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OfflineVertigo6911
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The Lion and the Lettuce
    #5820743 - 07/04/06 05:05 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Heres a post to help identify wild lettuce AKA Lactuca virosa.
many people confuse them with dandylions, and today i found both growing next to eachother, making for a nice photo opp:



topleft: Lactuca serriola
topright: Dandylion
bottemleft: Lactuca serriola
bottemright: both

ok so the L serriola is nealy identical to L virosa except that it has more and longer spines on the main vain on the bottem of the leaf.
about up to 2mm on L serriola and 1mm and less on L. virosa, wich may have leafs with no spines at all on the main vain.
also the serriola's leafs tend to have a 90 degree twist in them, where the virosa does not.
L. serriola emits a white juice where any part is damaged.
im not sure about L virosa, but dandylions definetly dont do that. (edit: yes they do :S)

both L verisa and L. serriola are active.


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Edited by Vertigo6911 (07/07/06 02:14 PM)


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5820798 - 07/04/06 05:25 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks for the photos and comparison.


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5820806 - 07/04/06 05:27 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

my pleasure dude :smile:


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5820819 - 07/04/06 05:30 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Does potency vary from either of the two?

I remember as a kid I would pick dandelions and squeeze the flower stem.I remember a distinct white liquid would come out of the stem.The liquid was thin and would seep from the walls of the hollow stem.


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Mad_Larkin said:  Death is just a thang.
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MrJellineck said:  Profits, prophets. That's all you jews think about.
sheekle said: life is drugs... and music... and cat... :snowman:


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5820917 - 07/04/06 06:02 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

i dont realy know about potency, im just getting aquainted with the plant.
i recently bought a fieldguide and this is what i found wile testing it out in my neigborhood.
the info is from that.

as for the dandylion and juice, what this plant makes looks milky, like opium latex, and it seeps from every part of the plant.

so if you tare the tip off a leaf white stuff will come out immediatly without squeesing or anything.

also if im not mistaken dandylions make 1 stem with 1 flower.
accoring to my fieldguide lactuca has flowers in clusters.


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5820966 - 07/04/06 06:19 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Interesting.

What field guide do you have?

Take more pictures and add more info when you obtain both!


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5820986 - 07/04/06 06:28 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

its this one: http://www.lijsters.nl/heukelsflora/
its 'the' guide for holland, unfortunatly all info on it is in dutch aswell... (lol)

essentialy its a giant identification guide.
its a system where u answer a bunch of questions like 'if woody stem go to #xx' wich u go trough and end up at the description of the plant.
allorganised by species n stuff so u get its cousins etc on the surrounding pages.

it was expensive, 45 euro's.
but well worth the money, as now i can identify most anything i come across in these parts :smile:


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5826641 - 07/06/06 04:55 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

i just accuired a L. virosa and noticed another difference between it and L. serriola:

L. virosa has a very long taproot, not unlike a thin carrot,
whereas the L. serriola does not.


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5827868 - 07/06/06 02:26 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Can you provide a picture of both to compare them?


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MrJellineck said:  Profits, prophets. That's all you jews think about.
sheekle said: life is drugs... and music... and cat... :snowman:


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5827889 - 07/06/06 02:35 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

well the virosa is kinda limp right now, but once it recovers ill
make some comparison shots.


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5827937 - 07/06/06 02:48 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

WoW good aticle on this stuff.


Quote:

Characteristics.─The leaves of garden lettuce, Lactuca sativa, when too old and going to seed, have a bitter taste, and the stalk then contains a milky juice which is intensely bitter. This juice contains Lactucin, and is common to all lettuces, but is especially virulent in L. vir., from which (as well as well as from Lact. sat.) Lactucarium, or "Lettuce Opium," is prepared. It has a soporific action, and is used "instead of Opium to allay cough, quiet nervousness, and induce sleep in cases where, from idiosyncrasy, Opium is not borne" (Brunton). This use of lettuces has been known from very remote times, and has not been added to by old-school observers. The sleep-provoking powers of Lactuca are recognised by sensitive persons who eat ordinary garden lettuce in salad. HomÅ“opathic provings and records of poisonings have produced an extensive array of symptoms. A simple reading of the symptoms will show what a powerful agent we possess in Lactuca, though the homÅ“opathic uses have not been as extensive as the proving seems to warrant. As an instance of poisoning I take this from C. D. P. A man, 25, ate Lact. v. in a salad, 7 p.m. Went to bed at 9. Was waked at 11 with sharp colicky pains, soon followed by nausea and vomiting, which lasted all night. Fell asleep at 5 a.m., but in the morning was astonished to find himself unable to distinguish objects clearly. A boy of 10 who ate of the same meal became affected with lively delirium at midnight, and it lasted till morning; he jumped about on the bed, played all sorts of pranks, and nobody could quiet him.





