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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Registered: 06/15/02
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Were the 60's a failure?
    #5624778 - 05/13/06 02:03 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I think they were.

That time period was a fad and it accomplished nothing of substance at all. The only noticeable thing it did do was loosen up some of society's stricter mores and it helped introduce extreme Leftism into certain segments of society. Big whoop.

It was an energetic but pointless spasm of rebellion punctuated by sex, drugs, and rock n' roll. The people involved then grew up and decided that they wanted nice houses and nice cars. They were no longer content to live in some shack on some hippy commune and bum around to rock concerts.

Material comfort trumped individual convictions. End of story.


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OfflineSnaggletooth
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5624787 - 05/13/06 02:05 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

yeah the hippies messed it up for all of us.....


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Atheist Chat


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InvisibleOneMoreRobot3021
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5624788 - 05/13/06 02:06 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I think sex drugs and rock 'n roll are three things vastly important to society, so I don't necessarily see the 60's as a failure, considering it propagated all of those.

The only way the 60's were a failure was the spread of the idea of "counter-culture." if you want to change society, you immerse yourself in it, you don't try and make your own. That only contributes to the fractures, splintered nature of things.


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Acid doesn't give you truths; it builds machines that push the envelope of perception. Whatever revelations came to me then have dissolved like skywriting. All I really know is that those few years saddled me with a faith in the redemptive potential of the imagination which, however flat, stale and unprofitable the world seems to me now, I cannot for the life of me shake.

-Erik Davis


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InvisibleHelp on the Way
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: OneMoreRobot3021]
    #5624799 - 05/13/06 02:11 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

OneMoreRobot3021 said:
if you want to change society, you immerse yourself in it, you don't try and make your own. That only contributes to the fractures, splintered nature of things.




yea i agree

gotta change it from within


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:shocked: *Divine Moments of Truth* :shocked:


"Limitless undying love which shines around me like a million suns - it calls me on and on across the universe" ~ John Lennon

"Once in a while you get shown the light in the strangest of places if you look at it right" ~The Grateful Dead

"Religionists, with their guaranteed eventual paradise, of which they know nothing, taking it all on 'faith,' can't be expected to understand or sympathize with those with a yen to storm the Gate of Heaven and see for themselves what all the praying's about!" ~Robert Hunter


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Offlinewrestler_az
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: OneMoreRobot3021]
    #5624802 - 05/13/06 02:12 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

the 60s failed? at what? how about the 50s, or 70s......shit, how are we doing right now?

the fact that we are still talking about the 60s says quite a bit.


--------------------
how's your WOW?





  Edited by yageman (04/20/06 4:20 PM) 


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: Snaggletooth]
    #5624807 - 05/13/06 02:13 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Snaggletooth said:
yeah the hippies messed it up for all of us.....




I never said they messed things up (although I do not like some of the leftover social legacies from the 60's). I was merely saying that they didn't get anywhere close to accomplishing a revolution.


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OfflineGinseng1
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: wrestler_az]
    #5624811 - 05/13/06 02:14 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

wrestler_az said:
the 60s failed? at what? how about the 50s, or 70s......shit, how are we doing right now?

the fact that we are still talking about the 60s says quite a bit.




:stoned: :thumbup:


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Flowing through beginningless time since time without beginning...


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Invisiblebuckwheat
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5624816 - 05/13/06 02:16 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Id say it was a failure but some seeds where planted.Trying to legislate an ideology doesn't work.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: wrestler_az]
    #5624817 - 05/13/06 02:16 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

wrestler_az said:
the 60s failed? at what? how about the 50s, or 70s......shit, how are we doing right now?

the fact that we are still talking about the 60s says quite a bit.




Things don't have to be successful to be memorable.

For example, Hitler's Third Reich wasn't successful yet we remember it.


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Offlinejcdangerously
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5624823 - 05/13/06 02:19 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

The 60's were a period of trial and error for our nation's youth. Although the hippie lifestyle was certainly not successful, our society as a whole benefited in that many people realized that living to excess isn't conducive to health or financial stability.


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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5624825 - 05/13/06 02:19 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I suppose it depends on what you are deeming success and failure. I think they failed at the most important thing it could have gotten done, which was destroying the stigma attached to recreational drug use.

They did make some half-way decent music, though. :shrug:


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Offlinewrestler_az
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5624829 - 05/13/06 02:22 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

RandalFlagg said:
Quote:

wrestler_az said:
the 60s failed? at what? how about the 50s, or 70s......shit, how are we doing right now?

the fact that we are still talking about the 60s says quite a bit.




Things don't have to be successful to be memorable.

For example, Hitler's Third Reich wasn't successful yet we remember it.




my point is why does it have to be a pass or fail type of thing? and based on what? and from whos point of view?


