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palmersc
Stranger
Registered: 02/23/06
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Loc: Arkansas
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Nigger
#5590961 - 05/04/06 06:12 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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I was in some other dudes dorm and his roommate walked in making a ton of noise. I said chill out nigga. Well he's black and he got pissed. I admit my word choice might not have been the best, but it's not something I gave a lot of thought to.
I left and went to return some movies and thought about it. I concluded that the hate was within him. I went back and wanted to talk about it but he sat there pissed off and didn't want to talk. I reasoned that no matter how justified you feel in this hate, you need to let go of it. Even more I said that if a word causes you to manifest that much hate for somebody you don't even know, there's some growing that needs to be done. He didn't want to talk about it and I tried to reason that this feeling of separation is because of that.
His response was that I had no idea what it's like. I guess I have an enemy now. Don't really know what to do. I guess nothing. I make an effort not to take anything personally.
I know the word originated out of hatred, but many cling to this. I'd like another perspective since I haven't given a lot of thought to it.
Edited by palmersc (05/04/06 06:13 PM)
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mr_kite
The Watcher
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Re: Nigger [Re: palmersc]
#5590983 - 05/04/06 06:19 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Whether you meant it as an insult or not the fact is that the word is insulting. You don't say "cunt" to a girl, you don't say "nigger" to a black person. It's not about hate. Unfortunately you may have just come across as a bit of a tit.
If he hates you becauase you called him nigger then that's unreasonable. But I doubt he hates you. But I don't think being pissed off is unreasonable.
-------------------- let yourself be silently drawn by the stronger pull of what you really love
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DoctorJ
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Re: Nigger [Re: palmersc]
#5590990 - 05/04/06 06:20 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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the word 'nigger' is only offensive because it is percieved as such
those who are offended by it are the ones who give the word its power to hurt.
"sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me."
Tell your friend's roomates that the human race began in Africa, that all races descended from africans. We are all niggers, and we all have the right to call eachopther as such.
Its not the word, but the intention behind its use that makes it bad or good. If your intentions in using the word were not malicious, you are free from blame.
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mr_kite
The Watcher
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Re: Nigger [Re: DoctorJ]
#5590996 - 05/04/06 06:22 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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You fail to consider social boundaries/laws, which, while often petty and stupid, remain important in many situations.
"If your intentions in using the word were not malicious, you are free from blame. " That's impressively idealistic but I think a bit naieve.
-------------------- let yourself be silently drawn by the stronger pull of what you really love
Edited by mr_kite (05/04/06 06:24 PM)
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CUBErt
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Re: Nigger [Re: mr_kite]
#5591007 - 05/04/06 06:28 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
mr_kite said: You fail to consider social boundaries/laws, which, while often petty and stupid, remain important in many situations.
Yea thats the truth. It is pretty stupid though, I bet his black friends refer to him as that all the time. As I am a big fan of the "make fun of everyone or no one" idea, I similarly think the word should either be okay for everyone to say (as a substitution for the word "dude" etc.) or no one should say it, if it really does bring to mind "that much hatred" (which I think is melodramatic if someone uses the word with one group of people but not the other).
-------------------- -CUBErt
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Icelander
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Re: Nigger [Re: palmersc]
#5591010 - 05/04/06 06:28 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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You meant no harm. It's up to him if he wants to take offense at anything like this. You are not forcing him to be mad or offended. He has a choice here.
None of us like it when someone is mad at us. It often gives rise to fear. So maybe you want to reason with him because his anger gives rise to some slight fear for you. Maybe you can let go of that and then let it all pass. He will most likely let go of it with time as will you.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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DoctorJ
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Re: Nigger [Re: mr_kite]
#5591018 - 05/04/06 06:31 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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naivetie has served me better than cynicism
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
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Re: Nigger [Re: mr_kite]
#5591036 - 05/04/06 06:37 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
mr_kite said: Whether you meant it as an insult or not the fact is that the word is insulting.
The word is a sound wave and an arrangement of lines. The word has the meaning we give it. If it was not intended as an insult, then it was not an insult. If the person was offended by it regardless, then that is their hang up.
