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OfflineMXNR
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Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
If there is a God, I am him.
    #5827567 - 07/06/06 12:54 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

First off, I guess technically this should go into the Religion forum, but I refuse to post in it because of the strict, pussy-ass guidelines:

"Similar to our Philosophy & Spirituality forum, here is a place for the dreamers who do not wish to have their ideas harshly criticized or disproved. Freely express and discuss your personal beliefs on spirituality, religion, mysticism and the paranormal. Share your views of the universe, souls, god(s), extraterrestrials and beyond. Attempting to disprove or discredit an idea will not be tolerated. If you wish to debate and argue a position, the Philosophy & Spirituality forum is your alternative."

Who doesn't want their ideas openly discussed? Why are you posting them on the internet then? As opposed to say...A NOTEBOOK! You know, they're just like a textbook but the pages are blank...and you write in them with a pen? Why do adults need a special little room where they can go and get protected from anyone who would openly question/discuss/attempt to disprove something they POSTED ON THE PUBLIC INTERNET?

Anyway, have any of you stumbled across an idea similar to this one:

"If there is a god, I am him."

DO you understand what I mean? It seems to me that if there is any form of greater sentience than the human mind, that it must be intimately connected with me in some way. I am reminded of a Bill Hicks quote:

"Today, a young man on acid realized that all matter is merely energy condensed to a slow vibration. That we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively. There is no such thing as death, life is only a dream and we're the imagination of ourselves."

Also, whenever I take a "Heroic dose" of shrooms (5g is McKenna's benchmark) I come to a point where I understand that I am everything; that all points are intricately connected and I am somehow bound up with the rest of it all. There's been a few points where I've said to myself in utter astonishment, "I....am....god." I don't claim that these things are true, nor do I claim to understand the scope of it all. But, it sure seemed like "enlightenment" to me.

Any of you have similar experiences? Have any Ideas about this?

The way that Alan watts describes it is:

Imagine a dark globe, like a dark blue bulb of cloth. Then imagine that the sphere has a billion tiny little hole in it, out of which light shines. Now, if you look at the thing as being a bunch of individual, tiny holes, each with an individual identity, well, just remember that they're just holes, the source of the light is one.

He must've had a similar experience to have thought something like that. I think that his description pretty much hits the mail on the head, although I don't know what implications that understanding holds, if any. Would that change the nature of my existence? Does this mean that death is an illusion? Another Hicks quote:

"The world is like a ride at an amusement park. And when you choose to go on it, you think it's real because that's how powerful our minds are. And the ride goes up and down and round and round. It has thrills and chills and it's very brightly coloured and it's very loud and it's fun, for a while. Some people have been on the ride for a long time, and they begin to question: Is this real, or is this just a ride? And other people have remembered, and they come back to us, they say, 'Hey – don't worry, don't be afraid ever, because this is just a ride ...' And we ... kill those people. Ha ha, 'Shut him up. We have a lot invested in this ride. Shut him up. Look at my furrows of worry. Look at my big bank account and my family. This just has to be real.' It's just a ride. But we always kill those good guys who try and tell us that, you ever notice that? And let the demons run amok. But it doesn't matter, because – it's just a ride. And we can change it anytime we want. It's only a choice. No effort, no work, no job, no savings and money. A choice, right now, between fear and love. The eyes of fear want you to put bigger locks on your doors, buy guns, close yourself off. The eyes of love instead see all of us as one. Here's what we can do to change the world, right now, to a better ride. Take all that money we spend on weapons and defenses each year and instead, spend it feeding and clothing and educating the poor of the world, which it would pay for many times over, not one human being excluded, and we could explore space, together, both inner and outer, forever, in peace. Thank you very much, you've been great." [several gunshots ring out, Bill mimes being hit and falls to floor, motionless.]

Feel free to openly criticize, discuss, ignore, debate, or question anything I've said in this post; I think we can handle that. But if it gets too tough I'm telling Mommy and you'll be in big, big trouble. :wink:


--------------------
Master: Everyday change your clothes and eat your food and you will become enlightened.

Pupil: Master, I do not understand...

Master: If you don't understand, eat your food and change your clothes.


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Offlineleery11
I Tell You What!

