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Offlinetwelvelookslikeu
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: ]
    #5804099 - 06/29/06 05:37 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

The big question is, “Will your outer mind recognize that for which you are ready at the higher levels of your being?” Too often people’s outer minds are so attached to a particular belief system, a particular approach to life, that they cannot recognize the ideas that can take them to the next level. Thus, people find an outer excuse for rejecting the teacher in disguise.


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InvisibleMourningdove
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: twelvelookslikeu]
    #5804119 - 06/29/06 05:44 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I always thought of Jesus as the universal metaphor of the snake eating its own tail. The universe consumes itself to keep moving. The human species had to consume their own god to evolve (no pun intended) to the next phase.


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Offlinetwelvelookslikeu
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: Mourningdove]
    #5804123 - 06/29/06 05:46 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Im sorry but I dont understand what you are trying to say.


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InvisibleMourningdove
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: twelvelookslikeu]
    #5804155 - 06/29/06 05:55 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Just my way of putting Christian metaphysics in the same place of all religions. The Australian Aboriginies look at the universe as serpent shaped or the Rainbow Serpent which eats its own tail, but gives birth to more of the snake's body. The universe is in a constant motion of opposites where death is not an end, only a flux of energy transfer. Since Jesus is a human god, it takes that concept and applies it to the human spaecies.


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Offlinetwelvelookslikeu
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: Mourningdove]
    #5804226 - 06/29/06 06:21 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Yea that does make sense.


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OfflineDoctorJ
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: Mourningdove]
    #5804281 - 06/29/06 06:38 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Jesus wasn't human.

He assumed human form, in order to communicate with a species of life that was WAAAAAAAYYYYY beneath him.


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Offlinetwelvelookslikeu
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: DoctorJ]
    #5804472 - 06/29/06 07:51 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Jesus was part of god as we all are. Christ's entity was too great to be contained in any one man or any one time so th man you think of Christ was not crucified. God did not sacrifice his dearly beloved son by allowing that son to be physical. The christ entity desired to be born in space and time , to stradle creaturhood in order to serve as a leader, and to translate certain truths in physical terms. His message was meant to be carried beyond the times, but this interpretation is not often made.


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OfflineDoctorJ
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: twelvelookslikeu]
    #5804556 - 06/29/06 08:28 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

exactly

the true christ is and always will be in Heaven. 

as it says in the Tao: "Names can be named, but not the Eternal Name.  Tao can be talked about, but not the eternal Tao."

The True Christ is beyond human comprehension.  It couldn't incarnate itself physically, because that would require exclusive definition, which He is beyond. 

but he does send representatives here to Earth, with whom he is deeply connected and in constant communication with. 

Thats why Jesus Christ allowed himself to be crucified.  He knew that his body was just an imperfect vessel, and that his True Self resided far far away from anyone's reach. 

There are many Christs here on Earth now.  Also, there are many Disciples of Christ (though only a small percentage of them can truly claim this moniker) on earth right now. 

I myself am an employee of Christ.  A pretty high ranking one, actually :smile:

truth is, Christ incarnates different aspects of himself at the same time.  He is literally walking around in a bunch of people's bodies right now.  Of course Christ can be multiple people at once!  He's freakin' God!  Who said the guy had to be logical?  :lol:

All of Christ's servants work in their own way with their own unique talents to bring about the Reality that Christ wants.  Knowing His agenda as well as I do, I can think of no other entity I would rather serve :heart:


Edited by DoctorJ (06/29/06 08:38 PM)


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InvisiblethatiAM
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: DoctorJ]
    #5804901 - 06/29/06 10:37 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

DoctorJ said:
exactly

the true christ is and always will be in Heaven. 

as it says in the Tao: "Names can be named, but not the Eternal Name.  Tao can be talked about, but not the eternal Tao."

The True Christ is beyond human comprehension.  It couldn't incarnate itself physically, because that would require exclusive definition, which He is beyond. 

but he does send representatives here to Earth, with whom he is deeply connected and in constant communication with. 

Thats why Jesus Christ allowed himself to be crucified.  He knew that his body was just an imperfect vessel, and that his True Self resided far far away from anyone's reach. 

There are many Christs here on Earth now.  Also, there are many Disciples of Christ (though only a small percentage of them can truly claim this moniker) on earth right now. 

