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Offlineperosiste
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: Plasmid]
    #8561431 - 06/25/08 06:42 AM (15 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Plasmid said:
IMO, giving your cat a hallucinogenic drug like psilocin or LSD is abusive.  Animals are thought to hallucinate from these substances (I believe I once read that cats will hiss at nothing and act as though they are interacting with hallucinations).  You may think that your cat enjoyed the experience and it may have, but you also risked traumatizing your cat and that is a horrible thing to do.  You should be charged with animal cruelty.

Animals do not administer psychedelic drugs.  Have you ever thought about that?  Animals will self-administer cocaine, heroin, etc.  They will not administer hallucinogens.  Only humans do that.

Deneau G, Yanagita T & Seevers M H. Self-administration of psychoactive substances by the monkey: a measure of psychological dependence. Psychopharmacologia 16:30-48. (1969)

Hoffmeister, F. Negative reinforcing properties of some psychotropic drugs in drug-naive rhesus monkeys. J Pharmacol Exp Ther 192, 468– 477.  (1975)

Nichols, DE.  Hallucinogens.  Pharmacology & Therapeutics.  101, pp. 131 - 181.  (2004)

Gresch, P. J., Strickland, L. V., & Sanders-Bush, E. Lysergic acid diethylamide-induced Fos expression in rat brain: role of serotonin-2A receptors. Neuroscience 114, 707–713.  (2002)

Ketamine is not (only) a "cat tranquilizer."  It is widely used in humans.  Also, ketamine is not exactly considered an ideal cat anesthetic.  Anyway, it's not like vets give cats so that they can have fun.  Vets give cats ketamine in order to prevent them from experiencing serious pain during surgery.

Here is a "cool" video of a cat on LSD:








1 how is this any more cruel than

removing sexual organs to control behavior
partial toe amputation (declawing)
physical mutilation (snipping tails and ears of some species)
neglect
keeping an animal in a enivornment thats to small
exposing animals to second hand smoke (cigarette smokers who smoke inside)
or anything else that "normal" pet owners do




2 Prove that animals DONT self administer hallucinogens

the OP said that the cat will now seek out the shrooms and eat them on it's own 
That kinda seems like self administering to me


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Risk Management will be the downfall of western civilization


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Offlinetomnl
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: perosiste]
    #8561442 - 06/25/08 06:52 AM (15 years, 7 months ago)

dont give it to your cat, thats animal abuse. I suggest feeding it to your goldfish


--------------------
Been away so long I hardly knew the place
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Leave it till tomorrow to unpack my case
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Back in the US
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OfflineAdamist
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: inoculatedGreif]
    #8561554 - 06/25/08 08:10 AM (15 years, 7 months ago)

IME, dosing your cat is not necessary. Cats are sensitive enough on their own to pick up on your psychedelic vibe without the aid of any chemical catalyst. Seriously, cats are mysterious creatures... There is evidence to suggest that cats and dogs can sense when someone is dieing, so it stands to reason that they'd also be able to sense when someone is tripping. :crazy:


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Offlineigwna
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: Plasmid]
    #8562795 - 06/25/08 02:01 PM (15 years, 7 months ago)

what about those wild cats that eat that hallucinogenic vine?

thats self-administering is it not?
maybe its a leopard or panther or w.e and not a domestic cat but its still a feline.

animals DO self-administer hallucinogens...

i've seen many a documentry on these kinds of things.


it MAY not be a great idea to do it, but this guy did everything he could to make it enjoyable for his cat and had a good outcome. thats good enough for me.


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I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.



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OfflinePlasmid
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: Shad0w]
    #8564378 - 06/25/08 09:07 PM (15 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Shad0w said:
..... I dont see any REAL reason not to let him make his own descisions.

You cant say it is "bad" for him and he doesnt know better.....
He is a (in some form ) consicous animal. just like any one of us...... 




It could be bad for the cat. 

Giving the cat a choice to eat some unknown substance is totally different than giving a human an informed choice.

A four year old is a conscious animal.  Would you leave a bag of ketamine out for your four year old to eat, simply because he/she might decide to eat or sniff that neat powder lying on the table?  Sure, it might (and perhaps probably would not) kill or permanently harm the child, but it is totally irresponsible to risk traumatizing an uniformed being.

