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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: How to CREATE new kinds of Shrooms. (For Real!) [Re: djfrog]
    #584058 - 03/20/02 05:47 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

Oh god! Not the post-it note prank again! God, I actually fell for that years ago. Cooking up post-its and spermicide! Damn did I feel dumb to find out it was Ythan's idea of a joke. It seems to be one that just won't die...


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"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obi Wan Kenobi

PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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OfflineCatzeye
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Re: How to CREATE new kinds of Shrooms. (For Real!) [Re: Asante]
    #584302 - 03/20/02 10:51 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

I've noticed that some strains seem to naturally go through a serious of mutations at each flush. The Amazonians I've worked with tend to start of rather small and potent with small caps then by the third or fourth flush they get very tall and have larger caps but the potency isn't the same. This is probably just a developmental phase. I've also noticed that shrooms will have a different phenotype depending on what type of substrate they were grown in. For example, I had some Amazonians grown on Rye and Millet which were cased with 50/50+ and they had a dark redish gold color and the stems were a light gold color. When I grew them out on Finch seed with oat groats I noticed the shrooms were a much more vibrant light gold with flecks of cream in them. I believe the amount of amino acids and triptomine pre-cursors in the substrate has a tremendous amount to do with a strains appearance, specifically for color and potency. I wonder if altering specific amino acids in the substrate would cause a "mutation" or perhaps bring up hidden traits?
Has anyone had experience with altering amino-acid content of substrate to produce specific mushroom traits like color or potency???
I've also noted in my experimentation with the shrooms that Nitrogen and Calcium can greatly affect mushroom size and density. I would be very interested in seeing some pictures of shrooms grown on a substrate or casing material with a High Nitrogen content compared with shrooms grown on a low Nitrogen content substrate or casing material.
Anyway, I guess my point of all this is that there are plenty of ways to change a shrooms morphology without using all the elaborate and toxic techniques described in the posts above.
What do you all think?

Cheers!

Catzeye


--------------------
~It is Green, It Is AquaMarine~
It is Colors I have Never Seen.
I can See Past You
To the White Sands.
Stevie Nicks


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: please don't [Re: mycofile]
    #584485 - 03/21/02 02:24 AM (20 years, 8 months ago)

Bullshit? I can't disprove it.

It's HIS thing & he gives not a spore away. Well: could still be bullshit, nay?
I don't know how potent the P.Az. is you manage to grow, but the Azures I've tried were only like 1.5x stronger than real good PF-TEKkies, and I'm quite positive about this because I tend to use low doses.
Notice the "(slightly)" bit in that post.

"post-it".. I'd say don't post it.


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Offlinezeronio
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Re: please don't [Re: Asante]
    #584953 - 03/21/02 12:50 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

I worked on creating atrificial life with genetic algorithms. Putting it simple that's computer simulation of evolution. There are two important things: recombination of genes (mating) and mutation (random alteration of genes).
The point is that increasing mutation rate improves results at begining but after a certain point result drasticly decline. It is similar in real evolution: very high mutation rate makes more damage than benefits.

My bet is that if your friend really got a strain that produces more psilocybin that was pure luck. It's easy to convince yourself that your mushrooms are more potent than others but that has probably nothing to do with reality. If you were using scientific methods than millions of strains and generations should be tested.

Don't belive everything you think...


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: please don't [Re: zeronio]
    #585042 - 03/21/02 04:57 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

> mutation rate improves results at begining but after a certain point result drasticly decline.

This is a common problem in genetic evolution algorithims that don't employ speciation (species seperation).


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


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Invisiblefastfred
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Re: please don't [Re: Asante]
    #3067737 - 08/30/04 10:10 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

Good post. Anybody have any interesting mutants yet?


-FF


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: How to CREATE new kinds of Shrooms. (For Real!) [Re: Asante]
    #3068783 - 08/30/04 08:15 PM (18 years, 3 months ago)

GMO's rock!!!


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Offlinemycoguy
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Re: please don't [Re: di11rod]
    #3071677 - 08/31/04 08:13 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

di11rod said:
this is not a very good idea at all.
<br>
<br>the method you are advocating (creating random mutations via UV) is so hopelessly uncontrolled that the odds are astronimically higher the results will be crappier mushrooms rather than better strains.
<br>
<br>i could hardly really care that somebody is growing crummier mushrooms except that there is so much spore trading going on that this practice would threaten the gene pool at large. not that it's going to make other mushrooms screwed up. what would happen is that you could never trust a spore print you got from someone and know that somewhere in the ancestral history some dumbass hadn't been subjecting the grandaddies to ultra-high levels of UV and now this spore print is going to spawn weakass mushrooms. want proof of this danger? look at PF's site and check out his explanation for what happened to his famous PF strain last year. he blames it all on accidental UV interference.
<br>
<br>if you really want unique, new mushrooms, follow mjshroomer's example and visit faraway lands and pick wild mushrooms yourself and harvest the spores. heck, take a trip to the gulf coast if you don't have the budget.




