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 blacksabbathrulz
Registered: 05/22/02
Posts: 2,511
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 Illegal immigration 
#5764744 - 06/18/06 03:23 PM (16 years, 11 months ago) |
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I had a thought earlier. Many people have no problem with illegal immigration, despite the billions of dollars of problems it causes every year. It would be great if the government surveyed everyone, and asked if they think we should allow these immigrants to come across. For those that said yes, I think it would be great if they were then to pay a sumly amount of money to support these illegal immigrants, and the people that said no would not have to pay a dime.
Anyone think that the ideas about illegal immigration would change?
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Silversoul
Rhizome
Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
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Quote:
blacksabbathrulz said:
Many people have no problem with illegal immigration
I have yet to meet such a person. Just because someone's not an irrational hardliner doesn't mean they're not concerned about the problem.
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blacksabbathrulz
Registered: 05/22/02
Posts: 2,511
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Re: Illegal immigration [Re: Silversoul]
#5764868 - 06/18/06 04:08 PM (16 years, 11 months ago) |
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I've met numerous people who think we should allow any and all mexicans to come into our country.
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 The_Red_Crayon
Exposer of Truth
Registered: 08/13/03
Posts: 13,673
Loc: Smokey Mtns. TN 
Last seen: 6 years, 27 days
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People dont just migrate on a massive scale, their needs to be a solid reason, Maybe the subsidized farming and NAFTA have flooded the mexican markets with cheap subsidized grain that mexican farmers cant compete therefore they migrate to the US a place where their is employment.
What you see is a problem of apathy, i see as a problem of Globalization and the Cooperate power interests trying to keep their profits up. Maybe if employers were actually penalized we wouldnt have such a catastrophe.
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niteowl
GrandPaw
Registered: 07/01/03
Posts: 16,291
Loc:
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Maybe if employers were actually penalized we wouldnt have such a catastrophe.
That is the only way, this flood of illegals will slow.
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Live for the moment you are in nowDon't be bogged down by your pastDon't be afraid of what lies in your future
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RosettaStoned
Stranger
Registered: 05/29/06
Posts: 540
Loc: North America
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: Illegal immigration [Re: niteowl]
#5765254 - 06/18/06 06:14 PM (16 years, 11 months ago) |
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Mandatory 5 yr minimum federal prison sentence for the top CEO of any parent company caught employing someone in the US illegally after a set date. And a 5 yr mandatory sentence for any foreigner caught using a stolen social security number in the US to pass as a citizen, after a set date.
Do this and you wouldn't need one fucking wall, there would be no reason for them to come here through the back door anymore.
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"Government big enough to provide you with all you need is also big enough to take everything you have." ~ Thomas Jefferson
"Without stupid, faggy potheads we wouldn't have wars." - Zappa
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xDuckYouSuckerx
xBannedx
Registered: 05/25/06
Posts: 1,410
Last seen: 16 years, 9 months
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hehe, back door 
I think that putting these illegals in prison is a bad idea. Id on't want to pay for them to exist no matter how they are doing it. Armed border agents with orders to shoot first would be the best way of stopping the flow.
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Unions are the bastions of the mediocre. - luvdemshrooms
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RosettaStoned
Stranger
Registered: 05/29/06
Posts: 540
Loc: North America
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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They are coming here for money to send back home though, and there has to be some enforced consequences for someone using fake documents so the employers can't say "I didn't know they were fake". Throw them both in jail for it so one can't blame it on the other. The numbers of illegals in jail would decrease in no time after the 1st 5-10 year period since there would be no more cash to be had here for them under the table.
Besides it's not like we don't have the prison room. http://www.mindfully.org/Reform/2004/FEMA-Concentration-Camps3sep04.htm
As appealing as shooting people may be to some, it is not the right thing to do when the true instigators of this whole mess wear nice suits. If you want to shoot anyone for this you need to look at the CEOs who exploit the poverty situation of mexico, not the mexicans coming here because they have no other option short of revolution. And if they tried revolution our govt would probably step in and help mexico to quell it.
