have a mullet?


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870565 - 07/17/06 07:16 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
I call her a girl out of respect.




Thats the most intellectually dishonest thing I've read in a while. "girl" and "boy" aren't mental attributes, they are physical characteristics. What if I saw some homo that acted like a female, can I call him girl all of the time? Oh nope, thats homophobia.


I'm now announcing that I have species dysphoria. I'm really a lion trapped in a humans body. I expect to be refered to as "the lion" rather than "the person", and I hope that you speciesest backwards hicks don't have a problem with that, i've got an ACLU lawyer right here!


Oh, I also might eat a few of you, but it's chill, respect my wishes n shit
Quote:


She says she is a girl despite the penis. I respect her enough to follow through with her wishes to be addressed and treated as a girl.




Despite what we may have seen in OTD, you can't have a penis and be a girl. Just doesn't happen.
Quote:


Recall that she's been though extensive medical analysis by this point. The medical consensus is that her psyche is that of a girl and that this is not a phase she will outgrow.



Medical consensus a few hundred years ago would have been to call the child a witch and burn them.


--------------------
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5870575 - 07/17/06 07:18 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Basilides said:
Actually, according to the APA, if someone has a positive self image they are by definition psychologically healthy.




So hating a part of your body that establishes your identity is "positive self image"? Odd.


--------------------
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InvisibleDiploidM
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870577 - 07/17/06 07:18 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I'm still unclear as to when the definition of "boy" and "girl" were changed.

This isn't about strict definitions. Society treats the genders differently. This girl has a male body, but she is a girl. And no matter what YOU say, I'll take her word about who she is over yours.

If I said that I felt like I was really a lion

That would make you dysfunctional and certainly unhappy as you would be unable to interact with other humans as a lion.

This has nothing to do with a functioning little girl stuck in a male body who is currently happy only because she hasn't been exposed to bigots yet.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: wilshire]
    #5870583 - 07/17/06 07:18 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

wilshire said:
one part of the story mentioned that the child "hates his penis". if this were a female child who dressed as a boy, acted as a boy, wanted to be a boy, and hated her vagina, she wouldn't be reinforced like this boy. she'd be hailed as a victim of pervasive misogyny and given counciling to help her accept her identity as a female. when it's a boy who wants to be a girl, they don't bother with any of that. i think that's a valid prediction, and while i don't know the specifics of this kid's situation, or who these adults are, it worries me that they might be letting their biases get in the way of the kid's best interests.




Thumbs up.


--------------------
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870590 - 07/17/06 07:20 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

xDuckYouSuckerx said:
Quote:

Basilides said:
Actually, according to the APA, if someone has a positive self image they are by definition psychologically healthy.




So hating a part of your body that establishes your identity is "positive self image"?  Odd.




Hence the transition from male to female, la derrr :rolleyes:


--------------------


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870596 - 07/17/06 07:20 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

YOU ARE, semantics, now stfu.


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870632 - 07/17/06 07:25 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

So let me ask you: what do you propose should be done with this person?


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870656 - 07/17/06 07:30 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I'm not a psychiatrist. I'd say that something needs to be done, thats for sure. The idiotic liberal mindset of just allowing disfunction to occur so that we can all feel warm and cuddly is just foolish. This boy has a rather serious problem. He needs to be counceled and taught that people with a penis and testicles arent' girls. I can't believe that you all think that a five year old boy that hates his penis is somehow qualified to speak on behalf of his mental stability.


--------------------
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InvisibleHank, FTW
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870664 - 07/17/06 07:31 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I really don't know, I know He would have been better off, if He had better parents, raising him in a better society. I honestly don't know what should be done for people like this. They will have to suffer the hardships that come along with this life, and I honestly feel bad for these people.

They are a product of our ass backwards societies.


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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InvisibleDiploidM
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Hank, FTW]
    #5870676 - 07/17/06 07:33 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

What should the parents have done differently?


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870678 - 07/17/06 07:34 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Psychiatry's Golden Rule: Do no harm. If allowing this child to persue the female identity reduces persisting suffering with the currently imposed male identity, it is a legitimate cathartic method.


--------------------


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Veritas]
    #5870684 - 07/17/06 07:35 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Veritas said:
What the hell is "dysphoria phobe"??  :confused: 

A phobia involves extreme fear of something...are you trying to say that "Pat" has a fear of male genitalia?

Dysphoria means "An emotional state characterized by anxiety, depression, or unease."  As Pat's gender assignment was a source of unease and depression, Pat was diagnosed with Gender Dysphoria.




"Gender dysphoria -- called gender identity disorder by the American Psychiatric Association -- is commonly misunderstood today, much as homosexuality was 50 years ago."

I would like to DICK SLAP the mother of this poor kid.

IMO a 3 year old can not be diagnosed with Gender dysphoria. so I guess that make me a..... 

Intolerant  3-5 year old  Gender dysphoria transgenderphobe??


--------------------
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America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870700 - 07/17/06 07:38 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Not encourage this behaviour for one. This is a very complex issue, and I admit, I don't know all the answers.

What I can say, is when I have children, the boys will be boys, and the girls will be girls.


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870707 - 07/17/06 07:39 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/boy
A male child
A son

Every definition says "male", doesn't mention "a child that may or may not have a penis but FEELS like a boy"

Girl says "a female child".

fe·male Audio pronunciation of "female" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (fml)
adj.

1.
1. Of or denoting the sex that produces ova or bears young.
2. Characteristic of or appropriate to this sex; feminine.
3. Consisting of members of this sex


Tell me how this young child with a penis, testicles, no ova and can't bear young is a "female child". KTHX!


--------------------
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Hank, FTW]
    #5870724 - 07/17/06 07:41 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

What I can say, is when I have children, the boys will be boys, and the girls will be girls.

Hypothetically, if by some magic you woke up tomorrow morning with the body of, say, an old woman, what should be done with you?


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870728 - 07/17/06 07:42 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

BINGO!!!


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Hank, FTW]
    #5870735 - 07/17/06 07:43 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

alpharedecho said:
Not encourage this behaviour for one. This is a very complex issue, and I admit, I don't know all the answers.

What I can say, is when I have children, the boys will be boys, and the girls will be girls.




What if your son becomes the next RuPaul


--------------------


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870739 - 07/17/06 07:43 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
What I can say, is when I have children, the boys will be boys, and the girls will be girls.

Hypothetically, if by some magic you woke up tomorrow morning with the body of, say, an old woman, what should be done with you?




What a worthless "what if" scenario, you are just showing your defeat by saying such things.


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870743 - 07/17/06 07:44 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Tell me how this young child with a penis, testicles, no ova and can't bear young is a "female child".

She is physically a boy, but psychologically a girl. Why is that so hard to understand?


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5870748 - 07/17/06 07:45 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Basilides said:
Psychiatry's Golden Rule: Do no harm. allowing this child to persue the female identity reduces persisting suffering with the currently imposed male identity.




Sadly this poor kid will probably put a bullet in his head before he/she is 16.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870751 - 07/17/06 07:45 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
Tell me how this young child with a penis, testicles, no ova and can't bear young is a "female child".

She is physically a boy, but psychologically a girl. Why is that so hard to understand?




They think this young child is an abnormal pervert.


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Hank, FTW]
    #5870754 - 07/17/06 07:45 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

What a worthless "what if" scenario, you are just showing your defeat by saying such things.

No, I'm showing you the exact situation this little girl finds herself in.

Now, can you answer the question or will you evade it again?


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870766 - 07/17/06 07:48 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Sadly this poor kid will probably put a bullet in his head before he/she is 16.

You may be right, and the cause will be a lot more about bigoted societal attitudes like those saturating this thread than about her gender identity issues.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


Edited by Diploid (07/17/06 07:58 PM)


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870809 - 07/17/06 07:56 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
Quote:

Basilides said:
Psychiatry's Golden Rule: Do no harm.  allowing this child to persue the female identity reduces persisting suffering with the currently imposed male identity.




Sadly this poor kid will probably put a bullet in his head before  he/she is 16.




