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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Invisiblechinacat72
eyes of theworld
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Registered: 11/14/02
Posts: 3,626
Loc: Terrapin Station
Re: Thinking of going on antidepressants [Re: monamine]
    #5654090 - 05/20/06 06:13 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

monamine said:
Quote:

niteowl said:
Quote:

PoopShooter said:

Once you're no longer depressed........stop taking the meds.



::adam1975::




With all due respect, that is a horrible idea. Antidepressants are basically an all or nothing thing that usually is long term. You might feel better for awhile, but you'll get rebound depression with a vengeance.




Actually current study of the neurophysiology of the hippocampus shows thats not always true. Prozac has been shown to cause a increase in neurogenesis in the hippocampus. This is a permanent change  and the med can be discontinued.
This is relevant for people who's depression is caused by atrophy of the hippocampus. Most people with chronic depression have hippocampus atrophy. That doesn't mean that 6 months of Prozac will work for them because the atrophy could be a side effect caused by cortisol being released because the the depression has a different cause. The hippocampus will just atrophy again when the med is discontinued. Then another course of treatment is needed.

As for deciding these things it's best to consult with your physician first. The reality of all this is that when it comes down to it we really don't know very much about the human brain. There are so many questions to be answered and tied together that we are in the pre-historic age of neuro science.


--------------------
Some rise
Some fall
Some climb
To get to Terrapin!!!


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Offlineebass
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Registered: 03/15/06
Posts: 387
Last seen: 11 years, 1 month
Re: Thinking of going on antidepressants [Re: niteowl]
    #5654914 - 05/20/06 11:16 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

niteowl said:
Quote:

Noetical said:
Take wellbutrin. Its got a stimulating feel to it and you can quit whenever you want with no withdrawls




Wellbutrin can cause anxiety attacks.


be warned




Wellbutrin is great. I have severe anxiety and depression. Wellbutrin has been great for both. Yeah it's not approved for treatment of anxiety...but it works for me...try it out and keep some xanax on hand in case you do get panicky. Wellbutrin is my favorite drug in my arsenal.


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OfflineCatalysis
EtherealEngineer

Registered: 04/23/02
Posts: 1,742
Last seen: 15 years, 6 months
Re: Thinking of going on antidepressants [Re: chinacat72]
    #5655338 - 05/21/06 03:01 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Prozac has been shown to cause a increase in neurogenesis in the hippocampus.




Yeah, that study was just released I believe...and *very* interesting, to me.

From what has been said here, it seems like I may benefit from wellbutrin. I actually have the opposite of anxiety disorder. I am too calm, relaxed, and zombified emotionally. Its almost like I have all the symptoms of depression but I am not horribly sad or anything. It sounds stupid but this state can really have a negative impact on your life if it is severe enough. Amphetamines actually put me in a place that I like to be but I don't do them for that reason, its dangerous.

Thanks for all the replies and insight. Please keep this thread going if anyone else has experiences/input concerning antidepressants.


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Offlinemonamine
dork
Male

Registered: 04/28/06
Posts: 1,089
Loc: Florida, US
Last seen: 17 years, 6 months
Re: Thinking of going on antidepressants [Re: chinacat72]
    #5655341 - 05/21/06 03:07 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

chinacat72 said:
Quote:

monamine said:
Quote:

niteowl said:
Quote:

PoopShooter said:

Once you're no longer depressed........stop taking the meds.



::adam1975::




With all due respect, that is a horrible idea. Antidepressants are basically an all or nothing thing that usually is long term. You might feel better for awhile, but you'll get rebound depression with a vengeance.




Actually current study of the neurophysiology of the hippocampus shows thats not always true. Prozac has been shown to cause a increase in neurogenesis in the hippocampus. This is a permanent change  and the med can be discontinued.
This is relevant for people who's depression is caused by atrophy of the hippocampus. Most people with chronic depression have hippocampus atrophy. That doesn't mean that 6 months of Prozac will work for them because the atrophy could be a side effect caused by cortisol being released because the the depression has a different cause. The hippocampus will just atrophy again when the med is discontinued. Then another course of treatment is needed.

As for deciding these things it's best to consult with your physician first. The reality of all this is that when it comes down to it we really don't know very much about the human brain. There are so many questions to be answered and tied together that we are in the pre-historic age of neuro science.




Yeah I know all that stuff about neurogenesis and the hippocampus, but I take Zoloft mostly for anxiety/OCD and not the stereotypical apathetic depression. (IE I would say I was depressed because of anxiety which in turned made me depressed)

I thought the downregulation of certain 5-HT receptors could decrease the release of stress hormones like coritsol?

I'm not saying that everyone that takes an antidepressant needs to be on it forever, but generally just outright stopping it once you feel better is a horrible idea. It will cause rebound depression and you'll get in a nasty cycle (I've been there).

I personally think I'll be on SSRI's or the future equivalent the rest of my life. It sucks, but I deal with it. The only alternative to me would be a bullet in the brain...seriously. I totally understand that throwing drugs at everything won't solve the problem, but I feel like I have to justify my use of antidepressants to people and they just don't understand, and it's frustrating.


