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Invisibleblack_dove
journeyman
Registered: 02/13/02
Posts: 88
Critique of Una's tek
    #564832 - 02/27/02 01:42 PM (22 years, 3 days ago)

This is not a critisism, just a critique. I find it interesting that Una doesnt presoak, or precook their grains/seeds. My friend both soaks the grain for 12 hours and then simmers and drains it. (before p-cooking). It is a lot more work than just putting grain&water in a jar and P-cooking.
Do many people use the "one step" process used by Mush Mush?
I would also be interested to know what percent they(mushmush) get contamination on. Perhaps their grains/seeds are much cleaner and freeer of endospores and such in Holland.
Thanks all...


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: Critique of Una's tek [Re: black_dove]
    #564836 - 02/27/02 01:51 PM (22 years, 3 days ago)

I don?t preesoak or precook it either. I use less water than Una though.


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Offlinecookiewhore
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Registered: 01/03/02
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Re: Critique of Una's tek [Re: black_dove]
    #564866 - 02/27/02 02:37 PM (22 years, 3 days ago)

When you are critiquing someones tek, it would be nice to have the link to the tek available.
I dont presoak or precook.
maybe i should.
paste the link please


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: Critique of Una's tek [Re: cookiewhore]
    #564929 - 02/27/02 03:55 PM (22 years, 2 days ago)



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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero

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Re: Critique of Una's tek [Re: Anno]
    #564941 - 02/27/02 04:12 PM (22 years, 2 days ago)

If I don't presoak, drain, and clean, I get nasty goo in the bottom of my container after sterilization. How do you manage to avoid that?

Edit: with rye berries I should mention.


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


Edited by Seuss (02/27/02 04:14 PM)


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: Critique of Una's tek [Re: Seuss]
    #564945 - 02/27/02 04:17 PM (22 years, 2 days ago)

1. use less water
2. skake jars while still hot
3. read http://www.fungifun.org/rye


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Critique of Una's tek [Re: Anno]
    #565012 - 02/27/02 05:41 PM (22 years, 2 days ago)

Thank you kind sir. #2 is most likely my problem.


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InvisibleUna
controlleddemolition

Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 970
Re: Critique of Una's tek [Re: black_dove]
    #565049 - 02/27/02 06:35 PM (22 years, 2 days ago)

If you want to know about our contamination rate it's about 1-2 out of 100 jars. And even if they contaminate it's often green mold, which is an airborne contaminant and thus not the result of improper sterilisation. While jars are cooling outside of the flowcabinet they pick up spores. Once introduced in the flowcabinet these might fall into other jars causing contamination.
We have used rye from many sources and have never had problems with the one step proces. It's just so much easier than to precook, especially when dealing with large numbers of jars.
It's really important to shake the jars while they are still hot to redistribute the dry and wet kernels.
The 1:1 ratio by volume is what works best for us giving maximum yields while still producing a shakable substrate. After sterilisation a typical spawn jar will look like this (notice the gunky kernels on the bottom):



After shaking and cooling it looks like this



In the next update of our website i will include the suggestion to experiment a little with rye/water ratios to find the optimum ratio for every individual case.

Of course when using bigger jars or bags the sterilisation time has to be prolongued. We do 2 hours for 1.5 liter jars and 2 1/2 hours for filter patch or DIY bags.

How big were the jars that you were using and how long did you sterilise them? What kind of contaminant was troubling you, was it a bacteria or a fungus. If it was fungal it's pretty sure that improper sterilisation wasn't your problem.

I doubt that we have been extremely lucky with our rye grain, having bought it from so many sources. In the past it sometime contained substantial amounts of debris. I even once found a dead and dried up frog in it YUK! Still we have until now never had problems with bacterial contamination of our rye grain spawn.

It has been suggested that you fill jars with rye and water and then let soak for 24 hours to let bacterial endospores germinate, making them easier to kill and then sterilise. However we have never found this necesary.


--------------------
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