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OfflineDarkflame
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A New Psychedelic?
    #5752460 - 06/15/06 06:06 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Hello everyone,
I've been reading up more about my Salvia plants recently and happened upon some documents containing details about a plant called Coleus Blumei. It is supposedly used by the Mazatec just like Salvia D. I couldn't find any real information about it here so I went to erowid. There was a little information and a few trip reports. If you are interested you'll probably read them all anyway, however, I'll just sum them up -

People make tea with loads of leaves (70+) and experience mild effects.
People smoke a few leaves (say 8) and have a moderate experience.

As this plant is related, though not very, to Salvia I suspect that the active ingredient, like salvinorin A, is not water soluble and this explains the dosage difference between the two methods. It is quite possible that the compounds are in the same family yet have different effects similar to comparing DMT and 4-HO-DMT in the tryptamine family.
The effects are described as being similar to a mild psilocybe trip lasting about two hours.
I'm currently trying to obtain a plant and will try smoking the leaves and possibly try the salvinorin A extraction process on them to isolate the psychoactive compound. By the way, if I get to isolate and publish data about it first, do I get to name it?
If anyone has any experience with the this plant please post. It is available at most nurserys and by seed and is a very common plant. There are some pictures of the plant here:
http://www.glasshouseworks.com/gallery2.html
I would be grateful if we tried a community experiment to determine the effects of this plant, as a new and currently legal psychedelic would be a great boon to the psychedelic using community.

Peace
Darkflame


P.S. If this topic has already been discussed and driven into the ground I'm sorry.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: Darkflame]
    #5752486 - 06/15/06 06:34 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

it looks pretty - way prettier than the salvia divinorum plant
let us know what happens.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


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OfflineClammyJoe
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #5752740 - 06/15/06 08:32 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Could be onto something


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OfflineDrGeek
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: ClammyJoe]
    #5752885 - 06/15/06 09:30 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I knew that plant sounded familiar... In my botany class, we worked with Coleus and at the end of the lab we even got to take one home, but I forgot mine! It's a really pretty plant, and now knowing that I could have tripped off it I'm even more dissapointed I forgot it.


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OfflineLSDenthusiast
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: Darkflame]
    #5753015 - 06/15/06 10:24 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Here are some trip reports on erowid, not many though. Sounds interesting. http://www.erowid.org/experiences/subs/exp_Coleus.shtml


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OfflineFruitboot
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: LSDenthusiast]
    #5753036 - 06/15/06 10:31 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Are these common to grow in US households? I had plants that my mom grew that looked very similar to some of those pictures.


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InvisibleBiG_StroOnZ
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: LSDenthusiast]
    #5753037 - 06/15/06 10:31 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)



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OfflineIamthewalrus
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: BiG_StroOnZ]
    #5753062 - 06/15/06 10:37 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

pretty sure I have some of these around my house


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InvisibleMike_yy
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: Iamthewalrus]
    #5753483 - 06/15/06 12:47 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Do we think its only Coleus blumei that contains the right chemicals ?.

I have a 'Coleus kong rose'. Its a hybrid, and a fairly new one too i think !
Coleus's normally need alot of light to grow and be healthy, this new kong rose has been bread to grow well in darker spots.

I haven't touched it yet just incase its poisonous, for all i know it could be very potent ( wishful thinking,,, :smile: )


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Offlineastraalialma
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: Mike_yy]
    #5754031 - 06/15/06 03:45 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I have been looking info on this plant too. The way that I got into it was that I saw a strange plant on a flowershop that I strangely recalled seen on the book that I had been reading: "Plants of the gods: Their Sacred, Healing, and Hallucinogenic Powers". I got home and browsed throu the book and found it to be Coleus.

here is what the book says:
Quote:



Coleus blumei Benth.
Painted Nettle

Labiatae (Mint Family)

Two species of Coleus have significance in Mexico. Related to Salvia divinirum is La Hembra ("the woman"); C. pumilus is El Macho ("the man"); and two forms of C. blumei are El Nene ("the child") and El Ahijado ("the godson"). C. blumei attains a height of 3 ft(1m) and has ..blabla size leaves..
Recently, salvinorine-like substances (diterpene) were discovered. The chemical structure has not yet been determined. It is possible that by drying or burning the diterpene, is chemical structure is modified into potent material. The chemistry and pharmacology must be researched further.





Why would they have given such names to these plants?
Would it affect a salvia trip if these two are combined in smoke or quid / extracts?

search the forum with word "coleus"

I have two small plants flowering under 24h fluoros. They look like the "Coleus Bada Bing" at that gallery from URL above.


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Offlinestemmer
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: astraalialma]
    #5754059 - 06/15/06 03:57 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I have tried coleus smoked and in a quid/in combination quite a few time because I like it.

Oh it does something, but there is no way more than 20% of people are going to be able to trip on it to any extent. Some will certainly say they cant feel a damn thing(thats just how so many people are composed).
SOOOO many people say they cant "really" trip off of 1 gram of mushrooms or get somewhat high from one hit of weed(cant even feel it). Well for those people, there is no way you will get more than a subtle high from coleus b(if anything).

Its a great additive to a fat bowl of weed. For me it intensifies the visuals that MJ gives me.