I'd tell him to get over himself.
Quote:
Unfortunately you may have just come across as a bit of a tit.
The black person comes off worse, becoming emotionally upset and resentful of another individual who meant no offense. How irrational.
Quote:
But I don't think being pissed off is unreasonable.
Well let's just see. We have but one moment in which to live. Our existance is defined by this present experience. To think that inflicting a negative emotion upon ourselves and to lessen our awareness of reality by becoming consumed by it is unreasonable is to deny oneself in the ultimate manner. Seriously.
Peace.
-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
Edited by fireworks_god (05/04/06 06:43 PM)
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Fucknuckle
Dog Lover
Registered: 04/24/04
Posts: 6,762
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SO.......... basically your saying this...........Fuck the irrational nigger......I am not responsible for his feelings.......Nice.
the first poster said something hurtful........his intent is not the point and is no excuse one way or another.
The fact is the black guy feelings were hurt. True what he felt is his problem but, the guy who called him a nigga feelings are hurt also. There was a mistake, misunderstanding made and two people are hurt. You cold logic will not work here.......not at all.
To the first poster...........You are right, you should in a few days talk to the guy again. If he won't talk then let it be. Realize your human and that we sometimes make mistakes and can not fix them. Be OK with your self and move on. What happened is no big deal really.
-------------------- What it is, is what it is my Brother. It is as it is, so suffer thru it.
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DoctorJ
Registered: 06/30/03
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I think its about fucking time for black people to get over it already
I hang out with black people all the time and 'nigga' comes out of their mouth about every 3rd word. They sell music with that word all in it. They don't mind white people buying their music and listening to them use that word.
Not only that, but when a black person says:"I can use the word nigga but you can't because you're white", you know what that's called?
RACISM
Maybe us white people should come up with a word the we call eachother that no other race is allowed to use. How well do you think that would go over? But guess, what? White people will never do that, because we aren't that fucking stupid in the first place.
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leery11
I Tell You What!
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Re: Nigger [Re: DoctorJ]
#5591550 - 05/04/06 08:29 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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the next time you see him he'll probably be more chill about it.
it's not the best of things but i can understand letting it slip, especially when it's used CONSTANTLY in pop culture so it doesn't seem as offensive anymore.
-------------------- I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo! ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!
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dr0mni
My Own Messiah
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Re: Nigger [Re: DoctorJ]
#5591649 - 05/04/06 08:48 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
DoctorJ said: I think its about fucking time for black people to get over it already
I hang out with black people all the time and 'nigga' comes out of their mouth about every 3rd word. They sell music with that word all in it. They don't mind white people buying their music and listening to them use that word.
Not only that, but when a black person says:"I can use the word nigga but you can't because you're white", you know what that's called?
RACISM
Maybe us white people should come up with a word the we call eachother that no other race is allowed to use. How well do you think that would go over? But guess, what? White people will never do that, because we aren't that fucking stupid in the first place.
Exactly!
Often I'll be walking down the street on campus and a car will drive by with rap at full volume and "Nigga, Nigga, Nigga" being broadcasted for 100 yards in all directions! AND THIS IS ACCEPTABLE?!!!
Now imagine a car full of white kids screaming "Nigger!" out the windows at the tops of their lungs as they drive through down town. I think it's safe to say that none of us wants to be in that car!
Why the double standard? And what right do blacks have to get upset by a casual "nigga" thrown into conversation much like "dude" is used (as mentioned above), when they themselves use this supposedly "degrading" word on one another with astronomical frequency!?
I call that hypocrisy!
There is a clear difference between "what up, nigga?" and "Fuck you, nigger!"
