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OfflineSDP
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Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate?
    #5597414 - 05/06/06 12:27 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

So yea... I have a family member who's a rich, white, repuclican, typical "grew up christian, say im christian but never really act christian, but i went through a christian TV phase during my midlife crisis" george-bush loving texan...

However, her years of perpetually being the BIGGEST bitch i know and b/c of that, always stressed out, she now has an immunodeficiency disorder (fibromyalgia) which makes you always hurt + get sick really eassily. So shes leaves the house like once every few months (been mainly stuch at home the last 4-5 years), doesnt do ANYTHING, just gets sick, goes through sick cycles, and obviously faces EXTREME depression. Although one side of me thinks "she deserves it, this is just karma feeding her a sweet spoon full of justice" i cant see anyone i have to care about (especfially someone that DOES have a great good side) suffer that much...

Cant get her to exercise, eat right, or take anything besides her presciption pharms... however i think a lot of positive things would stem from basic meditaion. Starting at the core.

As you can tell this is bound to be a difficult situation.. Shes open to yoga, but thinks anything based around meditaiton is "evil" or the "key to opening up your path to satan" although shes been MORE open to MAYBE considering it (trying to get her to attend an instructional sitting at a Zen center), but whenever she does she schitz'es out and is like "Im not going ANYWHERE if they dont claim jesus christ as their lord and savior! I have the right to believe how i want to believe and not go to these places where htey worship other gods!" She is too ignorant to know that all "temples" arnt the same, and that Zen isnt about religion, and its perfectly applicable principles to her christianity.

Anyone have any ideas or have worked with someone similiar? It seems EXTREMELY hard to get someone like this to do something good for themselves, just to do anything period, but much less something they are scared about. Any comments on approachs of these kind of people, or any paths taken to guide such a close minded christian into practicing meditaiton as apart of their spirituality. Thanks!

-SDP  :wink:


--------------------
Teonanacatl, open up my eyes
This sacrament, this prayer, beyond the world of lies
Guide me clearly through that which I dont understand
Give me strength to find the path
Help me fight any demons as you flow through me wholely
This is my prayer, that you protect me from evil, and bring me closer to peace
And open up my eyes, so i can see things as you do
Amen


Edited by SDP (05/06/06 12:28 PM)


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OfflineDoctorJ
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Re: Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate? [Re: SDP]
    #5597494 - 05/06/06 01:09 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

the road to god is rocky and treacherous

so what must we do?

we must pave it!

for the easier it is to get to god

the easier the seeker finds

and the guilty are forgiven


--------------------
'You can go to a hospital
Get yourself cleaned out.'


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OfflineDoctorJ
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Re: Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate? [Re: SDP]
    #5597519 - 05/06/06 01:22 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

also, you might refer her to the tao teh ching by lao tzu

for the TAO is an acronym. It stands for True Alpha Omega

the Tao is the way of Jesus Christ

anyone who truly knows christ

must also know Tao!

the tao teaches that water is the highest goodness

water flowed from jesus's wounds when he was on the cross

water is soft and yielding

but it carved the grand canyon!

the soft and the weak

overcomes the hard and the strong

this is the Way of christ

christ is unimportant, indeed he considers himself so

what is important is the Way


--------------------
'You can go to a hospital
Get yourself cleaned out.'


Edited by DoctorJ (05/06/06 01:25 PM)


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Invisiblemoog
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Registered: 02/15/05
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Re: Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate? [Re: SDP]
    #5597559 - 05/06/06 01:37 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

This kind of thing can be a delicate situation. When you're trying to get someone to think in new and different ways, subtlety is paramount. If there is not subltety, you will encounter resistance from the ego. Subtlety is like sneaking ideas into someone's mind through the back door, without the ego seeing it as a threat to its existence.

The best thing you can do for this person is to be a living example for them. Be your highest and purest essence, that part of you that stretches into the higher realms of consciousness. Drown those around in you in your light. But do not force the issue in a personal way. Be mindful of your own ego. Your ego is the part of you that judges something as good or bad, desirable or undesirable. You are living one way, they are living another way. It's ultimately their choice if they are to change.

One more thing:
Quote:

I have a family member who's a rich, white, repuclican, typical "grew up christian, say im christian but never really act christian, but i went through a christian TV phase during my midlife crisis" george-bush loving texan.



Judging and labeling people in this way does not help the situation. All you had to say was, "I have a family member who's a human being." Reach out to this person's humanness. She and you are more similar than you are different. When you stop focussing on the differences and begin to focus on your similarity of being, the solution of what you can do to expand her way of thinking will come to you more easily.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate? [Re: SDP]
    #5598914 - 05/06/06 10:48 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

You can only help those who truly want help.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5599078 - 05/06/06 11:42 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
You can only help those who truly want help.




