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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: Sinbad]
    #5683339 - 05/28/06 12:50 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Perhaps, just perhaps, the problem lies within you. It is more likely the dynamics at work in you that attract certain types of women to you and also which cause you to be attracted to certain women. It is most unlikely that women qua women are at fault. How do I know this? Much more from personal experience - me turning 53 in July - I've been around and have discovered much about how my inner deficits contributed to being in relationships with the wrong women.

My last wife was a nightmare as it turned out, but my own weakened self-esteem, my refusal to experience anger, my mistaken idea that being passive was ego-transcendence instead of what it was - co-dependence, all attracted a Borderline Personality Disordered manipulative, cold-hearted, damaged woman to me.

The girl who came onto me and then visited me in my dorm room late that night eventually slept with my roommate of 3 years, ostensibly to make me jealous, thinking that act would make me pursue her more avidly. In 2001 that same female was exiled from the state of Colorado to Texas. Called "The Heidi Fleiss of Aspen," she had gone from slut to prostitute to running one of the nations largest prostitution rings which used underage girls! This was the first girl I fell in love with! It took years to get her out of my mind after I broke up with her and I continued to dream about her for some 15 years!

Now, thank God, I have a really decent, beautiful, moral, educated Lady by my side (for 10 years now). She phoned and asked me out, which I never would have done because I was still looking for another 'wrong' type of woman (there were others I assure you) - usually blonde (bottle usually) like my ex-wife. I had to have my preconceptions and addictions to form broken by someone who appreciated me for me, and who also had to break her preconceptions about what kind of man she was looking for. So here's a pic of Rose. Not a blonde, but I'm not complaining. Rose went to Cornell University instead of Princeton or University of Pennsylvania (got into all three). She also took an MBA at one of my schools - University of Maryland. She a trooper at tripping and engages me in all the kinds of things that I engage you Shroomerites with in conversation. I find her sort of attractive  :wink: too.

"Seek and ye shall find; ask and it will be given thee." Word.

Peace, Love and Truth.



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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #5683480 - 05/28/06 02:05 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Great post Markos. :thumbup: And thanks for sharing the details of your experience.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleSinbad
Living TheMoment
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Registered: 12/23/04
Posts: 2,571
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: Icelander]
    #5683787 - 05/28/06 04:27 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Thank you everyone for your posts. This has been a most testing time in my life, so its always nice to know that people care.

A special thanks goes out to Markos for sharing your experience.

I think that perhaps i do attract the kind of woman who is passive, as i am quite an outspoken and active person, and the balance i seek in a partner is defineilty always something more passive. Maybe in looking for passive women, i always seem to encounter women with hidden issues and commitment problems. This time i was the rebound man by the looks of things. it always hurts when you discover something like this after a long drawn out breakup.

So how do i now attempt to change the type of women i usually fall for?. If you think that i am choosing the kinds of women who will hurt me so i can learn something. What could that lesson possibly be?

I feel right now that the only thing ive really learned from all this, is not to place my trust in women, becuase even if they have no intention to, they still always break my trust, and my heart eventually.


--------------------


Edited by Sinbad (05/29/06 08:17 AM)


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: Sinbad]
    #5683803 - 05/28/06 04:35 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I think men are as likely to betray one's trust as women are. However, I think it is because of one's sexual and/or romantic feelings towards women that it hurts more when they betray one's trust. At least, that is my experience.


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: Sinbad]
    #5683858 - 05/28/06 04:55 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

So how do i now attempt to change the type of women i usually fall for?




A concept I particularly like is that of affinity.  Merriam Webster defines this as "an attractive force between substances or particles that causes them to enter into and remain in chemical combination." (Among other less-applicable definitions.)

To change your attractions, you must alter your attractive force.  At this point, you are attractive to and attracted by women who betray your trust.  They do not represent all women, but the sub-set of women with whom you experience affinity.

I believe that this attractive force is created by the ways in which we manage our life energy.  If your energy in certain aspects of living is blocked or constricted, you will drawn in those who bring your attention to these aspects.  Just as our physical immune system seeks to restore health to our body, our spiritual immune system seeks to restore health to our spirit.

It is no accident that all of the women to whom you feel attracted share common traits.  They are exactly what you need to experience, and will continue to show up until you no longer need them.

