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Offlinebarfightlard
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Since America cares so much for others
    #5609722 - 05/09/06 06:11 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Why hasn't she done anything for Darfur, which is FAR worse off under their government than Iraqis were. No profit to be made or no strategic military positioning with limited resistence from the puppet government to be installed?

http://www.shoutwire.com/viewstory/11864/Darfur_A_Genocide_We_Can_Stop


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"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


Edited by bellylard (05/09/06 06:13 PM)


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: barfightlard]
    #5609773 - 05/09/06 06:27 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

One of the main arguments used for slamming the resumption of hostilities in Iraq was that Hussein was "contained" -- that he was no longer any danger to anyone other than Iraqis, therefore it was up to Iraqis and no one else to deal with him.

If you could explain how the Sudanese government is a danger to anyone outside Sudan's borders, perhaps we could discuss it further. But if America is supposed to learn from its "mistakes" (assuming the resumption of hostilities in Iraq was a mistake), then asking America to interfere with Sudan's internal politics seems more than a tad contradictory.



Phred


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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: Phred]
    #5609836 - 05/09/06 06:52 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Well, the latest main reason for going into Iraq was to free it's people from a brutal regime, so why haven't the USA helped out nations in even worse conditions(especially since they are much weaker than Iraq was). Why did Iraq recieve this "help" over all of the others?


--------------------

"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole

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Posts: 81,741
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: barfightlard]
    #5609919 - 05/09/06 07:09 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Because their leader was an out of control war mongering shit bag with a history of invading other countries and assisting terrorists. He was also under obligation to adhere to an inspection regimen which he defied.


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Invisibledownforpot
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Posts: 5,715
Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: barfightlard]
    #5609941 - 05/09/06 07:15 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

bellylard said:
Why hasn't she done anything for Darfur, which is FAR worse off under their government than Iraqis were. No profit to be made or no strategic military positioning with limited resistence from the puppet government to be installed?

http://www.shoutwire.com/viewstory/11864/Darfur_A_Genocide_We_Can_Stop




Haven't you been watching the news? UN is on it's way, with the US ambassador leading the way.

By the way, Shell drills in Sudan... Heh.


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http://www.myspace.com/4th25


"And I don't care if he was handcuffed
Then shot in his head
All I know is dead bodies
Can't fuck with me again"


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Registered: 06/15/02
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: barfightlard]
    #5610011 - 05/09/06 07:27 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Africa is a mess.  I say let them kill each other.    :shrug:


Edited by RandalFlagg (05/09/06 07:27 PM)


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OfflineDavid_vs_Goliath
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Registered: 04/01/06
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5610190 - 05/09/06 08:00 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

thats embaressing


--------------------
"People living deeply have no fear of death."
"Love the animals, love the plants, love everything. If you love everything, you will perceive the divine mystery in things. Once you perceive it, you will begin to comprehend it better every day. And you will come at last to love the whole world with an all-embracing love."
"Our problems are man-made, therefore they may be solved by man. No problem of human destiny is beyond human beings."


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: barfightlard]
    #5610343 - 05/09/06 08:33 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Well, the latest main reason for going into Iraq was to free it's people from a brutal regime, so why haven't the USA helped out nations in even worse conditions(especially since they are much weaker than Iraq was). Why did Iraq recieve this "help" over all of the others?




Do you believe the US was right to come to the aid of the Iraqis being held hostage by Hussein's Ba'athist thugs? No, you don't. Why then do you think the US should make the same "mistake" twice? Aren't nations supposed to learn from their mistakes?



Phred


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OfflineDavid_vs_Goliath
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: Phred]
    #5610412 - 05/09/06 08:51 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

considering the case in Sudan is different and sepereate rebel groups and the case in Iraq was a large nation under a tyrant with money and power. I think they are two completely different situations. I think we deffinatly should be there.


