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OfflineTrepiodos
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Registered: 06/30/06
Posts: 469
Loc: Los Angeles County Jail
Last seen: 14 years, 3 months
Where do we find our savior?
    #5817815 - 07/03/06 09:38 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Many people hold the idea that there is some sort of savior that will come and set things right for humanity, to bring a new era of peace, enlightenment and brotherhood to the masses of warring and confused humans. The most prominent among these (in my experience) is the Judeo-Christian concept of a Messiah. More numerous (world wide), are those who believe that a political system and it's "leader(s)" hold the answers to creating utopia, a heaven on earth. Another example can be found in those who look to the eventual beneficent intervention of an extra-terrestrial civilization

Even if any such fanciful situations were to ever come to fruition, I think it is spiritually counterproductive to rely on them. If we are given flesh on this earth for anything, it is to learn to better ourselves, spiritually and morally. We do not better ourselves by relying on someone else to make things right for us. Our betterment must be from individual initiative, from our own desires to realize the potentials that are inherent in all of us. We do not better ourselves by having an outside authority compel us by force or threat of force to change. Likewise, the spiritual and moral betterment of our neighbors can only come from within themselves, we cannot legislate this, we cannot coerce this. The materialistic mechanisms of the state are counterproductive to spiritual growth, reducing humans to physical resources to be plundered for some ideal, treating people as chattel belonging to the directors of the state’s apparatus or compelling them as simple minded domestic animals to be trained in the art of obedience. It is our ability to think in abstract concepts, to create new ideas, our transmission of knowledge, and our ability to choose novel ways of adapting to circumstances which set mankind apart from all other beasts on the planet. We cannot save humanity by sacrificing individuals to a collective or 'higher' good. We must appeal to our fellow man’s inherent abilities of reason and compassion, to the highest faculties of the human animal.

If there is a god that made you in his image, then you must learn to create the world you want as he created the world he wanted. If there's a heaven in store for us, we must learn to make it. Nothing's going to be handed to you on some heavenly platter. If there is any kind of supreme loving father figure, he'd tell his children that are looking and waiting for someone else to make things right to get off their sorry, dependent asses and learn to save themselves. This is what good parents do, instill self reliance in their children, not coddle them so they always have to run to daddy when they can't handle the problems they create.


--------------------

And as things fell apart,
Nobody paid much attention...

- David Byrne, '(Nothing But) Flowers' from the Talking Heads' album, 'Naked'


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InvisibleVeritas
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Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: Trepiodos]
    #5817854 - 07/03/06 09:49 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

:congrats:


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: Trepiodos]
    #5818201 - 07/03/06 11:22 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

"Many people hold the idea that there is some sort of savior that will come and set things right for humanity, to bring a new era of peace, enlightenment and brotherhood to the masses of warring and confused humans."

I found my savior several years ago....I looked into the mirror.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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OfflinejustAkid
Member of myCulture

Registered: 11/05/05
Posts: 323
Loc: The Present
Last seen: 13 years, 6 months
Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: Trepiodos]
    #5818211 - 07/03/06 11:25 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Very nice man.  I loved that. :thumbup:

...alot :thumbup: :thumbup:


--------------------
Trust thyself.


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OfflineTrepiodos
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Posts: 469
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Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5818258 - 07/03/06 11:40 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

As Mahatma Gandhi said one day as he looked in the mirror, "We must be the change we wish to see."


--------------------

And as things fell apart,
Nobody paid much attention...

- David Byrne, '(Nothing But) Flowers' from the Talking Heads' album, 'Naked'


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
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Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: Trepiodos]
    #5818264 - 07/03/06 11:42 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I agree.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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Offlineslaphappy
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Registered: 10/29/04
Posts: 1,188
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Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: Trepiodos]
    #5818502 - 07/04/06 12:42 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Trepiodos said:
Many people hold the idea that there is some sort of savior that will come and set things right for humanity, to bring a new era of peace, enlightenment and brotherhood to the masses of warring and confused humans.  The most prominent among these (in my experience) is the Judeo-Christian concept of a Messiah.  More numerous (world wide), are those who believe that a political system and it's "leader(s)" hold the answers to creating utopia, a heaven on earth.  Another example can be found in those who look to the eventual beneficent intervention of an extra-terrestrial civilization

Even if any such fanciful situations were to ever come to fruition, I think it is spiritually counterproductive to rely on them.  If we are given flesh on this earth for anything, it is to learn to better ourselves, spiritually and morally.  We do not better ourselves by relying on someone else to make things right for us.  Our betterment must be from individual initiative, from our own desires to realize the potentials that are inherent in all of us.  We do not better ourselves by having an outside authority compel us by force or threat of force to change. Likewise, the spiritual and moral betterment of our neighbors can only come from within themselves, we cannot legislate this, we cannot coerce this.  The materialistic mechanisms of the state are counterproductive to spiritual growth, reducing humans to physical resources to be plundered for some ideal, treating people as chattel belonging to the directors of the state’s apparatus or compelling them as simple minded domestic animals to be trained in the art of obedience.  It is our ability to think in abstract concepts, to create new ideas, our transmission of knowledge, and our ability to choose novel ways of adapting to circumstances which set mankind apart from all other beasts on the planet.  We cannot save humanity by sacrificing individuals to a collective or 'higher' good.  We must appeal to our fellow man’s inherent abilities of reason and compassion, to the highest faculties of the human animal.