My experience with changing attraction patterns has shown me that prolonged celibacy and relational seclusion allows for necessary introspection and slow internal shifting.

I spent several years alone while I examined my mental programs and chemical reactions.  I reviewed the patterns which were shared by my prior relationships, and integrated the lessons contained therein.

This process allowed me to reach a point of emotional equilibrium. For the first time in decades, I truly enjoyed my life without a partner.  I did not need to reject the possibility of relationship, but I knew that being alone was vastly preferable to the relationships I had been having. 

I regained the intuitive sense that nothing could harm me, not the part which was really me, and that the so-called heartbreaks I had experienced were the temper tantrums of my personality structure.

I wish you the best in your healing, dear one.  :heart:


Edited by Veritas (05/28/06 05:17 PM)


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Invisiblemoog
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Registered: 02/15/05
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: Veritas]
    #5683900 - 05/28/06 05:09 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I've found that if you just act like yourself you'll always attract the kind of mate you're looking for, looks-wise and personality-wise. If either you aren't being true to yourself, or the girls you're going after aren't being true to themselves, then the attraction isn't a true attraction, because one of you is attracted to a fake personality. This will inevitably result in conflict and hurt.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: Sinbad]
    #5683924 - 05/28/06 05:18 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Sinbad said:
...So how do i now attempt to change the type of women i usually fall for? (as falling in love with unstable women seems to be a reoccuring theme for me). If you think that i am choosing unstable women so i can learn something. What could that lesson possibly be?
...




sometimes for a guy, it's one's mother
is who one seeks closure with - esp.
when there is unfinished business.

after you untie some knots there
you can move on and see people for whomethey are on equal terms.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: redgreenvines]
    #5683944 - 05/28/06 05:24 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

How Freudian of you, red. :wink:

Freud was into energy work, too.  He called it libido, but it could also be called prana, chi, life force, etc...  When your energy gets stuck, or "cathected," on some hurtful event in your past, you have less life energy in the present.

Maybe we love (and hate) those who remind us of these stuck places because we want our energy to be freed, yet also want everything to remain familiar and safe.  The trick is to stop shooting the messenger, and finally get the message.  :heart:


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Trust In Women *DELETED* [Re: Veritas]
    #5683967 - 05/28/06 05:32 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Post deleted by redgreenvines

Reason for deletion: inappropriate for reasons of privacy sorry.



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:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: Sinbad]
    #5683986 - 05/28/06 05:37 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

unstable women so i can learn something. What could that lesson possibly be?

I like what Veritas has said on this. I would add only that the lesson is also one of attachment and self love.

You are a fast learner Sinbad but relationships are one of the big ones and maybe one of the last ones we work through. Could be because they are similar to our first ones. (Mater and Pater) Any unresolved issues with them will find there way into our most intimate relationships to others.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: redgreenvines]
    #5684002 - 05/28/06 05:40 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Excellent memory, red.  That post was before my time.

Yes, familial trauma hooks our life energy like nothing else. :sad:

Additionally, we learn what love feels like from our first love, for better or worse, and may seek that variety of love for the rest of our life.  When that first love is shared with someone unstable & incapable of returning love, we are being taught that love is about uncertainty and rejection.  I know I learned those lessons, and spent many years unlearning them.


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InvisibleMOTH
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: Sinbad]
    #5684034 - 05/28/06 05:48 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

It seems to me that as soon as you start expecting something from someone, they will let you down. If I start expecting certain behaviors from my husband, or he of me, we start to experience friction and unhappiness.

So instead, we let one another be as free as possible within the experience of our cooperative effort. We don't just "expect" things from one another...we try and act from a state of love, service and joy.

Maybe you should stop expecting things from the women you are involved with. Like, from your posts it seems like you expect them to behave a certain way just because you "gave them your trust." I don't think it works like that (evidently). You can trust and love people without expecting anything in return.

Personally, I've noticed that when I expect nothing from people, I am a lot happier.


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Offlinegregorio
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: Sinbad]
    #5684063 - 05/28/06 05:53 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Sinbad said:
Almost every woman i have had relations with, throughout my life, has tried/has has managed to shatter my trust through lies, secrets and betrayl. Why shoudl i ever trust another woman again?

I dont think i can after yet another confirmation of how untrustworthy women i come into contact with are in general.