I myself am an employee of Christ.  A pretty high ranking one, actually :smile:

truth is, Christ incarnates different aspects of himself at the same time.  He is literally walking around in a bunch of people's bodies right now.  Of course Christ can be multiple people at once!  He's freakin' God!  Who said the guy had to be logical?  :lol:

All of Christ's servants work in their own way with their own unique talents to bring about the Reality that Christ wants.  Knowing His agenda as well as I do, I can think of no other entity I would rather serve :heart:




Don't you think the 'true Christ' in Heaven is the space of awareness within all things, awareness before mind makes it a something?  It is within the beggar, the saint and the thief, wouldn't you say?

We all serve God, whether we realize it or not.

What is the reality that Christ wants?  Just universal peace and contentment, is it not?  The end of the me caring so much about me and starting to care about everyone?


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OfflineDoctorJ
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: thatiAM]
    #5805021 - 06/29/06 11:09 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I've already said too much about His plans. I'm pretty sure he would rather me not give away the end of the movie before it happens.

however, this 'peace' and 'contentment' you speak of cannot simply be bestowed upon the unworthy. It must be achieved. Since most of mankind is incapable of this, it will be quite some time before it happens. Jesus doesn't hand out free passes, dude. He's not going to wave his magic wand and make all your problems go away. YOU have a responsibility to yourself and those around you to create peace on Earth with your own actions.

And yes, everyone works for God, but not everyone does a good job. God has a lot of employees that are fuckups, and he tends to discipline them until they straighten themselves out.

A lot of so-called 'Christians' want an easy solution to the problems they have created for themselves. My advice is not to hold your breath for this. You dug your hole, and you can climb out. Not only that, you can pay for the re-seeding of the beautiful lawn you ruined. If you had used your free will properly in the first place, you wouldn't be in the hole, so don't expect Mr. Holy to get himself dirty cleaning up your mess.


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InvisiblethatiAM
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: DoctorJ]
    #5806243 - 06/30/06 08:10 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

We are all worthy of God's love and grace, we are inseparable from it.  God is incapable of ruthless discipline, there is only boundless love and ecstatic joy there.  And that is available to everyone, always, even during times of duress.

It is up to us to climb out of our own hole though, yes.  But it's not like some revengeful God is going to be body-slamming you while you are doing it.  God is within our little 'mistakes', but I don't see the point in thinking of it that negatively.  We need to make mistakes to find out what we aren't before we can find out what we are.  'Mistakes' are all infused and sustained by God, too.

The problem is getting caught up in these mistakes and thinking we are horrible, which prevents some from even acknowledging that we should be seeking God in the first place.  We are so sure what we are, we don't stop to think that maybe the real self has absolutely nothing to do with that, or any definition for that matter.  Getting hung up on things keeps us from moving on and continuing to grow.

We do have to work for it, but it's not like a punishment from God.  Take 1 step towards God, God takes 1000 steps towards you :smile:


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OfflineDoctorJ
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: thatiAM]
    #5806587 - 06/30/06 11:29 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I think it all depends on what you deserve.  God does body-slam some people.  He makes it tough for people who have made it tough on others. 

I can only imagine the shit he's been putting hitler through over the past 60 years :lol:

bastard deserves it though


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Offlinetwelvelookslikeu
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: DoctorJ]
    #5807201 - 06/30/06 04:14 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Actions that are "bad" are only bad because we believe they are bad and they make us feel guilt. We have created are reality. For example a cat kills a mouse for fun. The cat feels no guilt at all there for in the cats mind killing that mouse was not a bad thing. Now im not saying that a human killing a human isnt a bad thing because it is. Thats part are way of thinking. We hold so many false beliefs that alter are ego. I like how you said God is within our little 'mistakes' because god is. Its true that god does nothing wrong. We are all made from god and we all are god so there should not be anything we do that is wrong we have just taken in these false beliefs that cause these right and wrongs.


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OfflineDoctorJ
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: twelvelookslikeu]
    #5807236 - 06/30/06 04:30 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

whatever helps you sleep at night, dear

:rolleyes:

why is it that people can't take responsibility for the destructive acts they have committed against themselves and others? 

Of course there is wrong in the world!  God is weak here!  Earth is a Luciferian planet, and thus is ultimately doomed unless it reforms.  It really is that simple.  You think God cares if this planet destroys itself?  He has a zillion planets! 