Registered: 06/24/05
Posts: 5,998
Last seen: 8 years, 9 months
Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: MXNR]
    #5827836 - 07/06/06 02:09 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

whoa I didn't know Mr Hicks was that way... I thought he was just a cynical comedian.

neatness (referring to the 2nd quote you posted).

God isn't entirely appropriate if everyone is God..... as God is usually thought of as something with "power" per se....... and "with great power comes great responsibility."

I think saying we are all Buddhas would perhaps be better.... or we all have electrical outlets in us to become directly attached to (and therefore be, but with the exception of generally still being a human during the process) God, but most of us lost our extension cords or don't realize they exist.

about his second quote, it is estimated that if every north american internet user gave a meager $40 a year to charity, starvation would be wiped out.

also if there were no drug war we could wipe out starvation, annually, as well. that's right, anually, every year, we spend roughly enough to feed the world arresting people like us and flying around looking for marjiuana plants. There's one boys! Good job, you found plants growing upon earth!!!! Now the world is forever saved. Oh damnation! Who knew that weeds would keep growing and coming back........ our job is never done.


--------------------
I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo!

....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human......
Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!


Edited by leery11 (07/06/06 02:11 PM)


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Offlinethirdeyetruth
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Registered: 07/04/06
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Last seen: 17 years, 6 months
Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: leery11]
    #5827846 - 07/06/06 02:16 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

i wouldnt go as far as to say that i am God, but i would argue this, i am the creator. in my unuiverse, i control everything, since i am what gives it existence. it comes bakc the question : if a tree falls and no one hears it... yadayada. the point is that we live in a objective universe, and if there is nothing out there to percieve an event, then that event does not exist. and so in that sense, we are to ourselves GOOOOODS, faak.... nonsense???


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Offlineleery11
I Tell You What!

Registered: 06/24/05
Posts: 5,998
Last seen: 8 years, 9 months
Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: thirdeyetruth]
    #5827864 - 07/06/06 02:24 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

there is always something around to witness the trees collapse.... the grass. the tree itself.

how the first came into being is puzzling, and how the illusion of separation spread out is even moreso. of course, there IS separation......


--------------------
I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo!

....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human......
Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!


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OfflineMXNR
Did the Mushroom choose you?
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Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 406
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Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: leery11]
    #5827872 - 07/06/06 02:28 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

leery 11,

Yeah, Hicks got really spiritual and just pulled out all the stops right before the died of cancer. I Seriously suggest you smoke a bowl and watch/listen anything you can find by him. He is hilarious, brilliant, and a friend of the MUSHROOM! I recommend the video, "Sane Man." And the album, "Rant in E minor."

Also, here are some more Hicks quotes related to your post:

"Here is my final point. About drugs, about alcohol, about pornography and smoking and everything else. What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?"

"Why is marijuana against the law? It grows naturally upon our planet. Doesn't the idea of making nature against the law seem to you a bit... unnatural? You know what I mean? It's nature. How do you make nature against the fucking law?"

Also, I guess I should have clarified something. When I say I am god, I don't mean god in the sense of Zeus or Allah or Jehovah. I mean god, as in the boundless everything of existence. I suppose my previous Christian programming crept out in my first post. I suppose what I mean by understanding that I am god is, I understand that the only boundaries between me an everything else in the universe are mental ones or temporary ones.


Edited by MXNR (07/06/06 02:37 PM)


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Offlinethirdeyetruth
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Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: MXNR]
    #5827918 - 07/06/06 02:43 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

brilliant! that says it well...
on shrooms i once felt that i could do anything, and it would be just, because i had made the choice to do it.


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Offlinethirdeyetruth
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Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: leery11]
    #5827934 - 07/06/06 02:47 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

an observer must always be external, ie. the tree can witness itself falling,but that is really not a great example.  and so what about our universe? how are we observed...
:confused:


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InvisiblethatiAM
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Registered: 06/14/06
Posts: 1,250
Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: thirdeyetruth]
    #5828132 - 07/06/06 03:46 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

It's not that the personal you is God, it is that your true nature is God and divinity. Awareness without the story of a SOMEone is God. Just naked awareness. Hallucinogens help us to forget the story of me, awareness becomes naked. Instead of me experiencing wind, it is awareness experiencing itself. As you come down you begin to remember the story of you (which, I assure you, is no less fictional than any other story) and the idea of a me is attached to experience once more. When there is no personal you, you are tasting the divine nectar of God.