--------------------
how's your WOW?





  Edited by yageman (04/20/06 4:20 PM) 


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: jcdangerously]
    #5624836 - 05/13/06 02:23 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

jcdangerously said:
Although the hippie lifestyle was certainly not successful, our society as a whole benefited in that many people realized that living to excess isn't conducive to health or financial stability.




Not a lot of people realized it. The standard of living, resource usage, and debt of the average person have skyrocketed. Us First-Worlders are gluttonous.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: wrestler_az]
    #5624847 - 05/13/06 02:27 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

wrestler_az said:
my point is why does it have to be a pass or fail type of thing? and based on what? and from whos point of view?




A movement never has to be strictly "pass/fail". It's just that the 60's leaned more toward failure in my opinion.


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Offlinejcdangerously
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5624858 - 05/13/06 02:29 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

RandalFlagg said:
Not a lot of people realized it. The standard of living, resource usage, and debt of the average person have skyrocketed. Us First-Worlders are gluttonous.




Nonsense. People couldn't have helped but notice things like overdose statistics and unwanted pregnancies. As for the latter part of your statement, I agree, but it has little to do with the topic at hand. Our society is significantly changed now from what it was four decades ago.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: jcdangerously]
    #5624877 - 05/13/06 02:37 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

What were some of the things that the basic 60's mentality tried to get across?

1. Anti-consumerism

-A complete and utter failure. People live in bigger houses than ever before. People use more energy than ever before. Luxury is still heavily sought after. Personal debt has soared. Personal savings are down.

2. Anti-government

-The federal government is bigger and stronger than ever before.

3. Anti-military

-The U.S. military is incredibly well-funded, powerful, and it is heavily involved in foreign adventures and stationings.

4. Pro-drug

-Drugs are still illegal. In fact, some states have downright draconian laws in place for even simple possession.


Edited by RandalFlagg (05/13/06 02:38 PM)


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Offlinewrestler_az
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5624881 - 05/13/06 02:40 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

then i guess we should stop trying?


--------------------
how's your WOW?





  Edited by yageman (04/20/06 4:20 PM) 


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OfflineDoctorJ
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: wrestler_az]
    #5624894 - 05/13/06 02:44 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

maybe we should start trying intelligently.

the children of the 60's had the right dream (for the most part), but they also had terrible methods for making that dream a reality, as evidenced by the fact that it is NOT a reality today.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: wrestler_az]
    #5624905 - 05/13/06 02:47 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

wrestler_az said:
then i guess we should stop trying?




Admit the futility of what you're doing.

For example, it is utterly futile for the U.S. government to attempt to control and stop the illegal drug trade. The demand is too high and the profit margin is to great. They will never be able to stop it. The second they bust somebody, someone else moves in to take their place.

It is utterly futile to fight against the tide of human selfishness and materialism. Us humans like shiny stuff, comfort, and diversionary entertainment. Most people don't want a revolution because they're too comfortable.


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Offlinejcdangerously
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5624912 - 05/13/06 02:49 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

You're right on all counts, Randall, but you're overlooking a key point. As I mentioned previously, today's society is significantly different than it was then. There are many MANY contributing factors that led up to our current socioeconomic state.

Still, I maintain that the general public simply could not have overlooked the consequences of free love and wanton drug use.


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OfflineTheCow
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5624913 - 05/13/06 02:49 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

God I love shiny shit


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Offlinewrestler_az
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5624963 - 05/13/06 03:06 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

true that, i am pretty comfortable. the truth is as far as "movements" are concerned im most happy when im the only one that moves. or maybe its because i didnt grow up in the sixties and have nothing to base what i just said on so far in my life so ummmm....ya what was i saying?

give me something worth moving for and maybe ill join ya. what can we learn from our mistakes in the 60s? and where do we want to move to? please help me understand why we are so caught up in a decade from the past?


do we need some closure?


--------------------
how's your WOW?





  Edited by yageman (04/20/06 4:20 PM) 


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: wrestler_az]
    #5624977 - 05/13/06 03:11 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

wrestler_az said:
what can we learn from our mistakes in the 60s?




Nothing positive. Movements always attract sheep-like masses, become perverted, fracture, and fall apart. I have no faith in Man, his movements, or any of his various ideologies.

Quote:

wrestler_az said:
please help me understand why we are so caught up in a decade from the past?




Because it failed so grandly.

Quote:

wrestler_az said:
where do we move to




Hell if I know.


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OfflineMicrocosmatrix
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Re: Were the 60's a failure? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5625021 - 05/13/06 03:25 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Well, let's try again, bring back the $50 sheets and 500 mic hits and let's see how it goes this time.


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:orly:



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