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InvisibleAlex213
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Registered: 08/22/05
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WTF is going on in Iraq?
    #5808466 - 07/01/06 01:04 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

US soldiers accused of rape and murder of Iraqi family

The US military is investigating whether American soldiers raped an Iraqi woman and then killed her and three members of her family, including a child, south of Baghdad in March, officials said yesterday. It is the latest in a series of military investigations in which US troops are suspected of killing civilians in Iraq.

Last week, 12 US troops were charged with murder over the deaths of Iraqi civilians in two separate incidents. In addition, another criminal investigation is continuing into the suspected role of US marines in killing 24 unarmed Iraqi civilians in the western town of Haditha last November.

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/article1152079.ece

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OfflineThe_Red_Crayon
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: Alex213]
    #5808509 - 07/01/06 01:14 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

War is the complete and utter lack of reason.

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OfflinexDuckYouSuckerx
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: Alex213]
    #5809097 - 07/01/06 07:20 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

People do those things all the time. It doesn't have anything to do with us being at war or, as you are always trying to push, the inherent evil of this war. If you take three quarter million people, from anywhere, you'd see that a lot of them are going to be commiting crimes. The military is no different. Why don't you post "WTF is going on in Detroit" or washington DC? Your pithy comments serve to show that you are only trying to push your idiotic agenda.


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Unions are the bastions of the mediocre. - luvdemshrooms

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InvisibleUnderNose
all out of bubble gum
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5809106 - 07/01/06 07:31 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

why don't you and heston go and kill some shit then
War brings out the worst in people


--------------------
LAGM 2.022

:dna::dna:

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InvisibleAlex213
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Registered: 08/22/05
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5809190 - 07/01/06 08:58 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

People do those things all the time. It doesn't have anything to do with us being at war or, as you are always trying to push, the inherent evil of this war. If you take three quarter million people, from anywhere,

Then you'll be able to link me to all the stories of american soldiers back home shooting american women and kids. After all, they "do this all the time" right?  :rolleyes:

Why don't you post "WTF is going on in Detroit"

:boxerface:

Don't be "idiotic". Because we're talking about soldiers not the criminal population of America. Can you comprehend the difference?

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Offlinewilshire
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: Alex213]
    #5809492 - 07/01/06 11:37 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

this wasn't a criminal act of soldiers at war, as the haditha massacre was. it was a civil crime commited by occupation soldiers. there are about 170,000 american troops in iraq right now. the fact that a few of them occassionally commit heinous criminal acts doesn't surprise me at all, and it doesn't reflect on the overall situation in iraq. it's not like the red army occupation after world war two.

you might remember three american soldiers being convicted of rape in japan in 1996:

http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/9603/okinawa_rape/

and the last military execution in the US was a soldier convicted of raping an austrian girl.

these are civil crimes that may occur under any situation. the title you chose to give this thread implies that this event is just another symptom of the misdirection and frustration of the us military in its iraq "quagmire". i don't think that that implication is accurate.


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Invisibledownforpot
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: wilshire]
    #5809543 - 07/01/06 11:57 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

The crime rates of our troops reflect our own crime rates in the USA. It's pretty much the same crime rate for murder, rape, and suicide However, I think that suicide might be a little bit higher over there but I am not sure .


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InvisibleAlex213
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Registered: 08/22/05
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: wilshire]
    #5809814 - 07/01/06 01:50 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

this wasn't a criminal act of soldiers at war

Which incident are you referring to? There are at least 3 mentioned in the article. Are you honestly saying raping a woman then executing her, her entire family and her child isn't a criminal act of soldiers at war? Where else do you think such an act would happen?

the fact that a few of them occassionally commit

"Occasionally"? There are at least 4 incidents just in the two paragraphs above. There was another incident last week where a handicapped Iraqi was dragged out and shot. And remember these are only the stories we hear about. What ratio do you think there of acts that never get reported to superior officers and taken to prosecution? Ten to one? A hundred to one?

and it doesn't reflect on the overall situation in iraq

I disagree. I think occupation troops committing massacres, raping a woman then murdering her entire family does reflect on the overall situation in Iraq.

you might remember three american soldiers being convicted of rape in japan in 1996

Come off it. You can hardly compare a rape with this incident. The woman and her entire family including a child were slaughtered.

And you had to go back 10 years to even find a single case of rape. Can you find me a case of rape combined with the massacre of her entire family including a child?

these are civil crimes that may occur under any situation

Nonsense. I don't believe such a situation would have occured anywhere but Iraq today. If you can find me american soldiers commiting similar acts anywhere else in the world today then please do so.

the title you chose to give this thread implies that this event is just another symptom of the misdirection and frustration of the us military in its iraq "quagmire".

Not really. It's merely the first thing that comes to mind when you are regularly confronted by stories of massacres, rapes and the murder of children.

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InvisibleAlex213
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: downforpot]
    #5809832 - 07/01/06 01:55 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

The crime rates of our troops reflect our own crime rates in the USA

You need to compare the crime rates of serving soldiers in the US with serving soldiers in Iraq to find a suitable comparison. And remember we're not talking "crime" in the sense of smoking a doobie here. We're talking rape followed by mass murder. I think we can safely say Iraq will show a larger percentage of such crimes among soldiers than the US.