Here's the rest of the article
http://www.homeoint.org/clarke/l/lact_vir.htm

I can't tell if it's really good or really bad.
Any comment on how to use it, or how you use it?


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- [Re: Kerbouchard]
    #5828018 - 07/06/06 03:14 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

-


Edited by pod3 (10/26/06 09:30 AM)


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OfflineVertigo6911
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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: pod3]
    #5828167 - 07/06/06 03:57 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

yeah i read somewhere at erowid that they cut the stem at a certain height and collect the white sap and dry that.
then they take a thin slice off and start over.


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5830172 - 07/07/06 12:24 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)



--------------------
Mad_Larkin said:  Death is just a thang.
:clementine:
MrJellineck said:  Profits, prophets. That's all you jews think about.
sheekle said: life is drugs... and music... and cat... :snowman:


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: aNeway2sayHooray]
    #5830202 - 07/07/06 12:34 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

nice :smile:
i agree with that poster too, i found my plants virtualy on my porch
in the middle of the city...


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5831659 - 07/07/06 01:15 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

hey i just found out, dandylions do make white juice in the leafs,
so thats not an identifying trait...


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5831864 - 07/07/06 02:05 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

In the link I posted,he shows L.virosa.It is obviously producing juice/latex.

Also I stated the dandelions have a hollow stem.This is incorrect.I was confusing it with the very small dandelions.I dont know if L.virosa is actually THE dandelion.But I am sure the dandelion is a name that is subjective to different parts of the world.

Anyway,I am going out in a few to try and find both L.serriola and L.virosa.I will take pictures if I can find some batteries.

I assume the plants you posted pictures of are the young 1st year lactuca?If the link to entheogen.com is correct then they would be ready next year.

We need rain in my area bad.It has been a ridiculously dry summer.


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Mad_Larkin said:  Death is just a thang.
:clementine:
MrJellineck said:  Profits, prophets. That's all you jews think about.
sheekle said: life is drugs... and music... and cat... :snowman:


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: aNeway2sayHooray]
    #5831874 - 07/07/06 02:08 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Also the link I posted shows the "virosa" but it looks like what you posted as "serriola".I am confused.haha


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Mad_Larkin said:  Death is just a thang.
:clementine:
MrJellineck said:  Profits, prophets. That's all you jews think about.
sheekle said: life is drugs... and music... and cat... :snowman:


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OfflineVertigo6911
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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: aNeway2sayHooray]
    #5831935 - 07/07/06 02:23 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

But I am sure the dandelion is a name that is subjective to different parts of the world.




the one i was refering too is: Taraxacum officinalis, i believe your small dandylion.

im not sure about the growing cycle but my serriola is about 8 inches across, still very small.

on the surface virosa and serriola are identicle cept the leafs are proprotionaly longer on the virosa and the ones ive seen are a more neat rosette instead of the serriola wich looks a bit messy with the twisting leafs compared to virosa.


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5831966 - 07/07/06 02:31 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Ok I see now.I was confused because in your first post you say virosa then later in the post you say serriola.

Just to make sure I am on the same page as you,in the set of pictures you posted:the 2 on the left are L.serriola and the two on the right are Taraxacum officinalis?There is not a virosa in the picture correct?


--------------------
Mad_Larkin said:  Death is just a thang.
:clementine:
MrJellineck said:  Profits, prophets. That's all you jews think about.
sheekle said: life is drugs... and music... and cat... :snowman:


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OfflineVertigo6911
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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5832032 - 07/07/06 02:48 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

correct.


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5832610 - 07/07/06 05:17 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Ok I just got back from a quick walk.I found 2 or 3 types of lactuca but I brought back only two.I found what I think is L.serriola and L.virosa.

The serriola in your pictures is what I believe to be the "rosettes" of the serriola before it shoots up a stalk.

If I go by the pictures I have seen then the ones you posted are virosa.I will give an example of a serriola.Or what I think is serriola by my research.

Here is the flower top of what I believe to be l.virosa


Here are the leaves and stalk of the same plant.



And here is a leaf from what I believe to be serriola.But I am not sure.All the ones with this sort of leaf were significantly taller than the other pictures I posted.(EDIT:not serriola)




Please correct me if I have made a mistake.But I am quite sure your pictures are virosa and not serriola.


