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InvisibleIcelander
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What is a warrior?
    #5726815 - 06/08/06 01:57 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

This describes much of it to me. It's from Castaneda's final book.

"The most accurate statement about what a nagual is, which he voiced that day I found him, was that a nagual is empty, and that that emptiness doesn't reflect the world, but reflects infinity.
Nothing could have been more true than this in reference to don Juan Matus. His emptiness reflected infinity. There was no boisterousness on his part, or assertions about the self. There was not a speck of a need to have either grievances or remorse. His was the emptiness of a warrior-traveler, seasoned to the point where he doesn't take anything for granted. A warrior-traveler who doesn't underestimate or overestimate anything. A quiet, disciplined fighter whose elegance is so extreme that no one, no matter how hard they try to look, will ever find the seam where all that complexity has come together."


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5727063 - 06/08/06 02:43 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Have you read up on any Aikido Philosophy? Its a non violent defence martial art, The Way of Harmony.  They work with the warrior archetype too. The similarity to that emptiness in your quote would be, that it allows for the harmony of the surrounding universe, what Castaneda calls infinity I guess, to be felt, and then one can better stay within the tune of harmony.

I haven't gotten to far into studying it yet, though, just skimming it and, I really like its philosophy, which can be applied to life in general and not just when under attack.

One cool thing about it in actual physical non violent defence is that , these guys are trained, to help the attacker, fall down, so gracefully, they do not get hurt and actually find it a pleasant experience. They also somehow, help to move the attacker back into harmony and their attackers aggression against them just ceases.

What a beautiful art form it is.

It's almost hard to believe. I want to learn more about it.

:peace: :heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5727193 - 06/08/06 03:21 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

a warrior-traveler? hmm

could also be a old ex-soldier with a beer belly, bad case of PTSS, a cigarette in his mouth traveling around in a trailer-truck and listening to Merle Haggard looking to shoot some ex-hippies


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


Edited by OldWoodSpecter (06/08/06 03:22 PM)


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5727276 - 06/08/06 03:39 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I don't feel that this is something that can be defined since we are all of infinite potential. One cannot define the infinite.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5727292 - 06/08/06 03:41 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Thats how aikido philosophy seems to see it. You can only experience it by being in harmony with it.

:peace: :heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5727327 - 06/08/06 03:48 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
I don't feel that this is something that can be defined since we are all of infinite potential. One cannot define the infinite.




"There was not a speck of a need to have either grievances or remorse."

"A quiet, disciplined fighter whose elegance is so extreme"


This is definition enough for me.^^^


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinecapliberty
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5727613 - 06/08/06 05:01 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I've read about sofs, soldiers of fortune, their like mercenaries but are more employed with actual wars, their training so elite they can defeat any conventional solider with ease, they often take the losing side not for any cause other than some type payment. They have been employed for small operations such as Cuba, or panama. There training includes things like, interrogating, radiation shock, gas, radio transmitters, different fighting styles, sniper training, hand to hand combat, everything to be the ultimate warrior


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: capliberty]
    #5727635 - 06/08/06 05:09 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

:rofl2:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisibledblaney
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5727727 - 06/08/06 05:51 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

That's a very nice quote and all, my only qualm is with the idea of being a warrior. Being a warrior implies that you are at war with something, but war only intensifies feelings of division between people and things and ideas.

In Castaneda's terminology, the warrior is someone who lives up to most of their human potential. Instead of calling such a person a 'warrior', I would just call them a true 'human being' living in harmony with the energy of the Earth :thumbup:


--------------------
"What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?"

"Belief is a beautiful armor
But makes for the heaviest sword"
- John Mayer

Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin.

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln


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Invisibledorkus
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5727736 - 06/08/06 05:54 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Like the joker in the deck of cards. Never defined. Only defined insofar as the flow of a certain situation sets the value. Unpredictable, shapeshifting from low to high, powerful to weak. Given up the need to be strong.

No personal history. No identity. Nothing but emptiness.