Its up to us, the residents.  We can save this place or we can be irresponsible little brats and flush the whole thing down the shitter. 

Karma is God's law.  You can dodge it for awhile, but if you got warrants they will catch up to you. 

I'm sorry if your own guilt won't allow you to recognize that there is a price to be paid for the wrongs we as humans have committed.  But that's the harsh truth:  Gad ain't payin your way: YOU ARE. 

Unless you become self-sufficient, you will always be in debt and hence always a slave.  True freedom comes from mindful self-mastery, not mindless self-indulgence.  Welcome to the real world, hippy :rofl:

sorry to be harsh, but I'm sick of this tendancy for people to insulate and repress their morality and empathy and call that 'enlightenment'.  That's not enlightenment, its psychosis.  Thats like the difference between Jesus and Manson. 

People build this little bubble for themselves and expend all their effort towards their own happiness while purposefully blinding themselves to the evil in the world.  Enlightenment does not include denial. 

Always remember that just because your circumstances are flush doesn't mean that the world is peachy keen.  There are in fact other people besides yourself, and most of them are having a really bad time.  There are people in foriegn countries that subsist on DIRT.  Thats what they eat.  Fucking cakes of dirt.  So you can sit here in America enjoying and overconsuming and polluting and bombarding yourself with affirmations of how great you are and how peachy everything is, or you can grow up and wake up to realize that that there is injustice in the world, and there is work to be done. 



Edited by DoctorJ (06/30/06 05:47 PM)


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OfflineSchwammel
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: DoctorJ]
    #5807383 - 06/30/06 05:45 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

"""I always thought of Jesus as the universal metaphor of the snake eating its own tail. The universe consumes itself to keep moving. The human species had to consume their own god to evolve (no pun intended) to the next phase."""

but if you consume yourself wahts left?


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InvisiblethatiAM
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: DoctorJ]
    #5807515 - 06/30/06 06:36 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

DoctorJ said:why is it that people can't take responsibility for the destructive acts they have committed against themselves and others? 

Ego says "I must be right!  I have to be right, which makes others wrong.  Therefore I exist as this: the definition of correct,"  But of course that's not quite how it works :smile:  But that's how.  It is true, we do need to take responsibility for the suffering we have caused.  But it is not like we should get caught up in feeling terrible for it.  Accepting it and moving through it, flowing with life.  That is what it is all about.  It is taking responsibility yet seeing that suffering isn't God's punishment, it is your own deal and it's only as much punishment as you make it.  Feeling happy or sad or torturous isn't what is important, it is feeling.

Of course there is wrong in the world!  God is weak here!  Earth is a Luciferian planet, and thus is ultimately doomed unless it reforms.  It really is that simple.  You think God cares if this planet destroys itself?  He has a zillion planets! 

I wouldn't say God cares.  You are absolutely right, it is up to us.  But if we are willing to take these steps towards salvation, God is there to help and guide us every single step.  It's not like God is like, "Fuck off heathens," but more like, "If you decide to seek me, I will guide you into my arms."

Its up to us, the residents.  We can save this place or we can be irresponsible little brats and flush the whole thing down the shitter. 

Karma is God's law.  You can dodge it for awhile, but if you got warrants they will catch up to you. 

Hells yes, but it's not like this karma load is a bad thing or punishment by any means.  It is God's divine gift to help us grow and transcend that.

I'm sorry if your own guilt won't allow you to recognize that there is a price to be paid for the wrongs we as humans have committed.  But that's the harsh truth:  Gad ain't payin your way: YOU ARE. 

Unless you become self-sufficient, you will always be in debt and hence always a slave.  True freedom comes from mindful self-mastery, not mindless self-indulgence.  Welcome to the real world, hippy :rofl:

:smile:

sorry to be harsh, but I'm sick of this tendancy for people to insulate and repress their morality and empathy and call that 'enlightenment'.  That's not enlightenment, its psychosis.  Thats like the difference between Jesus and Manson. 

