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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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One River
#5708691 - 06/03/06 07:56 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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This is something that I have been giving thought to lately. I was thinking about the predatory nature of life. All life lives by consuming other life. There is no way around it. For something else to live, something else must die. This is not good or bad...it is just the way it is. Life itself seems to be a single organism with many forms. Could it be that all life is but one river that flows through all organisms ...every organism but a tributary of one river with all of the tributaries flowing to the river itself? Maybe the idea that we are separate is but an illusion of ego...perhaps there is only one life force and we are but the mold that temporarily gives it shape.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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dblaney
Human Being

Registered: 10/03/04
Posts: 7,894
Loc: Here & Now
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We're a mutual eating society: everything eats everything else.
It's so strange that people are buried in wooden boxes. I would want my body to provide nourishment for as many organisms as possible.
Separateness is indeed illusory.
-------------------- "What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?" "Belief is a beautiful armor But makes for the heaviest sword" - John Mayer Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin. "This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln
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Silversoul
Rhizome


Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
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Quote:
Huehuecoyotl said: Life itself seems to be a single organism with many forms.
I've thought about this quite often. We too are a collective of individual, interdependent organisms. We call them "cells." Then each organism is also part of a greater ecosystem, which is like an organism unto itself. Then all the ecosystems on earth function together to make the earth itself an organism. This could be extended to the interstellar level, and encompass the entire universe.
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gettinjiggywithit
jiggy


Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
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Just the other day, looking out in my back yard I was thinking, The big birds eat the snakes, the snakes eat the frogs, the frogs eat the bugs and..........then I thought, DAMN, being an animal must suck never knowing when another is going to come along and have you for lunch.
You're visual on the one river of energy moving in and out of forms is a BEAUTIFUL one. It makes it all more acceptable to see it in that light.
My next thoughts were about how, it does not make sense to me that "life in form" must consume the energy of , "life in form" for their to be "life in form".
That would imply a closed system or limit to the energy supply. I think the source well of energy, just keeps or can, pumping out more and more and keeps expanding itself in the process. We just havn't learned how to tap into it fully yet and thats why this who consuming it from out of other forms thing got started.
Just thoughts I think.
Something in my core tells me, it doesn't have to be the way of form consuming form to get energy to live on. If everything could develop the ability to live off prana, the river itself, that would be so ideal.
I accept it as it is for now and yet, I dream for the day of self sustenance to manifest and work to get this prana stuff figured out in the meantime.
These bodies and physical life would be so much more enjoyable if we didn't have to be such slaves to maintaining them. I think about how much mundane time, lives and money is spent, food shopping, cooking/keeping the family fed, stuffing our faces and cleaning up after it all just to do it again in a few hours, bahh.
When it comes to people needing food, we are literally bottomless pits. 
I was just talking to my husband and daughter about this and they were like, "That would be no fun, food tastes so good."
I ji wa wa 
Hue, what do you have to say on why the river just can't feed the forms that come from its own energy until its ready to just withdraw it and collapse the form?
Why do forms have to consume the energy from other forms to live?
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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Re: One River [Re: dblaney]
#5708895 - 06/03/06 08:44 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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I want my body exposed to the air so that I can be food for something else. Being left on a scaffold like the native warriors of the great plains would suit me fine.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,855
Loc: Pandurn
Last seen: 1 year, 12 days
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I'd prefer to be set adrift on a fjord, in a burning, wooden ship...
 Peace.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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The universe IS a closed system. That is not my speculation, but scientific fact. We are in every way subject to the second law of thermodynamics...now while it is a closed system...it is a vast one.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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I have some symapthies there, but the fire would cause a serious waste of food...maybe the boat with no fire would work for me...as long as I was arrayed with my weapons and armor.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,855
Loc: Pandurn
Last seen: 1 year, 12 days
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Whether or not a system is closed is a matter of perspective, I would imagine. It simply depends on your definition of universe. If the word is all-encompassing, then I guess it could be considered to be a closed system, but the nature of an all-encompassing universe implies that one would not find boundaries... which would seem to suggest that such a system wouldn't exactly be "closed".

