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Amazon Shop: ½ Pint Jars, Brown Rice Flour, Pressure Cooker, Vermiculite

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Invisibleparhelion
neurospelunker

Registered: 03/01/02
Posts: 24
2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions?
    #567048 - 03/01/02 05:45 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

hello,

I've got 6  (1/2) pint jars of puerto ricans in an empty dresser drawer.  I innoculated them 2 weeks ago and I only see about a dime-sized growth in 1 jar.  Any suggestions as to what I can do to to speed up the process?  It's a little cold in my apartment, but not below 70 degrees F. 

Two days ago, I put them all in an empty shoe box and set them next to my water heater in hopes the little extra heat would speed up things.  The lids are on snug (not tight)...and the masking tape is still over the holes.  Is it possible they're not getting enough air?

...I'm lost...or impatient :smile:

Any suggestions are appreciated..

peace 


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OfflineTankGurl
Stranger
Registered: 01/13/02
Posts: 17
Last seen: 15 years, 7 months
Re: 2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions? [Re: parhelion]
    #567055 - 03/01/02 05:55 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

85 seems to be the optimal temperature needed during colonization. Do you have a thermometer to tell you what temp your jars are at?

~Brandi


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Invisibleangryshroom
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/18/01
Posts: 7,262
Re: 2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions? [Re: parhelion]
    #567158 - 03/01/02 08:02 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Make sure its in the mid 80s. They grow like twice as fast from 70F to 84.5F. 2 weeks, hmm...It might just be cold. Or you could just have acquired some old spores. Air circulation should not be a problem. Try taking off the masking tape, I have never kept it on, nor have had any problems with it off.

Puerto's are extremely aggressive colonizers, you should be getting a lot more growth than that!!! :frown:


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InvisibleWakingUpLate
addict
Registered: 12/29/01
Posts: 559
Loc: Born on a mountain, Raise...
Re: 2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions? [Re: parhelion]
    #567173 - 03/01/02 08:21 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I wouldn't think it was air. And by two weeks you should be seeing way more than that. What is your substrate and how much water did you use? If it's standard PF tek and BRF, I'd wonder about the spores. I saw some B+ do just like that and the ones that didn't show growth at all were reinnoc'd with a new syringe and took off. Just a thought.:peace:
 


--------------------
The rest of those, who have gone before us,
cannot settle the unrest of those who follow.
(Finding Forrester)


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OfflineALHOFF177A17
DoWn RU?

Registered: 01/24/02
Posts: 241
Last seen: 4 years, 17 days
Re: 2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions? [Re: WakingUpLate]
    #567207 - 03/01/02 09:21 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Probably too little water...I did that once it sux.


--------------------
www.DoWnClothing.COM


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Invisibleparhelion
neurospelunker

Registered: 03/01/02
Posts: 24
Re: 2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions? [Re: WakingUpLate]
    #567250 - 03/01/02 10:34 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Well, I've followed the PF Tek verbatim: 1/2 cup vermiculite, 1/4 cup BRF, 1/4 cup water (I believe those were the measurements...)

I'll try to move them to a warmer enviroment to see if there's any improvement. The spores were purchased from sporeworks...I assume they're fresh. I also have a syringe of Mazatepec. I'll do another 6 jars with these and see what my results are..

thanks for the suggestions!


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InvisibleZen Peddler
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/18/01
Posts: 6,379
Loc: orbit
Re: 2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions? [Re: WakingUpLate]
    #567415 - 03/02/02 01:38 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

What do you mean by old spores? Ive used prints recentally from December 2000 and they worked fine.
If its water content chances are youd have low germination, not stalling.
Stalling is due to either an unseen competitor or the levels of c02 are too high. You wanna flip the jars, and if that doesnt work they'll need the tape off the lids - you might want to use some sort of filter - such as that thin tape stuff.
If its yeast then i will smell, so crack one open.
Higher temps will promote colonisation - so if you have contams, the mycelia has a better chance of getting a foothold before they appear.


--------------------


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OfflineXAZIA
glitter goddess
Registered: 08/22/01
Posts: 678
Loc: oklahoma
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
Re: 2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions? [Re: Zen Peddler]
    #567511 - 03/02/02 04:44 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

innoculated two weeks ago and they are puerto ricans. i'm gonna go out on a limb and say thermal death. how long did you let your jars cool after sterilization before you innoculated them? since NONE of the jars are doing anything except the dime sized growth in ONE jar...raise your temps to mid 80s. you can accomplish this by constructing (if thats what you want to call it) an incubator. if you have a heating pad, the simplest way is to lay it on the floor, place a rubbermaid (large enough to hold another rubbermaid inside with your jars in it) on top of the heating pad. fill this rubbermaid with a couple inches water (depending on the capacity, you want enough water to keep the smaller rubbermaid suspended in the warm water but a small enough volume that the heating pad can keep a constant temp. in the mid 80s. i put an analog thermometer in the small rubbermaid with my jars on the "floor" of the container where it is warmest. if your analog on the bottom of the rubbermaid reads, say 86 deg. you know your ambient "room" (or technically, "container"), temp is a few deg. lower, lets say..82 deg. and we all know that the core of our jars is a few deg. (slightly) higher than our ambient "room" temp. so just to guesstimate with this scenario your jars would be colonizing at around 84-85 deg.



--------------------
"Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds."