Are you talking about me?  I have been tossing around the word enlightenment here and there in my posts, which is of course silly :smile:  It really is nice to care for others and be a force for peace.  Does that mean that peace is right?  I don't know.  Right and wrong are certainly illusional, but that doesn't mean we just go around killing people.  I guess it's just having compassion and letting the wisdom of the moment guide you.  Be a force for compassion and peace always.  I agree, enlightenment has nothing to do with supressing anything, especially empathy.  Enlightenment is kind of like the big, big BIG empathy :smile:

People build this little bubble for themselves and expend all their effort towards their own happiness while purposefully blinding themselves to the evil in the world.  Enlightenment does not include denial. 

Yes, the personal self of course doesn't matter at all, not even the enlightened self.  Big self is what it's all about, getting people to stop caring about themselves all the time.  I just think it's silly to see God as so vengeful.  The big point is to follow and realize God, who will want to follow a God that is kicking them while they are down?

Always remember that just because your circumstances are flush doesn't mean that the world is peachy keen.  There are in fact other people besides yourself, and most of them are having a really bad time.  There are people in foriegn countries that subsist on DIRT.  Thats what they eat.  Fucking cakes of dirt.  So you can sit here in America enjoying and overconsuming and polluting and bombarding yourself with affirmations of how great you are and how peachy everything is, or you can grow up and wake up to realize that that there is injustice in the world, and there is work to be done. 

Yes, much work!  Meditate and pray always for peace.  Just because others don't have adequate food and shelter doesn't mean we can't enjoy ours.  Ignoring the suffering of others is pointless too, of course.  Be a fountain of peace always, spread peace.  It is entirely within our possibility to end this suffering.






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OfflineDoctorJ
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: thatiAM]
    #5807597 - 06/30/06 07:16 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Ego says "I must be right! I have to be right, which makes others wrong. Therefore I exist as this: the definition of correct," But of course that's not quite how it works But that's how. It is true, we do need to take responsibility for the suffering we have caused. But it is not like we should get caught up in feeling terrible for it. Accepting it and moving through it, flowing with life. That is what it is all about. It is taking responsibility yet seeing that suffering isn't God's punishment, it is your own deal and it's only as much punishment as you make it. Feeling happy or sad or torturous isn't what is important, it is feeling.




some egos are more in tune with God than others. The ego itself is not wrong, merely the improper application of ego is wrong. Its like Ayn Rand once wrote: "Money is not inherently evil just because people use it to do evil things."

Just because there is no universal right and wrong (due to the fact that the universe is in a constant state of flux) does not mean that right and wrong do not exist within the parameters of the situation at hand. Situational ethics. Moral compass. Right and wrong are illusions? Thats a fuckin cop-out. Grow up or get chopped down, man.

And yes, suffering is God's punishment! Its his way of teaching you not to be a fucking dumbass! You persist in being a complete moron, destroying yourself and everything around you, and God will punish you until there is nothing left to punish. He is not sentimental. If you get your shit together, great. If not, He ain't gonna cry at your funeral.

Of course, God's punishments are always with benign intentions. Think of it this way: How can someone learn Kung-Fu if they don't get their ass kicked by their teacher every now and then? How good will someone be in a fight if they've never once had their ass kicked before? Lemme, tell ya: Lotta peoples on this planet need a good ass-whuppin, dude. These people have so little self-discipline its fucking pathetic.

Put stress on a muscle in the right way, it gets stronger. God puts stress on us so we get stronger.

Quote:

Are you talking about me?




why, got a guilty subconscious? not everything is about you. Why are you asking me this question? you should ask yourself if the examples I gave fit your behavior. And if they do, then you got some work to do.

You can't just go out, do a bunch of fucked up shit, then 'forgive yourself' and go back to being happy. Thats fucked up and irrespponsible. You have to fix the problems you caused. You have to resore balance! God isn't going to do it for you. Why should He? Its your fucking problem that you created. God created you. His work is done. So solve your own fuckin problems and leave that nigga alone.

Quote:

Hells yes, but it's not like this karma load is a bad thing or punishment by any means.




yes, it is punishment. Much in the same way working off a credit card debt is punishment for a shopping spree. I don't know how to put it any more simply than that. You can sit there and deny to yourself the existence of the Dark side all you want; that doesn't make it go away. If you think that you can wish away the Devil, you are an idiot sitting on train tracks about to get squashed.

Quote:

Enlightenment is kind of like the big, big BIG empathy




its actually much more than that, but if thats all you can get a handle on, I'll leave you with your bottle while I go get a steak.