Where do you draw the line?  A dog can decide to drink ethylene glycol if it wants.  Does that mean that you should leave a bowl of antifreeze out on the floor just because the dog can decide to drink it? 

The animal doesn't know what the consequences will be of ingesting some substance it doesn't know about anymore than a child does (which is why you keep cleaning products locked away).  A responsible person should consider the fact that there is potential harm in letting an animal eat something it doesn't know about.  I hope you wouldn't treat your own children this way.


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OfflinePlasmid
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: igwna]
    #8564407 - 06/25/08 09:16 PM (15 years, 7 months ago)

[QUOTE]skcorrelyt said:
what about those wild cats that eat that hallucinogenic vine?[/QUOTE]

Please provide some kind of reference so I can look this up.  All the evidence I've seen suggests otherwise.


[QUOTE]animals DO self-administer hallucinogens...[/QUOTE]

Do you have a reference?

[QUOTE]i've seen many a documentry on these kinds of things.[/QUOTE]

Care to name the documentary so that I could have more to go on than your good word?  (or wild imagination)

[QUOTE]but this guy did everything he could to make it enjoyable for his cat and had a good outcome.




You're basing that on his few posts in this thread which probably add up to less than 300 words?

How did this guy even know that his cat wouldn't be poisoned by something else in the mushrooms?  Substances that are harmless to humans can be poisonous to animals (chocolate is poisonous to dogs).  There's nothing to suggest here that this guy even bothered to make sure that a cat wouldn't have an allergic reaction to something in fungi.


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OfflineAnonymousRabbit
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. [Re: Plasmid]
    #8564467 - 06/25/08 09:34 PM (15 years, 7 months ago)

.


--------------------
.


Edited by AnonymousRabbit (05/18/22 11:19 PM)


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Offlinelukey2411
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #8564748 - 06/25/08 10:51 PM (15 years, 7 months ago)

My best mate would always tell me how his dog will eat his bud if he leaves it outside, I never believed him until about two months ago when we were shrooming pretty hard and he put about half a gram, chopped up, onto the ground and his dog ate it without hesitation. You can imagine the hysterical laughter that ensued.  :boxerface:


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Offlineigwna
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: Plasmid]
    #8565135 - 06/26/08 12:47 AM (15 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Plasmid said:
[QUOTE]skcorrelyt said:
what about those wild cats that eat that hallucinogenic vine?[/QUOTE]

Please provide some kind of reference so I can look this up.  All the evidence I've seen suggests otherwise.


[QUOTE]animals DO self-administer hallucinogens...[/QUOTE]

Do you have a reference?

[QUOTE]i've seen many a documentry on these kinds of things.[/QUOTE]

Care to name the documentary so that I could have more to go on than your good word?  (or wild imagination)

[QUOTE]but this guy did everything he could to make it enjoyable for his cat and had a good outcome.




You're basing that on his few posts in this thread which probably add up to less than 300 words?

How did this guy even know that his cat wouldn't be poisoned by something else in the mushrooms?  Substances that are harmless to humans can be poisonous to animals (chocolate is poisonous to dogs).  There's nothing to suggest here that this guy even bothered to make sure that a cat wouldn't have an allergic reaction to something in fungi.






here is a documentry:







i dont remember which one of those has the part about the jaguar eating the ayahausca but its in there.

my dog ate chocolate once but didnt die. he got into the easters baskets. idk how poisonous that it can really be. idk tho, you got me on that one.

he got lucky sure, but his cat had only positive effects which goes to show not every idea has to be a bad one when other people say it is.


i'm kinda high so i dont know if i answered all your questions.. but dont really care to scroll up either. hope you enjoy.


--------------------
I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.



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Offlineigwna
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: lukey2411]
    #8565138 - 06/26/08 12:48 AM (15 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

lukey2411 said:
My best mate would always tell me how his dog will eat his bud if he leaves it outside, I never believed him until about two months ago when we were shrooming pretty hard and he put about half a gram, chopped up, onto the ground and his dog ate it without hesitation. You can imagine the hysterical laughter that ensued.  :boxerface:




i've seen this too


--------------------
I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.



