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tak
geo's henchman



Registered: 11/20/00
Posts: 3,776
Loc: nowhereland
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: Microcosmatrix]
#5789588 - 06/25/06 02:59 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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this is why driving sucks. everyone gets arrested in cars.
-------------------- The DJ's took pills to stay awake and play for seven days.
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Annapurna1
liberal pussy

Registered: 05/21/02
Posts: 5,646
Loc: innsmouth..MA
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: Microcosmatrix]
#5789593 - 06/25/06 03:02 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Yeah, but if some other asshole hits you, you can go to jail and face heavy financial losses due to no fault of your own.
thats not necessarily a probable cause for a drug test...but the potential for abuse still exists..especially in cases where there is a financial incentive to do so (below)...to date..however NORML reports no widespread pattern of abuse...
Quote:
Avoid the states that have a little car in them..
funny that some states should have the little car right next to the little marijuana leaf...can you say "kickbacks"??...
--------------------
"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



Registered: 10/08/02
Posts: 44,175
Last seen: 3 months, 10 days
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: Microcosmatrix]
#5789766 - 06/25/06 04:13 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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I think that's what Seuss was implying.
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero


Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
Last seen: 2 months, 19 days
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: RosettaStoned]
#5790042 - 06/25/06 05:49 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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> And where do you suggest poor people get such a camera?
With burden of proof being upon the state, the cop would be required to provide the camera and evidence to the jury showing that somebody was indeed impaired.
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
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sever
Where am I?
Registered: 02/02/03
Posts: 161
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: carbonhoots]
#5791007 - 06/25/06 11:32 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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~
Edited by sever (07/17/06 02:04 PM)
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Konnrade
↑↑↓↓<--><-->BA



Registered: 09/13/05
Posts: 13,833
Loc: LA Suburbs
Last seen: 8 months, 25 days
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: Microcosmatrix]
#5791302 - 06/26/06 01:17 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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"Zero tolerance" (n)- a system wherein policymakers have established a legal excuse to avoid the effort of fair arbitration over criminal matters. The standard of judgement is that if an official might have to put forth the effort to think, then the suspect is guilty. This system is popular among policymakers, as it frees them from responsibility for the injustice they subsequently wreak, in addition to absolving them of the requirement to work.
--------------------
I find your lack of faith disturbing
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RosettaStoned
Stranger

Registered: 05/29/06
Posts: 540
Loc: North America
Last seen: 15 years, 10 months
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: Seuss]
#5791376 - 06/26/06 01:43 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Seuss said: > And where do you suggest poor people get such a camera?
With burden of proof being upon the state, the cop would be required to provide the camera and evidence to the jury showing that somebody was indeed impaired.
I disagree. I don't think the burden of proof is on the state at all. The burden is on you to prove that the case against you is bullshit. And all the while they will dangle a nice deal in front of you if you cop a guilty plea. Plead innocent and they will kindly remind you of the maximum penalty compared to the deal they are offering.
And how much does it cost to fight a case in court effectively? Even something as trivial as a DUI? 2000? 5000? How many people can afford that? So basically entrust your fate to the maximum penalty if your public defender fails (who has zero incentive to care about the outcome of your case) or plead guilty and take the deal they are offering. Especially for someone who is broke or has a prior record, the choice is obvious.
-------------------- "Government big enough to provide you with all you need is also big enough to take everything you have." ~ Thomas Jefferson "Without stupid, faggy potheads we wouldn't have wars." - Zappa
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero


Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
Last seen: 2 months, 19 days
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: RosettaStoned]
#5791633 - 06/26/06 04:27 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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> I don't think the burden of proof is on the state at all.
Fortunately, the US constitution disagrees with you.
> The burden is on you to prove that the case against you is bullshit.
Please take a liberty and law class before engaging in this sort of debate. Assuming we are speaking of the US law system, you are very ignorant (in the true sense of the word, not meant as a flame).
The burden of proof is always on the accuser in the US court system. If the accuser doesn't show up to court, and you are the defendant, then you walk free. If a cop claims that you were driving while impaired, then it is up to him to prove that you were impaired.
I'm not interested in any perceived corruption in the system. Compared to any of the other countries I have lived in, the US justice system is the least corrupt of them all. That isn't to say there aren't problems, but this thread is not about corrupt courts but rather stupid politicians passing stupid laws.
My original idea still holds: Rather than making up magical "over the limit" numbers and stupid "zero tolerance" rules we need a simple "driving while impaired" roadside skills test. Anything from an injury to a drug can cause impairment. If one cannot pass the roadside test, the jury gets to watch the cops dashboard camera and decide if the person should be convicted of a crime or not. Simple, easy, and fair.
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
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RosettaStoned
Stranger

Registered: 05/29/06
Posts: 540
Loc: North America
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: Seuss]
#5792427 - 06/26/06 12:46 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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Well I'm glad you think the american public defenders do such good work that they can be depended on to get you an innocent verdict. But something tells me you have never had to use one, nor will. Poor people and people with prior records are fucked in the courts every single day.
You can sit back and have a perceived idea that our govt gives a fuck about the constitution and I can sit back and watch the numbers in our jails continue to rise. This is a prison planet and the courts are handing out the sentences. Pretty soon they will be coming door to door testing for drugs and locking anyone up who fails the test. Or how about a drug test to get a drivers license? To apply for a loan?
I still stand by my original statement, that the burden of proof is on the accused. Sure the prosecuter has to show up, but they do that every day, it's their job. They'll be there and if you want an innocent verdict (barring extremely rare circumstances) you have to dish out lots of cash for a decent defense. And without a decent defense, you are surely to be found guilty. But that assumption falls on the premise that public defenders are worthless, which if you believe they can provide adequate defense, then I guess from that point of view, the burden is on the state.
A public defenders job, is to offer you the prosecutions deal, anything more than that and you are in for an unfortunate surprise.
-------------------- "Government big enough to provide you with all you need is also big enough to take everything you have." ~ Thomas Jefferson "Without stupid, faggy potheads we wouldn't have wars." - Zappa
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Microcosmatrix
Spiral staircasetechnician


Registered: 10/20/05
Posts: 11,293
Loc: Ythan's house
Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: RosettaStoned]
#5792457 - 06/26/06 12:56 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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You're both right.
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero


Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
Last seen: 2 months, 19 days
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: RosettaStoned]
#5792800 - 06/26/06 03:01 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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> Well I'm glad you think the american public defenders do such good work that they can be depended on to get you an innocent verdict.
Please quote any line of mine in this thread that has the words "public defender" in it, other than this one. I am always amazed how people can read my mind. 
> I still stand by my original statement, that the burden of proof is on the accused.
Then you still lack a fundemental understanding of how the US court system works. I have a friend that walked from a DUI, in Arapahoe County Colorado, because the cop that arrested him didn't show up for court. His public defender asked the judge to drop the case because the accuser was not present, and the judge did. (Other police that showed up on the scene as backup were in court, but the original arresting officer was not. *laugh* Wanna talk about some pissed off cops; it was beautiful! I thought the one older guy, a supervisor, was gonna have a heart attack the way his face turned red.)
I have personally been through the court system, on the wrong end of the stick so to speak, twice. Both times with public defenders. Once for a minor charge and once for three major felonies (not drug or violence related). I got off with a fine/no record on the minor charge and with a three year suspended sentence on the major felonies. After three years, the charges went away as if they had never been. Since then, I have worked for the federal government and passed a very invasive security check, I have puchased firearms after passing the background check, I have a CCW permit (again required a background check), etc. In other words, my record is clean. You may think the system is corrupt beyond reason, but having been through it myself, I know that it is not always so.
Don't get me wrong, there are certainly problems with the system. I have always felt that lawyers should be restricted to civil suits and that ONLY public defenders should be allowed for criminal cases with both the defense and prosecution being given identical budgets for the case. Of course, since you can read my mind, you knew this already... I also don't think that any confession, or guilty plea, should be allowed in court. Even if the person admits guilt, I think the state should be required to prove it, before a jury of peers, as well. And in case you are curious, I am against the death sentence.
Finally, if we didn't have so many non-violent drug related charges in the system, then maybe, just maybe the over worked public defenders would be able to do a better job. Blame the politicians, not the courts... of cousre, most politicians come out of the court system... don't get me started kvetching about lawyers.
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
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Microcosmatrix
Spiral staircasetechnician