I could see some people getting into it though. It calms the mind a bit, and for me gives subtle miniature visuals when taken in large amounts.

The more people try it the more they will ruin it for others though. Mainly because a favorite word used by high dosers at the shroomery is "placebo".

No placebo here, I know it has its subtle effects.


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OfflineRateLimitEnzyme
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: astraalialma]
    #5754079 - 06/15/06 04:03 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Let me know if they turn out to be hallucenogens...

http://www.entheology.org/edoto/anmviewer.asp?a=39&z=5


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Offlinestemmer
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: RateLimitEnzyme]
    #5754138 - 06/15/06 04:19 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

If you read my post they are not some typical hallucinogen.

They are more like a herbal calm that might make you feel kind of high, maybe even subtle visuals if you smoke some and make a HUGE quid.... If it doesnt work, then smoke pot with it next time and see if you feel any different(you should feel a bit different even if you are a psychedelic hard head).


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Offlinetoastandjam
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: stemmer]
    #5754217 - 06/15/06 04:48 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Is there a guide to identifying the correct genus and species? Either weblinked (I haven't found one yet, though I'll edit if I do) or from personal experience? These would be great to have as indoor or windowbox plants, how convenient.


--------------------
Q: We wanted to see if you had the ability to expand your mind and your horizons... and for one brief moment, you did.
PICARD: When I realized the paradox...
Q: Exactly. For that one fraction of a second, you were open to options you'd never considered. That's the exploration that awaits you...not mapping stars and studying nebulae... but charting the unknowable possibilities of existence.

To carry yourself forward and experience myriad things is delusion. That myriad things come forth and experience themselves is awakening. -Dogen Zenji


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OfflineDarkflame
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: toastandjam]
    #5754307 - 06/15/06 05:11 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

It is supposedly quite common to US households. I'm going to try to get one tomorrow and I'll post back when/if I get it.

Stemmer:
Whilst it is quite right of you to say that some people will be hard heads and call it placebo, I feel that its equally possible that you are a hard head and other people will find it stronger rather than the other way around unless you know other people who have tried it.

It is equally possible that like Salvia many people will need more concentrated extracts than just the plain leaf. We'll have to find out.

Peace,
Darkflame

P.S. Bought my CND membership yesterday. yay!


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Offlinestemmer
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: Darkflame]
    #5754320 - 06/15/06 05:14 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I am the last person you would call a hard head.

I say this without bias. I used to take 1500 mics of lsd or 5-7 grams of shrooms(VERY high doses for me). That and ayahuasca made me the most sensative person you will likely ever know.

I can trip VERY hard from .5 grams of mushrooms. So your wrong basically, no offence..... Thats why I mentioned how most people would likely not get anything out of it and complain about it later.

I actually gave a very accurate bit of info about how active this seemingly random plant really is, and I probably know more about it than anybody at this site. Hense the whole "most people wont get anything out of it" type of thing I was saying before..

You would have to be mentally ill to be more sensative than myself.
I say this for informational purposes. I have no reason to dilute the subject as you have suggested..


Edited by stemmer (06/15/06 05:21 PM)


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OfflineIamthewalrus
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: stemmer]
    #5754361 - 06/15/06 05:23 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I'm a lightweight with weed but a hard head with most everything else(my tolerance seems pretty much normal to acid tho)


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Offlinestemmer
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: Iamthewalrus]
    #5754450 - 06/15/06 05:41 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Its kind of fucked up to say this and some of you wont believe me, but I can easily feel one 3 second finger-touch of a potent hit of acid. I can feel any mushrooms through my fingers, more so if I have clammy hands. I can also feel 1/10th and even FAR less of a salvia leaf on my tongue.

I tried coleus many times when I was not so sensative to hallucinogens and I can say for sure, Most people who wonder about it have no idea how subtle it really is. SSOOOOOO many people will not even feel it. If you are looking for a hallucinogen, dont look to C blumai. Its hardly a trip or a high(though it does something for sure).
Thats why I suggested it be used with MJ no matter how you prepare it.


Edited by stemmer (06/15/06 05:52 PM)


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OfflineCptnGarden
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: stemmer]
    #5754989 - 06/15/06 07:49 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

i just posted recently 2 links to coleus reports. search coleus under my username in the past year and you should find em. smoking didnt do anything, but tea definately did something.


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OfflineLysergic_Milkman
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Re: A New Psychedelic? [Re: CptnGarden]
    #5756015 - 06/16/06 01:30 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I tried some today, tea method. I boiled ~80 large leaves in a pot for ~10 minutes, and let simmer & cool for ~30 minutes. The thing that strikes me about this plant is that the coloring in the middle and on the bottom (of some varieties) is transient. In other words, you can boil the color out of the leaves, leaving behind some dark Burgundy liquid (color depends on species, i suppose) and a pot full of plain green leaves. Could the active chemicals be held in this 'dye'?
As stemmer said, the effects are subtle at best, comparable to smoked Datura [muscle relaxation, clear head, moments of thoughtlessness/emptiness (all the things you want for meditation)], only more intense and longer lasting (the relaxation, especially).
The Kong Rose variety (purple inside, green on the margin, and green underneath) is active, and I can account for that claim from personal experience.


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