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Offlinebuckallyall
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Confused on Flushes
    #5635532 - 05/16/06 12:56 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

OK,

Im still a newbie here and Im very confused on flushes.  I just picked like 10 shrooms of 3 different casings I have and there are still a couple more big ones to be picked.  Now when im done picking like the last 5 or 10 big ones I have like 20 or 30 pins that are about 1-2 inches tall.  are those my second flush or still my first????  Also, I have been reading that you are supposed to pick every pin off then dunk and re-case.  Is this true???  Do you really pick every single little last pin or what????  Im very confused on this becuase ive read like 12 different threads and most say different things.  If someone could help clear some things up for me that would great.  Thanks

:mushroom2: :crazy2: :mushroom2:


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Invisiblemonstermitch
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: buckallyall]
    #5635540 - 05/16/06 12:57 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

still the first.

yes, pick them all. Every one.
yes, every one.

I do anyway.


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Offlinebuckallyall
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: monstermitch]
    #5635569 - 05/16/06 01:06 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Ok well im going to give them another day or 2 to see if any get bigger before I decied what is an abort and what is just slow...Im guesing that is the right thing to do. Also I fear I have lots of overlay from a thin 1st casing layer should I do a deep scratch after I pick every shroom then dunk and then case it???? Thanks again for the help I just wanna get the most out of my casings.


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Invisiblemonstermitch
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: buckallyall]
    #5635577 - 05/16/06 01:09 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

I suggest no scratching.

I suggest no dunking.

we're talking casings here right?

here:

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/3290155/an/0/page/0

hyphae has some good info hear you can learn from.


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Offlinebuckallyall
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: monstermitch]
    #5635629 - 05/16/06 01:22 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Ok...Ive read this many time already but I still dont get it. You just said to pick every last one and hyphae says that the first and second pins come up at the same time...Im really lost here I didnt think this was that confusing till I started to read more into it


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Invisiblemonstermitch
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: buckallyall]
    #5635649 - 05/16/06 01:27 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

you kind of missed his point a bit.

he says that the first, second, and so on pinsets are determined by your first pinset, so it is a very important one.

I believe.

still, pick all of the shrooms and that will conclude your first flush.

after a while more pins will begin to grow and that will be your second flush.

how many pins develop the second time is determinate upon the first flush pinset, I believe that is what he is saying.


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Offlinebuckallyall
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: monstermitch]
    #5635693 - 05/16/06 01:39 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

AHHHHH I see OK I get that part now but I still think I have overlay on my casings. There is alot of myc. and I cant see any of the casing layer. it took it over completely. Should I just re case it... give it a lite scratch and then since all the pins are gone give a small casing layer so it doesnt use to much energy to re group from all this??? Thanks again for all the help!

P.S. I think I have overlay becuase I read hyphae's thing on overlay and mine is very water resistant. I went from misting to trying to use a syringe to keep it wet around the pins and the water drops just chill on there and dont move for like 12-24 hours.


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Invisiblemonstermitch
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: buckallyall]
    #5635807 - 05/16/06 02:01 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

I'm still thinking that you don't have overlay.

I bet you casing layers are totally colonized though.
did you use coco coir in your casings?
that stuff has lots of nutes in it. I use it as a substrate sometimes.
I only put 10%coir in my casings, sometimes I forget and skip it.

Do you have a picture to throw up to look at.
with a picture you can have lots of others give you a good opinion.
I could totally be wrong about the overlay, but I think you're okay and I still would not recommend a scratching. Seeing how you are colonized and fruiting I would just go with it as is with no casing, patching, or scratching.

yup, that's what I would do. I'll look for a link or something where someone smarter than I can explain why better...


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Offlinebuckallyall
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: monstermitch]
    #5635857 - 05/16/06 02:12 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

So what should I do with my second flush then? I know now (cuz of you) to get all the pins off but then what. If I'm gonna act like I have to casing cuz its sooooo colonized what do I do to get a second flush...and how do I re-hydrate it with so much myc on top? Should I get all the pins off, dunk it, and then just fruit and not put on more casing? or is there a better way for someone in my situation???


P.S. No coir that I know of in my casing. I bought it from mycoshack they called it there special blend it had cactus soil and some other stuff in it..but no coir that they told me about.


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Edited by buckallyall (05/16/06 02:16 AM)


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Invisiblemonstermitch
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: monstermitch]
    #5635868 - 05/16/06 02:14 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)



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Offlinebuckallyall
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: monstermitch]
    #5635927 - 05/16/06 02:25 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

mine do look alot like those but how do you get a good second flush when they are like that???


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Invisiblemonstermitch
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: monstermitch]
    #5635939 - 05/16/06 02:26 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/5616360/an/0/page/8

your casing is in fruiting mode.
to case it, you would be incubating it afterwards...
don't want to exhaust and overwork the mycelium now.
your substrate is fully colonized (casing too) and fruiting.
I would not case, not dunk, not scratch, and not mist directly.