Registered: 10/20/05
Posts: 11,293
Loc: Ythan's house
Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: Seuss]
#5792821 - 06/26/06 03:06 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
I have always felt that lawyers should be restricted to civil suits and that ONLY public defenders should be allowed for criminal cases
A recepie for certain disaster. The Public Pretender is paid by the MAN, works for the MAN, and answers to the MAN...
Not to you.
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



Registered: 10/08/02
Posts: 44,175
Last seen: 3 months, 10 days
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: Microcosmatrix]
#5792831 - 06/26/06 03:12 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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A defense attorney does not answer to the government, regardless of whether they are a public defender or not. I have had a n enormous exposure to public defender and the court system, and I can assure you that these men and women have nothing but the best interest of their clients in mind.
Not everyone involved in gov't is a corrupt, lying scumbag; just most of them.
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: Redstorm]
#5792857 - 06/26/06 03:22 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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"Once for a minor charge and once for three major felonies (not drug or violence related)."
What, did you try to rob a bank with a banana? That you stole with a getaway car? That a baby was in?
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero


Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
Last seen: 2 months, 19 days
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: zappaisgod]
#5792959 - 06/26/06 03:58 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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> What, did you try to rob a bank with a banana?
Nah. I had a very experimental mind as a youth. Certain law enforcement agencies, such as the ATF, didn't appreciate the loud percussive noises that I was creating. Turns out they have a lot of regulations regarding the creation of, transportation of, use of, and storage of... some things regardless of the science one has in mind. They happily ignored the "I'm a minor" bit and tossed the proverbial book at me. Three years later, I was squeaky clean. It wasn't all bad. Many years later, I landed a job in a real lab testing the properties of new, experimental explosives; hired largely because of my previous experience. In todays world, I would have been tagged a terrorist and carted off to some hidden prison. *shiver* How times have changed.
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: Seuss]
#5793061 - 06/26/06 04:29 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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I'm glad to hear you escaped the pervasive lack of humor so endemic these days. I, myself, could have had some interesting law enforcement issues in a similar vein, had I been caught, as a sprout.
As a side note, I consider you to be the only reliable source for an understanding of anything scientific who posts in PA&L. If you say it I believe it. Everybody else seems to have Social Scientist Disorder. Now there's an oxymoron, Social Scientist.
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Microcosmatrix
Spiral staircasetechnician


Registered: 10/20/05
Posts: 11,293
Loc: Ythan's house
Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: Annapurna1]
#5793102 - 06/26/06 04:43 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
funny that some states should have the little car right next to the little marijuana leaf...can you say "kickbacks"??...
Yeah decrim + DUID = greed
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero


Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
Last seen: 2 months, 19 days
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: zappaisgod]
#5793197 - 06/26/06 05:08 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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> If you say it I believe it.
Be careful there. I have made mistakes, though I try not to for the most part. Sometimes, with the conspiracy crowd, I will leave one or two in on purpose to see if anybody picks up on it or not. Seldom am I called... and when I am, it is usually by W_S. Never on anything important, at least intentionally.
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: Seuss]
#5793442 - 06/26/06 06:27 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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There is a surprising paucity of science knowledge here. I trust you not to lie and to apply a level of rigor above that of the social "scientists" who over step their.....what? nonsense? fantasies?
Little tests for W_S? Now that's funny.
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hunnybunny420
Stranger



Registered: 10/12/09
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Re: Drive weeks after smoking weed? Get convicted of drugged driving. [Re: carbonhoots]
#14317239 - 04/19/11 12:50 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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I dont like to drive anywhere unless I have at least one blunt to smoke
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