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Offlinewilshire
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: Alex213]
    #5809879 - 07/01/06 02:06 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

the event i'm speaking about is the rape/murder. in my comparisons to events in japan and austria, i am pointing out that this is a civil crime committed by soldiers stationed abroad. it is not something on par with a haditha, a my lai, or the treatment russian and german soldiers gave civilians on the eastern front in world war two. it's regular old street crime. show me any population of 170,000 of predominantly young men, in any situation, and i will find you some rapists and murderers among them.

my point is that rapes and murders happen all the time in all sorts of circumstances. that event says nothing about the overall military situation in iraq.


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InvisibleAlex213
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: wilshire]
    #5811598 - 07/02/06 03:19 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

it's regular old street crime.

Nah. You don't get groups of american soldiers raping and then murdering entire families in everyday american life. That kind of thing only happens in Iraq.

show me any population of 170,000 of predominantly young men, in any situation, and i will find you some rapists and murderers among them.


I think you're being a little harsh on soldiers there. As I said, if you can find me examples of groups of soldiers committing rapes and then murdering entire families in America then you may have a point.

that event says nothing about the overall military situation in iraq.

If it has nothing to do with the situation in Iraq then why arn't soldiers raping and murdering entire families back home in America?

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InvisibleBiG_StroOnZ
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: Alex213]
    #5811654 - 07/02/06 03:58 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

they have nothing else to do there...

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InvisibleMourningdove
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Registered: 11/24/05
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: BiG_StroOnZ]
    #5812004 - 07/02/06 10:06 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Those soldiers are cowards and losers and should be dealt with either by the US or the insurgents.

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Offlinewilshire
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: Alex213]
    #5812472 - 07/02/06 01:21 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

If it has nothing to do with the situation in Iraq then why arn't soldiers raping and murdering entire families back home in America?

i see your point. the presence of law and order in iraq and the position and condition of us soldiers there is different than in the united states or other countries.

i shouldn't have said that the event said "nothing" about the military situation in iraq. it doesn't mean anything useful though. occupation soldiers are in a position to abuse their power? there is a lesser degree of law and order in a country that has recently had its government of 35 years deposed, and is currently in a mild state of war, than elsewhere? you don't say...


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InvisibleHank, FTW
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Registered: 05/04/06
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5813354 - 07/02/06 07:28 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

xDuckYouSuckerx said:
People do those things all the time. It doesn't have anything to do with us being at war or, as you are always trying to push, the inherent evil of this war. If you take three quarter million people, from anywhere, you'd see that a lot of them are going to be commiting crimes. The military is no different. Why don't you post "WTF is going on in Detroit" or washington DC? Your pithy comments serve to show that you are only trying to push your idiotic agenda.




--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:

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InvisibleAlex213
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Registered: 08/22/05
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: wilshire]
    #5814212 - 07/02/06 11:53 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

occupation soldiers are in a position to abuse their power? there is a lesser degree of law and order in a country that has recently had its government of 35 years deposed, and is currently in a mild state of war, than elsewhere? you don't say...

I'm not convinced "lesser degree of law and order" and "mild state of war" really explain such atrocities. And don't forget it's been 3 years since Saddam was deposed and we already have an alleged "Iraqi government".

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OfflinexDuckYouSuckerx
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: Alex213]
    #5815276 - 07/03/06 09:51 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Nope, you are right. The thing is, we are there for oil/blood, and thus, George Bush and Dick Cheney made this war and the conditions are entirely their fault and make kids likely to rape/murder. Thats the answer you wanted, yes? Well, you got it, ta ta.


--------------------
Unions are the bastions of the mediocre. - luvdemshrooms

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Offlinewilshire
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: Alex213]
    #5815315 - 07/03/06 09:58 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I'm not convinced "lesser degree of law and order" and "mild state of war" really explain such atrocities.

what does then?


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InvisibleHank, FTW
Looking for the Answer

Registered: 05/04/06
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: xDuckYouSuckerx]
    #5815345 - 07/03/06 10:07 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

xDuckYouSuckerx said:
People do those things all the time.  It doesn't have anything to do with us being at war or, as you are always trying to push, the inherent evil of this war.  If you take three quarter million people, from anywhere, you'd see that a lot of them are going to be commiting crimes.  The military is no different.  Why don't you post "WTF is going on in Detroit" or washington DC?  Your pithy comments serve to show that you are only trying to push your idiotic agenda.




:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:


--------------------
Capliberty:

"I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol
Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

:rofl:

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OfflinexDuckYouSuckerx
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Re: WTF is going on in Iraq? [Re: wilshire]
    #5815369 - 07/03/06 10:13 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

wilshire said:
I'm not convinced "lesser degree of law and order" and "mild state of war" really explain such atrocities.

what does then?




Bush lied, and the soldiers know that so they rape and kill. Clearly, this is all Bush's fault and somehow shows how wrong the Iraqi war is.


--------------------
Unions are the bastions of the mediocre. - luvdemshrooms

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