Probably, with all the cold hearted rectitude that people carry with them in regard to gender roles. Hopefully she'll have a loving and supportive family that will see her through the transition into adulthood, because she will without a doubt encounter the abuse of bigots. People lack compassion these days, what can one say :shrug:


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5870833 - 07/17/06 08:00 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

"what can one say"?

Don't send this child to public school!!  :eek: 

The backward, moronic, bigoted attitudes expressed in this thread will be increased exponentially in the public school environment.  Yuck.  :tongue:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Veritas]
    #5870846 - 07/17/06 08:03 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Yup! Homeschool.

but this sorry mom puts her in Public School and holds a Press conference!


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870851 - 07/17/06 08:04 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
Yup! Homeschool.

but this sorry mom puts her in Public School and holds a Press conference!




Maybe she has a bit of fortitude that we're unaware of.


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5870864 - 07/17/06 08:07 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
She is physically a boy, but psychologically a girl. Why is that so hard to understand?




Don't know, you'd have to ask Websters and Merriams dictionaries, not me. I'm just using the defined word.

What if I wake up on day and I feel like a real bitch? Can I just say "Ugh, I'm a woman today", and then change back?


The bottom line, do you honestly believe that a 5 year old child has the requisite agency and mental ability to determine that hes really a girl???


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870869 - 07/17/06 08:09 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Do autistic children decide that they are autistic? What part of intractability don't you understand?


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5870890 - 07/17/06 08:14 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

PROOF. Give me PROOF that it's some genetic thing and Ill accept it.


--------------------
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5870895 - 07/17/06 08:16 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Basilides said:
Do autistic children decide that they are autistic? What part of intractability don't you understand?




Do people decide to have a preference to anything?


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5870904 - 07/17/06 08:17 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Basilides said:
Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
Yup! Homeschool.

but this sorry mom puts her in Public School and holds a Press conference!






Maybe she has a bit of fortitude that we're unaware of.




Fortitude??????

She is a Crazy bitch.

I think the same Kid different article.

http://villagevoice.com/news/0622,reischel,73391,6.html




"What would you change about yourself?"

"Mm... my penis," Nicole murmurs.

"What would you do with it?" her mother asks.

"Um... cut it," Nicole replies, very softly.

"And what would you do with it then?" asks a surprised Lauren, who later says she's never before heard Nicole express dislike for her penis.

"I would hammer it," Nicole says.

"What?" Lauren says.

"Hammer it," Nicole insists more strongly.

This is a deeply disturbed child who needs help, not a lawyer to get him in to school as a female.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870908 - 07/17/06 08:18 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)



--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870922 - 07/17/06 08:20 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

xDuckYouSuckerx said:
I'm not a psychiatrist.  I'd say that something needs to be done, thats for sure.  The idiotic liberal mindset of just allowing disfunction to occur so that we can all feel warm and cuddly is just foolish.  This boy has a rather serious problem. 




:thumbup:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870930 - 07/17/06 08:23 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

The bottom line, do you honestly believe that a 5 year old child has the requisite agency and mental ability to determine that hes really a girl???

No. This is why a group of medical, mental health, and education professionals was consulted by her parents. The consensus is that she is a girl and that this is not something that will pass.

What happens when she becomes an adult and persists in insisting that she is a female psyche trapped in a male body. Will you finally take her word for it then?


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5870934 - 07/17/06 08:24 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

New research suggests genes and prenatal hormones could have more sway in gender identity than previously thought




Excuse me if I don't see that as the pure bedrock of logic and science that you do.


--------------------
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870935 - 07/17/06 08:24 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Male-to-Female Transsexuals Have Female Neuron Numbers in a Limbic Nucleus

Transsexuals experience themselves as being of the opposite sex, despite having the biological characteristics of one sex (19, 20, 21).

In line with the hypothesis that in transsexuals sexual differentiation of the brain contrasts with that of the genetic and physical characteristics of sex, our group has recently found that the size of the central subdivision of the BST (BSTc) was within the female range in genetically male-to-female transsexuals.

The Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism




http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/85/5/2034


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870939 - 07/17/06 08:24 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

And, also, that article basically says "everything we used to thing is now probably wrong!". So, in 10 years, something else could come up. Hardly real science.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870944 - 07/17/06 08:25 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I suppose you think the American Psychological Association is just another leftist Jewish conspiracy  :rolleyes:


--------------------


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Veritas]
    #5870948 - 07/17/06 08:26 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Oh yea? well... www.godhatesfags.com

Hah!


--------------------
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5870952 - 07/17/06 08:28 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Wow, thats not disturbing at all......


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5870958 - 07/17/06 08:29 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Diploid, Basilides, Veritas what do you people think about the article lonestar just posted?


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870963 - 07/17/06 08:30 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

xDuckYouSuckerx said:
Oh yea? well... www.godhatesfags.com

Hah!




Yes, that site is proof that humans can survive after donating their brains to science!!  :eek:  :shocked:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5870978 - 07/17/06 08:34 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I think that the Psychiatric profession is a bit, well, top-heavy with Jews, yes, and I think that they are ab it loony/left winged. If you need some "organization" to tell you that a 5 year old boy who wants to get rid of his penis (That he hates) isn't the most darlining little thing in the world, then I don't think I can help ya.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5870982 - 07/17/06 08:35 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

She seems Ok with the prospect of attending public school as a girl. How she will react to the first whim of intolerance is another question, but I doubt it hasn't been pondered.


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5870991 - 07/17/06 08:38 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

So then, you think that a 5 year old is capable of making these decisions? I mean, when I was five, I was making mud castles and playing with Tonka trucks, but this he/she can determine their own sexuality at that age? Thats seriously what you think?


--------------------
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5870993 - 07/17/06 08:38 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

what do you people think about the article lonestar just posted?

asks a surprised Lauren, who later says she's never before heard Nicole express dislike for her penis.

You're comparing a kid saying for the first time ever that he wants to cut off his penis to a little girl who's spontaneously exhibited an unwavering aversion to being male since she could talk? Alright...


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


Edited by Diploid (07/17/06 08:53 PM)


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5870994 - 07/17/06 08:38 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

xDuckYouSuckerx said:
I think that the Psychiatric profession is a bit, well, top-heavy with Jews, yes, and I think that they are ab it loony/left winged. If you need some "organization" to tell you that a 5 year old boy who wants to get rid of his penis (That he hates) isn't the most darlining little thing in the world, then I don't think I can help ya.




Why am I not surprised that your ideology conflicts with science.


--------------------


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5870997 - 07/17/06 08:38 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

d33p said:
Wow, thats not disturbing at all......




nope sometimes I Love to beat the meat. :smirk:


--------------------
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We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5871000 - 07/17/06 08:39 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
The bottom line, do you honestly believe that a 5 year old child has the requisite agency and mental ability to determine that hes really a girl???

No. This is why a group of medical, mental health, and education professionals was consulted by her parents. The consensus is that she is a girl and that this is not something that will pass.

What happens when she becomes an adult and persists in insisting that she is a female psyche trapped in a male body. Will you finally take her word for it then?




Well it seems like all those doctors have thoroughly convinced it(sisters choice of words, not mine) that it should embrace its dysfunction since it's just "a special girl." And it has "a girl brain in a boy body." So, i guess we'll never know.

Of course, they are infallible doctors.

I think this case is quite interesting. It seems like its a very extroverted person so I'm sure school would be weird for it.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5871001 - 07/17/06 08:39 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

So then, you think that a 5 year old is capable of making these decisions? I mean, when I was five, I was making mud castles and playing with Tonka trucks, but this he/she can determine their own sexuality at that age? Thats seriously what you think?


--------------------
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5871006 - 07/17/06 08:40 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Yup, thats the whole premise here. That medical society today is totally perfect, we've corrected all of the egregious errors of the past and modern medicine is absolutely, totally correct in every assertation that they make.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5871030 - 07/17/06 08:46 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

xDuckYouSuckerx said:
So then, you think that a 5 year old is capable of making these decisions? I mean, when I was five, I was making mud castles and playing with Tonka trucks, but this he/she can determine their own sexuality at that age? Thats seriously what you think?