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Mad_Larkin said:  Death is just a thang.
:clementine:
MrJellineck said:  Profits, prophets. That's all you jews think about.
sheekle said: life is drugs... and music... and cat... :snowman:


Edited by aNeway2sayHooray (07/07/06 05:59 PM)


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OfflineVertigo6911
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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: aNeway2sayHooray]
    #5832699 - 07/07/06 05:40 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

yours both look like virosa to me.
theres very little spines at all and whats there is 1mm or less.
that last one might be another kind alltogether.
virosa and serriola are the ones mentioned in my book cause they are native, but there may be more where your at.

the spines on my plant are 2mm and theres lots of em.

but the dead giveway is the raproot.
serriola doesent have one, virosa does.

so im positive the pics i posted are of serriola, but on the surface the difference is invisible.

if i run into more of em ill try to get some pics of the root systems
and ill see about getting detail pics of the spines if my cheapo cam will cooperate...


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5832741 - 07/07/06 05:53 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I just grabbed another large one with the same type of leaves as the last picture I posted.After I lookd closer I think you are right,the last one is a different kind.

When you say spines,do you mean the spines on the bottom of the leaf stem or the prickly looking things that surrond the entire leaf?


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:clementine:
MrJellineck said:  Profits, prophets. That's all you jews think about.
sheekle said: life is drugs... and music... and cat... :snowman:


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5832753 - 07/07/06 05:58 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

actualy both.
the serriola has them around the edges of the leaf and on the stem on the underside of the leaf, typicly 2mm in sise.

according to my book virosa has them 1mm and smaller around the leaf
and they may be completely absent on the underside of the leaf, or else 1mm and smaller.


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- [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5835179 - 07/08/06 01:30 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

-


Edited by pod3 (10/26/06 09:29 AM)


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: pod3]
    #5835377 - 07/08/06 02:26 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

they seem to be pretty commen here...


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- [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5840140 - 07/09/06 08:00 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

-


Edited by pod3 (10/26/06 09:29 AM)


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: pod3]
    #5840201 - 07/09/06 08:18 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

pod3 said:
Common here, too. Abundant seeds will be available to trade, if anyone can't find it for free.




Same here.

I thought it was common knowledge about letuce being phsycoactive during/after flowering. I was a teenager the last time I messed with it though..... I actually have some 4 1/2 foot tall ones that I neglected to harvest at the right time for eating. I might mess around with an extraction.


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5849246 - 07/11/06 11:16 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Anyone ever tried or think steam distillation of the essential oils of Lactuca plants?
How would you use such an oil?


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Edited by flowie (07/11/06 11:45 PM)


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Kerbouchard]
    #5850197 - 07/12/06 09:10 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Ok, my damn camera broke, so these are gonne be the last pics i upload for a wile.
some adult plants:

Lactuca virosa:




Lactuca serriola:





it seems that the length of the spines vary alot, and on these adults they get as big as 5mm on the back of the leaf.
so what i said earlyer about length of these spines doesent realy work.

also from the shape of the leaf, maybe the one i took home might be virosa after all.

im gonna try to harvest these adults, try to get some seeds and maybe
try to get some 'speudo-opium' out of it.
after that ill dig em up and inspect the roots thuroughly.
if all goes well ill find some more juveniles and check their roots aswell.

in the meantime i guess ill see about getting myself a new camera...


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5850210 - 07/12/06 09:14 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)



how about this?


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Mitchnast]
    #5850217 - 07/12/06 09:17 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

well i think the green one is etable, but the other one will prolly give u some serious OBE there, might even contain some 5-Meo-w...


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5851622 - 07/12/06 05:56 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

this is proobing to be harder then i thought,
apparently there are forms of virosa with the pointy leafs and forms of serriola with long leafs.

apparently all the the long leaf ones i posted are L. serriola.
L. virosa apparently has wider leafs then these.

also these all have that twist in the leaf at the base, wich is supposed to be absent from L. serriola.

the one i have with the long taproot may be virosa, but i dont have pics of that yet.

i noticed another thing on pics i googled:
some variations have spines on the stem, some do not.
ive seen this for both pointy and streight leafed plants.


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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5853861 - 07/13/06 06:34 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

were talking about Lactuca spec. here dude.
if you want to go offtopic u need to be funnyer.


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OfflineMitchnast
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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Vertigo6911]
    #5854016 - 07/13/06 09:10 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

sorry man, a real picture of A real lion In a feild of opuim lettuce is just too damn cool to dispute.

TOO DAMN COOL.


Edited by Mitchnast (07/13/06 11:23 AM)


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OfflineVertigo6911
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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Mitchnast]
    #5854576 - 07/13/06 12:43 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

what are you trying to provoke?

keep your OTD shit in the OTD forum, this is a place wit hsubject matter.

wtf are u even doing here?


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: The Lion and the Lettuce [Re: Mitchnast]
    #5854624 - 07/13/06 01:01 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Give it a rest, Mitchnast! You're derailing the topic.


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