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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban

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Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban
    #5710635 - 06/04/06 10:17 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticl...&archived=False

By Matt Spetalnick

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President George W. Bush on Saturday urged the Senate to pass a constitutional ban on same-sex marriage, in a congressional election-year pitch to conservatives whose enthusiasm for him has cooled.

The Senate next week plans to debate a proposed amendment against gay marriage, though it is believed to have little chance of passing.

"Marriage is the most enduring and important human institution, honored and encouraged in all cultures and by every religious faith," Bush said in his weekly radio address.


"Ages of experience have taught us that the commitment of a husband and a wife to love and to serve one another promotes the welfare of children and the stability of society."

Bush said a constitutional amendment was needed to keep "activist" judges from overturning efforts by some state legislatures to ban gay marriage.

But Joe Solmonese, president of the Human Rights Campaign, accused Bush of using the radio address to "appease his right-wing conservative base."

"At a time when Americans are tuning in to hear about issues they care about, he chose to spend the time advocating writing discrimination into the Constitution."

By Matt Spetalnick

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President George W. Bush on Saturday urged the Senate to pass a constitutional ban on same-sex marriage, in a congressional election-year pitch to conservatives whose enthusiasm for him has cooled.

The Senate next week plans to debate a proposed amendment against gay marriage, though it is believed to have little chance of passing.

"Marriage is the most enduring and important human institution, honored and encouraged in all cultures and by every religious faith," Bush said in his weekly radio address.


"Ages of experience have taught us that the commitment of a husband and a wife to love and to serve one another promotes the welfare of children and the stability of society."

Bush said a constitutional amendment was needed to keep "activist" judges from overturning efforts by some state legislatures to ban gay marriage.

But Joe Solmonese, president of the Human Rights Campaign, accused Bush of using the radio address to "appease his right-wing conservative base."

"At a time when Americans are tuning in to hear about issues they care about, he chose to spend the time advocating writing discrimination into the Constitution."

The bill's sponsor, Sen. Wayne Allard, a Colorado Republican, has acknowledged he has far fewer than the 67 votes needed to win passage.

At least 13 states have passed their own amendments banning gay marriage. Vermont and Connecticut have legalized civil unions. Just over half of all Americans oppose same-sex marriage, a March poll by the Pew Research center showed.


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Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Offlinekotik
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Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: Diploid]
    #5710649 - 06/04/06 10:24 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

why do gays want to get married so bad? The only reason I can think of, are the tax benefits. In that case, the govt should make a different form for legal couples (seperate from marriage), then this would seem to be resolved.

the problem is condoning homosexuality in the first place, thats the issue with the politicians it seems.


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No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban

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Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: kotik]
    #5710651 - 06/04/06 10:25 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

why do gays want to get married so bad?

Why do so many people give a shit that they do?

Live and let live!


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleSilversoul
Rhizome
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Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: kotik]
    #5710656 - 06/04/06 10:30 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

kotik said:
In that case, the govt should make a different form for legal couples (seperate from marriage), then this would seem to be resolved.



It would only be resolved if the same rules apply to gay couples and straight couples alike. It's about equality, not tax benefits. In fact, married people get penalized more often than not.


Quote:

the problem is condoning homosexuality in the first place, thats the issue with the politicians it seems.



Advocating equality for gays is no more condoning homosexuality than advocating equality for blacks is condoning dark skin.


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Offlinekotik
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Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: Silversoul]
    #5710671 - 06/04/06 10:35 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
Advocating equality for gays is no more condoning homosexuality than advocating equality for blacks is condoning dark skin.




ah, but advocating equality for blacks WAS condoning their skin (or at least, associating with those with black skin). Before it was LAW that they blacks were equal, you could easily be hung for just being friends.

about the having equal rights to marry... I don't buy that at all. The ONLY reason you need government permission to marry, is if you intend to make use of the tax benefits and change of official status. If two people want to take oaths to each other, I don't see why they should pay the government to make it official. I'm positive there are places in every state two gay people can have a priest wed them without anyone going to jail.


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No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.


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InvisibleSilversoul
Rhizome
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Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: kotik]
    #5710677 - 06/04/06 10:41 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

kotik said:
The ONLY reason you need government permission to marry, is if you intend to make use of the tax benefits and change of official status.



wrong wrong wrong

You're forgetting hospital visitation rights, inheritance rights, and divorce procedings.


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Offlinekotik
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Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: Silversoul]
    #5710726 - 06/04/06 11:03 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
Quote:

kotik said:
The ONLY reason you need government permission to marry, is if you intend to make use of the tax benefits and change of official status.



wrong wrong wrong

You're forgetting hospital visitation rights, inheritance rights, and divorce procedings.




im just as wrong as i am ignorant  :blush:

i do recognize the issue, and i still think a seperate government form that provides the same rights that is seperate from marriage would do just as well.  Fighting to extend the concept of marriage in opposition to the church is not going to get anywhere, at least not that way.

Personally, I don't see why anyone would stop people from forming pairs.  if anything, its better for society, regardless of how they make dirty.  :3some:


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No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.


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OfflineRedstorm
Prince of Bugs
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Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: Diploid]
    #5710902 - 06/04/06 12:00 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I don't really care if they use the word "marriage" or not, but homosexuals should receive every benefit after forming a union that heterosexuals do. Otherwise, it is unconstitutional.