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"Government big enough to provide you with all you need is also big enough to take everything you have." ~ Thomas Jefferson
"Without stupid, faggy potheads we wouldn't have wars." - Zappa
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xDuckYouSuckerx
xBannedx
Registered: 05/25/06
Posts: 1,410
Last seen: 16 years, 9 months
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I don't think that the Evil CEO's ala Mr Burns are behind it. Most of the people doing the hiring are plant managers, or guys that run small companies. Not that I'm making excuses, hire an illegal, face a firing squad.
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Unions are the bastions of the mediocre. - luvdemshrooms
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RosettaStoned
Stranger
Registered: 05/29/06
Posts: 540
Loc: North America
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Quote:
Most of the people doing the hiring are plant managers
While this may be true, I'm a firm believe in "the buck stops here". If the companies under your umbrella are hiring illegals the ultimate responsibility falls on the chief executive officer.
But at least you are supporting an equal opportunity firing squad 
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"Government big enough to provide you with all you need is also big enough to take everything you have." ~ Thomas Jefferson
"Without stupid, faggy potheads we wouldn't have wars." - Zappa
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xDuckYouSuckerx
xBannedx
Registered: 05/25/06
Posts: 1,410
Last seen: 16 years, 9 months
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In a nutshell, we should decree that illegal aliens are to be considered foreign invaders and repelled as necessary, to include lethal force. The military that we move back from overseas bases we would have on our borders.
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Unions are the bastions of the mediocre. - luvdemshrooms
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buckwheat
Cynically Insane
Registered: 12/09/02
Posts: 11,179
Loc: Not Enough Characters to ...
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I wouldnt count on anything from government. Instead of building a border wall they are quitely building the NAFTA superhighway. That should thell you where their long term intentions are.
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GabbaDj
BTH
Registered: 04/08/01
Posts: 19,658
Loc: By The Lake
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Re: Illegal immigration [Re: buckwheat]
#5766572 - 06/19/06 01:52 AM (16 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Instead of building a border wall they are quitely building the NAFTA superhighway.
Building a boarder wall is the most ecinomical and effective solution to the problem.. Above any and all legislation a wall would provide jobs for Americans, Provide relief from the $$$ spend to provide services to immigrants and it would provide greater protection for the American Middle Class.
Imagine a system where a wall is made and a new "Boarder Corps" progeam is created with voulenteers protecting the boarder from illigals comming into the country and destroying the school system. The voulenteers could be paid with college scholarships.
Once the wall is in place the current system of deporting criminals could be beefed up and the system would work smooth.
Its just that simple.
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GabbaDj
FAMM.ORG
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RosettaStoned
Stranger
Registered: 05/29/06
Posts: 540
Loc: North America
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: Illegal immigration [Re: GabbaDj]
#5766669 - 06/19/06 02:31 AM (16 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Its just that simple.
I don't believe it's that simple at all. As long as companies are willing to hire illegals then they will find a way to get here, no matter what size wall we build.
I like to use this analogy when discussing this situation with my folks. If your house is infested with ants eating the food crumbs off your floor, do you build a big wall to keep the ants out? Or do you keep the floor clean and the food put away? (not that I consider illegal aliens ants, I personally believe they are being exploited) As long as there is food on the floor you will have ants. Lets pretend raid spray doesn't exist for this analogy, since killing them will never be an option nor should it.
Stop the companies from being able to employ these people (by jail time not just fines!!!) and they will no longer have a reason to come here en mass. It IS as simple as that.
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"Government big enough to provide you with all you need is also big enough to take everything you have." ~ Thomas Jefferson
"Without stupid, faggy potheads we wouldn't have wars." - Zappa
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niteowl
GrandPaw
Registered: 07/01/03
Posts: 16,291
Loc:
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Quote:
RosettaStoned said:
I don't believe it's that simple at all. As long as companies are willing to hire illegals then they will find a way to get here, no matter what size wall we build.....
Stop the companies from being able to employ these people (by jail time not just fines!!!) and they will no longer have a reason to come here en mass. It IS as simple as that.
Building a wall will solve nothing.
Punish the people, that are hiring the illegals, and the problem will be solved in a year.
Most of the solutions, to Americas problems, are staring them in the face.....they just don't want to see it.