Bob Marley

Remember, EGOISM is the beginning, the source, and the root of EVIL!

http://www.fanaticus.com/pf-tek.htm
http://www.mycotopia.net/teks/hongus.html


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InvisibleWakingUpLate
addict
Registered: 12/29/01
Posts: 559
Loc: Born on a mountain, Raise...
Re: 2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions? [Re: Zen Peddler]
    #567526 - 03/02/02 05:49 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I didn't say old spores. I just said I'd wonder about the spores. Now that I've seen xazia's post. I'd say that would be a better guess.(hot jars) But I'm sure that wasn't the case with the B+. And everything else sounds right. Altough I have a limited knowledge on the subject, I can't see how there would be CO2 buildup without growth. The B+ colonized one jar (just enough to get more spores) and it took over a month. The new spores were PF Classic and took off and were finished before the B+ that started 2 weeks earlier. And the results are clearly PF. So that was my guess. I'm not trying to lay blame anywhere. I don't doubt at all that spores can and do last for years, especially if they're frozen. Just trying to help. :peace: 


--------------------
The rest of those, who have gone before us,
cannot settle the unrest of those who follow.
(Finding Forrester)


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Invisiblemrdasani
enthusiast
Registered: 10/19/01
Posts: 224
Re: 2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions? [Re: WakingUpLate]
    #567529 - 03/02/02 05:54 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Hey guys, I got a question about temperatures.... if its 85degress on the thermometer, would it be higher temperature in the jars itself....since the measures temp is actually the air NOT the substrate. I believe substrate does get a bit hotter than the air temp anyway....whats the difference in temp of air and solid material??


--------------------
"Come on you raver, you seer of visions,
come on you painter, you piper, you prisoner, and shine!" - Pink Floyd (Wish You Were Here 1975)

"Never underestimate the power of denial." -from American Beauty.


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InvisibleWakingUpLate
addict
Registered: 12/29/01
Posts: 559
Loc: Born on a mountain, Raise...
Re: 2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions? [Re: mrdasani]
    #567535 - 03/02/02 06:04 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

....whats the difference in temp of air and solid material??

...about two degrees. :peace:


--------------------
The rest of those, who have gone before us,
cannot settle the unrest of those who follow.
(Finding Forrester)


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Invisibleparhelion
neurospelunker

Registered: 03/01/02
Posts: 24
Re: 2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions? [Re: XAZIA]
    #567560 - 03/02/02 08:51 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

yep yep....it MAY be possible the jars were too warm (damn). I waited about 2 hours after pressure cooking them. I also set the cooker in the freezer after the pressure was released for about 30 minutes....

And yeah, they smell...I don't know the words to describe it, but it's not putrid and I don't see any other growth (contams, ect). I've still got a little bit left in the syringe...I'll re-innoculate a couple of the jars, keep the tape off and watch them closely...

thanks


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InvisibleWakingUpLate
addict
Registered: 12/29/01
Posts: 559
Loc: Born on a mountain, Raise...
Re: 2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions? [Re: parhelion]
    #567837 - 03/02/02 04:57 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

..."I also set the cooker in the freezer after the pressure was released for about 30 minutes.... "

Did you release the pressure by taking the jiggler off? Or did you let it cool until ther was no pressuer? If you took the jiggler off, that's a no-no.
If there's 15 lbs of pressure on the cooker then the boiling point is about 250. As soon as you stop cooking the water temp inside the jars is well above 212. If you take the jiggler off the boiling point drops and the water inside the jars turns to steam. So, we may be back to water content.:peace:

 


--------------------
The rest of those, who have gone before us,
cannot settle the unrest of those who follow.
(Finding Forrester)


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OfflineBeppoMarx
old hand
Registered: 09/01/01
Posts: 1,126
Last seen: 12 years, 7 months
Re: 2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions? [Re: WakingUpLate]
    #567873 - 03/02/02 05:43 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

wow this was an informative post.
par-your jars problem is temperature. its hard to get cubensis mycellium to germinate and grow at 70 degrees. waiting only 2 hours shouldnt be a problem; time isnt the issue temperature is.
when i get done pcing my jars i move the pc over a burner that was not lit to cool faster. i then remove the jiggler 5 or 6 times for 20 seconds or so to speed the cooling process. as soon as the pressure stabilizes i remove the lid and take my jars out and down to my basement concrete floor and even quart jars are cool in under 2 hours (i even flip them after an hour or so)
wakinguplate- that is a good point becaus ethe water does turn to steam as you release the pressure; though im sure a good majority of teh percentage is from the water in the PC i now see that some of teh moisture in the jars should be lost this way too. i never took that into consideration but its never given me much of a problem either.


--------------------
Holy shit people; COMMON SENSE! we were all born with it where did it go?
maybe theres a tek out there to explain how to use it!
BUCKETS BRIGADE left hand man!!!


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OfflineXAZIA
glitter goddess
Registered: 08/22/01
Posts: 678
Loc: oklahoma
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
Re: 2 weeks and little signs of growth...suggestions? [Re: parhelion]
    #573366 - 03/06/02 09:06 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

if you have more spores i would not re-innoculate those same jars! first your water content is not appropiate they have been sitting for over two weeks now. and i would seriously doubt that they are still sterile. don't waste your spores. better to waste more verm and brf. clean your jars thoroughly and start over. this time let your jars cool overnight or at least 6-8 hours. hope i didn't post this too late.
good luck!


--------------------
"Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds."

Bob Marley

Remember, EGOISM is the beginning, the source, and the root of EVIL!

http://www.fanaticus.com/pf-tek.htm
http://www.mycotopia.net/teks/hongus.html


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Amazon Shop: ½ Pint Jars, Brown Rice Flour, Pressure Cooker, Vermiculite

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