If there is a god that made you in his image, then you must learn to create the world you want as he created the world he wanted. If there's a heaven in store for us, we must learn to make it. Nothing's going to be handed to you on some heavenly platter.  If there is any kind of supreme loving father figure, he'd tell his children that are looking and waiting for someone else to make things right to get off their sorry, dependent asses and learn to save themselves.  This is what good parents do, instill self reliance in their children, not coddle them so they always have to run to daddy when they can't handle the problems they create.




:laugh:

We're dependant because we are born with sin. If I'd been brought up believing that I was fundamentally evil, I'd be leaning towards something too.

Like - shit daddy-o, I'm fucking evil, so you have to tell me exactly what to do, so I don't fuck it up and go straight to hell AIGHT!?

Yuch.

Its time we got around to atleast pretending to be alone, on top and in control of our environment. Aren't we supposed to evolve? Or was that yesterdays news ... kinda like acid rain?  :smirk:


--------------------
The argent messenger of truth beyond truth, the antithesis of life, cruel and bleak as interstellar space, pulseless and frozen as absolute zero, dazzling with the frost of irrefragable logic and unforgettable fact.


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OfflineTrepiodos
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Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: slaphappy]
    #5819208 - 07/04/06 09:26 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

slaphappy said:
We're dependant because we are born with sin.



I do not believe that someone who just came into being is already encumbered with sin. It seems rather silly that one could be guilty without ever committing an act. Sin cannot exist without volition, it requires choosing actions in contradiction to a moral code.

Quote:

If I'd been brought up believing that I was fundamentally evil, I'd be leaning towards something too.



That's a good description of 'original sin,' the fundamental evil of the innocent. The concept is just another propaganda tool of those running religions to dupe the unquestioning faithful.


--------------------

And as things fell apart,
Nobody paid much attention...

- David Byrne, '(Nothing But) Flowers' from the Talking Heads' album, 'Naked'


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Offlinetwelvelookslikeu
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Registered: 06/27/06
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Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: Trepiodos]
    #5819403 - 07/04/06 10:28 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Jesus will be reincarnated some time in this world. Or he already might have we just ignored him again.


--------------------


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InvisibleVeritas
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Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: twelvelookslikeu]
    #5819412 - 07/04/06 10:32 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I certainly am. :smirk:


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Offlinecapliberty
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Registered: 04/23/06
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Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: Veritas]
    #5819690 - 07/04/06 11:55 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

:thumbdown:


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InvisibleVeritas
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Posts: 11,089
Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: capliberty]
    #5819815 - 07/04/06 12:28 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I was referring to putting the Jesus pretender on my Ignore User list.  If the actual Jesus came around again, I'd be interested in meeting him.  As long as he didn't make a big fuss over himself like the Pope.  :tongue:


Edited by Veritas (07/04/06 04:31 PM)


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InvisibleMushmanTheManic
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Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: Trepiodos]
    #5820094 - 07/04/06 01:48 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

:iloveyou:


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Offlinetwelvelookslikeu
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Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5820114 - 07/04/06 01:54 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Who is pretending to be Jesus?


--------------------


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: twelvelookslikeu]
    #5820163 - 07/04/06 02:13 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

:lol: I can tell you are new here, even without checking your registration date.


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OfflineSchwammel
Auk

Registered: 12/10/05
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Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: Veritas]
    #5820184 - 07/04/06 02:21 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

""""Many people hold the idea that there is some sort of savior that will come and set things right for humanity, to bring a new era of peace, enlightenment and brotherhood to the masses of warring and confused humans."

I found my savior several years ago....I looked into the mirror. """

BUT WHAT DID YOU SEE?

Did you see our savior or did you see the devil?


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Offlinetwelvelookslikeu
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Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: Schwammel]
    #5820257 - 07/04/06 02:46 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

You know even if a savior did come back no one would even care because they are too conditioned by everything and wouldn't even believe him.

Yes I am new. Sorry if I'm making you regulars uneasy.


--------------------


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: twelvelookslikeu]
    #5820644 - 07/04/06 04:29 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

You're not making me uneasy.  There was a big stink here recently involving a member who claimed to be a reincarnation of Jesus.  :shrug:


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Offlinetwelvelookslikeu
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Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: Veritas]
    #5820656 - 07/04/06 04:35 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Oh that does stink.


--------------------


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: Where do we find our savior? [Re: twelvelookslikeu]
    #5820696 - 07/04/06 04:48 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah, especially when the real reincarnation of Jesus is a long-time member here.  I mean, how arrogant to come on and pose as Jesus when anyone can recognize the real deal from his avatar. 

:grin:



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