As Diploid said, medical and psychiatric professionals have assessed her. Do you know what child psychology is? While you were playing with Tonka trucks (which by the way, were marketed by the Hassenfeld brothers - Jews) there were professionals observing behaviors on your part that you weren't even aware of. That is, if your parents were ever concerned about your well-being.


--------------------


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5871039 - 07/17/06 08:48 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
what do you people think about the article lonestar just posted?

asks a surprised Lauren, who later says she's never before heard Nicole express dislike for her penis.

You're comparing a kid saying for the first time ever that he wants to cut off his penis to a little girl who's spontaneously exhibited a non-wavering aversion to being male since she could talk? Alright...




Isn't it the same kid, I'm pretty sure it.

And it said that it wanted to cut off its dick and hammer it. Maybe the mother said that so the reporter wouldn't be thinking, "WTF THIS NUTS!!!"

Shit, in the other article it said it hated its penis. Where did that come from?

And did you read the whole article, why only reply to that?


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5871046 - 07/17/06 08:50 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

d33p said:
Diploid, Basilides, Veritas what do you people think about the article lonestar just posted?




She sounds like a child who has either been told or gathered for herself that having a penis does not "fit" with who she feels she is.  Expressing a wish to destroy what doesn't belong is something all bigots should understand.  :smirk:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5871049 - 07/17/06 08:50 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

i have a feeling basilides will keep this thread alive for years


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5871052 - 07/17/06 08:50 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

So you think that medical doctors and psychiatrists are always correct then, yes?


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Veritas]
    #5871055 - 07/17/06 08:52 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Nicole "carried like a girl" when Lauren was pregnant, but when Nicholas was born, he was definitely a baby boy.


Anyone know what this means? Im genuinely curious. Also the original article said males and females in the womb act a certain way.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5871068 - 07/17/06 08:56 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

And just another general question, is it usual practice to encourage a boy to be a girl(and vice versa) if they go through that phase as an toddler. The second article makes it clear that the parents encouraged it. Call me crazy, but no one i know nor i would encourage our three year old son to act like a girl and wear high heels and such. Maybe I'd just be a bad parent.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5871072 - 07/17/06 08:57 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

It's a myth that boys and girls "carry" differently, as in the mother's pregnant belly sits higher or lower depending upon the sex of the baby.

I've not read anything about male/female differences in fetal activity.  :shrug: 

Ultrasound is the way doctors "peek" at the baby during gestation, and even that doesn't always yield definitive results.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5871077 - 07/17/06 08:58 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

they say if you dangle a gold ring on a string over a womens pregnant stomache it rocks sideways or swings in a circle like divining rods or something
i've heard they can carry different too
wives tales


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: quiver]
    #5871095 - 07/17/06 09:05 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

wives tales

Exactly.

The fact that something does not work never stops a True Believer from believing it works anyway.


--------------------
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4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5871097 - 07/17/06 09:06 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

No, not always. 30, 40 years ago the medical establishment would have imposed the physiological identity on such a child without considering any kind of psychological implications. But one of the reflective guidelines of modern psychiatry is catharsis and harm reduction, and in this case, the male identity is a torment for this child. The professionals in this case are not at all attempting to conduct a consensus as to why gender dysphoria exists - that's for researchers and meta-analysts within the American Psychological Association to tend to. In this case, they are interested in bringing mental well-being to this child, and if it involves dresses and doll houses, then the Rx is already in.


--------------------


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Veritas]
    #5871098 - 07/17/06 09:07 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Veritas said:
It's a myth that boys and girls "carry" differently, as in the mother's pregnant belly sits higher or lower depending upon the sex of the baby.

I've not read anything about male/female differences in fetal activity.  :shrug: 

Ultrasound is the way doctors "peek" at the baby during gestation, and even that doesn't always yield definitive results.




So you didn't read the second article lonestar posted?

Please, Diploid, Veritas, and Basilides read the whole thing and offer at least a short opinion on it.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5871107 - 07/17/06 09:09 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

d33p said:
The second article makes it clear that the parents encouraged it.




Yup, its Liberalism gone Mad.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Diploid]
    #5871108 - 07/17/06 09:09 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

with a little wishful thinking and a flick of the wrist it could work:grin:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5871123 - 07/17/06 09:14 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Second article.......


See Tom Be Jane

The country's youngest transgender child is ready for school. But is school ready for her?

by Julia Reischel
May 31st, 2006 4:06 PM







Nicole has been insisting she's female since she could talk.

It's a spring break morning, and by 11 a.m. at the Anderson home, chaos is erupting. School is out for the week, and the twin boys are throwing a ball inside the spacious, two-story house. Upstairs, the preteen daughter pretends not to hear her mother calling. Lauren Anderson, a tanned and well-dressed stay-at-home mom who seems incapable of sitting still, cajoles her offspring to behave as she waits for a babysitter to arrive.
Her youngest, Nicole, five, is frowning. Nicole's face is framed with delicate brown braids, and her fingernails are painted a rainbow of colors. She plans to go swimming with a friend at the community pool, but at the moment, she doesn't like the way her dress feels. She yanks the hot-pink halter-top over her head, telling her mother, "This is poking me. I want to change my dress."

Minutes later, she scampers back, now as naked as a jaybird except for her underwear. Without the dress, you can clearly see her penis, tucked carefully into her pink patterned panties.

Born a biological male whom the family named Nicholas, Nicole today dresses, acts, and lives like a girl. She's been insisting she's female since she could talk, say the Andersons, who asked that their real names not be used for this article. "He has always been attracted to the flowers, the bright colors, his Barbie dolls, and his beloved mermaids," Lauren says, using the male pronoun for her child. In fact, talking with Lauren, who fully supports Nicole's desire to live as a girl, it's clear that the family is still working out the grammar of how to refer to its youngest.

"As a young toddler, he wouldn't let me snap her onesies together because she wanted to wear a 'dwess' like his sister," Lauren says, mixing pronouns like he and her interchangeably.

Lauren admits that the family is feeling its way down a path very few families find themselves navigating. Although it's common for young boys to play with dolls or paint their nails—what parents classically refer to as "a phase"—it's much rarer for a child to so completely identify as the opposite sex. And what to do about it has been the subject of fierce debate for decades.

Nine years ago, a Belgian film, Ma Vie en Rose, explored the most common reaction to a young boy's decision to live as a girl. In other words, the parents panicked. So did the rest of the neighborhood, who shunned and ridiculed the boy's family until they felt compelled to move away. In real life, meanwhile, another famous case in 2000 ended even worse. When Zachary Lipscomb's parents attempted to enroll him as a girl named Aurora in an Ohio school at age six, a state child protection agency took the child away.

Some therapists insist that such children should be discouraged from living as the opposite sex because, they have found, the large majority of such children grow out of it. Studies show that many end up as gay adults. But a growing coalition of therapists, scientists, and activists disagree and refer to such children—even those as young as three years old—as transgendered, insisting that the child's new identification shouldn't be discouraged.

The Andersons are in the latter camp, encouraging Nicholas to be Nicole. Experts consulted by this reporter say the Andersons are the only family in the United States supporting a five-year-old's choice to live as the opposite sex. This fall, the Andersons plan to enroll Nicole in a Broward County, Florida, kindergarten class as a female. They are convinced that's the only way she'll be happy.

That decision has rallied much support for the family's side. There's attorney Karen Doering of the National Center for Lesbian Rights, for example, who represented Michael Kantaras, a female-to-male transsexual, in a widely publicized 2004 victorious custody battle in the Florida Supreme Court. Kantaras, who won joint custody of his two children when the court ruled that his parental rights were not nullified by his sex change, was the first transsexual parent to win such a high-profile victory. Doering is advising the Andersons as they wait to hear from school officials, who so far have given no indication of how they plan to prepare for Nicole's enrollment.

And that's where Nicole's story veers even further from the ordinary. Because trying to pressure school officials to address the Andersons' concerns is a person who could be either a big help or a big distraction.

Mark Angelo Cummings, a man who once was a woman, has become something of a Spanish-language television talk-show phenomenon. Cummings's outspoken appearances, which have wowed Latino TV hosts with stories of his transformation, are leading to a new openness about transsexuality in the Latino community. And Cummings plans to use his celebrity, such as it is, to promote Nicole's cause.