I agree. Does the thread-starter have any scientific references to back up his post? I find this whole thing very hard to control...and believe.


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Invisiblefastfred
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Re: please don't [Re: mycoguy]
    #3072140 - 08/31/04 10:21 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

What's so hard to believe? PF ran into problems because he had no idea what he was doing. He ran many generations of mushrooms under a blacklight.

UV mutants are a conerstone of strain development. They are well established in advanced breeding programs.



-FF


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OfflineMikeOLogical
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Re: please don't [Re: Asante]
    #3128450 - 09/13/04 12:05 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

A danger not mentioned with UV sterilizers- My friend wired one into his glove box, expecting better sterility.

He permanently ruined his eyesight from the reflected rays bombarding his eyes as he looked into the glovebox.

The total time frame in which the damage occured was a matter of days, with only a few minutes per day of exposure.

I would not recommend playing with UV without knowing how to prevent all the dangers.

Mutations in mushroom culture can be easily achieved through successive cloning. It takes much longer, but it is the only mutagenic method that is absolutely safe.


--------------------
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Invisiblefastfred
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Re: please don't [Re: MikeOLogical]
    #3128902 - 09/13/04 07:15 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

The main danger of UV exposure is a slight increase in the rate of cataracts. This doesn't occur until later in life (40+). That information is based on exposure to the sun. You should not be using UV lamps that are that much stronger than the UV from the sun.

Your friend would have had to have a tremendous exposure to UV in order to damage his eyesight in such a short timeframe. Most hoods that I've seen have a plexiglass front on them, which would totally shield the UV rays from the user. It is also well known that you should not look directly at UV lamps. Ignoring this is akin to staring directly into the sun.

They are in common use in sterile transfer rooms and hoods. The light needs to be turned off when you start work, so the exposure should be minimal.

The proper way to induce UV mutations is to irradiate the spores until a germination rate of 1-2% occurs. This method, when done properly, will not expose the scientist to ANY UV rays. Hence there is no danger in doing it.


-FF


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Offlinevc77
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Re: please don't [Re: Asante]
    #3131762 - 09/14/04 06:03 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

I think is this is a great thread. Although the concept is open for failure and quite complicated to do, it is still possible.


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Offlinemush20
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Re: please don't [Re: Asante]
    #3133107 - 09/14/04 12:00 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Uhhh, you sure they were Azures? They are way way more potent then cubes. More like 2 to 3+ times. The only thing I would think would work is possibly using mutenegins or selective breeding. I do know for a fact that they do work for pot, theres some kinda gout medicine that might work on shrooms as well. As for cubes, ive noticed the potency varies to some degree, but you cant tell accuratly by eating at all. There is way to many variables.

BTW, Your friend just happends to have some super potent mutant cubes that could revolutionise the shroom growing business and he just happends to keep it to himself when he could make a LOT of money from it?


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OfflinePhanTomCat
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Re: please don't [Re: mush20]
    #3238447 - 10/10/04 01:26 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Hey, this sounds like fun if ya~ had the time....!    Mutation stuff is always cool.... 

(I wanted to bump this so I could find it later in my posts list....)  :laugh:

ChoW~


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OfflinePhanTomCat
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How to CREATE new kinds of Shrooms. (For Real!) [Re: Asante]
    #3238450 - 10/10/04 01:28 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Oooops, meant to reply to the original....


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InvisibleSuper_Blunt
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Re: please don't [Re: PhanTomCat]
    #3312318 - 11/03/04 08:59 AM (18 years, 1 month ago)

interesten


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InvisibleMiddlemanM

Registered: 07/12/99
Posts: 8,396
Chromosome Cowboy [Re: EvilGir]
    #3382960 - 11/19/04 01:35 PM (18 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

jezu said:
Ok there is another method that would produce a super mutant shroom,. This would be done using Mitotic Inhibitors, which is a chemical that would double the amount of chromosome in the shrooms. The chemical that would be used would be Colchicine-Dimethyl Sulfoxide which is derived from the autumn crocus.





got any links on colchicine and cannabis?
i'm not finding anything at overgrow.


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: Chromosome Cowboy [Re: Middleman]
    #3382988 - 11/19/04 02:20 PM (18 years, 23 days ago)



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Invisibleryan
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Re: Chromosome Cowboy [Re: Anno]
    #3389919 - 11/21/04 01:17 AM (18 years, 22 days ago)

Most everything in this 4 page post is bullshit. Some not practicle, most plain wrong.

Colchicine has been used with a variety of plants. If fact the person that originated the B+ had some BS to say about it being developed with colchicine and an autoclave or some crap like that.


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Invisibleryan
Member since 1997
Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 111
Re: Chromosome Cowboy [Re: ryan]
    #3390810 - 11/21/04 05:57 AM (18 years, 22 days ago)

here is an old thread to bring up some ideas:

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat...=true#Post91392


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