--------------------
"People living deeply have no fear of death."
"Love the animals, love the plants, love everything. If you love everything, you will perceive the divine mystery in things. Once you perceive it, you will begin to comprehend it better every day. And you will come at last to love the whole world with an all-embracing love."
"Our problems are man-made, therefore they may be solved by man. No problem of human destiny is beyond human beings."


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OfflineSirTripAlot
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: Phred]
    #5610420 - 05/09/06 08:53 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Is it a bad thing that the USA is giving money to people in need?


I thought the liberals would love this wasting of my tax money....

Whats to say that the warlords over there, will not hold the food for political/ territorial gain....just like Somalia?


--------------------
“I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”


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OfflineTheCow
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Registered: 10/28/02
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: Phred]
    #5610498 - 05/09/06 09:13 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Show me the mass genocide of people that was currently going on in the Iraq regime and I will buy your argument. The reason for war was WMD's let us remember, not because he was murdering people, that came afterwards. So please point out the genocide that was ongoing when we went into Iraq.


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InvisibleGijith
Daisy Chain Eater

Registered: 12/04/03
Posts: 2,400
Loc: New York
Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: barfightlard]
    #5610526 - 05/09/06 09:23 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

How does a country 'care' exactly?


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what's with neocons and the word 'ilk'?


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OfflineEquilibriuM
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Registered: 07/17/05
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: Gijith]
    #5610640 - 05/09/06 09:58 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

A country is just a word for a bunch of people that occupy a piece of land.... So saying a country cares, is saying the people that live in this one area of land "care" - Or the people that control the people of this one piece of land "care"


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HELP!!!!!!!!!


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Registered: 10/03/04
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: barfightlard]
    #5610758 - 05/09/06 10:28 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I thought Canada was going to HELP with Darfur??????????

Maybe they backed out because it could turn into a Quagmire.....

They are OIL RICH... maybe we (USA) could help.

Noooooo the liberal CUNTS would only say we are helping for Halliburton.....


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America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Invisibledownforpot
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Registered: 06/25/01
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: lonestar2004]
    #5610789 - 05/09/06 10:35 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

LOL. Shell drills in Sudan. Gives the money to the Muslim government, which then kills the Christians. LOL.

So if we start boming Sudan, we will be basically funding the war on both sides, :smile:

Since US is a world power, it is expected to help. So don't even bring up Canada. Also, the American people will only give a fuck about something when it is on their television sets and if you haven't noticed, Sudan/Darfur has been all over the TV recently. So Bush got up and said "OMG, we got a genocide on our hands."


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http://www.myspace.com/4th25


"And I don't care if he was handcuffed
Then shot in his head
All I know is dead bodies
Can't fuck with me again"


Edited by downforpot (05/09/06 10:40 PM)


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OfflineSirTripAlot
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: downforpot]
    #5612455 - 05/10/06 12:16 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

downforpot stated :Also, the American people will only give a fuck about something when it is on their television sets and if you haven't noticed,



At least we do something, there are plenty of other nations, that see it on their TVs and do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.


--------------------
“I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”


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Offlinededjam
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: SirTripAlot]
    #5612485 - 05/10/06 12:21 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

SirTripAlot said:
downforpot stated :Also, the American people will only give a fuck about something when it is on their television sets and if you haven't noticed,



At least we do something, there are plenty of other nations, that see it on their TVs and do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.




Thats because they are all sitting on thier asses thinking "hmmm the united states should do something about that" We are expected by the rest of the world to police and financially support half the world, even if they dont agree with us...but as soon as we do, we are the bad guys. Amazing.


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OfflineRonoS
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: zappaisgod]
    #5612562 - 05/10/06 12:37 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Because their leader was an out of control war mongering shit bag with a history of invading other countries and assisting terrorists.




Your description sounds suspiciously familiar for some reason.


--------------------
"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"


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Invisibledownforpot
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: SirTripAlot]
    #5612765 - 05/10/06 01:36 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

SirTripAlot said:
downforpot stated :Also, the American people will only give a fuck about something when it is on their television sets and if you haven't noticed,



At least we do something, there are plenty of other nations, that see it on their TVs and do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.