Is this quote also about surrender. Acceptance. And is that the whole core of the teaching?

Stopping the self-talk undefines us gradually. These hands are just tools.

Did you read all of that? :wink:


Edited by dr_mandelbrot (06/08/06 05:55 PM)


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Invisibledorkus
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: dblaney]
    #5727742 - 06/08/06 05:57 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I like fool.

Did you ever listen to the Alan Watts lecture called Wisdom of the Ridiculus?

Great stuff.


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Invisibledblaney
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: dorkus]
    #5727767 - 06/08/06 06:05 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

dr_mandelbrot said:
I like fool.




:thumbup: :laugh:


--------------------
"What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?"

"Belief is a beautiful armor
But makes for the heaviest sword"
- John Mayer

Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin.

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: dorkus]
    #5727776 - 06/08/06 06:08 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Indeed.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5727849 - 06/08/06 06:28 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:
One cool thing about it in actual physical non violent defence is that , these guys are trained, to help the attacker, fall down, so gracefully, they do not get hurt and actually find it a pleasant experience. They also somehow, help to move the attacker back into harmony and their attackers aggression against them just ceases.

What a beautiful art form it is.

It's almost hard to believe. I want to learn more about it.




Taking into careful consideration the statement you made that I have in quotations and the "feel" that it had in reading it, I want to learn more about it as well. :thumbup: It inspired a sort of "image" that was emotionally appealing. I must be in one of those moments in which I am more open to the subtle energies.... my formidable mind with all of its architecture is becoming more transparent... but yet still so effective in its purpose... :nut:

*Clicks your thread on the issue* :wink:

:earth: :sun: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #5727878 - 06/08/06 06:36 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I once saw a film clip with the founder of Akido in center with 8 police officers in circle around with nightsticks who could attack at will. This was the most amazing clip of Martial Arts I have ever seen. He was untouchable and it seemed that I would lose sight of him. Hard to believe. He was a small man as I remember it. It was long ago and seems dreamlike now. Sometimes I can't remember if I actually saw it.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineSchwammel
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5727917 - 06/08/06 06:47 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

This describes much of it to me. It's from Castaneda's final book."

doesn't sound at all like you ice...I know thats not what you said,

but, its a start.

Why do you want to become a warrior/ traveler? Aren't you that already?


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: capliberty]
    #5727924 - 06/08/06 06:48 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

"I've read about sofs, soldiers of fortune, their like mercenaries but are more employed with actual wars, their training so elite they can defeat any conventional solider with ease, they often take the losing side not for any cause other than some type payment. They have been employed for small operations such as Cuba, or panama. There training includes things like, interrogating, radiation shock, gas, radio transmitters, different fighting styles, sniper training, hand to hand combat, everything to be the ultimate warrior"

You are describing a soldier. I have been a soldier, but a soldier is not necessarily a warrior. I suppose one could be, but they are not the same.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5727949 - 06/08/06 06:58 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

"A quiet, disciplined fighter whose elegance is so extreme"

This is a fine statement, and I like the sentiment, but to ask what makes a warrior is like asking what makes a human being. I like this definition of the hunter/warrior:

"A hunter uses his world sparingly and with tenderness, regardless of whether the world might be things, or plants, or animals, or people, or power. A hunter deals intimately with his world and yet he is inaccessible to that same world."
"That's a contradiction, " I said. "He cannot be inaccessible if he is there in his world, hour after hour, day after day."
"You did not understand, " don Juan said patiently. "He is inaccessible because he's not squeezing his world out of shape. He taps it lightly, stays for as long as he needs to, and then swiftly moves away leaving hardly a mark."

