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Offlinejohnjohnandjamal
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Marijuana Induced Convulsions
    #5827322 - 07/06/06 11:28 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I recently acquired some cookies for this past Canada day. They were fairly small (about 2" diameter). Two of my friends decided they would eat a cookie instead of drinking when we were walking around out in the city. They started to get high and at that point we went into a bar. After a few mins, one of my friends leans back on a chair and then just drops on the ground and starts convulsing. We quickly run to pick them up to get them out of there. We get them to the door and then it happens again. After that, they puked and were ok.

Does anyone know exactly what triggers these convulsions?


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Offlinekotik
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Re: Marijuana Induced Convulsions [Re: johnjohnandjamal]
    #5827337 - 07/06/06 11:34 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

ive heard more about this type of thing with much stronger drugs, but considering that MJ is a hallucinogen (psychedelics, dissociatives and deliriants) it could provoke the same effects.

more often than not (according to my understanding) your friend is probably very prone to convulsions, and the drugs triggered that.

but really, no matter what I say, or anyone else.. without many more details, it would be all speculation.


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Offlinegub
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Re: Marijuana Induced Convulsions [Re: kotik]
    #5827418 - 07/06/06 11:55 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

yes ... i don't know very many


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Offlinesqu1d
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Re: Marijuana Induced Convulsions [Re: gub]
    #5827438 - 07/06/06 12:01 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Or it wasnt the drugs and he just convulsed..
Sometimes things aren't related at all.


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Offlinemellowrubberduck
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Re: Marijuana Induced Convulsions [Re: squ1d]
    #5827510 - 07/06/06 12:35 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Get the doctor's diagnosis. You did take him to a doctor, right?


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OfflinePhishe
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Re: Marijuana Induced Convulsions [Re: mellowrubberduck]
    #5828124 - 07/06/06 03:44 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Going to the doctor would be an obvious choice being in canada where marijuana isn't a illegal right?


Edited by Phishe (07/06/06 03:45 PM)


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OfflineMorphMan
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Re: Marijuana Induced Convulsions [Re: Phishe]
    #5828452 - 07/06/06 05:21 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

The doctor isn't going to bring you to jail. You should bring him to the doctor and get him checked out.


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OfflineFalseAlternative
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Re: Marijuana Induced Convulsions [Re: MorphMan]
    #5828979 - 07/06/06 07:13 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

That doesn't surprise me, because my friend smoked some really strong weed with his friend before school and was blacked out, huddled on the floor of the bus. So, if that happened, then convulsing doesn't seem too out of the picture.


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OfflineDinahTheCat
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Re: Marijuana Induced Convulsions [Re: FalseAlternative]
    #5829057 - 07/06/06 07:27 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Some people supposefully can have "pyschosis" induced from maryjane, so it seems not completely random for your friend to have an attack of convultions, although there must be some sort of logical explanation of why it occured, but also i suppose some are even "allegric" to cannabis, so.... dammit i forgot where i was going with this. Good luck with your friends current state and future affairs with cannabis.


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"Sanity is not statistical."



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OfflineEreignis
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Panic attack [Re: MorphMan]
    #5829078 - 07/06/06 07:30 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Hi there. I'm new here, but since I've witnessed the same kind of thing that you're talking about I thought I'd share my three completely isolated experiences with it. I've seen three panic attacks, and two of those were accompanied by seizures/convulsions.

First attack: 190lb guy, relatively inexperienced pot smoker, was slightly drunk before taking a few bowl hits. He had a clear cut case of an anxiety attack (also known as panic attack), exhibiting symptoms of intense confusion and disorientation and claiming nausea. According to my notes, the attack seemed to come in three waves of two minutes each, separated by about the same amount of time when the subject claimed to have recovered and regained his equilibrium. The third attack was a seizure, which lasted less than ten seconds. On waking the subject did not remember having had the seizure and seemed to have recovered.