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
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Re: Nigger [Re: palmersc]
#5591789 - 05/04/06 09:25 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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It is a good policy to always think before acting. If one considers ones actions before acting and accepts the consequences then one can act without fear or second thoughts. If one is experiencing fear or second thoughts it means that by not considering the act you have rejected responsibility for your actions. If you have offended someone you did not intend to offend then tell them so. if they cannot accept it then so be it, your abligation is met. In the future think before opening your mouth. Using ones mouth in an irresponsible manner is the cause of many ass beatings.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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MarkostheGnostic
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Re: Nigger [Re: palmersc] 1
#5591863 - 05/04/06 09:37 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Sorry, but you'll have to grow up and out of your cultural programming. That word needs to die. Only morons continue to use it - morons Black and White, but especially Black. Blacks need to forget its use entirely, but those who use it cling to a pathological past. Whites who use it are always inappropriate as well as stupid as far as I'm concerned. At least with Blacks its like an ethnic telling an ethnic joke - it's only cool if the joke is about your own group, not another's. Nevertheless, the N-word needs to die. Those who keep it alive are essentially ignorant and irresponsible. They are not working for positive change, just wallowing in ignorance like a pig in the mud. Incidentally, my Lady is Black (Nigerian-Jamaican) and we discuss this topic in depth. She concurs with me, and she is a Lady.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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FungusMan
I81U812
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Quote:
MarkostheGnostic said: Incidentally, my Lady is Black (Nigerian-Jamaican)
Technically, she IS half NIGER,lol. Just playing. What about Honky, Cracka, Wetback, Spic, and so on. Its just part of life, no matter where you are in the world. Get over it.
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SneezingPenis
ACHOOOOOOOOO!!!!!111!
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empowering words...... real smart.
Also, great argument about vilifying a word..... its all a really great way to.... just..... really get at the root of the problem? you dig?
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Fospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
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Re: Nigger [Re: palmersc]
#5591982 - 05/04/06 10:14 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
palmersc said: I know the word originated out of hatred, but many cling to this.
"I mean, Lincoln freed the slaves, like, what? 130 years ago. How long does it take to get your act together? "
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Nigger [Re: Fospher]
#5591990 - 05/04/06 10:16 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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It's not easy to know how things really are until you walk in another mans shoes.
You are lumping a whole lot of people together here.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Fospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
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Quote:
fireworks_god said:
Quote:
mr_kite said: Whether you meant it as an insult or not the fact is that the word is insulting.
The word is a sound wave and an arrangement of lines. The word has the meaning we give it. If it was not intended as an insult, then it was not an insult. If the person was offended by it regardless, then that is their hang up.
No. A word is a way to convey an idea, as of today it is currently our best. By telling someone something, I'm not merely making air resonances to vibrate my vocal chords producing a sound, I'm relating a thought. If you started telling a bunch of pizza oven/jew jokes to an Auchwitz survivor, nobody would find it funny, even if you did not mean any harm.
Quote:
I'd tell him to get over himself.
Why don't you follow your own advice, and walk around Southside Chi-town with a sign that says "I HATE NIGGERS" (a la diehard), and tell some thugs that they're just being irrational and get over themselves? Put your theory to test, you know.
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Fospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Registered: 02/09/05
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You think blacks in America are oppressed?
In today's America, being a white male is a disadvantage. The fact that if you're of a different color skin or the wrong gender only puts you behind some guy who isn't as qualified getting ahead through Affirmative Action.
Just here in Chicago, recently some woman's right group sued the fire department saying that there aren't enough woman firefighters. They won, forcing the state to overturn the law, allowing the training for a woman to be easier. Which basically means that a woman going into a burning house will not be as qualified as a standard recruit.
Reverse racism is also racism! Where is the logic in people that are given jobs/education opportunities on the basis of need and not skill?
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Re: Nigger [Re: Fospher]
#5592053 - 05/04/06 10:40 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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You think blacks in America are oppressed?
No I don't. Not anymore then we all are. That wasn't what I was getting at.
I'm saying each man is different. There are no "blacks" just like there are no "whites" in reality. There are just lots of individual people. Some are oppressed maybe and some aren't. When you say whites are this or that you are lumping lots of individuals together and imagining that they are all the same.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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DoctorJ
Registered: 06/30/03
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to me, the word 'nigga' is just a synonym for 'man', 'dude', 'dog', 'fool', 'bro', etc, etc...