This fall, whether it's ready or not, the Broward School District will make some sort of history. Thanks to a showboating transsexual guardian angel and the little boy who insists he's a girl.



On a recent morning, it takes a lot of coaxing to tear Nicole away from watching The Ten Commandments to tell a reporter how she feels about being a "special girl."

"Do you know why you're a special girl?" her mother asks.

"Because... I have a girl brain in a boy body," Nicole says, lowering her usual penetrating voice to an almost inaudible sigh.

"What does that feel like? Does it feel good? Or is it hard?"

"Hard," Nicole says.

When her mother asks her if she's happy with the way she looks, she says no.

"What would you change about yourself?"

"Mm... my penis," Nicole murmurs.

"What would you do with it?" her mother asks.

"Um... cut it," Nicole replies, very softly.

"And what would you do with it then?" asks a surprised Lauren, who later says she's never before heard Nicole express dislike for her penis.

"I would hammer it," Nicole says.

"What?" Lauren says.

"Hammer it," Nicole insists more strongly.

Later, Lauren says she constantly feels as if she's flying by the seat of her pants. "There is no protocol," she says. "Nobody knows of anybody. No five-year-olds who go to school fully transitioned. There's no book called How to Raise Your Gender Variant Preschooler."

Nicole "carried like a girl" when Lauren was pregnant, but when Nicholas was born, he was definitely a baby boy.

"So we dressed him all boyish," Lauren says, as she fondly turns the pages of a fat baby album. There are pages and pages of little Nicholas—with his family smiling at his bris, dressed in a tiny football uniform, being hugged by his older siblings. Nicholas looks happy. But Lauren says his desire to be treated like a girl was constant.

"At first, I thought it was cute," she explains. "I don't have a problem putting nail polish on a little boy. I don't have a problem if my son plays with dolls. His older brothers went through a similar period of doll playing and asking for nail polish on their toes. There's no reason to say no to a phase. I never once said 'no.' A phase is a phase."

So baby Nicholas was allowed to wear high heels. To play with Little Mermaid and Barbie dolls. To grow his hair a little longer. But instead of being satisfied with these concessions, Nicholas always asked for more. One day, he asked for something his parents weren't expecting.

Lauren was sitting at her computer working when two-year-old Nicholas, who, like all the Anderson children, had a frank understanding of anatomy, came to her with a request: "I want the fairy princess to come and make my penis into a vagina," he said.

Lauren mentioned Nicholas' strange demand to his pediatrician at the child's three-year birthday checkup, expecting to be told that the behavior was part of the phase. "She got a concerned look on her face," she says. "This was not the reaction I was looking for." The Andersons were advised to look into Nicholas' desires with the help of a therapist.

Frightened, Lauren says she turned to her college copy of the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) and looked up something called "Gender Identity Disorder," the clinical term for transsexualism. It seemed to describe Nicole's behaviors exactly.

The Andersons called Marcia Schultz, a psychologist in Coral Springs. One session with Nicholas, who was then three, convinced Schultz that he had a form of GID.

"Nicholas is a transsexual who wants to be a woman," Schultz says.

Through Schultz, the Andersons met Heather Wright, a jovial and frank male-to-female transsexual with a hearty handshake who lives in Green Acres with her female partner and their three children. They took Nicholas to see her. Wright immediately noticed that little Nicholas seemed uncomfortable in his body.

"He was definitely very quiet," Wright remembers. "He definitely wasn't happy with having to wear the clothes he was wearing. One of the things he was upset about was he wanted to wear girl clothes. All he got away with was getting Little Mermaid flip-flops."

After meeting with Schultz and Wright, the Andersons began allowing Nicholas to act and dress like a girl in the safety of their home or in the anonymity of the grocery store or at Disney World. That summer, Nicholas' camp even allowed him to wear a girl's bathing suit. But at preschool, Nicholas remained a boy and seemed satisfied with relegating his girl time to afterschool hours. Until he turned five.

"Right at the age of five, it was like 'boom,' " Lauren says. "Since he hit five, he totally rebelled and refused to wear boy clothes. Every single day was a fight. By the end of the school year, she looked like a totally different child."

Today, Nicole gets to be all girl at home and is supposed to be "neutral" in public at her preschool, where many of her friends, all girls, call her "she." But every day, Nicole chips away at the vestiges of her boyhood.

"I try to do the neutral thing, and it doesn't work," Lauren says, "Slowly, every day, a new article of clothing will come out of the closet. And we end up looking like a girl."



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


"Since he hit five, he totally rebelled and refused to wear boy clothes," says Nicole's mom. "Every single day was a fight. By the end of the school year, she looked like a totally different child."
photo: Colby Katz
Nicole has settled on a gender, but there's little else that's settled when it comes to Gender Identity Disorder. Even the name itself—that a child like Nicole has a "disorder"—is contested.

Until 1973, homosexuality was listed in the DSM as a mental disorder; then it was removed after intense debate in the psychiatric community. And many transsexuals believe GID should have been tossed out at the same time. For some, however, GID continues to be a useful diagnosis that helps determine whether a person is a good candidate for sex reassignment surgery.

Politics about transsexualism permeates any discussion of GID. The only long-range scientific study conducted by psychologists, harshly criticized by transsexual activists, shows that many boys diagnosed with GID as children grow up to be gay males and that only a few continue to identify as female. Studies by endocrinologists, on the other hand, have uncovered some biological similarities in the brains of transsexuals, a finding that suggests that transgenderism is not something one can merely "grow out of."

All of which means that there's little anyone can agree on when it comes to treating five-year-old boys who want to be girls.

"There are three basic types of attitudes about this," says Heino F.L. Meyer-Bahlburg, director of the Program of Developmental Psychoendocrinology at the New York State Psychiatric Institute and a professor of psychiatry at Columbia University. "There are people who are strictly anti-trans kids who always try to modify the behavior. There are people who are strongly supportive, who from the outset would strongly encourage a transgender identity. Then there are the people sitting on the fence."

Kenneth Zucker, a psychologist who has treated hundreds of young Gender Identity Disorder children at the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health at the University of Toronto, is a well-known proponent of modifying behavior. He advises that children with GID undergo therapy to work through their hatred of their bodies before being accepted as transsexuals. His clinical research shows that he has an 80 to 90 percent success rate of steering young GID children away from living as trans adults. Gay and transsexual groups are harshly critical of Zucker, saying that his work encourages religious-right organizations that seek to "cure" gays of their homosexuality. But Zucker himself has taken pains to separate himself and his work from those organizations.

Told of the Andersons and their plans to enroll Nicole in school as a girl, Zucker says he's concerned that the Andersons have been swayed by an activist transsexual agenda and are ignoring the possibility that Nicole might simply be a troubled child. "Let's see if there are ways to try and help this child work this through," he says. "Instead, they're going to cement this in more and more." He says that what the Andersons are doing could be considered "some type of emotional neglect."

Meyer-Bahlburg is more ambivalent. "Force doesn't really work very well. On the other hand, I don't feel clear about strong encouragement in the transgender direction, because the vast majority of kids fall out of it," he says. When he treats GID boys, he advises his patients to beef up boyish activities and play with carefully selected male playmates.

The Andersons, however, side with experts who consider children like Nicole transsexuals. Lauren attended the annual Philadelphia Trans-health Conference this January, where gender-variant children was a main topic and the subject of panels such as one titled "How Young Is Too Young?" Most parents at the conference seemed to agree that it's never too early to support a child as a transsexual, even at age five.

"I would never want to force any person to be something they're not," says Tom Anderson, Nicole's father. "This is different from 'It's time to stop drinking chocolate milk from a baba' or taking away a blanket. This is the essence of the person."


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

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Invisiblequiver
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5871154 - 07/17/06 09:22 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

could the parents be transgendered maybe?
thats fucking sick,they should not have those kids even if theyre not gay



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Edited by quiver (07/17/06 09:23 PM)


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5871160 - 07/17/06 09:24 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

i'm fucking seriously almost goign to vomit.


If my son is ever spoken of in a narticle that deals with barely being able to see his penis through his pink checkered panties, I'm going on a suicide mission.