Quote:

Yes, much work! Meditate and pray always for peace.




Again, there's more to it than that. Meditation and Prayer are for the Self's well-being, mainly. In order to cure the ills of the world, you have to ACT. You can't just sit there hoping it will go away. "Evil to triumphs because good people do nothing."

Quote:

I just think it's silly to see God as so vengeful. The big point is to follow and realize God, who will want to follow a God that is kicking them while they are down?




God IS vengeful! I've witnessed His vengence! You fuck up, He'll getcha. Count on that. And who said following God was a choice? Actually, there is a choice: You can follow God, or you can cease to exist.

And let me ask you this: Who will want to follow a God who lets people get away with heinous crimes and doesn't punish criminals? You think God is some kind of cosmic pushover? You think that the victims of Criminals don't deserve Justice? Letting criminals off the hook without punishment is unfair to the victims. Perhaps if you ever were a victim, you'd understand this.


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InvisiblethatiAM
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: DoctorJ]
    #5807711 - 06/30/06 08:15 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

DoctorJ said:
some egos are more in tune with God than others.  The ego itself is not wrong, merely the improper application of ego is wrong.  Its like Ayn Rand once wrote:  "Money is not inherently evil just because people use it to do evil things." 

Just because there is no universal right and wrong (due to the fact that the universe is in a constant state of flux) does not mean that right and wrong do not exist within the parameters of the situation at hand.  Situational ethics.  Moral compass.  Right and wrong are illusions?  Thats a fuckin cop-out.  Grow up or get chopped down, man.

I guess it can be a cop-out if you make it one.  The thief is not wrong by stealing, he is just playing his part in the evolution of the world, just like everything.  If the thief decides he is wrong, then fine.  But there is no real objectivity, it is all okay.  Right and wrong exist, but only within the parameters of the mind, which we (as you must know) transcend.

And yes, suffering is God's punishment!  Its his way of teaching you not to be a fucking dumbass!  You persist in being a complete moron, destroying yourself and everything around you, and God will punish you until there is nothing left to punish.  He is not sentimental.  If you get your shit together, great.  If not, He ain't gonna cry at your funeral. 

Of course, God's punishments are always with benign intentions.  Think of it this way:  How can someone learn Kung-Fu if they don't get their ass kicked by their teacher every now and then?  How good will someone be in a fight if they've never once had their ass kicked before?  Lemme, tell ya:  Lotta peoples on this planet need a good ass-whuppin, dude.  These people have so little self-discipline its fucking pathetic. 

I guess if you choose to see it as a punishment then that's up to you.  I just think it's an opportunity for growth.  Kind of like you are saying, you've got to fall over sometimes to learn how to ride a bike :smile:  But it's not like gravity is punishing you for sucking at riding the bike.

Put stress on a muscle in the right way, it gets stronger.  God puts stress on us so we get stronger. 

Totally agree, but it's not a vengeful or angry stress.  It is a gift, not wrathful.

Quote:

Are you talking about me?




why, got a guilty subconscious?  not everything is about you.  Why are you asking me this question?  you should ask yourself if the examples I gave fit your behavior.  And if they do, then you got some work to do. 

Well, because I didn't see anyone saying anything about enlightenment between the post you mentioned it and your previous post.

You can't just go out, do a bunch of fucked up shit, then 'forgive yourself' and go back to being happy.  Thats fucked up and irrespponsible.  You have to fix the problems you caused.  You have to resore balance!  God isn't going to do it for you.  Why should He?  Its your fucking problem that you created.  God created you.  His work is done.  So solve your own fuckin problems and leave that nigga alone. 

You're right, God won't do it for us but he is always helping, guiding.  It's not like he is some unresponsive dick.  When you are looking for help and ask sincerely, he will help you.  God wants us to find happiness and peace within him, he helps us.

Quote:

Hells yes, but it's not like this karma load is a bad thing or punishment by any means.




yes, it is punishment.  Much in the same way working off a credit card debt is punishment for a shopping spree.  I don't know how to put it any more simply than that.  You can sit there and deny to yourself the existence of the Dark side all you want; that doesn't make it go away.  If you think that you can wish away the Devil, you are an idiot sitting on train tracks about to get squashed. 