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OfflineCatalysis
EtherealEngineer

Registered: 04/23/02
Posts: 1,742
Last seen: 15 years, 6 months
Re: Thinking of going on antidepressants [Re: monamine]
    #5655349 - 05/21/06 03:12 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Yeah, I once thought like them but I have come to realize that the impact of mental illness on your life can be horrible and if a drug can help alleviate that, then it is definatly a valid option. It is easy to say that it is all in your head when it is not you that has the disease.


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Offlinemonamine
dork
Male

Registered: 04/28/06
Posts: 1,089
Loc: Florida, US
Last seen: 17 years, 6 months
Re: Thinking of going on antidepressants [Re: Catalysis]
    #5655359 - 05/21/06 03:28 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Catalysis said:
Quote:

Prozac has been shown to cause a increase in neurogenesis in the hippocampus.




From what I've seen said here, it seems like I may benefit from wellbutrin. I actually have the opposite of anxiety disorder. I am too calm, relaxed, and zombified emotionally. Its almost like I have all the symptoms of depression but I am not horribly sad or anything. It sounds stupid but this state can really have a negative impact on your life if it is severe enough. Amphetamines actually put me in a place that I like to be but I don't do them for that reason, its dangerous.





I'm not a doctor obviously (half of them are fucking idiots IMO anyway), but you sound like a good candidate for Wellbutrin if you do decide to go on an antidepressant.

So, I understand you have problems with apathy and just a general lack of drive? This subtype of depression actuallly has a lot to do with the catecoleamines (norepinephrine,dopamine,etc) from my understanding. If you don't have any serious anxiety, I say go for it.

I'm the total opposite. My brain just wouldn't shut the hell up. It felt like total mental overload which manifested itself in really bad panic attacks and obcessive thoughts- thus I take Zoloft.


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Offlinemonamine
dork
Male

Registered: 04/28/06
Posts: 1,089
Loc: Florida, US
Last seen: 17 years, 6 months
Re: Thinking of going on antidepressants [Re: Catalysis]
    #5655363 - 05/21/06 03:37 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Catalysis said:
Yeah, I once thought like them but I have come to realize that the impact of mental illness on your life can be horrible and if a drug can help alleviate that, then it is definatly a valid option. It is easy to say that it is all in your head when it is not you that has the disease.




Yeah totally. Kinda like what you said in your original post, my life was going great and I still felt like a wanted to die for no apparent reason at all. If that's not biochemical, I don't know what is.

It would be a different story if my lifestyle sucked and I just threw drugs at it as a shortcut, but that was not the case at all. (In fact I did throw drugs at it, but instead of antidepressants it was massive amounts of painkillers.)

People act like antidepressants are some kind of amphetamines or something like that. If they are doing their job properly and the dose is right, you can barely tell you're on anything.


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Invisibleniteowl
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Registered: 07/01/03
Posts: 16,291
Loc: Flag
Re: Thinking of going on antidepressants [Re: monamine]
    #5655683 - 05/21/06 09:28 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

monamine said:
People act like antidepressants are some kind of amphetamines or something like that. If they are doing their job properly and the dose is right, you can barely tell you're on anything.





It is true that you will feel better while on these drugs. But if the core reasons behind your troubles isn't addressed....then after a few years the drug begins to not work as well.

Then you go looking for another drug to hide your troubles.....make life "good" again.

It is an endless cycle that can only stop when you try to figure out WHY your depressed or anxious in the first place.


Drugs are just a band-aid.........even prescription drugs.


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future


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Offlinemonamine
dork
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Registered: 04/28/06
Posts: 1,089
Loc: Florida, US
Last seen: 17 years, 6 months
Re: Thinking of going on antidepressants [Re: niteowl]
    #5656530 - 05/21/06 02:19 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:


It is true that you will feel better while on these drugs. But if the core reasons behind your troubles isn't addressed....then after a few years the drug begins to not work as well.




You don't think I took a long deep look inward and tried to find the root of the problem? I can't even begin to describe the self introspection I went through. Taking antidepressants with side effects was my last choice before suicide.

I looked, and looked, and looked. There was no outward problem to solve. Everything was seemingly well on the outside. No kind of spirtual outlet worked and psychedelics just made me even more depressed.

It's not normal unhappiness. I can't really describe it for anyone that hasn't been through it. Your whole thought processes are screwed up-you can't even think straight. Shit I had trouble speaking in complete sentences. My whole mind was off and I could tell.


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Offlinemonamine
dork
Male

Registered: 04/28/06
Posts: 1,089
Loc: Florida, US
Last seen: 17 years, 6 months
Re: Thinking of going on antidepressants [Re: niteowl]
    #5656539 - 05/21/06 02:21 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Drugs are just a band-aid.........even prescription drugs.




Using an analogy, I should have bled to death instead of applying a band-aid?

I know you mean well, but you're kind of starting to piss me off man...


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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


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