Seems that the fucked up whacko liberal parents encouraged this sort of shit.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5871175 - 07/17/06 09:28 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

You all notice that he had a bris, right? Inherente self-loating in the Jewish mindset...


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5871259 - 07/17/06 09:52 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
"Get a clue."


some of the young boys put on dresses AND played with dolls! Is that gender dysphoria?

Sorry i will never understand a 3-5 year old being diagnosed with dysphoria phobe.




No, that is not gender dysphoria. That is an example of a tranvestism fetish.

"The diagnosis requires the absence of physical intersex conditions and the presence of clinically significant distress or impairment of psychological function (American Psychological Association, 1994Go). The condition varies in intensity from mild anxiety which may be managed by occasional cross-dressing, to a deeper confusion where counselling is necessary, or to the profound anxiety of `being in the wrong body'. Only in the more extreme cases is gender reassignment the appropriate treatment (Brown, 1990Go, Schlatterer et al., 1996Go; Cohen-Kettenis and Gooren, 1999Go)....There is evidence of associated changes in brain morphology. Post-mortem studies have shown that the bed nucleus of the stria terminalis is of smaller, typically female, size in male to female transsexuals (Zhou et al., 1995Go). Individuals in the primary gender dysphoria category also exhibit a well-documented lifelong deep disorder of core sexual identity not linked to stress (Levine and Lothstein 1981Go). It would seem from this that transexual feelings represent not only a psychological disorder, but also a social phenomenon with roots in possible physiological differences."


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5871274 - 07/17/06 09:55 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
Sadly this poor kid will probably put a bullet in his head before he/she is 16.




Actually, that is quite likely. Persons with severe Gender dysphoria or Gender Identity Disorder who do not undergo gender reassignment have a terribly high successful suicide rate, even higher than those with Bipolar disorder.


Edited by MushmanTheManic (07/17/06 10:08 PM)


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5871516 - 07/17/06 10:54 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

To begin, I don't even believe this thread belongs in this forum. It probably would fit better in P&S where people can be civil, but it already has a ton of replies, so it can stay.

This thread hasn't been terrible so far, but I don't want to see anyone taking stabs at each other. Anything not pertaining to the subject at hand will be deleted and vacations from PAL will be handed out. I just thought I would give you the heads up.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5871761 - 07/17/06 11:58 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

xDuckYouSuckerx said:
Quote:

Silversoul said:
Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
The Mom has a Masters in Sociology and the dad is a lawyer.......explains a lot.



Yes. People in the social sciences tend to have fewer redneck tendencies.




Don't you have a mullet?



No. Where the fuck did you get that idea?


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Redstorm]
    #5871781 - 07/18/06 12:02 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Oops. Sorry Redstorm, I didn't see that last post. Please don't ban me.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5872912 - 07/18/06 10:08 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

only in America...


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: kotik]
    #5873137 - 07/18/06 11:49 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

kotik said:
only in America...



I don't know about that. I'd expect this more out of Europe. But this does give me hope for my country.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5873184 - 07/18/06 12:04 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
this does give me hope for my country.




Makes me want to puke. Poor little fella.


--------------------
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We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5873221 - 07/18/06 12:23 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Yes, it's sad that the kid has to live with gender dysphoria, but I'm glad that at least the kid has loving, supportive parents. I'd hate to see what would happen if some of the people in this thread were the child's parents.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5873248 - 07/18/06 12:38 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

"One day Lauren was sitting at her computer working when two-year-old Nicholas, who, like all the Anderson children, had a frank understanding of anatomy, came to her with a request: "I want the fairy princess to come and make my penis into a vagina," he said."


Bullshit!

I've never heard of any 2-year-old (until now) whose vocabulary included "penis" and "vagina".

That mother is very Disturbed.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5873277 - 07/18/06 12:46 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
"One day Lauren was sitting at her computer working when two-year-old Nicholas, who, like all the Anderson children, had a frank understanding of anatomy, came to her with a request: "I want the fairy princess to come and make my penis into a vagina," he said."


Bullshit!

I've never heard of any 2-year-old (until now) whose vocabulary included "penis" and "vagina".

That mother is very Disturbed.




:thumbup:


--------------------
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:rofl:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5873293 - 07/18/06 12:51 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
"One day Lauren was sitting at her computer working when two-year-old Nicholas, who, like all the Anderson children, had a frank understanding of anatomy, came to her with a request: "I want the fairy princess to come and make my penis into a vagina," he said."


Bullshit!

I've never heard of any 2-year-old (until now) whose vocabulary included "penis" and "vagina".

That mother is very Disturbed.



So because the child has a good vocabulary, that means he/she has bad parents? Bullshit. I don't remember when I learned those words, but it was pretty early on. And teaching a child those words does not mean that you're teaching them to love one and hate the other.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5873759 - 07/18/06 02:35 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
"One day Lauren was sitting at her computer working when two-year-old Nicholas, who, like all the Anderson children, had a frank understanding of anatomy, came to her with a request: "I want the fairy princess to come and make my penis into a vagina," he said."


Bullshit!

I've never heard of any 2-year-old (until now) whose vocabulary included "penis" and "vagina".

That mother is very Disturbed.



So because the child has a good vocabulary, that means he/she has bad parents?  Bullshit.  I don't remember when I learned those words, but it was pretty early on.  And teaching a child those words does not mean that you're teaching them to love one and hate the other.




:thumbdown:

Sounds like you're being naive to me. They encouraged his behavior because they thought it was a phase. That to me is bad parenting. They ruined the kid as far I'm concerned. But I'm sure he'll be real happy living the rest of his life around the delusional liberal wackjobs mentioned the story. God forbid the "nazis" try and correct his dysfunction while hes still an impressional tike so he can live some semblance of a normal life.

:puke: is right


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5873775 - 07/18/06 02:39 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

These parents didn't just decide on their own that the child had gender dysphoria. That was the prognosis of a trained psychiatrist. You honestly think the parents wanted this? This would have to be a vast conspiracy involving many people in order for it to be deliberate.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5873839 - 07/18/06 02:57 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Did you even read the other article?

Do you know how many bad/fucked up kids/people there are in this world? A lot. Do you think the parents of those kids wanted them to be fucked up/bad? No. Does that mean all those parents are not at fault? No. Intention is not the issue. Good intentions will only get you so far in the world. Dumbass liberals don't seem to understand this at all.

The child no longer has just gender dysphoria.

They encouraged his behavior and could be heavily responsible for the current situation. They sent him to doctors who seemed to think it was not bad or wrong that he wanted to be a girl and castrate himself. Who do you think told him he has a girl's brain in a boys body? Surprise, surprise he ends up like this. Whether his gender dysphoria's root cause was biological or not and whether it could have been treated is not the issue im talking about. His dynsfunction was nutured and the product is the fucked up kid they have now. He is not normal. He sounds quite disturbed. Five year old boys shouldn't want to cut off their penis and hammer it.

Would you encourage or even allow your son to wear high heels, nail pollish, and dresses as a two/three year old?


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5873855 - 07/18/06 03:01 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
These parents didn't just decide on their own that the child had gender dysphoria. That was the prognosis of a trained psychiatrist. You honestly think the parents wanted this? This would have to be a vast conspiracy involving many people in order for it to be deliberate.





"Kenneth Zucker, a psychologist who has treated hundreds of young Gender Identity Disorder children at the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health at the University of Toronto, is a well-known proponent of modifying behavior.

Told of the Andersons and their plans to enroll Nicole in school as a girl, Zucker says he's concerned that the Andersons have been swayed by an activist transsexual agenda and are ignoring the possibility that Nicole might simply be a troubled child. "Let's see if there are ways to try and help this child work this through," he says. "Instead, they're going to cement this in more and more." He says that what the Andersons are doing could be considered "some type of emotional neglect."

"swayed by an activist transsexual agenda".......


Ya think????????


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5873874 - 07/18/06 03:05 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

As of right now, there is no known cure for gender dysphoria, save for sex change operations. The child is not comfortable with being a boy. The parents and doctors may have provided the child with the vocabulary to express her feelings, but they did not create those feelings, and certainly did not create this disorder. If a gender dysphoric child goes to school as their biological sex, they will get picked on just the same as would if they dressed as the opposite sex and everyone found out. At least by dressing up, the child can avoid the taunting for the time being.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5873884 - 07/18/06 03:07 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Stop quoting Hitler lonestar, what does he know.......