All of a sudden it doesn't matter so much what you are feeling or experiencing, just that you are. Just being is enough.


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: MXNR]
    #5828275 - 07/06/06 04:25 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

The classic expression of an identification with The All (Pan), with the Fullness [Pleroma: Greek] is St. Paul. His words are: "I live, yet not I; Christ liveth in me." (KJV). You see, even if one is blessed with the insight that your 'I' is, in Reality, one with God, how one translates that Experience down, into words, makes a world of difference on how one is received and responded to. The Sufi mystic al Halaj - a Muslim with a particular love for Jesus - said: "I am Truth," after Jesus' "I am the way and the truth and the life." For THAT verbal expression, the sin of 'shirk' Hallaj was executed:

(B) Shirk by Deification

"This form of Shirk...relates to cases where created beings or things are given or claim Allah's names or His attributes. For example, it was the practice of the ancient Arabs to worship idols whose names were derived from the names of Allah. Their main three idols were: al-Lat taken from Allaah's name al-Elah, al-'Uzza taken from al-'Aziz and al-Manat taken from al-Mannan. During the Prophet Muhammad's era there was also a false prophet in a region of Arabia called Yamamah, who took the name Rahman which only belongs to Allah."

Yahamah called himself "Compassion" - a Name which is attributed to every sura in the Qur'an "Allah, the Compassionate, the Merciful." Yamamah was probably put to death for it. Al Hallah was killed for calling himself Truth. They cut off his hands and feet and crucified him after his love for Jesus.

We are all 'waves' that are completely one with the same 'Ocean.' Thinking that we are separate waves that arise, move, fade and die on 'the other shore' means that we only see the individual, the particularities of existence, not the universality of Being. We see the differences that divide, not the commonalities which unite. Enlightenment, Liberation consists in the Realization, the Gnosis that we are in Truth, the same Being giving rise to different manifestations of form in space-time. Speaking in ways which express one's inner awareness and Gnosis [Knowledge] of this Identity must be couched so as not to sound like one's ego is being equated with God. Our embodied egos should not be spoken of in ways that can be misunderstood by others. It is like saying 'I am God, and you are not God.' St. Paul said "We have this treasure in earthen vessels," meaning that this Realization, this Knowledge [Gnosis] belongs in the "inner man." To bring this Realization out and speak it has always been considered to be blasphemy. The Pharasees attempted to try Jesus on this charge, but instead was tried under sedition - that He called himself a "king," thus speaking treason against Herod and Caesar. But I digress. THIS Realization should be depicted with the symbolic gesture of the raised index finger pressed to closed lips (Crowley style).

Lastly, this Realization or Knowledge is at the core of genuine religious experience. It is life-changing and the change is in the direction of increased patience, tolerance and compassion, never ego-centricity, arrogance and meglomania. Then, one has pathological inflation of the ego - paranoia, delusions of grandeur, not Enlightenment.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: thirdeyetruth]
    #5828342 - 07/06/06 04:47 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

thirdeyetruth said:
i wouldnt go as far as to say that i am God, but i would argue this, i am the creator. in my unuiverse, i control everything, since i am what gives it existence. it comes bakc the question : if a tree falls and no one hears it... yadayada. the point is that we live in a objective universe, and if there is nothing out there to percieve an event, then that event does not exist. and so in that sense, we are to ourselves GOOOOODS, faak.... nonsense???




lol, If I was your boss and I fired you, would you still be the creator of your own universe?


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: MXNR]
    #5828404 - 07/06/06 05:07 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Bill Hicks was always spiritual. He always considered himself a christian. Sure he made fun of most of them, but that was usually the extremists.

Go read his biography, it is great. Every chapter begins with an answering message left by Bill (usually).

I can't quote it exactly, but towards the end it talks about how Bill was nominated for "Best New Comedian" of the year award, and on the last page it talks about how his mother sent out cards with his full name and lifespan dates on it for the funeral..... then two days after his funeral, Carrot Top won his award.