But this is not THE definition, just one description of one aspect of the warrior.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5727983 - 06/08/06 07:09 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

You are correct Hue, I am steeped in the Castaneda books for many years and have absorbed all the definitions of a warrior according to Don Juan. That statement sums up a mood for me and a feeling about warriors without really giving a definitive description. It was personal. I just felt like sharing it, kind of like a poem to see how others would read and interpret it.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5728094 - 06/08/06 07:42 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

"The world is a mystery, and it is not at all as you
picture it." --CC


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5728096 - 06/08/06 07:44 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I will take another look at The Active Side of Infinity when I listen to the audio book that I have found. My last reading was several years ago.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5728143 - 06/08/06 07:53 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

So far I would say it his his most personal account. There is a nostalgia in it and I think for him a sense of amazement and awe. If any of it is true he has lead a fine life.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5728208 - 06/08/06 08:15 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I'd like to see that clip you saw. I believe you saw it and I believe its hard for you to believe it. Like this one site said about-

Imagine being able to move like a spinning top and if someone attacks you, they will fly away from you and not be able to enter your center.


Maybe the guy you saw had some of that action going on. :lol:

The art of Aikido did develop from out of the Samurai warriors. Kublai Khan, just could not conquer the ones using it, try after try , even with his having more men and weapons, with every repeat attack.

The history and philosophies and basic techniques are in a book called, Complete Aikido-The Definitive Guide to the Way of Harmony by Roy Suenaka with Christopher Watson.

I've only taken the time to poke around it here and there. So far, a great read. Even interesting stuff is in it on breath work, which you said you have been getting into. You may want to check the book out.

I'm with dblaney in that, I do not like the violent aspects of the word warrior or idea that there is something we are at war with either. It's not conducive to our sense of peace in this world.

However, lets keep real, even though we may learn the sense of right timing and how not to provoke attack, there may be times we feel moved to protect others who aren't as able too. being able to do so non violently is a skill that could greatly come in handy in this world.

There are also times, we may find ourselves under the attack of and struggling with the enemy within the self. The ways of the inner warrior that we have developed will determine that personal outcome.
I figure, learning more about a way that is non violent and shows compassion and concern for the attacker can only serve myself and help me to serve others the best I can.

Wish there was another word for such a warrior that wasn't associated with war and violence as we think of them.

How bout Peace Maker? :wink: Gandhi fought for the independence of India from British rule and he never had to resort to violence.

Jesus fought for the liberation of the soul from it's mental shackles and prisons and never had to resort to violence.

Buddha fought for freedom from suffering and never resorted to violence. 

Oh well, I like the different definitions for aspects of it that are being shared here. :smile:

:peace: :heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5728234 - 06/08/06 08:22 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I spent years in the Martial Arts world, I saw lots of Akido practioners and instructors and went to their demos and sparred with a few. No one I saw came anywhere close to the founder of the art. He was way beyond the best. No sir, I think he was the real deal. That's rare in the Martial Arts world as it is in daily life.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5728273 - 06/08/06 08:33 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

How bout it. I read that a TRUE master, has developed an even greater physical precision then that of a world class ballerina. I read its the most difficult of all of them to master the physical aspects of it.

I have no intention of doing that either. I figure, I can learn from the philosophies which apply to daily living and they do quite well. It was hard to find books at Barnes and Nobles when I was there that focused more on the philosophies themselves. This one has a good mix of all of it. I just have to get to reading more of it now. :lol:

:peace: :heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5728333 - 06/08/06 08:47 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I believe he was so good because he embodied his philosophy of Akido. No one gets that good IMO on physical skill alone.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5728395 - 06/08/06 09:01 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I agree 100%. I read it's the ideal defensive martial art for women and children because you don't need brute physical strength and skill to be effective with it. Of course, to be effective, you have to be embodying and applying the philosophy with the physical the techniques.

Its not about the physical aspects of them anyway to me. I find that part to be just a fun way to exercise. No matter how good you are at any of it, one bullet can take you out and anyone can pull a trigger. I like applying the philosophies to other parts of life.