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5873898 - 07/18/06 03:10 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
As of right now, there is no known cure for gender dysphoria, save for sex change operations. The child is not comfortable with being a boy. The parents and doctors may have provided the child with the vocabulary to express her feelings, but they did not create those feelings, and certainly did not create this disorder. If a gender dysphoric child goes to school as their biological sex, they will get picked on just the same as would if they dressed as the opposite sex and everyone found out. At least by dressing up, the child can avoid the taunting for the time being.




Bullshit, not everyone agrees with those doctors. And you seem to be dodging the majority of what I was postulating.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5873989 - 07/18/06 03:43 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I've addressed what I can. But let me ask you a question: Since you're so smart, what would you do with a child who had gender dysphoria? Personally, I'd follow the doctor's advice.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5874039 - 07/18/06 04:08 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

You've adressed nothing which contradicts your position. I can only infer that you are ignoring what condricts your position.

And i wrote my response to your impudent question, but you are going to need to answer my question, which you've been ignoring, first.

Would you encourage or even allow your two/three year old son to wear high heels, nail pollish, and dresses?


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5874044 - 07/18/06 04:10 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

d33p said:
Would you encourage or even allow your two/three year old son to wear high heels, nail pollish, and dresses?



I have answered that: I said I would do whatever the doctor suggested. If he suggested that, then yes.

Now answer my question: What would you do if your child had gender dysphoria?


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5874056 - 07/18/06 04:14 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I've never heard of any 2-year-old (until now) whose vocabulary included "penis" and "vagina".

The sexual precocity of this child probably contributed to his diagnosis.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5874066 - 07/18/06 04:19 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

They encouraged his behavior because they thought it was a phase. That to me is bad parenting. They ruined the kid as far I'm concerned.

If the child truly has Gender dysphoria, the parents did the correct thing. No amount of "good parenting" can prevent a neuropathological syndrome that develops in the womb.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5874091 - 07/18/06 04:27 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

"swayed by an activist transsexual agenda"

I'm surprised you've unwittingly uncovered the latest Liberal terror tactic. It seems the Pinkos are encouraging gender bending in a planned effort to confuse, thus demoralizing and weakening, the righteous Conservatives. I suspect many Liberals are contingent homosexuals themselves, but this is another matter entirely. We must eradicate the pervasive transsexual influence that threatens to destroy These Great States.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5874100 - 07/18/06 04:29 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

MushmanTheManic said:
"swayed by an activist transsexual agenda"

I'm surprised you've unwittingly uncovered the latest Liberal terror tactic. It seems the Pinkos are encouraging gender bending in a planned effort to confuse, thus demoralizing and weakening, the righteous Conservatives. I suspect many Liberals are contingent homosexuals themselves, but this is another matter entirely. We must eradicate the pervasive transsexual influence that threatens to destroy These Great States.



:rofl2:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5874103 - 07/18/06 04:31 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
I have answered that: I said I would do whatever the doctor suggested. If he suggested that, then yes.





So you would call a doctor right away if your son did anything strange concerning gender/sex? What do you think the doctor is gonna say to you while your standing in front of your kid with one hand on the phone and one hand tugging a dress awawy from your two year old.....

You don't seem to be getting the question. The parents encouraged the behavior and then it exacerbated to a certain point at which time they got in touch with doctors. I'm talking about at the first signs of the behavior. Would you have done the same as the parents or discouraged/stop the behavior or called the shrink you must have on speed dial as your answer seems to indicate?

And how would you know what doctor to call so you can follow their directions? You can find a doctor to support anything, you should know that.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5874122 - 07/18/06 04:36 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I wouldn't see much harm in a boy dressing up in women's clothes. In fact, at first I'd think it was rather cute and funny, and would probably take pictures. If it became a bigger issue, as it clearly did, I would call a doctor that I trust, just as any good parent would. You seem to be implying that they intentionally called a quack who would support the idea that the child had gender dysphoria. I find such a notion laughable.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5874220 - 07/18/06 05:00 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

MushmanTheManic said:
They encouraged his behavior because they thought it was a phase. That to me is bad parenting. They ruined the kid as far I'm concerned.

If the child truly has Gender dysphoria, the parents did the correct thing. No amount of "good parenting" can prevent a neuropathological syndrome that develops in the womb.




An opinion which not everyone shares. However, this is not the issue. The kid no longer has just gender dysphoria, it developed into something more possibliy due to encouragement. Could the dysfunction be corrected with the proper help and parenting? Maybe, maybe not. The only one harmed by not trying is the little kid.

Quote:

The Andersons called Marcia Schultz, a psychologist in Coral Springs. One session with Nicholas, who was then three, convinced Schultz that he had a form of GID.

"Nicholas is a transsexual who wants to be a woman," Schultz says.

After meeting with Schultz and Wright, the Andersons began allowing Nicholas to act and dress like a girl in the safety of their home or in the anonymity of the grocery store or at Disney World. That summer, Nicholas' camp even allowed him to wear a girl's bathing suit. But at preschool, Nicholas remained a boy and seemed satisfied with relegating his girl time to afterschool hours. Until he turned five.





They seemed to have made up their minds rather quick and sudden on such a complicated and difficult issue, dontcha think?

Quote:

Kenneth Zucker, a psychologist who has treated hundreds of young Gender Identity Disorder children at the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health at the University of Toronto, is a well-known proponent of modifying behavior. He advises that children with GID undergo therapy to work through their hatred of their bodies before being accepted as transsexuals. His clinical research shows that he has an 80 to 90 percent success rate of steering young GID children away from living as trans adults. Gay and transsexual groups are harshly critical of Zucker, saying that his work encourages religious-right organizations that seek to "cure" gays of their homosexuality. But Zucker himself has taken pains to separate himself and his work from those organizations.

Told of the Andersons and their plans to enroll Nicole in school as a girl, Zucker says he's concerned that the Andersons have been swayed by an activist transsexual agenda and are ignoring the possibility that Nicole might simply be a troubled child. "Let's see if there are ways to try and help this child work this through," he says. "Instead, they're going to cement this in more and more." He says that what the Andersons are doing could be considered "some type of emotional neglect."




I'm sure Zucker is just one of those crazy conservative conspiracy nuts you mentioned. What does he know, he is only another doctor.

Quote:


Meyer-Bahlburg is more ambivalent. "Force doesn't really work very well. On the other hand, I don't feel clear about strong encouragement in the transgender direction, because the vast majority of kids fall out of it," he says. When he treats GID boys, he advises his patients to beef up boyish activities and play with carefully selected male playmates.

The Andersons, however, side with experts who consider children like Nicole transsexuals. Lauren attended the annual Philadelphia Trans-health Conference this January, where gender-variant children was a main topic and the subject of panels such as one titled "How Young Is Too Young?" Most parents at the conference seemed to agree that it's never too early to support a child as a transsexual, even at age five.

"I would never want to force any person to be something they're not," says Tom Anderson, Nicole's father. "This is different from 'It's time to stop drinking chocolate milk from a baba' or taking away a blanket. This is the essence of the person."





Would you agree that what the father says is liberal hogwash? The kid is three, does that means you can force him to do everything else the "right" way, but something so important as their sexual identity, "their essence," should be left up to the kid and single minded people so he can be fucked up and alienated for the rest of his life?

And it really looks theirs minds are soundly made up. It doesn't even seem like they bothered to get much of a second opinion. I'll tell you, my kid would have deservered more than just a second opinion.

The possibliy that the Andersons have been swayed by an activist transsexual agenda doesn't sound so far fetched to me.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5874269 - 07/18/06 05:18 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
I wouldn't see much harm in a boy dressing up in women's clothes. In fact, at first I'd think it was rather cute and funny, and would probably take pictures. If it became a bigger issue, as it clearly did, I would call a doctor that I trust, just as any good parent would. You seem to be implying that they intentionally called a quack who would support the idea that the child had gender dysphoria. I find such a notion laughable.