I would mist the chamber and not be too worried about some mist landing on the casings.
I would possibly inject the casing in several places an inch or two apart with a couple of cc's of sterile distilled water.
but that last part for me is questionable.
I've never had a casing layer totally colonize, but I have worked without casings all together.

a picture would really be good so I could have an idea.
some people do dunk their casings.
some people do inject water into their casings/cakes.

whatever the wet weight of the mushrooms from the flush is equals what water was used up. Minus around 10% or so.
so 90% of your fresh flush weight needs to be replaced to the casing to return it to it's weight prior to first flush.

the casing will shrink as the mycelium consume the nutrients so maybe you wouldn't put that 90% in, maybe a bit less.

again, this is out of my ability to answer correctly for sure, but at least it's something for you.


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Edited by monstermitch (05/16/06 02:46 AM)


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Offlinebuckallyall
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: monstermitch]
    #5635962 - 05/16/06 02:32 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Yea that helps alot. Thanks alot for the help man but im hittin the sack right now its 1:30 in the morning where I am and im gettin tired im going to try to get some pics tomorrow and wait a day or to too see if anything will happen with the pins I have left. Then I dont know what im going to do. I think just pick all the pins and see if more show up on there own...if not ill dunk or inject water. Other wise im going to just leave it alone.


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Invisiblemonstermitch
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: buckallyall]
    #5635980 - 05/16/06 02:36 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

buckallyall said:
mine do look alot like those but how do you get a good second flush when they are like that???




remember in hyphae's thread about casings when he stated the pinflushes are determined by the original pinset? This could be the way it is and your second pinset is already sort of determined, you can just try to get all of them to maturity with the correct conditions.

when not using a casing I set the trays out on the shelves and place a piece of wax paper over them. Every couple of days I switch out the wax paper. A micro climate is created between the wax paper and the substrate and I leave it on til they pin and push it up. After that into the fruiting chamber.

It was a tek I read long ago on some other site. I think
RogerRabbit was given credit for bringing the idea to life.
He^is quite intelligent and wise in this field of study. You should look into his threads and at www.mushroomvideos.com
great stuff.

I don't use the wax paper in between flushes, I just leave them in the fruiting chamber and they do very well.
so this idea may not work for you, but it is something at least that can be investigated.


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Edited by monstermitch (05/16/06 02:49 AM)


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: buckallyall]
    #5636484 - 05/16/06 08:07 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

The minute mushrooms are your second flush often times larger than the first flush.


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Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
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Offlinebuckallyall
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: hyphae]
    #5637786 - 05/16/06 04:33 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Ok

Im still confused on how to get my second flush. I get the part to pick off every pin. But then what do I do since I have so much myc. Should I dunk it or inject water or do you just leave it and let it dry out??? Any ideas hyphae.....?

When I get back from the store tonight Im going to try to get a picture for ya!


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: buckallyall]
    #5638601 - 05/16/06 07:49 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

buckallyall said:
Ok

Im still confused on how to get my second flush. I get the part to pick off every pin. But then what do I do since I have so much myc. Should I dunk it or inject water or do you just leave it and let it dry out??? Any ideas hyphae.....?

When I get back from the store tonight Im going to try to get a picture for ya!



You do not want to pick off every pin those are future flushes bro! Just pick the ones that have opened or are about to depending on personal preference and any aborts leave your next flushes pins bro so they can mature, this will take a few days (5-7) before they will bolt so mist that casing to near saturation and be patient my friend.


--------------------
Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy.
Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal :wink:
Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
Gas Exchange vs. FAE

"We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"


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Offlinebuckallyall
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: hyphae]
    #5639195 - 05/16/06 10:01 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Awesome Thank you soooooo much. That is the type of answer I was looking for. Im cleaned up my casings today. I picked all the mature ones and the aborts and some that were on the sides. Im going to use a clean syringe to just squirt water on my casing and not mist so that I hopefully dont get a ton of aborts. Thanks again for all the help hyphae and monstermitch!!!!


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: monstermitch] * 1
    #5639295 - 05/16/06 10:28 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

monstermitch said:
still the first.
yes, pick them all. Every one.
yes, every one.
I do anyway.




Quote:

monstermitch said:
I suggest no dunking.





Quote:

monstermitch said:
still, pick all of the shrooms and that will conclude your first flush.

after a while more pins will begin to grow and that will be your second flush.

how many pins develop the second time is determinate upon the first flush pinset




Sorry, but the above is some seriously horrible advice. You really need to get a few grows under your belt and not try to simply paraphrase what you've read in other threads.

You do NOT pick all the small pins when you harvest first flush. If you do you destroy the second and third flushes.

Dunking substrates is an excellent way to hydrate between flushes. Recase the divits where the substrate was damaged by picking.

The number of pins that develop in the second flush has nothing at all to do with the first flush, unless you do something silly like pick them off. Many times, as said above, the pins for the first three flushes all form at once, then sit dormant waiting their turn.

The first flush is over when you've picked the mature fruits. The second flush will begin when the pins you LEAVE in place begin to grow a few days after you pick. Dunking won't hurt the pins. Just make sure you give plenty of air exchange when you place the tray back in the fruiting chamber, so the water can evaporate off the pins.
RR


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Offlinebuckallyall
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Re: Confused on Flushes [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #5639324 - 05/16/06 10:34 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks for the info. I'm glad to see the heavy hitters are helping me out.


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