:peace: :heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5728441 - 06/08/06 09:09 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

The benefit of learning the Martial Art is the conditioning of the mind and spirit. The result is a healing state of relaxation that is what self defense is all about IMO. You rarely meet as deadly a foe as your own negative conditioning. It kills most people long before their time.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Edited by Icelander (06/08/06 09:10 PM)


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5728709 - 06/08/06 10:02 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

:thumbup:

:peace: :heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5733259 - 06/10/06 04:41 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Or to dr. m :wink:
Eek, a warrior fool ? A fool warrior ? Warrior clown ? :whoa:
Not one for me please :grin:

A warrior knows for what he will engage and what are his goals and what is opposed and who are his opponents.
He is serving a higher context.
In that same context the Healer will fit. He is the other side of the warriors blade. He knows who and what has to be eliminated and who/what has to be restored.
Not every opponent needs devastation, as not every alley needs healing. Most it's vice versa.


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


Edited by BlueCoyote (06/10/06 04:49 AM)


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Invisibledorkus
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #5733404 - 06/10/06 07:39 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Like Coyote.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5733422 - 06/10/06 07:54 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I can't see the word "warrior" without thinking "jihadist"

- both terms coming at me obliquely from other cultures packed with dual meaning, and disjointed cultural references; one meaning is personal and religious, and not in the least pugnacious, and the other meaning is vile with the pestilence of hate and destruction.

the term has to be taken out of conventional meaning to be of use here:
it has to become paradox


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


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Offlinefresh313
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #5733448 - 06/10/06 08:09 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

The Goal of the Warrior is to achieve the totality of the self, that is, to light up all the Eagle’s Emanations within the Cocoon at once and aligning them with the greater whole and thus liberate the luminosity, through the controlled manipulation of the position of the assemblage point. The art of displacing the assemblage point is termed "dreaming" and the art of positioning the assemblage point on the displaced position is called "stalking", to be understood as "becoming stalk-like and oblong, stretching into infinity. Everything, absolutely everything, is the product of a being's position of the assemblage point.
self-dialouge keeps the assemblage point static. :mushroom2:


Edited by fresh313 (06/10/06 08:16 AM)


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: fresh313]
    #5733688 - 06/10/06 10:13 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

so ballancing stalking and dreaming
like
concentration and circulation
like taoist meditation
eagle emanations are like feathers like
thousand petalled lotus or chrysanthemum


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


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Offlinecapliberty
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #5733822 - 06/10/06 11:03 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I read book starship troopers, its better than any starwars book, Anyways these guys had these machine like bodies, they had built in sensory equipment, they could jump long distances and hover while shooting at the same time, the armor was so thick that they could take on rapid machine gun fire, also the body armor was designed to react to neurological brain impulses when moving, so all you had to do was enact the move and it would exaggerate any movement, these were bad ass warriors,LOL

Our troops today are so loaded with technology on their outfits that they kind of resemble starship troopers, I think down the line we will have super mobile combat outfits cause they're useful in close quarter combats, but also have the powerful impact compared to a tank rather than a regular ground troop.


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #5733917 - 06/10/06 11:28 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

A coyote isn't a fool :cryariver:
He is a peaceful warrior.
:goes on hunting his tail...


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #5733948 - 06/10/06 11:37 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
I can't see the word "warrior" without thinking "jihadist"

- both terms coming at me obliquely from other cultures packed with dual meaning, and disjointed cultural references; one meaning is personal and religious, and not in the least pugnacious, and the other meaning is vile with the pestilence of hate and destruction.

the term has to be taken out of conventional meaning to be of use here:
it has to become paradox




Warrior has become my favorite term for what I'm trying to accomplish in my life. It really is a war but the only casuality is your awareness if one isn't ready to fight for it. Now fighting may be learning how to let go and relax or surrender. That's where the confusion comes in for many.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisibledblaney
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5733970 - 06/10/06 11:44 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I've always thought of fighting as a struggle between two or more sides.

If letting go, relaxing, and surrendering is fighting, then couldn't walking be flying? Couldn't driving be sleeping?

I think fighting may be a misnomer.


--------------------
"What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?"

"Belief is a beautiful armor
But makes for the heaviest sword"
- John Mayer

Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin.