Read this. Was this good parenting? Would you have done what the parents did here?

Quote:

"At first, I thought it was cute," she explains. "I don't have a problem putting nail polish on a little boy. I don't have a problem if my son plays with dolls. His older brothers went through a similar period of doll playing and asking for nail polish on their toes. There's no reason to say no to a phase. I never once said 'no.' A phase is a phase."

So baby Nicholas was allowed to wear high heels. To play with Little Mermaid and Barbie dolls. To grow his hair a little longer. But instead of being satisfied with these concessions, Nicholas always asked for more. One day, he asked for something his parents weren't expecting.

Lauren was sitting at her computer working when two-year-old Nicholas, who, like all the Anderson children, had a frank understanding of anatomy, came to her with a request: "I want the fairy princess to come and make my penis into a vagina," he said.





And no where did i imply that they intentionally called a quack who would support the idea that the child had gender dysphoria. How you came to that conclusion is sad to say the least.

What they did however was go to one nearby Shrink who after one meeting was convinced that the kid had a form of GID. From there they started meeting transsexual's and similarly minded groups leading them to only be exposed to one possibility. Acceptance. It seems that they were content with only believing in this one possiblity which in my mind is wrong.

In this case there are doctors who support both sides. How do you choose which doctor to believe? Wouldn't it ultimately end up being your decision and not a doctors?


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5874340 - 07/18/06 05:40 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I don't see any evidence of the parents encouraging anything.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5874386 - 07/18/06 05:52 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Basilides said:
I don't see any evidence of the parents encouraging anything.




Blind?

Quote:

"At first, I thought it was cute," she explains. "I don't have a problem putting nail polish on a little boy. I don't have a problem if my son plays with dolls. His older brothers went through a similar period of doll playing and asking for nail polish on their toes. There's no reason to say no to a phase. I never once said 'no.' A phase is a phase."

So baby Nicholas was allowed to wear high heels. To play with Little Mermaid and Barbie dolls. To grow his hair a little longer. But instead of being satisfied with these concessions, Nicholas always asked for more. One day, he asked for something his parents weren't expecting.

Lauren was sitting at her computer working when two-year-old Nicholas, who, like all the Anderson children, had a frank understanding of anatomy, came to her with a request: "I want the fairy princess to come and make my penis into a vagina," he said.




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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5874390 - 07/18/06 05:53 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

You seem to confuse a lack of discouragement with encouragement.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5874397 - 07/18/06 05:56 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I don't see any encouragement. Should normal parents be horrified beyond capacity at the first sight of Barbie or something?


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5874398 - 07/18/06 05:57 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I find it troubling when parents try to stamp out self-expression in their children, and become anal about them being normal.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5874438 - 07/18/06 06:09 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

You guys seem to be delusional. You also don't seem to have the capacity to grasp the meanings of encourage.

If a kid wants something he can't get and you give it to him, you are encouraging him to pursue that act. Are you guys really that far gone?

Maybe I should ask my sister about the matter. She is in her senior year at UM pursuing a BSED with an emphasis on child psychology.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5874474 - 07/18/06 06:17 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Does she have an anti-LGBT bias?


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5874493 - 07/18/06 06:22 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Basilides said:
Does she have an anti-LGBT bias?




Not at all. However, why should it matter? A question could be phrased without including specifics.


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5874506 - 07/18/06 06:25 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

You'd be surprised how often political views conflict with science


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5874649 - 07/18/06 06:58 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
Yes, it's sad that the kid has to live with gender dysphoria, but I'm glad that at least the kid has loving, supportive parents. I'd hate to see what would happen if some of the people in this thread were the child's parents.




if you think twisting a kids mind to suit a politically correct sexual trend is being 'loving' then i damn well hope you are sterile


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: quiver]
    #5874656 - 07/18/06 06:59 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Gender dysphoria is not a trend


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5874682 - 07/18/06 07:03 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
I've addressed what I can.  But let me ask you a question:  Since you're so smart, what would you do with a child who had gender dysphoria?  Personally, I'd follow the doctor's advice.




personally i'd wonder where i went wrong and the best thing between a shrink and a child is distance,a 'smart' counselor told me that one :smirk:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5874694 - 07/18/06 07:05 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Basilides said:
Gender dysphoria is not a trend




thats the greatness of a free world,we can all have different opinions


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: quiver]
    #5874723 - 07/18/06 07:12 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

That's fine, just keep it out of policy  :smirk:


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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Basilides]
    #5875100 - 07/18/06 08:18 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

well when people like you irl try to encroach their self rightious twisted beliefs onto me,i'll do something about it besides type words:D


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InvisibleMushmanTheManic
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Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5876229 - 07/19/06 12:55 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

An opinion which not everyone shares. However, this is not the issue. The kid no longer has just gender dysphoria, it developed into something more possibliy due to encouragement. Could the dysfunction be corrected with the proper help and parenting? Maybe, maybe not. The only one harmed by not trying is the little kid.

The parents may have facilitated the development of this syndrome, but to me it seems unlikely. It is not unusual for children to explore masculine and feminine roles, but generally, when the child hits puberty, the role for him or her is clearly defined. This child though is years away from puberty and has already defined his role as a female. It is possible that the child is terrible confused. It is also possible that this child truly has Gender dysphoria syndrome and his brain exhibits characteristics typical of a female brain.

Environment and genetics cannot be seperated, but if the first possibility is true, then the parents or other factors in the childs environment most likely caused this problem. If the second possibility is true, the problem was probably a result of a physiological problem that was mostly unaffected by parenting.

They seemed to have made up their minds rather quick and sudden on such a complicated and difficult issue, dontcha think?

This isn't just some kid who is effeminate and likes to play with dolls. When a boy talks about genital mutilation and the desire to be a woman, at the age of five, clearly something is very wrong.

I'm sure Zucker is just one of those crazy conservative conspiracy nuts you mentioned. What does he know, he is only another doctor.

Zucker deals with Gender Identity Disorder, not Gender Dysphoria syndrome. Those with GID identify with the opposite sex (and sex roles) rather than their own sex. Basically, they're effeminate men (queers) and masculine women (dykes). Gender Identity Disorder also involves no physiological abnormalities. Individuals with Gender Dysphoria feel like "A man in a womans body" and show physiological differences in their brain.

Although... I'd like to see psychotherapy and parent counseling employed first and gender reassignment used as a last resort.


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InvisibleHank, FTW
Looking for the Answer

Registered: 05/04/06
Posts: 3,912
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5877046 - 07/19/06 09:25 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Anyone remember the movie "Boys Don't Cry"? Tell me, what was the theme of this Hollywood movie? Who were the villains? What was its point of view? What is your point of view?

I agree with quiver, this shit is part of a trend, and Hollywood helped kicked it off.


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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Offlined33p
Welcome to Violence

Registered: 07/12/03
Posts: 5,381
Loc: the shores of Tripoli
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5877182 - 07/19/06 10:40 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

MushmanTheManic said:
An opinion which not everyone shares. However, this is not the issue. The kid no longer has just gender dysphoria, it developed into something more possibliy due to encouragement. Could the dysfunction be corrected with the proper help and parenting? Maybe, maybe not. The only one harmed by not trying is the little kid.

The parents may have facilitated the development of this syndrome, but to me it seems unlikely. It is not unusual for children to explore masculine and feminine roles, but generally, when the child hits puberty, the role for him or her is clearly defined. This child though is years away from puberty and has already defined his role as a female. It is possible that the child is terrible confused. It is also possible that this child truly has Gender dysphoria syndrome and his brain exhibits characteristics typical of a female brain.

Environment and genetics cannot be seperated, but if the first possibility is true, then the parents or other factors in the childs environment most likely caused this problem. If the second possibility is true, the problem was probably a result of a physiological problem that was mostly unaffected by parenting.

They seemed to have made up their minds rather quick and sudden on such a complicated and difficult issue, dontcha think?

This isn't just some kid who is effeminate and likes to play with dolls. When a boy talks about genital mutilation and the desire to be a woman, at the age of five, clearly something is very wrong.

I'm sure Zucker is just one of those crazy conservative conspiracy nuts you mentioned. What does he know, he is only another doctor.