They can't do much. Our country has the most wealth. We can pretty much help anyone we want to without it being a financial strain on us.


--------------------



http://www.myspace.com/4th25


"And I don't care if he was handcuffed
Then shot in his head
All I know is dead bodies
Can't fuck with me again"


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Offlinequillini
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Re: Since America cares so much for others [Re: Phred]
    #5612841 - 05/10/06 01:56 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Phred said:
One of the main arguments used for slamming the resumption of hostilities in Iraq was that Hussein was "contained" -- that he was no longer any danger to anyone other than Iraqis, therefore it was up to Iraqis and no one else to deal with him.

If you could explain how the Sudanese government is a danger to anyone outside Sudan's borders, perhaps we could discuss it further. But if America is supposed to learn from its "mistakes" (assuming the resumption of hostilities in Iraq was a mistake), then asking America to interfere with Sudan's internal politics seems more than a tad contradictory.



Phred




OK, let me try to put this as clearly as I can. You'll probably call me a hyprocrite, but try to follow me here:

I don't think it was wrong for the US to oust Saddam. Under the right circumstances, with the right planning, for the right reasons, it would have been sweet. What I always had a problem with was the way the war was prosecuted. Iraq was branded as part of this ill-defined "War on Terrorism" thing, when it actually had nothing to do with terrorism at all. So we invade Iraq with no postwar planning, meaning reconstruction by default would be our problem. In light of the terrorist insurgency, if you want to call it that, we had thus confined our battlefront to the borders of one country. When the problem we were trying to address spanned over several countries, it is easy to see how occupying Iraq immediately put us at a disadvantage. So now terrorists can come into Iraq from Iran, Syria, and Saudi Arabia, shoot our guys with RPGs and plant a bunch of IEDs and so forth, do their damage, and return home to prepare for another strike. This is a bad position, and we are now essentially playing whack-a-mole with these people.

Again, if we weren't in the middle of a global aniterrorism campaign, I would have been all for invading Iraq. If Bush said "it's time to get rid of Saddam Hussein because he's just a fucker", he would have had me from the word go. But instead he just told a bunch of lies about WMDs, "misunderestimated" the sectarian conflict that was bound to happen after the fall of the Saddam regime, and labeled anybody who asked questions as unpatriotic. Saddam was indeed contained, but the only reason that fact was used to slam the war was because the opposite claim (that Saddam was an imminent threat) was the rationale being used to go to war. If you want to topple Saddam just because he's a fucker, I'm right with you. But instead we got hoodwinked into it, and that is inexcusable.

Please remember, at the time it was all about the WMDs. That's all anyone was thinking about. Post-9/11, that was quite a potent argument, that our security here at home was at stake. I don't begrudge Bush for being a warmonger so much as a fearmonger. He spun the Iraq thing like it was part of 9/11. That was the most offensive thing about it. Even in the debates with Kerry, when it was suggested that we invaded for no reason (and just to be fair, it was a suggestion made by that fucker Kerry that voted for it himself), Bush responded "they hit us first", obviously referring to 9/11.

My point is that, though the invasion itself might have been morally justified, the timing and planning of it were horrible and the reasons for it were all wrong. You might say the end justifies the means but that simply does not fly. With the proper planning and perspective, many aspects of our present hardship could have been avoided. Great strategic mistakes have been made because only a few points of view on it were even considered. There was never any level-headed, rational discussion, because everybody was scared out of their minds thinking Saddam was going to attack us.

So I fully support intervention in Darfur, so long as it's planned out and done for right and consistent reasons. On the same note, I also think the fundie regime in Iran should be toppled. We would have been much better off with Saddam and without Iran than we are presently with the situation reversed.


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No; truth, being alive, was not halfway between anything. It was only to be found by continuous excursions into either realm, and though proportion is the final secret, to espouse it at the outset is to insure sterility.

Only connect...


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