The word 'nigger' on the other hand is basically like the equivalent of calling a white person a 'hick' or 'white trash'. Basically, nigger means a low class black person. It is an insult, for sure, but not necessarily an unjust one. When I hear a rap song about mistreating women and conspicuously consuming, I say "That's nigger music." If I heard a country song about the same thing, I would say "That's redneck/white trash music."
My father always told me never to use the word 'nigger' unless my intent was to insult someone.
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CUBErt
Connoisseur ofHallucination
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Re: Nigger [Re: Fospher]
#5592073 - 05/04/06 10:46 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Fospher said: Reverse racism is also racism! Where is the logic in people that are given jobs/education opportunities on the basis of need and not skill?
Agreed entirely. When I was a freshman in high school this black dude who was a senior in one of my classes would always call me "cracka jack." Now I didn't personally mind, it kinda made me chuckle... but it was odd to think what would happen if I responded to him as "mah nigga." Because of the age/size difference I decided not to try and find out. Something that definitely wasn't acceptable though was this militant (black panthers status) black teacher at school who (eventually!) got fired. This kid I know who had him said he would refer to white kids as "crackers" sometimes. And this teacher was the type of guy who would call you a racist if you referred to something like "black magic" or anything totally unrelated that cast the color black in a negative light. I don't think either racism or reverse racism is worse than the other. But I think since racism is generally very socially unacceptable now, we are going to see the more subtle reverse racism come into play more often.
-------------------- -CUBErt
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DoctorJ
Registered: 06/30/03
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Re: Nigger [Re: Fospher]
#5592084 - 05/04/06 10:51 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Reverse racism is also racism!
There is no need to use the term 'reverse racism'. Racism is racism, no matter who commits it. the modifier 'reverse' is unneccessary, and in fact reinforces the stereotype that white people have a monopoly on racism, which is completely untrue. Turn on UPN and see how many white jokes they tell. Sure there are streets where black people can't walk without getting harassed, but there are also streets where white people can't walk without getting harassed.
Here's an unpopular fact:
White people didn't invent slavery and in fact we have done more to end slavery than any other race on the planet. So minorities, you're welcome. Now quit bitching and get your shit together.
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Fospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
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Quote:
Icelander said: When you say whites are this or that you are lumping lots of individuals together and imagining that they are all the same.
Not anymore than the job or the school system - and I never imagined/said that they were all the same.
Also, while I don't believe in race infe/superiority, some races are better than others at certain aspects (and may be worse off than others).
Example in point: Norway is the best country to live in. Norway is also extremely Socialistic - almost a Communist nation. A janitor almost gets the same paycheck as a college professor. The country also has the highest school testing. A student would work just as hard independent of his profession. Why would they do this? Why would they work their ass off knowing they aren't going to make more money? Thing is - they work for the pleasure of the job and the welfare of the people, money is not an aspect.
Would this system work in the States? Fuck no! And that's fine, because the United States is not a homogenic nation whatsoever, it is a country of immigrants. Want to work your ass off 16hours/day as a stock broker and drive the latest beamer? Cool. Want to sit on your ass working 20hours/a week as a pizza delivery boy when you're 40? Cool - you're probably going to get benefits as well.
Different races dont just have different skin color - they are different physiologically as well. And it is an obvious fact that your physiological apearance has a dramatic effect on your persona.
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hot48yearolds
Dharmakaya
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Quote:
Huehuecoyotl said: It is a good policy to always think before acting. If one considers ones actions before acting and accepts the consequences then one can act without fear or second thoughts. If one is experiencing fear or second thoughts it means that by not considering the act you have rejected responsibility for your actions. If you have offended someone you did not intend to offend then tell them so. if they cannot accept it then so be it, your abligation is met. In the future think before opening your mouth. Using ones mouth in an irresponsible manner is the cause of many ass beatings.
I'd have to disagree with this sort of view, i enjoy being more... spontaneous.