--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineDeviate
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Re: Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate? [Re: Icelander]
    #5599295 - 05/07/06 12:48 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

you can lead a man to water but you cannot make him drink


Edited by Deviate (05/07/06 12:49 AM)


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InvisibleLakefingers

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Re: Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate? [Re: Deviate]
    #5600152 - 05/07/06 06:37 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Teach her how to each pears in the sunshine...


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OfflineLazyCrash
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Re: Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate? [Re: Lakefingers]
    #5604554 - 05/08/06 01:05 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

I'm not that well-versed in the Bible...but maybe there are some quotes that may lead her to believe that meditation is an acceptable part of her religion? Anyone?

I mean, come on, people use Bible quotes to back anything up nowadays.


--------------------
:mallow:


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Offlinefresh313
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Re: Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate? [Re: LazyCrash]
    #5604601 - 05/08/06 01:24 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

in some places the doctors perscribe meditation

they give u a picture to go home and meditate on

the theory is, u will get to a different level, vibrational space, plane, where your illness no longer exists.


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate? [Re: SDP]
    #5604662 - 05/08/06 01:41 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate?



Don't.


--------------------


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OfflinejustAkid
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Re: Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate? [Re: SDP]
    #5607027 - 05/09/06 01:12 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Kind of off-topic, but there's a new drug that came out called Lyrica that helps fibromyalgia. It treats nerve pain. The first one out that treats nerve pain. Narcotics don't treat amped up nerve pain and they make you dazed. It's really helped my mom. Also Love is Christ's message. People tend to forget that.


--------------------
Trust thyself.


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InvisibleFreedomFight
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Re: Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate? [Re: justAkid]
    #5608200 - 05/09/06 12:42 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Wow, this is a lot like my mom (except my mom is definately NOT a bitch). I have come to the conclusion that it can't be, and possibly shouldn't be, done. Prayer and meditation are like one in the same (prayer just focuses on an external being). If you can't get her to meditate then try getting her to pray for 10+ minutes. If she can just focus on the idea of God and His ultimate power and justice for an extended period of time then I feel it would be just as helpful.
Instead, I feel the problem is that she doesn't pray/meditate and already is depressed (naturally, from the cronic fatigue). If you truly care then you will help her seek happiness within her own faith through prayer. Perhaps if you can get her praying then you can try to talk about the similarities between the two to shift her views.


--------------------
I do not grow anything illegal.
I do not sell anything.
I am, however, a very curious individual.
I also try to be helpful.


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OfflineJCoke
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Re: Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate? [Re: FreedomFight]
    #5608567 - 05/09/06 02:30 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

what freedomfight said brings up a good point.

I heard from listening to one of ajahn bram's talks on meditation, that some people don't just focus on the breathe, but rather, they fill there head with a color like "blue" or "yellow" and just focus on that, or some people focus on a concept like "peace" or "love" or something like that.

so why don't you suggest to her to focus on God? or Jesus? or God's love and mercy? or Jesus's love and sacrifice?

or how about meditating on the lord's prayer?:

'Our Father in heaven,
  hallowed be your name,
your kingdom come,
  your will be done
      on earth as it is in heaven.
Give us today our daily bread.
Forgive us our debts,
      as we also have forgiven our debtors.
And lead us not into temptation,
  but deliver us from the evil one.


or the Beatitudes?:

Blessed are the poor in spirit,
      for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are those who mourn,
      for they will be comforted.
Blessed are the meek,
      for they will inherit the earth.
Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness,
      for they will be filled.
Blessed are the merciful,
      for they will be shown mercy.
Blessed are the pure in heart,
      for they will see God.
Blessed are the peacemakers,
      for they will be called sons of God.
Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness,
      for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.


would that not work?

:mushroom2: peace  :mushroom2:


--------------------
hello, your name is life on earth
------------------------------------

"I traveled a long way seeking God, but when I finally gave up and turned back, there He was, within me! O Lalli! Now why do you wander like a beggar? Make some effort, and He will grant you a vision of Himself in the form of bliss in your heart." -the saint of the Kashmir Shaivism tradition: Lalli.


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Offlineleery11
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Re: Help! How to get a middle-aged christian white republican yuppie to meditate? [Re: JCoke]
    #5636973 - 05/16/06 12:46 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

the Gospel of Thomas?

The Kingdom of Heaven is within. Christ is within.

Christ is not in the TV.... that's the anti-christ by default (if there is such a thing.) Christ is not in the whitehouse, if so he would at least by on TV crying saying "I don't want to go to war, this is the worst thing a human can ever possibly do, but there is no other choice." for surely a man with the Holy Spirit would not say things like God wants me to go to war.... these people are "evil" etc.

A man would say "this is a terrible choice to make but it seems the best option. We must wish these terrorists love and compassion."