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OfflineMXNR
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Registered: 07/20/04
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Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #5829600 - 07/06/06 09:46 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Thank you for the awesome replies guys. You really helped me clarify a few things. My only question now is:

"Is somebody behind the wheel? Or is this crazy car driving itself?"


--------------------
Master: Everyday change your clothes and eat your food and you will become enlightened.

Pupil: Master, I do not understand...

Master: If you don't understand, eat your food and change your clothes.


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Offlinecapliberty
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Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: MXNR]
    #5829706 - 07/06/06 10:11 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I say we're all a part of the whole, in a sense we're related to God, as in everything else, and being naturally related, I would think that one would obtain related powers, Even the animals have this instinct within them, to give them more depth, then what actually may appear, that life in definition has a denominator, of randomness, this attribute is what gives mystery to life, w


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InvisibleMystikMushroom
I RULE YOU!
Registered: 10/11/04
Posts: 400
Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: MXNR]
    #5830185 - 07/07/06 12:27 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

MXNR said:
Thank you for the awesome replies guys. You really helped me clarify a few things. My only question now is:

"Is somebody behind the wheel? Or is this crazy car driving itself?"




Thats a great question IMO...

we are ALL behind the wheel at the same time, yet that also means that no one is behind the wheel at the same time as well.

It's duality co-exisiting...and the acceptance that both exists, co-exists, and not exist simultaneously in an an infinite moment...of NOW.. .

Which means..everything is everything! :P

Hm...that barley makes huh?

Well i feel the vibeof the original post and had to add my spin!


Edited by MystikMushroom (07/07/06 12:28 AM)


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OfflineMXNR
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Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: MystikMushroom]
    #5830208 - 07/07/06 12:36 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Awesome post, thanks! And I love the avatar and sig. :thumbup:


--------------------
Master: Everyday change your clothes and eat your food and you will become enlightened.

Pupil: Master, I do not understand...

Master: If you don't understand, eat your food and change your clothes.


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Offlineslaphappy
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Re: If there is a God, I am him. [Re: thirdeyetruth]
    #5830321 - 07/07/06 01:28 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

thirdeyetruth said:
an observer must always be external, ie. the tree can witness itself falling,but that is really not a great example.  and so what about our universe? how are we observed...
:confused:




This is the source of this discussion. This is the main core of existence - i.e the depression, the helplessness, the meaninglessness, the apathy, the ignorance, the hopelessness.

If nobody's watching; WTF is the meaning of all this?

Depressing?!

No way in hell. That makes it all just fucking worth it. This is a free world, and I'm about to rock my fucking socks off!

I can do whatever the hell I want, and the only one watching is me. I am my own judge. I am the auroral messenger of truth. I am the light, I am the show, I am the dance, I am. And thats the only one. I am the only one. I am alone. I am me. Thank God.

The cops arrested me the other day. Almost made me miss the Tool concert at the Quart festival in Kristiansand, Norway. That doesn't change the notion of me being in total control. Upon release, I took the train. (They took my car to search for drugs over night, damn pigs;p) I reeped what I sowed. As planned. I didn't get fired, though - but if I was, that too would be a result of the usage of my divine power. There was no coincidence, or circumstantial event that lead to 51 ecstasy being found in my appartment.

It was just a stupid choice on my part. Stupid, in the momentum, but its initiative has taught me a great deal about a great deal. Which was what God really needed at this point.

I mean, thank me!  :smirk:

And thank you, thank you so painstakingly, totally, undividedly, conclusively and ultimately eternally much for being parts of me, for being me, for being the whole of me and yourself and together as one we sail this blue orb through the void.

By the way. This ship has no stearing wheel at all. The autopilot has been on for eons. We have to make one, to make it work. We have to be one, to make it work. We have to think ahead, to make it work. We have to face the ocean of unpleasentries and fears, just to know that we can make it work.

The ride is of no consequence, and thats why we must take action and do what we know is the ultimate. For us.

:psychsplit:  We must undergo. :heartpump:




--------------------
The argent messenger of truth beyond truth, the antithesis of life, cruel and bleak as interstellar space, pulseless and frozen as absolute zero, dazzling with the frost of irrefragable logic and unforgettable fact.


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