There is a lot of truth in those statements. I ahve nothing more to say about it except don't give up just don't let your guard down.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: gregorio]
    #5684077 - 05/28/06 05:56 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I think the fact that one is "guarding" in the first place and striving to acheive is going to prevent any real relationship from being shared.

:earth: :sun: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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InvisibleSinbad
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: Veritas]
    #5684109 - 05/28/06 06:05 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Its not even as if i go out and look for women. I have never even been out on an official "date" in my life,as i always just kind of slip into relationships. Its like these women just discover me and there is a connection, and gradually something develops, but only later do i find out how much baggage they are carrying and by that time its too late. With my last girlfreind (we broke up last week), i made sure before hand that she had no personal "history" and even probed her family tree for instances of mental illness.

After that i thought i might have somehow broken the chain, and was elated at the possibility of a relationship with someone who was not going to flip the tables on me, and for a long time, it was very good, and everything went amazingly well.

I fell in love with her, and trusted that she felt the same (as she said she did). We made a commitment to work through our personal issues together (as i have my fair share of neurosis too :wink:).

Needless to say it ended disasterously, and now im picking up the pecies of my broken heart, yet again. This time it was so sudden and unexpected that the shock had me in a state of denial for days afterwards.  :sad:

Its certainly something karmic. Perhaps i screwed around alot of girls in my past life, and this is just the karmic payback  :crazy:

Thanks for that post Veritas i certainly think that some of what you said is defineltely true.


Edited by Sinbad (05/29/06 08:16 AM)


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InvisibleSinbad
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: MOTH]
    #5684123 - 05/28/06 06:07 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

EllemyshShade said:
It seems to me that as soon as you start expecting something from someone, they will let you down.  If I start expecting certain behaviors from my husband, or he of me, we start to experience friction and unhappiness. 

So instead, we let one another be as free as possible within the experience of our cooperative effort.  We don't just "expect" things from one another...we try and act from a state of love, service and joy. 

Maybe you should stop expecting things from the women you are involved with.  Like, from your posts it seems like you expect them to behave a certain way just because you "gave them your trust."  I don't think it works like that (evidently).  You can trust and love people without expecting anything in return. 

Personally, I've noticed that when I expect nothing from people, I am a lot happier.




This is very true! Thank you  :thumbup:


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OfflinegrimR
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: fireworks_god]
    #5684131 - 05/28/06 06:08 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Many people have a hard time coming to realize, we are nothing more than animals with more going on for us psychologically. No matter how we try to play it off, we will still have the hardwired instincts as any other mammal. You can't trust anyone given specific circumstances anyone can stab you in the back. Don't trust them. Or anyone for that matter.

Psychology preaches that every human/animal acts on whatever meets their next basic need. There is no such thing as love, caring or any of those feel good/comfort teachings. You might have to look deep inside yourself to see the truth but for those with an open mind, it is there, no matter how hard it is to accept. We all wish life had more to it than this, but as humans we are no better than a virus in this world, consuming natural resources until this world is nothing more than dead matter.

Sorry for the rant but just speaking what comes to mind. Truth is all you have is your family while you live here.

Use em an lose em... or just let it happen to you


--------------------
- grimR


-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
http://egolost.com 
"I am already given to the power that rules my fate. And I cling to nothing, so I will have nothing to defend. I have no thoughts, so I will see. I fear nothing, so I will remember myself."

- Don Juan teachings


Edited by grimR (05/28/06 06:12 PM)


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: Sinbad]
    #5684174 - 05/28/06 06:17 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Maybe you need to try guys for awhile. I'll send you my address. :wink:

Please send naked photo.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Edited by Icelander (05/28/06 06:17 PM)


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InvisibleSinbad
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: Icelander]
    #5684190 - 05/28/06 06:23 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Id rather become a monk than join the dark side of the force!  :shocked: :starwars: :lol: :thumbdown:


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InvisibleSinbad
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Re: Trust In Women [Re: Sinbad]
    #5684223 - 05/28/06 06:30 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I have to admit though. I probably am rather more unstable than my ex right now. But only now, do i realize just how much this has all affected me. i really gave everything to this relationship and shared everything with her. Now i am paying the price for that.  :sad:

I have alot of healing to do before i can move on from this. I forgive her though, and i still love her deeply. :heart:


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