Christ is not found through the whitehouse.

Because Christ is found within, your body IS a Temple of God..... and to desecrate it with unhealthy living means that it is not likely that God will ever want to dwell in you and give you what he has to offer....... mildewed and smouldering, fundamental differing...... i know the pieces fit cause i watched them fall away........ doomed to crumble lest we grow.

No you can't defile your temple if you want Christ. You just have to put forth effort. Evertyhing about Christianity is in support of meditation, for what more is meditation than cutting forth all loose ends, all dogmas, all that which is UNTRUE and finding the one single thing that is true? This is your God right there, inside you waiting to be cultivated.

It is your mustard seed, are you going to plant it in soil or neglect it ? TV is idolatry. You spend more time in communion with TV than you do with Christ..... it's just a given.

All these things should be abundantly clear to anyone attempting to follow in the ways of Jesus.... however they aren't. Your plight is one suffered by many...... the religion of America is a religion of injustice, apathy, lethargy, greed, avarice, hatred, and war. This does not mean that this is what Christianity is supposed to be..... it just means that authorities blasphemed against Christ long ago and used his teachings to spread hate.

And they are still doing so.

Your friend is lost .... and I don't know what to say. All I know is that take that which is abundantly true to you, and speak it to her. Speak truely of Christ to the best of your ability, which is what I'm trying to do.

I don't know Jesus... i haven't been overcome with his love.... except on LSA...... I'm doubtful. But I do know, that they are right. He's within YOU. That you have to go looking.

And I do know, that the life we are supposed to live, is not the life most materailistians live. I do know that you cannot support war and be a follower of Christ. You cannot support the atrocities of the US government (which are numerous) and be a follower of Christ. You cannot pollute your mind with television and improper diet and lethargy and be a follower of Christ.

Can you be engaged in politics, watch educational documentaries, exercise a lot, eat well, enjoy the occasional program on the television...... feel compassion for Bush.... and be a follower of Christ? Well, I think so perhaps. It depends on how ascetic you are supposed to be...... the middle way is good, conducive for peace. But this is not a middle way.

We are whores and junkies and sluts...... slaves to the media. Adultery is committed in the mind isn't it? Well .... gee just look at EVERY COMMERCIAL ON TV.... half naked women selling just about any product you can imagine. For me personally I don't have a hard time looking at real women and not lusting after them, but I lust after women on the TV like crazy.... TV women elicit strong craving and suffering in me, because they are prostitutes. They have sold their bodies for money and are selling products through sexual suggestion.

Every woman on TV acting like that is basically saying "I will sleep with you" and I don't think that's right.

I mean, my libido thinks that's right. But it just brings me undue great and numerous suffering craving that which I cannot have, and reinforces me to be a depraved sex focused pervert in real life. Which I am not at all.

Sometimes you have to be forceful to get people to see. But I think the best way is by setting example. Take the plank out of your eye, then work on her plank.

Psychedelics were my answer, to realizing how evil the world is. But it was a HARD ride tons of bad experiences and being in misery.

I'm not even sure that Christianity is the right way to go.... the only thing is "Christ" and that is necessary, but it might not be like everyone thinks it is, with some deity waiting to greet you..... it might be that YOU have to BECOME Christ through a period of tribulation and deep soul searching... afterall he said to his disciples that they must take up a cross and follow him.

So I mean..... it's not about what you can't do.... what's wrong. It's about what's right. It's okay for her to be who she is.... she just needs to get in tune with CHRIST and the bad stuff will start fixing itself on its own.... so you know I would just try and teach her about how beneficial meditation can be, and how living a life with Jesus means not being so connected to the dramas and distractions of this world.... how it's actually kind of "sinful"
but you can't really convince people to stop watching TV by saying it's evil, can you? I say it's evil all the time and people don't receive it very well.

Find that which is right and you will have the strength to overcome that which is wrong. Most people aren't in tune with metta, with Christ-consciousness, with uncondtiional love and forgiveness and compassion. With the Holy Spirit... with mindfulness...... with the eightfold path.... with the middle way. With the Tao.... with God. With Allah. With Buddhas and Boddhisattvas and the Sangha...... with nature. With Earth. With Gaia. With Peace. With Love.

They are tuned into AMERICA through MEDIA...... and the most important thing I know about this, that I can't seem to explain to people that don't know it already... is that when your mind is tuned into media frequencies, it is a distracted plagued mind.... it is INCAPABLE OF REST and MEDITATION IS THE SOLUTION.

silence. What happened to silence? There is no silence, everywhere you go you take noise with you. And you go home and rest to the whitenoise of the radiation box. Such a mess.


--------------------
I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo!

....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human......
Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!


Edited by leery11 (05/16/06 12:54 PM)


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