A year later I watched my sister have a panic attack. An experienced pot user, she had eaten a large and very potent space cake hours before the attack. When it struck, she claimed that it was accompanied by an intensely unpleasant sense of disorientation which prevented her from moving her body, and confusion which prevented her from speaking.

A few years after that I watched another girl have a panic attack with seizures. She claimed to be an experienced user that had taken a long vacation from weed. It happened after we had taken a few hash hits in a coffeeshop in amsterdam. She started by exhibiting all the signs of a panic attack that the other two experienced, to the point of asking me point blank, "Where am I? What is going on?". Her attack also came in two waves, the second wave being a short period of convulsion which she did not remember. One second she was smiling, a blink later, and she had clunked to the ground and started convulsion. It was frightening to watch, but fortunately I knew what to say to calm her. The worst part about panic attacks is the confusion, the complete lack of comprehension of what is going on. The most important thing is to explain what is happening to them and that they rarely last longer than ten minutes. Supposedly, giving them sugary stuff to drink will bring them off the attack faster, but explaining things simply and clearly seems to help most. I think these attacks should be called "confusion attacks," because the confusion is primary, and the panic stems from the confusion.

Anyway, I write all this because I hypothesize that one symptom of MJ-induced panic attacks is seizures. Did your friend have any other symptoms? Was he an inexperienced user or dealing with a strong dose?


Edited by Ereignis (07/06/06 07:36 PM)


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OfflineDinahTheCat
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Re: Panic attack [Re: Ereignis]
    #5829133 - 07/06/06 07:40 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

It is queer, to my mind, things like this induced by cannabis occur, even without cause from the taking of other drugs that may cause states such as these. I doubt that there is in most cases, a relevant explanation, one probably as relevant in explaining the occurance of schizophrenia in someone whose familie's past shows no record of such a similar case. Ereignis, did any of these 3 people (to your knowledge) have occuring similar cases in the time after the attacks?


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"Sanity is not statistical."



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Offlinesqu1d
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Re: Panic attack [Re: DinahTheCat]
    #5829142 - 07/06/06 07:43 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Previous animal studies have demonstrated that cannabinoids possess anticonvulsant activity; however, a handful of human trials examining the effects of the cannabinoid cannabidiol (CBD) on epileptic-induced seizures have yielded mixed results. A recent trial in England of cannabis extracts on an in vitro form of epilepsy found that extracts performed more effectively than THC alone in treating symptoms of the disease.




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OfflineDinahTheCat
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Re: Panic attack [Re: squ1d]
    #5829587 - 07/06/06 09:43 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Hmmm interesting how a drug can posess so many different outcomes on many.


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OfflineMuppet69_420
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Re: Panic attack [Re: DinahTheCat]
    #5830389 - 07/07/06 02:01 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I often have minor convulsions due to mj's disorientation. Its only a few minor muscle spasms though and its nothing a walk wont fix. In all my experiences with mj and its use i've never witnessed anyone going into uncontrolable seizures/convulsion due to weed. Definently will be a damn nuisiance to have to worry about during any panic attacks that might surface in the future.


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Quote:

I live to learn and learn to live.

forget w/e was here b4 it was meth gibberish.... :meff: :rail2: :rail: ....thats as old as my account...

On that note fart in public and grin. :publicfart:

Hail Shroomery!




Edited by Muppet69_420 (07/07/06 02:02 AM)


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OfflineEreignis
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Re: Panic attack [Re: DinahTheCat]
    #5834475 - 07/08/06 08:19 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

DinahTheCat said:
did any of these 3 people (to your knowledge) have occuring similar cases in the time after the attacks?


|

To my knowledge none of them have had another panic attack. The girl who had seizures mentioned that she had had epilepsy earlier in life, but had not had an attack for years. The male who had seizures had never had them before.