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Live for the moment you are in nowDon't be bogged down by your pastDon't be afraid of what lies in your future
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niteowl
GrandPaw
Registered: 07/01/03
Posts: 16,291
Loc:
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Re: Illegal immigration [Re: niteowl]
#5766769 - 06/19/06 03:37 AM (16 years, 11 months ago) |
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This whole "illegal immigrant problem" is troublesome to the American worker on many fronts. One reason being that, it makes it harder for people to unite into unions, if the company can just start hiring illegals.
I have seen this first hand in a factory near where I live. The employees started talking about forming a union.....within 6 months the company started hiring Mexican workers.
Big business wants cheap labor.
Big business funds our politicians.
Why do you think our Government hasn't made this a priority?
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Live for the moment you are in nowDon't be bogged down by your pastDon't be afraid of what lies in your future
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Baby_Hitler
Errorist
Registered: 03/06/02
Posts: 27,295
Loc: To the limit!
Last seen: 15 minutes, 4 seconds
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What about the COEOs who send OUR jobs overseas to some goddamned gook/wetback/niggar?
I say we line up all the rich people in America and shoot hem in the face with bombs!!!1
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(•_•)
<) )~ ANTIFA
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niteowl
GrandPaw
Registered: 07/01/03
Posts: 16,291
Loc:
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Re: Illegal immigration [Re: Baby_Hitler]
#5767447 - 06/19/06 09:57 AM (16 years, 11 months ago) |
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I say we line up all the rich people in America and shoot hem in the face with bombs!!!1
And this will solve.........
what actually?
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Live for the moment you are in nowDon't be bogged down by your pastDon't be afraid of what lies in your future
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wilshire
free radical
Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 2,421
Loc: SE PA
Last seen: 13 years, 4 months
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Many people have no problem with illegal immigration, despite the billions of dollars of problems it causes every year.
cite sources please. what is the total tax burden imposed by illegal immigrants? what is their contribution to the GNP? what might their tax contribution be if they were legally recognized and paid taxes?
it seems to me that like many, you are assuming that these dirty, unskilled, criminal trespassers must, as a matter of simple common sense, be a bad thing for our country. lets see some proof. illegal immigrants bust their ass doing work you'd never think of doing so that you can have cheap food. you wanna go out to CA to pick lettuce? work in a meat packing plant? a chicken farm?
what is the problem with immigration? who do they harm by being here working?
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GabbaDj
BTH
Registered: 04/08/01
Posts: 19,658
Loc: By The Lake
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Quote:
I don't believe it's that simple at all. As long as companies are willing to hire illegals then they will find a way to get here, no matter what size wall we build.
It is that simple.. Mexicans arent here just for work. Many women come here once they are pregnant to have their babies. Hospitals are PACKED with Mexicans searching for free medical care and whoever asked for proof of the burdeon, I dont need to site sources. Hospitals are required to help people, illegal or not. Jails are ordered to clothe, feed and house illigals and schools are required to teatch illegals. These people may pay taxes on their beer and calling cards but they do send a major chunk of the money they make to Mexico and out of our econemy. All while we pick up the bill for their health care, schooling and criminal activity. That shits got to stop.
I have NEVER met a mexican who says that its dificult to get into the US, and Ive met HUNDREDS. Every single one of them have NO problem whatsoever getting in and out of the US. They even use our boarder crossing to go back to Mexico, then they use many of the known trails that lead straight back in. They do this over and over and over.
A lady I work with brought her sister up from Guatamala illigaly for just a few hundred bucks so that she could have her baby. She stayed with her sisted in her one bedroom apartment with 7 other people for a few months till the day came. She went to the hospital, had the baby and got released. However many thousands of dollars it costs to have a baby was paid for by me and you. This happens several dozens of times daily in hospitals in and around Los Angeles.
A wall is the number one answer. Enforcement goes hand in hand with a wall. I say let the good ones stay but the ones who get arrested or have run ins with the law and are illegal should get sent straight back and with the wall in place and people watching that wall they will no longer have such an easy time getting back in.
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GabbaDj
FAMM.ORG
Edited by GabbaDj (06/19/06 10:47 AM)
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