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InvisibleHELLA_TIGHT
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Re: Asteroid to narrowly miss Earth [Re: johnuk]
    #5829262 - 07/06/06 08:22 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

It would be pretty fucking risky to send a nuke into space, I doubt that there are any in orbit.


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Offlinejohnuk
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Re: Asteroid to narrowly miss Earth [Re: HELLA_TIGHT]
    #5829326 - 07/06/06 08:39 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

HELLA_TIGHT said:
It would be pretty fucking risky to send a nuke into space, I doubt that there are any in orbit.




ICBMs are designed to fly themselves into space automatically, so hiding one inside something that's 'supposed' to be in orbit would only make that process even easier.

Of all the whacky space age plans for super duper weapons of the future, putting a few of these into orbit is by far the most realistic.

They were talking about doing this atleast twenty years ago.


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Offlinedebianlinux
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Re: Asteroid to narrowly miss Earth [Re: johnuk]
    #5829337 - 07/06/06 08:44 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

yes, and a treaty was signed saying no one would do it. now, i know shit like that is a joke but there are a whole lot of eyes paying attention to what is going up and what is coming down so I suspect that nukes are not in orbit at this time.


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Offlinejohnuk
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Re: Asteroid to narrowly miss Earth [Re: debianlinux]
    #5829384 - 07/06/06 08:56 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah, you can pretty much forget the treaty part altogether. There are a bunch of treaties against nuclear weapons development yet the US is still the world leader on that - I believe it's currently received literally trillions of dollars worth of cash. Things only seem to become illegal in the nuclear world once the MIT labs and such have tested something of their own and are on to stage two - closing off the door behind them with a ban on stage one. And the stage two testing is usually said to be necessary to "safely maintain the stockpile", which is a complete heap.

There's absolutely no way countries like the US are going to let other's in on what's onboard their latest reconnaissance satellites, even if they are really for reconnaissance work. Plus, it's not like the US has to launch their stuff from someone else's joint.

I'm not usually into conspiracy type stuff, but I do read a whole shit load of scientific work and have come to realise that if you want government funding, particularly in the US, you basically have to demonstrate how your project can help a.) kill middle eastern guys b.) prevent the death of your own idiots.

The UK is about to replace their Trident ICBM system. 25 billion pounds I think it will cost. And this is to maintain a handful of submarines and missiles. The present government is simultaneously working on privatising our NHS and schools, as well as the postal service, public transport and so on (I have no freaking clue where all this cash is going, maybe building more Millenium domes somewhere in the countryside). I've never heard anyone ever mention that many billions of pounds in association with anything government funded in the UK before. The same guy who thinks this is a great idea suggests that we should all fly the UK flag in our garden. I think it's because he's a prick. :grin:


Edited by johnuk (07/06/06 09:07 PM)


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Offlinerazorbladeshoes
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Re: Asteroid to narrowly miss Earth [Re: Seuss]
    #5829438 - 07/06/06 09:07 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Seuss said:One last thought... although fission devices can be made small and light, fusion devices cannot be. There are tonnes upon tonnes of lead, uranium-238, and steel inside a fusion device. For example, Tsar Bomba, which could deliver up to 100 megatons in optimal configuration, weighs in at 27.5 tonnes (over 65,000 pounds).




That bomb was heavy because:

1. they weren't too concerned about weight (plane deliverable vs. missle deliverable)
2. required a large parachute system, which aren't light
3. had a really poor yield to weight ratio to begin with

Some U.S. warheads are over a megaton and under 1000lb, like the W59 (which was also made in the 60's). It was 550lb and had a 1MT yield. So assuming 550lb/MT, you 'could' easily put about 25MT on an escape velocity towards an astroid with a Delta heavy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/W59


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Offlinedebianlinux
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Re: Asteroid to narrowly miss Earth [Re: razorbladeshoes]
    #5829457 - 07/06/06 09:11 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

based on the limited research i've done it seems nukes behave wholly differently in the absence of an atmosphere. i'm not convinced a nuke would do much more than irradiate a good sized asteroid.


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Offlinejohnuk
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Re: Asteroid to narrowly miss Earth [Re: debianlinux]
    #5829482 - 07/06/06 09:18 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

debianlinux said:
based on the limited research i've done it seems nukes behave wholly differently in the absence of an atmosphere. i'm not convinced a nuke would do much more than irradiate a good sized asteroid.




True, but you could put the energy released to use by giving it something to push against.

Due to the conservation of momentum, whatever the bomb ejects from one side will equate to a certain amount of push in the opposite direction.

Putting mass into space costs money, but momentum / energy also depends on velocity. If you were to eject that material at a very high speed, like it would be from a nuclear explosion, you could produce a usable pushing force in the other direction.

That's basically how designs for fission / fusion based engines work. The fuel is ejected from the nozzle and burnt (used up) within it. At the same time, a jet of propellant (like helium) is released into the area. The energy from the fuel is absorbed by the, usually inert, propellant and becomes it's kenetic energy - thrust.

In fact, in a way, it's a good thing that there isn't any atmosphere to push against since it means that even gentle pushing, over time, will build up. Although, that's kind of how these things end up travelling so fast to start with.


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Invisibledurban_poison
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Re: Asteroid to narrowly miss Earth [Re: johnuk]
    #5830441 - 07/07/06 02:44 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

fuck nukes solar sails or solar magnification


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: Asteroid to narrowly miss Earth [Re: razorbladeshoes]
    #5830580 - 07/07/06 05:16 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

based on the limited research i've done it seems nukes behave wholly differently in the absence of an atmosphere. i'm not convinced a nuke would do much more than irradiate a good sized asteroid.




But irradiate it so intensely that part of the asteroids surface cooks off, that providing thrust.

Quote:

So assuming 550lb/MT




Even less than that. The initial megaton will occupy much more weight than subsequent ones. The actual fuel weight is 25 kilos (55lbs) per megaton, but ofcourse it needs casing materials, a plutonium "sparkplug" etc.

27.5 tons containing 2 tons of nuclear fuel is not too bad actually, and if you replace lead by uranium as was originally intended, the same weight buys you 100 megatons.
I think not even state of the art technology can get the Tsar 50Mt device below 10 tons because a lot of weight simply is *needed* as either fuel or for inertia.


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