-------------------- "Truth is more in the process than in the result." - J. Krishnamurti "We ourselves are not an illusory part of Reality; rather are we Reality itself illusorily conceived." Wei Wu Wei
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Deviate
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Fospher said: Reverse racism is also racism! Where is the logic in people that are given jobs/education opportunities on the basis of need and not skill?
i attended a debate about affirmative action a few months ago. both sides made good points but it was brought up that studies have shown that on resumes where people had ''black sounding names'' they were less likely to get the job than people with white sounding names who had a criminal record. keep in mind they were never interviewed so there wasnt proof they were black. the point of affirmative action is to give qualified black people a chance to perform, not allow unqualified people to take positions over qualified peoole.
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder
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Why don't YOU try to develop some manners, some class, some grace, some maturity instead?
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder
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Re: Nigger [Re: DoctorJ]
#5592979 - 05/05/06 05:44 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Yes...to you that's what you have agreed to allow the word to mean to you because you are programmed like the rest with faulty information. It's not important what YOU have decided a word means, regardless of its bastardized spelling and pronunciation. It is a word that will always be a vehicle for hate no matter how it's used, and by whomever uses it. It is no joke from my perspective that Blacks still hold sufficient self-hatred that they use the word out of familiarity and a participacion mystique - a pre-verbal identification with being Black. It is no joke that Black males seek out White, blue-eyed blonde females as a symbol of their own self-acceptance and the introjected values of White culture. It is no joke that King Kong goes ape for such a female, even though surrounded by Black native women. The same racism from the 1930s found its way into 2006 for the movie remake. Wake Up!
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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OldWoodSpecter
waiting
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Re: Nigger [Re: DoctorJ]
#5592987 - 05/05/06 05:51 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
DoctorJ said: the word 'nigger' is only offensive because it is percieved as such
well yea, but what does that change?
Why does a dog bite you when you hit him with a stick? Because he was programed to respond like that. So what do you do? Go around telling everyone how the dog is responsible for his own reactions, or simply try avoiding to provoke him next time?
The fact is some black people get offended by the word, so you have a choice, to offend them or not
-------------------- I descend upon your earth from the skies I command your very souls you unbelievers Bring before me what is mine
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goobler
Reanimated
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Posts: 48,909
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Re: Nigger [Re: DoctorJ]
#5593001 - 05/05/06 06:05 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
DoctorJ said:
Maybe us white people should come up with a word the we call eachother that no other race is allowed to use. How well do you think that would go over? But guess, what? White people will never do that, because we aren't that fucking stupid in the first place.
yes we do, its called superiority
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JacquesCousteau
Being.
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Re: Nigger [Re: palmersc]
#5593037 - 05/05/06 06:41 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Your use of the word was unintentional, and you meant it in a way that had no malicious intent.
That being said, he still has "the right" to get mad because he is a human being and he has the right to feel how he wants to feel.
You then went on to tell him how wrong HE was, even though you're calm and rational and he is still steaming mad. What do you want to accomplish here? This is an approach that will only raise his temp.
Anyone who has ever had a debate with an over-emotional person should know that over-emotional people tend to have a defense mechanism that kicks in, acting like a wall that will not receive any logic that comes from whom they are being shielded.
You will never change his mind if you do not first soften his defenses. In other words, you need to approach it like: "Look man, I thought about what happened between us, and I just wanted to apologize. That whole thing didn't need to take place... it's not a word I use regularly, and it just sort of happened."
If that doesn't get him to lose the hostility (Which should be your primary goal right now, NOT changing his mind about the subject) then I would just stop trying to talk to him.
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Asante
Omnicyclion prophet
Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 87,229
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Re: Nigger [Re: palmersc]
#5593039 - 05/05/06 06:43 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Take responsibility for the fact that whatever you intended, a thing you did turned to shite.
Its not just a word, its a word with a hideous past. You intended it frivolously but the person who you directed it to took offense. That makes it your problem.
Taking responsibility for the consequences of your own actions. You know this is what you have to do but kinda try to pull a quicky on yourself. No such quickies: do the right thing.