Hmm, I'm not Christian so I don't really believe in the devil.  What does God's punishment have to do with the devil anyway?  God's punishment is the devil?  Kind of paradoxical.

Quote:

Enlightenment is kind of like the big, big BIG empathy




its actually much more than that, but if thats all you can get a handle on, I'll leave you with your bottle while I go get a steak. 

Yes it's much more than that, which is why I said kind of like.  Nobody is going to describe it or understand it with the mind, it's kind of futile to say exactly what it is.

Quote:

Yes, much work! Meditate and pray always for peace.




Again, there's more to it than that.  Meditation and Prayer are for the Self's well-being, mainly.  In order to cure the ills of the world, you have to ACT.  You can't just sit there hoping it will go away.  "Evil to triumphs because good people do nothing." 

I guess prayer and meditation is my way of acting.  What do you suggest?  It isn't really feasible to go over to Africa and give everyone a big sandwich.  Or kill people who you think are wrong.  That is more like being a tool in the hand of your devil, wouldn't you say?  Jesus wouldn't go around killing people or telling people to fuck off because they are evil.  Why should any Christian do the same?

Quote:

I just think it's silly to see God as so vengeful. The big point is to follow and realize God, who will want to follow a God that is kicking them while they are down?




God IS vengeful!  I've witnessed His vengence!  You fuck up, He'll getcha.  Count on that.  And who said following God was a choice?  Actually, there is a choice:  You can follow God, or you can cease to exist. 

And let me ask you this:  Who will want to follow a God who lets people get away with heinous crimes and doesn't punish criminals?  You think God is some kind of cosmic pushover?  You think that the victims of Criminals don't deserve Justice?  Letting criminals off the hook without punishment is unfair to the victims.  Perhaps if you ever were a victim, you'd understand this.

Maybe you are right, I don't really see myself as a victim.  That's your choice, too.  We get our justice, I just don't see it as something that we deserve, like a belt whipping to keep everyone in line.  It is ourselves punishing ourselves, God is just helping us to grow.  I have to go bowling now, my roomie is waiting.  Peace :smile:






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Invisiblekake
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: thatiAM]
    #5807751 - 06/30/06 08:43 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Sorry, but DoctorJ, you're starting to sound like a fucking quack. You claim to be one of Jesus's special servants, yet you go on and on about how God is going to punish without sympathy. You are confusing some components of psychology with acts of God. I don't read the Bible, and even I know you're a bit off course with your concept of God.

Chill the fuck out man, God is not your evil step father who hits you and tells you it will make you a man. God is not the one who dishes out the punishments. God is the one who is there to heal you and help you see your wrongdoings, to give you the courage to change and make things right.

Your ideas conflict severely.


--------------------
The answer to 1984 is 1776.


Edited by kake (06/30/06 08:51 PM)


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OfflineDoctorJ
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Re: Jesus Lived for you [Re: thatiAM]
    #5807786 - 06/30/06 09:04 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

The thief is not wrong by stealing, he is just playing his part in the evolution of the world, just like everything. If the thief decides he is wrong, then fine. But there is no real objectivity, it is all okay




No, thieves are wrong.  Period.  I used to steal, and have paid 100x over for everything I have taken.  Now I don't steal.  I create my own wealth.  Everyone has the capability to make themselves wealthy without stealing or otherwise negatively effecting those around them.    Thus, those who choose to take what they need and desire from others instead of creating it for themselves are shirking their responsibility to both themselves and their environment.  For one thing, they are denying themselves the ability to create by instead choosing to commandeer what others have created.  For another thing, they are depriving others of what is rightfully theirs. 

The cat and the mouse are slaves to a system that forces them to be enemies.  You talk about transcending the mind, yet as long as you steal, you are a slave to your desires.  By taking what rightfully belongs to another, you are putting yourself in their debt, and thus denying yourself transcendence. 

Quote:

When you are looking for help and ask sincerely, he will help you.




he'll help me if I deserve help.  Sometimes I do, sometimes I don't.  You take some of the letters of my name and it says: "Just Wish".  Thats the way I see magic:  I make a wish, and if that wish is Just, then God and I can make it happen.  But if that Wish is unjust, it will never happen, at least not with God's blessing.  The absence of God's blessing in our actions creates karmic debt. 