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Offlinemack_tasticlies
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Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: Redstorm]
    #5711036 - 06/04/06 12:41 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

to no one in particular,

This is such a fucking non issue.

Its a political tool.

no one really cares if gays get married its just a way for the sides to gather votes.

Let them get married for Christ's sake(ha ha), its not like if we don't they are going to quit being gay. I mean we already let them adopt and the lizzies have kids.


Edited by mack_tasticlies (06/04/06 12:58 PM)


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Offlinewilshire
free radical
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Registered: 05/11/05
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Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: Diploid]
    #5711042 - 06/04/06 12:43 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

1. it is not the government's place to define marriage.
2. a union of two women or two men should be given the same legal standing as a union between a woman and a man.
3. this country is full of idiots.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: wilshire]
    #5711086 - 06/04/06 12:54 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

wilshire said:
1. it is not the government's place to define marriage.



Exactly right. Why this particular contract issue should have a special place in law is beyond me. It is exactly the same as any business agreement. Dissolution should be handled as a civil torts matter
Quote:



2. a union of two women or two men should be given the same legal standing as a union between a woman and a man.



Which is to say pretty much none. Think about it. Millions of single people get fucked too. Co-habitors get fucked. Childless people get fucked
Quote:




3. this country is full of idiots.




Oh, now there's a fucking revelation. I'm not sure we always agree on just who the idiots are but there sure is no shortage.


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OfflineDieSpectra
Stranger

Registered: 05/08/06
Posts: 109
Last seen: 11 years, 1 month
Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: wilshire]
    #5711118 - 06/04/06 01:01 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

wilshire said:
1. it is not the government's place to define marriage.
2. a union of two women or two men should be given the same legal standing as a union between a woman and a man.
3. this country is full of idiots.





/agree

IMHO...
Marriage is between people and their god or other beliefs. Gay or straight, we shouldn't have to apply to the government to get married.

It seems to me gay people should just get married however they wish, and just say their married regardless of not having a "legal" marriage license if that is their wish. They could just draft out wills and other legal forms to ensure that their partner would be entitled to their property if they should die (This seems like what straight people should do too).

Regardless stop giving benefits to married couples and then we can cut taxes so people's money will stay in their own hands. Fuck you big government!


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OfflineDavid_vs_Goliath
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Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: zappaisgod]
    #5711122 - 06/04/06 01:02 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:


Diploid said:
why do gays want to get married so bad?

Why do so many people give a shit that they do?

Live and let live!




:thumbup: :thumbup: :grin: :thumbup: :thumbup:

In response to the question of why homosexuals would want to get married...

Why do men and women marry?? Why not just be "together"?

Same reason for homosexuals. It is a pact for life. a commitment of fidelity and a lifelong bond. Other than that it means nothing, and don't get started on the church's premarital sex shit.


--------------------
"People living deeply have no fear of death."
"Love the animals, love the plants, love everything. If you love everything, you will perceive the divine mystery in things. Once you perceive it, you will begin to comprehend it better every day. And you will come at last to love the whole world with an all-embracing love."
"Our problems are man-made, therefore they may be solved by man. No problem of human destiny is beyond human beings."


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Offlinemack_tasticlies
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Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: David_vs_Goliath]
    #5711200 - 06/04/06 01:24 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

pre marital sex is the only kind I know!


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Offlinemack_tasticlies
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Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: mack_tasticlies]
    #5711206 - 06/04/06 01:25 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I can't imagine that it feels all that different from marital sex, but hell someone made it a sin. Marital must be immaculate.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: mack_tasticlies]
    #5711282 - 06/04/06 01:41 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

How do you get a woman to stop sucking your dick?
Marry her.
Badumdum. I'll be here all week. Don't forget to tip the waitresses


--------------------


Edited by zappaisgod (06/04/06 01:43 PM)


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Invisiblestantonfreedom
Stranger
Registered: 05/11/06
Posts: 27
Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: Diploid]
    #5711644 - 06/04/06 03:31 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I would think that Bush would be FOR gay marriage, since the new world order wants to decrease the size of the population. Hehe.


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Offlinekotik
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Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: stantonfreedom]
    #5712573 - 06/04/06 08:06 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

perhaps the concept of married gay couples is countrproductive for the constant propaganda of how they are all sexually promiscuous, loaded with STDs and out to convert your children.

Besides, I am almost afraid of what the "christians" (and i use the term loosely) will target next, when gay marriage doesn't hold as much leverage.


--------------------
No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.


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InvisibleLe_Canard
The Duk Abides

Registered: 05/16/03
Posts: 94,392
Loc: Earthfarm 1 Flag
Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: Diploid]
    #5712921 - 06/04/06 09:36 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Having solved all other problems, George turns to this pressing issue.  :rolleyes:


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OfflineBasilides
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Re: Bush Pushes Gay Marriage Ban [Re: kotik]
    #5712975 - 06/04/06 09:55 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

kotik said:
why do gays want to get married so bad? The only reason I can think of, are the tax benefits. In that case, the govt should make a different form for legal couples (seperate from marriage), then this would seem to be resolved.

the problem is condoning homosexuality in the first place, thats the issue with the politicians it seems.




I don't see why potentially condoning homosexuality can even be a bad thing. Gays want to get married because they want to be 100% equal to the majority. Exactly what is wrong with that?


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."


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