Many responses in this thread are just plain sad
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
Edited by Asante (05/05/06 07:09 AM)
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FungusMan
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Re: Nigger [Re: Asante]
#5593115 - 05/05/06 07:41 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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I get tired of this, "Its not just a word, it has a past" thing. I dont care what anyone says, nigga and nigger are the same thing. Maybe if THEY would stop using that word, then others would follow.IMHO, there is MORE racism from blacks these days than whites. Hell, blacks even have theyre own cable channels. If white people tried to make a channel called White Entertainment Program, it would get shot down like a nazi prayer group at a Jewish Highschool. They even have theyre own colored history month. WTF?
And if a music group throws up theyre fists Black Power style in a video, Its all good. So, since they have all this racism power, dont deny me the right to call them what they call themselves. F ckin niggers,lol.
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Asante
Omnicyclion prophet
Registered: 02/06/02
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Quote:
Maybe if THEY would stop using that word, then others would follow.
Isn't that turning the world on its head? This isn't Alice's Wonderland where words mean what you want them to mean, and where the people you are calling names have to change their ways before you grace them by stopping your insults.
Quote:
dont deny me the right to call them what they call themselves. F ckin niggers,lol.
It's clear where you stand.
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leery11
I Tell You What!
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you realize almost every channel is a white channel, right?
they shouldn't be calling themselves niggers but neither should you, you know what results its going to provoke.
now if you want to sit one down and have a debate with him on the meaning of the word and share your perceptions, cool. but there's no need to throw the word around just because it doesn't bother YOU because it clearly bothers other people......
be careful when using it is all, or don't use it at all. it is not conducive to healing, understanding, or communication and serves as a barrier of separation. always.
its used by blacks as a barrier, it's used by whites as a barrier. your observations are essentially right, it's ridiciulous that they go out of the way to paint themselves the way that they do, and really all it does is create MORE racism against them like "damn all that rap music and them acting deliberately stupid and speaking slowly" or whatever
but its their culture, we don't get them back to having equal cultural status with the rest of us by throwing out their epithets.
-------------------- I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo! ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!
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mr_kite
The Watcher
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Quote:
fireworks_god said:
Quote:
mr_kite said: Whether you meant it as an insult or not the fact is that the word is insulting.
The word is a sound wave and an arrangement of lines. The word has the meaning we give it. If it was not intended as an insult, then it was not an insult. If the person was offended by it regardless, then that is their hang up.
I'd tell him to get over himself.
As I said, that's being naievely idealistic. The word has not only the meaning you give it, but the meaning that society and history gives it. Would you say "fucking cunts" to your grandmother? Could you defend saying "fucking cunts" to your grandmother by saying you intended it with a diferent meaning? Unlikely. As I said, one has to be aware of the bigger picture as unfortunately society and the world in general is not as enlightened and objective as yourself. If you ignore other people's point of view, whether through ignorance or ideals, then that's extremely self-centered.
-------------------- let yourself be silently drawn by the stronger pull of what you really love
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mr_kite
The Watcher
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Quote:
FungusMan said: I get tired of this, "Its not just a word, it has a past" thing. I dont care what anyone says, nigga and nigger are the same thing. Maybe if THEY would stop using that word, then others would follow.IMHO, there is MORE racism from blacks these days than whites. Hell, blacks even have theyre own cable channels. If white people tried to make a channel called White Entertainment Program, it would get shot down like a nazi prayer group at a Jewish Highschool. They even have theyre own colored history month. WTF?
And if a music group throws up theyre fists Black Power style in a video, Its all good. So, since they have all this racism power, dont deny me the right to call them what they call themselves. F ckin niggers,lol.
Consider the thing you are most self-conscious/paranoid about. Maybe you have a disproportionally fat right hand. Maybe you have a huge growth on your chin, that isn't a beard. Of course you could make fun of it, but would you allow someone else to take the piss? This is the same sort of argument. It's all about social awareness, part of being human, part of being a reasonable person.
I know in this forum you can't say anything is right or wrong or good or bad, but Jesus people, calling a black man a nigger and then debating whether he has the right to be offended is a bit anal. Think about it in your head for a while with your reasonable person brain instead of your coldly philosophical brain.