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: dblaney]
    #5734003 - 06/10/06 11:53 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Instead of fighting, substitute struggle.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5734054 - 06/10/06 12:08 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

The real warrior has no need to struggle or fight anymore.
He knows where he stands and what to do.
Every opponent will fall to ashes by the simple presence of a true warrior :grin:


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #5734134 - 06/10/06 12:30 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Do you base this on personal experience or just is it just wishful thinking?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #5734971 - 06/10/06 05:35 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

"Every opponent will fall to ashes by the simple presence of a true warrior"

The only true opponent for the warrior is the self.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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OfflineSchwammel
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5735012 - 06/10/06 05:49 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

its a black man with nothing to fall back on,
its a white man with no saving grace
its you and I...

A warrior is a humble man,
a man of statue; that doesn't
pretend to be what he isn't


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OfflineSchwammel
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Schwammel]
    #5735069 - 06/10/06 06:08 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

a warrior is all the simple people
asking simple questions...

Who am I


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5735490 - 06/10/06 08:26 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

"The only true opponent for the warrior is the self."

That's it exactly. And it's been my experience that warrior is the correct term and it is a war.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5736309 - 06/10/06 11:42 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Holy shit is it ever a war!!! Every day could be one's "last battle on Earth" as well.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Schwammel]
    #5737984 - 06/11/06 01:21 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

To Icey,
If you know your goals and limits, the 'yes' and the 'no' falls so deterministic, that one can afford to see how far your opponent will go, before he struggles by himself. Mostly experience.
Try it :wink:


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #5738053 - 06/11/06 01:49 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I have no opponents.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5738142 - 06/11/06 02:19 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Opponents may also be called everything that opposes ones state of wellbeing in a more associative way.

As Hue said, the strongest opponent may be the 'me' itself.


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #5738185 - 06/11/06 02:32 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Sounds like war. :laugh:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisibledorkus
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5738869 - 06/11/06 05:43 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

If there is a war, it is a war fought with love. This is what the term fool represents to me, Blue, that he surrenders and accepts. Falls freely. The term warrior in war with it's own self sounds strange. I am in war with my own self too much of the time already, and it feels very wrong. Then again, what is this self? The thoughts of yesterday (and all days ahead) gathered into a lump forming me to react as I do, even writing this. How can I suppress it? Should I?

The fool archetype taken to an extreme leads me into nihilism and apathy, because I can't get over the fact that stuff ends and nothing really matters in the end. It makes me feel coldhearted, or said in another way, there is one thought (part of my self) that judges this prementioned thought as coldhearted, or at least detached from the world and the suffering. Thoughts lay around intermingled like that and it's hard to unwind it. Is this the subconscious structure that is the wall hiding me from me true self? Is karma just another term for the subconscious with it's roots and many branches spread out forming the reactional behaviour of every being? Can there be found a higher self on the other side of this wall, and have you found it? Do you dwell in it? Is this awakening?

So all these different anchored thoughts are my different selves, organizing themselves in resonance and making the inner "me" a myriad of personalities.

Maybe it could be said it is a war against the illusion of a fixed self? And if we would accept or somehow integrate this as the foundation of life, then every deed ever done both by "others" and by "ourselves" would easily be accepted. I just can't seem to integrate it. It keeps slipping away. So I shouldn't even integrate it, as the process of trying to grab on makes it slide away? Then all one could do is to let it fall down, to give up? It is a paradox which is spinning me in circles. Damn, I always seem to move in circles. Hopefully this spiral goes upwards.

So to me it now seems that I have to realize that there is no me in the first place. And I do realize this, but it doesn't help. But I am sure there is a way around it, to experience reality without this veil of self. I suspect I've had glimpses of this, and can't stop thinking about that I must anchor in this. That the I must die. Do you think it is possible to accomplish it? There wasn't like a mystical dimension or anything coming through, only a true humble nakedness making me feel like I never felt before. I'm not sure I even did experience it, maybe I'm just deluding myself further.

A person who unwinds from all the different selves will have no pre-conditioning left, this is what I mean with that he will truly be a fool. Maybe this is where the real fun starts? This is to have given up the self to the flow of the Tao. Do anyone think it is possible at all? Have you done it? What does awakening mean?