Zucker deals with Gender Identity Disorder, not Gender Dysphoria syndrome. Those with GID identify with the opposite sex (and sex roles) rather than their own sex. Basically, they're effeminate men (queers) and masculine women (dykes). Gender Identity Disorder also involves no physiological abnormalities. Individuals with Gender Dysphoria feel like "A man in a womans body" and show physiological differences in their brain.

Although... I'd like to see psychotherapy and parent counseling employed first and gender reassignment used as a last resort.




I'm talking more about how they never said no to his demands and seemed to allow this to go on for a long time(they let him grow out his hair) without thinking any strange about it. How could that not have fostered the behavior. Hes just a little kid, they are very impressionable even with a neuro-pathological syndrome i imagine.

And hasn't the child's condition progressed beyond just gender dysphoria now, or would you just call it an extreme case. To me it seems like its gone way beyond just anxiety or the base definition of the term as its my under standing. Like i asked before, "Genetics doesn't make a kid hate his penis, want to cut it off and hammer it, and want to wear girl clothes; does it?" I dont see how his environment couldn't have failed him. He is seriously messed up. It makes me mad that 2-3 years of going to shrink and all the other "beneficial" stuff the parents were doing left their kid in this state.

I'd agree that there was something wrong with the kid that couldn't have been corrected by the parents by the time they went to the shrink. I should have been more clear but i meant they had quickly decided on a plan of action which appears to have been acceptance. I think the shrink's position seems quite clear considering her following actions and the influence she had on the parents if they werent so pro "accepting their kids condition" beforehand. Sorry, but if it was my kid i wouldn't just accept that my kid would have to endure one of the most difficult life paths right off the bat when hes only a three year old.

About Zucker, i was talking about what he said about the parents and the situation not about whether he could have cured the kid since i had assumed there was some difference between GID and GD.

And thank you for saying you'd like to see psychotherapy and parent counseling employed first and gender reassignment used as a last resort. I'm not closed off to the idea of gender reassignment, i just think it should have been the last resort as do you. Whether Liberalism or an activist pro-transsexual agenda caused the parents to react the way they did is arguable imo.

And i find the thought of that transsexual conference they went to with their kid scary. It sounds like incestuous amplification to me. Thats never good.


--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


Edited by d33p (07/19/06 10:48 AM)


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InvisibleHank, FTW
Looking for the Answer

Registered: 05/04/06
Posts: 3,912
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5877315 - 07/19/06 11:15 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I didn't get to pick my haircuts/clothes/etc until I was at least 8 or 9....and what is wrong with that.


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Hank, FTW]
    #5877753 - 07/19/06 01:17 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

alpharedecho said:
I didn't get to pick my haircuts/clothes/etc until I was at least 8 or 9....and what is wrong with that.



Nothing, but I also see nothing wrong with letting the child make that choice either.


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InvisibleHank, FTW
Looking for the Answer

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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5877872 - 07/19/06 01:47 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
Quote:

alpharedecho said:
I didn't get to pick my haircuts/clothes/etc until I was at least 8 or 9....and what is wrong with that.



Nothing, but I also see nothing wrong with letting the child make that choice either.




Yeah just like that Adam Sandler movie: "Big Daddy", good movie, but not practical or good parenting to let your toddler/child run the show.


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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Invisible1stimer
Religion=Rape
Registered: 11/18/01
Posts: 1,280
Loc: Amerika
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Silversoul]
    #5877985 - 07/19/06 02:18 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Nothing, but I also see nothing wrong with letting the child make that choice either.



Children need to be guided in life because they are ignorant.


--------------------
ash dingy donker mo gollyhopper patty popiton rockstop bueno mayo riggedy jig bobber johnathan pattywhacker gogboob t-shirt monkey.

There is such emotion in the distortion.


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Offlinerelativexistance
"beads, bees!?!?beads ....BEADS!!!"
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: 1stimer]
    #5878946 - 07/19/06 07:50 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Usage Note: Traditionally, gender has been used primarily to refer to the grammatical categories of “masculine,” “feminine,” and “neuter,” but in recent years the word has become well established in its use to refer to sex-based categories, as in phrases such as gender gap and the politics of gender. This usage is supported by the practice of many anthropologists, who reserve sex for reference to biological categories, while using gender to refer to social or cultural categories. According to this rule, one would say The effectiveness of the medication appears to depend on the sex (not gender) of the patient, but In peasant societies, gender (not sex) roles are likely to be more clearly defined. This distinction is useful in principle, but it is by no means widely observed, and considerable variation in usage occurs at all levels.

Note the by no means widely observed, i.e. if you're born with a ding dong you are a male. Also by no means am I referring to homosexuality, so don't get that confused. This kid has a mental problem or was socially programmed wrong to believe they are something they aren't. For them to think they are a female they would have to look down at their penis and not see its existance. A person is just a person, if a boy wants to wear girls clothes and play with dolls who gives a shit thats what they want to do. But when they start denying their very biological existance thats just messed up. Its such a bullshit term/diagnosis, I mean what if I was born to think shit I'm a dog. I'm not a human being, I'm a dog. Would it be alright to allow me to continue my life thinking I'm a dog? I mean deep down inside I'm not a human being I am a dog, I can feel my inner dog want to go run out in the grass on all fours and play catch. Same thing as this poor little kids case, I just don't agree with this diagnosis/term of transgendered.


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OfflinePhred
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: relativexistance]
    #5879059 - 07/19/06 08:25 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

:thumbup:


Phred


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InvisibleHank, FTW
Looking for the Answer

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Posts: 3,912
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: relativexistance]
    #5880990 - 07/20/06 10:53 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

relativexistance said:
Usage Note: Traditionally, gender has been used primarily to refer to the grammatical categories of “masculine,” “feminine,” and “neuter,” but in recent years the word has become well established in its use to refer to sex-based categories, as in phrases such as gender gap and the politics of gender. This usage is supported by the practice of many anthropologists, who reserve sex for reference to biological categories, while using gender to refer to social or cultural categories. According to this rule, one would say The effectiveness of the medication appears to depend on the sex (not gender) of the patient, but In peasant societies, gender (not sex) roles are likely to be more clearly defined. This distinction is useful in principle, but it is by no means widely observed, and considerable variation in usage occurs at all levels.

Note the by no means widely observed, i.e. if you're born with a ding dong you are a male. Also by no means am I referring to homosexuality, so don't get that confused. This kid has a mental problem or was socially programmed wrong to believe they are something they aren't. For them to think they are a female they would have to look down at their penis and not see its existance. A person is just a person, if a boy wants to wear girls clothes and play with dolls who gives a shit thats what they want to do. But when they start denying their very biological existance thats just messed up. Its such a bullshit term/diagnosis, I mean what if I was born to think shit I'm a dog. I'm not a human being, I'm a dog. Would it be alright to allow me to continue my life thinking I'm a dog? I mean deep down inside I'm not a human being I am a dog, I can feel my inner dog want to go run out in the grass on all fours and play catch. Same thing as this poor little kids case, I just don't agree with this diagnosis/term of transgendered.




Well said! 5 shroomz


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:


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InvisibleMeat_Log_Smurf
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Registered: 01/31/03
Posts: 1,144
Loc: BFE
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #5881696 - 07/20/06 03:13 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I agree. My best friends (female) half brother was raise as a girl in the home. His mom had sole custody and she dressed him in female clothing and put makeup on him. He's a flaming homo. Coincidence, I think not.


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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Meat_Log_Smurf]
    #5881707 - 07/20/06 03:18 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Anyone here see the movie Sleepaway Camp?


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Offlined33p
Welcome to Violence

Registered: 07/12/03
Posts: 5,381
Loc: the shores of Tripoli
Last seen: 10 years, 8 months
Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: Redstorm]
    #5882067 - 07/20/06 05:31 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Yea, that was an under rated slasher series. I got the boxed set a few years ago.


--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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OfflineRedstorm
Prince of Bugs
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Re: 'Transgendered' Child Set to Enter Florida School System [Re: d33p]
    #5882109 - 07/20/06 05:44 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

this thread reminds me of the end of the first movie


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