-------------------- let yourself be silently drawn by the stronger pull of what you really love
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Asante
Omnicyclion prophet
Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 87,229
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Re: Nigger [Re: mr_kite]
#5593236 - 05/05/06 08:47 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
I know in this forum you can't say anything is right or wrong or good or bad, but Jesus people, calling a black man a nigger and then debating whether he has the right to be offended is a bit anal. Think about it in your head for a while with your reasonable person brain instead of your coldly philosophical brain.
I have no doubt whatsoever that these good people will say N*gger out loud surrounded by young black men. Because, let's face it, the word is harmless enough and if they take offense it's their problem, right?
Hands up if you read the above paragraph and thought of violence being committed against the white man. Thats racism people. Racism in a thread called N*gger.
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
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LunarEclipse
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Re: Nigger [Re: palmersc]
#5593251 - 05/05/06 08:52 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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"I was in some OTHER dudes room and HIS roommate walked in making a ton of noise. I said chill out nigga." etc etc blah blah blah
All I can say is WOW. Let's think about it from the black guy's perspective. He comes home, already pissed off about something, and some white guy he hardly knows tells him to "CHILL OUT NIGGA". In his own CRIB. THEN, the white guy comes back in a couple of hours and wants to tell him to "let go of HIS hate".
To me, it sounds like the black guy was being nice (or maybe he isn't that big) by not:
1. Kicking you out of his dorm room for being a jerk 2. Kicking your ass first
From your story, perhaps he felt sorry for you and took pity. You don't sound particularly "bright". Or if I am being kind I would say you lack understanding and empathy.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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kotik
fuckingsuperhero
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the word is very charged, and not very well understood by anyone not affected by it.
imagine your family was all holocaust survivors. I imagine you may take "jew" a little more to heart, but its a combination of that persons over-sensitivity, and your lack of sensitivity.
how hard would it have been to say "chill out man"
replace it with some other words
"chill out bitch" "chill out slaveboy" "chill out dumbfuck"
none of these would sound right, so its a little ignorant for you to just assume it's a problem with your friend, when its clearly a problem with you as well, since you don't understand the meaing of the word.
-------------------- No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.
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LunarEclipse
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Re: Nigger [Re: kotik]
#5593306 - 05/05/06 09:15 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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"how hard would it have been to say "chill out man""
Are you responding to my post? If so, did you read it?
What gives the original poster any right to tell this man in his own dorm room that he hardly knows to "Chill OUT MAN!"??
Were it me in that situation FUCK THAT I woulda said who the fuck are you and CYA Beatch get the FUCK OUT OF MY ROOM! Or words to that effect.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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kotik
fuckingsuperhero
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no, my bad i was responding to palmersc
i always use the quickrespond at the bottom though.
i was under the impression they were friends. calling a stranger such a term is WAY out of line, especially in his room.
Im not even sure the point of this post.
-------------------- No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.
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kotik
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Re: Nigger [Re: Fospher]
#5593346 - 05/05/06 09:33 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
In today's America, being a white male is a disadvantage. The fact that if you're of a different color skin or the wrong gender only puts you behind some guy who isn't as qualified getting ahead through Affirmative Action.
hah... words of a true oppressed white man. preach on brother
-------------------- No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.
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Rogues_Pierre
Stranger
Registered: 03/03/06
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Re: Nigger [Re: kotik]
#5593356 - 05/05/06 09:40 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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There's nothing wrong with the word nigger. Its just slang for black person. Negro means black in Spanish. The latin nigrum is used in English such as substatia nigrum (part of brain the generates dopamine) and piper nigrum (black pepper). As you can see the latinized word for black isn't a bad word. It simply refers to the color black.
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Asante
Omnicyclion prophet
Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 87,229
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Quote:
There's nothing wrong with the word nigger. Its just slang for black person. Negro means black in Spanish. The latin nigrum is used in English such as substatia nigrum (part of brain the generates dopamine) and piper nigrum (black pepper). As you can see the latinized word for black isn't a bad word. It simply refers to the color black.
You're using the part of your brain that hasn't been exposed to the real world. Its nice academic discussion but we don't live in the academy, and this thread pertains to an unfortunate real-world event.