Sorry if I'm going off-topic. I've been confused again today.

But what is left? It's just thoughts into thoughts into thoughts and there is no way out of it. How can this be a gradual process?

The self itself is the war. The very concept of having a self will mean a constant struggle cause there cannot be separation in true harmony. Different aspect will be in disorder. We cannot even have two thoughts that don't contractict themselves in one way or the other. Therefore we must end it. End our self. Could this be the archetypical surrendering on the cross?

It does seem like a war, I agree. I watched the temptation of christ yesterday, which is a movie using Jesus as an archetypical figure to display the eternal struggle between spirit and the flesh in man. He waged a war with an axe, baptizing with fire which is love.

Sorry for the long ramble.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: dorkus]
    #5738984 - 06/11/06 06:14 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

The term warrior in war with it's own self

There's a misunderstanding here. The war is with the false programs and herd mentality and not with the true self. The battle is to free the authentic spirit of the self so one may live as fully as possible. Can anyone say they don't have to fight for it? Effort is what I'm talking about. Effort against our inerta and fear and lazyness. Our desire to roll over and be safe at all costs.

It takes a warrior also to look nothingness and death in the face and decide to live out his or her destiny with gusto. Thats a war also.

Maybe it could be said it is a war against the illusion of a fixed self? Yes! you said a mouthful here.

So to me it now seems that I have to realize that there is no me in the first place.

Don't be too sure of this. There is a you IMO and what you must realize is that it is more than just your personality structure. You are everything that is.

Good post. You're thinking.(and feeling) :thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisibledorkus
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: Icelander]
    #5739011 - 06/11/06 06:21 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Thank you for clearing it up for me. :japsmile:


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: dorkus]
    #5741307 - 06/12/06 10:58 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Yes, a war against false programming of the self... very well said, Ice.
I hope, what I say now correlates a bit, because I will speak a bit more 'freely':
As long as one struggles, one is no warrior. If one IS, then the time has come :wink:
The gimmick herein lies, as Ice said, the warrior is not dependent on any human or fact, besides the ones he chooses to be, and which he knows and can build upon.
If someone opposes his 'goals', he simply gives the 'opponent' the choice to flee or die. But if the opponent (also associative) is weak, the warrior may council a/his 'healer' and may heal him, adding him/it to ones 'army', instead of making him vanish :smile:
I think, a good warrior must also be a good healer and vice versa, else it won't work right.
:heart:

BUT, a warrior also has to re-check, re-prove and recontemplate his 'inner' and 'outer' goals for validity, achievement, necessity and of course if he is still in sync with them. Else he will get blind...and...fool (again ?) and he will lose his path, making him no warrior anymore.

Recontemplate in private (without human influence) and be sure (again) with your opponents and friends.


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #5741338 - 06/12/06 11:10 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

» Who The Cap Fit

Man to man is so unjust, children
You don't know who to trust
Your worst enemy could be your best friend
And your best friend your worst enemy

Some will eat and drink with you
Then behind them su-su 'pon you
Only your friend know your secrets
So only he could reveal it
And who the cap fit, let them wear it [repeat]
Said I throw me corn, me no call no fowl
I saying, "Cok-cok-cok, cluck-cluck-cluck"

Some will hate you, pretend they love you now
Then behind they try to eliminate you
But who JAH bless, no one curse
Thank God we're past the worse

Hypocrites and parasites
Will come up and take a bite
And if your night should turn to day
A lot of people would run away
And who the cap fit let them wear it [repeat]


--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.


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Offlinecapliberty
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Re: What is a warrior? [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #5741552 - 06/12/06 12:12 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

A warrior is the unorthodox killer; Is the shadow that flickers in the corner of your eye when you weren't paying attension, The razor sharp sammori that slices you to oblivion; an indivdual keen upon destruction for the pride of his heart and the anger of his mind, but is justified by the rawness of his nature and convinction of his truth.


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