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For faults in the clouds of delusion

Shall we go, you and I, while we can? Through the transitive nightfall of diamonds


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OfflinePanoramix
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Re: Panic attack [Re: Ereignis]
    #5834492 - 07/08/06 08:37 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Like Muppet69 I get twitchy sometimes if I've had a lot of weed, particularly on an empty stomach, I thought it was a blood-sugar thing or something.  Once I did black out momentarily and loose muscle control directly after hitting a massive bowl while already quite high once.  One second I was standing by the window, smoking m'bong, the next I'm prone on the floor soaked in bongwater. :argh:

Luckly this was back in the days when I smoked a plastic bong, so the mess wasn't nearly as bad as it could have been.  But yeah, I have occaisonally temporarily lost vision and equilibrium and/or twitched, to my experience it hasn't been anything to worry about, but then my experiences seem much milder than your friend's.  No harm in getting him to go to the emerg, get him checked over.


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Don't worry, I'm wrong.


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OfflineIamthewalrus
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Re: Panic attack [Re: Ereignis]
    #5834496 - 07/08/06 08:43 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

panic attack would make sense since weed is known to be an anxiety trigger with certain ppl


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InvisibleStickyWater
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Re: Panic attack [Re: Iamthewalrus]
    #5834538 - 07/08/06 09:15 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I've never personally seen anyone convulse, but I have had my muscles just slowly give out. There was no anxiety or panic. A bit of alcohol had been consumed (a couple glasses of wine) and me and 4-5 other people split a 1/4 throughout the night. It started with a light headed feeling and tunneling vision, but this stopped when I sat back down. Getting up again I was fine for a few minutes until again I was light headed with the tunneling vision, then my legs just kind of started to sink down and I was on the floor. Tried to pick myself up, arm wasn't going to hold me up and I just hit my head on the floor. Got back up, felt fine, took a few steps, felt it coming again and just sat on the floor and eventually dragged myself to a couch.

Personally it felt kind of like a strong rush of blood to the head that seemed to happen shortly after standing up that ws just amplified more than anything that was caused by the drug, but of course I'm not a doctor...

And whoever said weed's legal here should really check their information before coming here :tongue:

It's not so much legal as people usually just look the other way. But still, if you get caught smoking they will take any bud you have, they probably wont arrest you or anything (unless it's a trafficing charge). They'll most likely just give you a warning, but still best to avoid that.


Edited by StickyWater (07/08/06 09:18 AM)


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InvisibleZen Peddler
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Re: Panic attack [Re: StickyWater]
    #5845835 - 07/11/06 04:33 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

weed can make some people's blood pressure drop like nothing else. When your blood pressure is low you get trembly, feel hyperactive or anxious and can feel very dizzy and lightheaded, even out of it completely. The other symptom can be a sudden thumping heart-rate.
A lot of people who think they have had a panic attack from MJ aer actually experiencing postural hypotension from MJ.


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InvisibleMycoCakeEater
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Re: Panic attack [Re: Zen Peddler]
    #5845852 - 07/11/06 04:47 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Could you explain more on how cannabis effects your blood pressure and other affects on your body, I was a daily user, witha volcano, and exerienved head rushes, thumping heart, and heart palpatation.


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InvisibleZen Peddler
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Re: Panic attack [Re: MycoCakeEater]
    #5845869 - 07/11/06 05:10 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Sure - basically it can effect your blood pressure in a number of ways - either by increasing norepinephrine levels which dilate blood vessels or just by decreasing the blood pressure directly by suppressing the autonomic nervous system reaction to standing.
Basically what happens is that blood pressure and blood flow can be reduced because of venous dilation causing the bodies autonomic nervous system to become overexcited to counteract this problem. This only happens in people who are suseptible to either low blood pressure or orthostatic hypotension (feeling dizzy when you stand suddenly)
This is done by releasing epinephrine and norepinephrine which cause anxiety, clamminess, heart rate increases and body tremors, but this actually makes the problem worse, because norepinephrine actually dilates the vains more.
This creates a cycle where the brain flow and presure is reduced causing mental confusion and dizziness, and in some people fainting on standing, and trembly feelings, heart racing and anxiety.

its all proven- most medical texts explain that marijuana is a potent cause of postural hypotension.