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OfflinePlasmid
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: perosiste]
    #8565193 - 06/26/08 01:11 AM (15 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

perosiste said:
1 how is this any more cruel than




That's not relevant.  Even if it is just as cruel, more cruel or less cruel than those other things, it is still irresponsible an cruel.  Pointing out that Auschwitz was a cruel environment doesn't suddenly justify irresponsibly abusing animals.

Quote:

2 Prove that animals DONT self administer hallucinogens




What do you think those references in the post you quoted demonstrate?  Experimental evidence that animals don't administer hallucinogens.

I can not, ever, prove anything.  Don't make unreasonable demands. 

I can just as easily ask you to prove that animals do self-administer hallucinogens.  Is your "Proof" going to be a post on the Shroomery?  Some guy says his cat now seeks out shrooms?  Anyway, the references I have cited do far more towards providing demonstrations that animals do not self-administer psychedelics than some guy's post on the Shroomery.


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OfflinePlasmid
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: igwna]
    #8565198 - 06/26/08 01:13 AM (15 years, 7 months ago)

You consider those documentaries meaningful?

I am absolutely appalled that some of you are trying to justify this.


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Offlineigwna
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: Plasmid]
    #8565230 - 06/26/08 01:28 AM (15 years, 7 months ago)

i dont know why you're so against it.

cat had a good time, is fine, didn't bug, didn't die and you're still crying about it.

and animals do self-administer drugs, the only reasons these natural plants are looked down upon because society demonized them.

we're animals too, should we stop using these?


--------------------
I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.



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OfflinePlasmid
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: igwna]
    #8565244 - 06/26/08 01:35 AM (15 years, 7 months ago)

Please provide evidence that animals self-administer hallucinogens.  All evidence I see says that the only hallucinogens animals self-administer are dissociatives.

I am against it because it is irresponsible and abusive.  The OP could not have known that the cat would have a good time.  The end does not justify the means.  I think this is irresponsible, abhorrent behavior precisely because it is unnecessarily risking trauma to an animal.

Quote:

the only reasons these natural plants are looked down upon because society demonized them.




What the fuck are you talking about and how is this at all relevant?

Quote:

we're animals too, should we stop using these?




Where is this coming from?  If you want to use them, go ahead.  You can make an informed decision about the risks you want to take.

A cat force fed shrooms did not have that choice.

Like I said before, I seriously hope none of you would treat your children this way.


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Offlineigwna
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: Plasmid]
    #8565254 - 06/26/08 01:42 AM (15 years, 7 months ago)

:rolleyes:


--------------------
I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.



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Invisibleroquet
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: Plasmid]
    #8565600 - 06/26/08 06:28 AM (15 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Plasmid said:
Please provide evidence that animals self-administer hallucinogens.  All evidence I see says that the only hallucinogens animals self-administer are dissociatives.




google "jaguar dmt" for thousands of pages about it.


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OfflinePaulrus
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: roquet]
    #8565615 - 06/26/08 06:41 AM (15 years, 7 months ago)

I didn't know we had so many PETA activists here. This must really piss you off Plasmid. :sheeplove:


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Offlineigwna
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: Paulrus]
    #8569336 - 06/26/08 11:20 PM (15 years, 7 months ago)

its the people who cry about a cat experiencing something outside the norm positively are among those afraid of change.

govt brainwashin is my best guess


lawl.


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I don't believe in cops, bosses, or politicians. Some call that anarchism. I call it having a fucking heart that beats.



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OfflineTomass
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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: lozl]
    #8569547 - 06/27/08 12:34 AM (15 years, 7 months ago)

Fuckin give mr whiskers sum of your shrooms because he should be able to experience the awesomeness of magic mushrooms with you. Because i give mushies to my cat all the time like three days a week. I also shoot him up with heroin and smoke reefer with him too. I also rub his furry little balls until he gets a red rocket beacuase he really likes that.


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I was totally :nonono: but now im just like :vaped: and happy


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Re: Can my cat trip with me? [Re: shroomie_glen]
    #8569615 - 06/27/08 01:15 AM (15 years, 7 months ago)

mix a little sumthin in with the catnip:thumbup:


Edited by tomtwg (06/27/08 01:17 AM)


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