 Peace.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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There are boundaries to what we call our universe. It is finite.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,855
Loc: Pandurn
Last seen: 1 year, 12 days
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I've never seen any reason to be so certain about something as unknown as that, let alone much of anything, really. 
 Peace.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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gettinjiggywithit
jiggy


Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
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Quote:
Huehuecoyotl said: The universe IS a closed system. That is not my speculation, but scientific fact. We are in every way subject to the second law of thermodynamics...now while it is a closed system...it is a vast one.
The third law of thermodynamics breaks the first and second at the quantum scale. If prana is a quantum energy and our physical bodies have a way to breath it in an convert it, we could be drawing from anti matter itself.
Though what energy came from out of the Big Bang making up the physical universe may be finite, I don;t think science has any facts confirmed on the amount of quantum energy available, let alone, if there are ways holes are punched to draw from where it ever it is the energy of the big bang came out from.
What if we could produce micro quantum big bangs to pull more in with our bodies somehow?
I know I am dreaming at this point and just like thinking about possibilities, of what may lay in waiting behind stones yet unturned.
Maybe this isn't the thread for going there. 
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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fireworks_god: "I've never seen any reason to be so certain about something as unknown as that, let alone much of anything, really."
Science confirms that space is curved and therefore finite. Now there could well be other universes, but since it cannot be measured it is pointless to consider this. Just as it is pointless for me to argue with you. You are welcome to your own interpretation of fact.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
Edited by Huehuecoyotl (06/03/06 09:23 PM)
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PhanTomCat
Teh Cat....


Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 5,908
Loc: My Youniverse....
Last seen: 14 years, 11 months
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Quote:
Huehuecoyotl said: All life lives by consuming other life. There is no way around it. For something else to live, something else must die.
Plantlife.... Water, light, and a few salts.... Life without consuming life....
Right...?
>^;;^<
-------------------- I'll be your midnight French Fry.... "The most important things in life that are often ignored, are the things that one cannot see...." >^;;^<
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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Even plants grow from the death of other life.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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PhanTomCat
Teh Cat....


Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 5,908
Loc: My Youniverse....
Last seen: 14 years, 11 months
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They do in nature because death is abundant - for the most part.... But, a plant can live in a closed system without death - given water light and salts, and still live.... Using rock-wool as a soil matrix has no death/nutrients on it's own....
Even bees that live a somewhat symbiotic life with a flower's nectar lives off of the plant's secretions.... And the bees give back in the relationship by cross pollinating by the action of collecting the nectar....
No life dies from the feeding of the bees, and both plant and insect benefit, or are codependent of each other for their very survival....
>^;;^<
-------------------- I'll be your midnight French Fry.... "The most important things in life that are often ignored, are the things that one cannot see...." >^;;^<
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demiu5
humans, lol


Registered: 08/18/05
Posts: 43,948
Loc: the popcorn stadium
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I don't know if this has been said before...but your statement of [paraphrased]...something must die for something else to live... is not true. Autotrophs my friend.
I will now continue to read this thread. Thank you.
edit: the idea had been stated, but not just plants. There are many organisms that feed directly off sunlight and/or/but not necessarily a few other chemicals.
-------------------- channel your inner Larry David
Edited by demius (06/03/06 09:55 PM)
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gettinjiggywithit
jiggy


Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
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I understand if it's pointless for you to think further on it. It is really Far Out, yet not so out of reach to me to make the idea interesting to explore. Just thought I would throw it out there and ask.
It is a fact that the third law breaks the first two though.
Now what Phantom is talking about, that's the sort of stuff I am seeing/feeling when I think about these things. Co-operation with energy even if its finite then, instead of this competition survival of the fittest stuff with life forms consuming each other for energy instead of just drawing from the river they came out of.
It's like a creative challenge for me.
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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PhanTomCat
Teh Cat....


Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 5,908
Loc: My Youniverse....
Last seen: 14 years, 11 months
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The only reason I picked out that one point and argued it is because I think it is an important aspect to just toss aside and dismiss....
At some point, this planet had no "life" as we know it - as it was not habitable for life as we know it.... Then for some reason (God - or however you believe life magically sprung up on this planet), life just started.... If it started on it's own, it started with one life that divided into more life, and did not live off life/death yet because it itself was the only "living" thing.... Then life proceeded to make life over the whole planet, still not being able to feed of off death....
I don't mean to be the rock in your river, ( ) but some life just doesn't need life or death to live off of....

>^;;^<
-------------------- I'll be your midnight French Fry.... "The most important things in life that are often ignored, are the things that one cannot see...." >^;;^<
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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"I don't mean to be the rock in your river, ( ) but some life just doesn't need life or death to live off of...."
In nature it does...but that is beside the point. My point is to ask if life is a unified force moving through various forms...if we are all one.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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