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OfflineMetaMountain
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Re: Panic attack [Re: Zen Peddler]
    #5845889 - 07/11/06 05:31 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks for that infomation bluemeanie.I have a hypotensive crisis when i smoke THC ,even from a single hit. Your post is like a Q.E.D.


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InvisibleMycoCakeEater
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Re: Panic attack [Re: MetaMountain]
    #5846142 - 07/11/06 08:50 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

"This creates a cycle where the brain flow and presure is reduced causing mental confusion and dizziness, and in some people fainting on standing, and trembly feelings, heart racing and anxiety."

You are my savior on this information, I have commonly those trembly feelings ( feeling you get when you get close to a very high edge), racing heart and heart palpitations. I am very scared to investigate the reason, in that it could be something very serious, which this could be, but I am in that cycle. Is this cycle called "postural hypotention"? Just making sure I read correctly. I really would like to get rid of this, as it affects my daily life greatly. Thank you very much on this information. It means ALOT. :cool:


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Panic attack [Re: MycoCakeEater]
    #5846157 - 07/11/06 08:59 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I wonder if viagara would help?


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Offlinejohnjohnandjamal
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Re: Panic attack [Re: redgreenvines]
    #5849083 - 07/11/06 10:38 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

My friend that suffered the experience was an avid smoker whom I've gotten very high with on a number of occassions. As far as I know, it was an isolated experience.

I've experienced a lot of mental confusion and dizziness before when smoking weed. I find that this only happens when I smoke primarily sativa based strains. Is it possible that only certain types of weed create low blood pressure?


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InvisibleMycoCakeEater
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Re: Panic attack [Re: johnjohnandjamal]
    #5850705 - 07/12/06 12:38 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Blue meanie, this cycle, is there a name for it. Also, what are some ways to get out of it?


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InvisibleZen Peddler
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Re: Panic attack [Re: MycoCakeEater]
    #5860923 - 07/15/06 07:05 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

its just a bodily reaction to THC. The best way to avoid it would be drink some licorice tea to increase your blood pressure. And yes it is a form of pronounced postural hypotension.
If you get it all the time, there is a medication for it called florinef, but some poeople get bac side effects from this.


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InvisibleGr33nTree73
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Re: Panic attack [Re: Zen Peddler]
    #5860988 - 07/15/06 07:28 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I'm guessing that there could have been mold on the weed that was used when baking the cookies. I've heard of this being a common affect along with not being able to move when someone consumes shrooms that have a mold on them so why would it be much different with mary jane.


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InvisibleMycoCakeEater
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Re: Panic attack [Re: Gr33nTree73]
    #5874070 - 07/18/06 04:20 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I have stopped smoking marijuana, as it was a daily thing, been clean for about a week, and still in the cycle. Is it caused by something else?


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InvisibleSobercolober
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Re: Panic attack [Re: Zen Peddler]
    #17110925 - 10/27/12 09:54 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

bluemeanie said:
its just a bodily reaction to THC. The best way to avoid it would be drink some licorice tea to increase your blood pressure. And yes it is a form of pronounced postural hypotension.
If you get it all the time, there is a medication for it called florinef, but some poeople get bac side effects from this.




Would actual licorice bars do the job too ?

I am very interested in this I wrote a post about Anxiety/Panic attacks and how I deal with them. there is definitely a link with this standing up thing cause I can feel extra mangled if I am too high when I stand... if I get up the high almost doubles ! So i go up really really slowly like over 30 seconds so the body does what it needs to slowly avoiding a sudden change.

Interesting topic and worth cross referencing the posts.

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/17105452


Edited by Sobercolober (10/27/12 10:03 AM)


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