I suppose that ringing up karmic debt is fine if you want to be trapped on earth for awhile.  But Earth won't last forever, and if you are still in debt when Earth is finally destroyed, kiss your ass goodbye.  Trust me, you don't want to go down with this ship.  You can borrow against Karma a little, but my advice is not to bite off more than you can chew, otherwise you will choke, and God will do nothing to save you.  He might even let off a wild cackle as you gasp for air and suffocate. 

Quote:

God's punishment is the devil? Kind of paradoxical.




Uhhhh....  thats exactly logical if you ask me.  Fuck God over, misappropriate His gifts, get sent to Hell.  Become the devil's bitch.  If God encompasses all that is, he encompasses both reard and punishment, good and bad.  You think God is powerless to hurt you?  :lol:  you're in for a nasty surprise. 

God will give you a lot of credit.  He'll let you dig a hole all the way to Hell, then laugh as the magma burns you alive. 

If you don't believe in the Devil, you haven't been out in the world enough.  The Devil resides in every scumsucking politician that's in it for the bucks.  He lives in the hearts of all those rich assholes who would rather drive an SUV than help the world out of its suffering.  Much like electrons, you cannot prove the existence of Satan, but you can easily see his influence over the world. 

IMO, Satan is that little voice inside everyone that says: "There are no consequences for your actions.  Go apeshit." 

If this were a perfect world, going apeshit might be acceptable.  But this ain't no perfect orld.  You are tied to a bunch of separate egos and everything you do effects them.  You have to let this realization overcome Satan's advice. 

Quote:

Maybe you are right, I don't really see myself as a victim. That's your choice, too.




:rolleyes:  give me a fuckin break.  I chose to be a victim.  I invited a bunch of thugs over to my house and told them to take all my money, gangbang my girlfriend, and take a piss over all my work. 

I mean come on, when you see some 10 year old kid crying because some crackhead stole his bike, do you think :"Well, that kid chose that, its his fault."  Hell no!  You think : "Man, I hope they get the asshole that chose to take that kid's bike and buy crack with it instead of getting a job and buying his crack with earned money, like a responsible human being." 

Quote:

I guess prayer and meditation is my way of acting. What do you suggest? It isn't really feasible to go over to Africa and give everyone a big sandwich. Or kill people who you think are wrong. That is more like being a tool in the hand of your devil, wouldn't you say? Jesus wouldn't go around killing people or telling people to fuck off because they are evil. Why should any Christian do the same?




prayer and meditation seem like your way of acting irresponsible to me. 

We may not be able to give everyone in Africa a big sandwich, but we can consume less sandwiches.  We can not waste the earth's resources so that there are plenty to go around!  Seriously, doesn't it seem wrong to you, how fat people are in this country when compared to the emaciated children of Africa?  Don't you realize that's cause and effect? 

It doesn't so much piss me off that Americans have wealth, but that they squander it on things that are unimportant.  While more important deeds remain undone.  People who overindulge while their neighbor starves to death are fucking repulsive to me.  Where is the empathy in that? 

And yes, actually Jesus did tell people off.  The money changers in the temple for instance.  He lit a fire underneath the Pharisees' asses! 

And hey, Jesus may not have killed people, but if I ever saw a girl getting raped in a back alley, I wouldn't let Jesus's example stop me from cutting the guy's dick off with my trusty switchblade.  Jesus was a great guy and he did a good job for that particular life, but you said yourself that there is no objective right and wrong, so maybe its time for the Godly to stop forgiving, stop turning the other cheek, and stand up and fight for what is right! 

We wouldn't even exist in a country where we are free to have this conversation if men with balls hadn't stood up and valiantly fought against tyranny and opression to found this great nation. 




Anyway, my main point is simply this:  You have a Higher Destiny and a Lower Fate. 

Your Higher Destiny will not be handed to you.  You must earn it through patience, self-sacrifice, love, and rightful actions. 

If you do not achieve your Higher Destiny, you will be subject to your Lower Fate.  Lower Fates don't tend to be pretty.  Live up to your Destiny, or be subject to your Fate. 

"Time has taken its toll on you
the lines that crack your face.
Famine your body it has worn through
Withered in every place
Pestilence for what you have to endure
For what you have put others through.
Death- deliverance, for you for sure,
Now there's nothing you can do."


Edited by DoctorJ (06/30/06 09:46 PM)


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