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kotik
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Re: Nigger [Re: Asante]
#5593419 - 05/05/06 10:09 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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i wonder if half of the people who post here are just bots, without any experience in reality.
-------------------- No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.
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leery11
I Tell You What!
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Quote:
Rogues_Pierre said: There's nothing wrong with the word nigger. Its just slang for black person. Negro means black in Spanish. The latin nigrum is used in English such as substatia nigrum (part of brain the generates dopamine) and piper nigrum (black pepper). As you can see the latinized word for black isn't a bad word. It simply refers to the color black.
and fuck means fornication under consent of the king but you know what.... people find it offensive.
it isn't about the word, if I said "pie" to someone who was savagely made love to by a peach cobbler..... it would elicit some severe responses...... and imagine if I said "that's a nice piece of pie" in a victims of pie attacks support group....?
You don't call people nigger, because though it is just a word, it is a socially charged word you can call your friends nigger if they don't mind...... even black people if they dont' mind. But you don't just RANDOMLY throw the word around.
I would not deliberately say fuck around a young child or anyone below their teenage years.... I would not deilberately say it around nuns and monks and priests and old people....... I would not go to a preschool class and talk about my experiences with masturbation..... I would not go to a black person and say "nigga" deliberately....
Honestly I might want to, because I've become saturated with the social use of that word and don't even find it that offensive anymore either.... but you have to realize whether or not you agree with it..... words have charge.... to some people fuck hurts. it causes them pain to hear. or cunt imagine a girl who was verbally abused throughout her life and that word brings up trauma to her....
while its true that many if not all words COULD hold damage... words use to discriminate should be spoken with a mindful tongue.
You don't say "what's up chink" or "what's up cracker" or "what's up retard" or "what's up no legs" or "what's up cripple" or "what's up slave"
You just have to be mindful man. Do you really disagree with this? You can do whatever you want but words are more than just collections of sounds..... these sounds have charged meanings deep in the mind of the social unconscious....... nigger is not associated with "negro" it is not associated with the LITERAL meaning it is associated with slavery, discrimination, HATE, and oppression...... it doesn't matter what the dictionary says, it's been used and bastardized as a hateful slur.
It's like the swastika... it's a sacred holy symbol, but the Nazis also used it.... so maybe brandishing a swastika to Jews isn't a great idea, even if you are just wanting to promote Buddhism.
-------------------- I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo! ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!
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RedNucleus
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Re: Nigger [Re: palmersc]
#5593542 - 05/05/06 10:42 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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http://www.ebaumsworld.com/videos/nword.html
racism is screwed up but don't worry it's very easy to figure out. Here's the one and only rule:
Rule number One: All white people are racist and all black people are victims who are justified in their hate.
Yeah. It's the truth. Don't worry about the fact that affirmative action is reverse discrimination. Don't worry about the fact that black people can say and do whatever the hell they want to hurt white people, and with impunity. They deserve it because they are the superior race. Accept it or be burned in your life. Hail Black History Month.
-------------------- Namaste
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palmersc
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Quote:
LunarEclipse said: All I can say is WOW. Let's think about it from the black guy's perspective. He comes home, already pissed off about something, and some white guy he hardly knows tells him to "CHILL OUT NIGGA". In his own CRIB. THEN, the white guy comes back in a couple of hours and wants to tell him to "let go of HIS hate".
To me, it sounds like the black guy was being nice (or maybe he isn't that big) by not:
1. Kicking you out of his dorm room for being a jerk 2. Kicking your ass first
From your story, perhaps he felt sorry for you and took pity. You don't sound particularly "bright". Or if I am being kind I would say you lack understanding and empathy.
You jump to too many conclusions. There was no hate in the room. A minute before we were laughing and telling jokes. I brought this up since I think there's something wrong with the situation. He's black and I'm white. That changes things huh?
I think this sums it up
Quote:
JacquesCousteau said: Anyone who has ever had a debate with an over-emotional person should know that over-emotional people tend to have a defense mechanism that kicks in, acting like a wall that will not receive any logic that comes from whom they are being shielded.
This guy is intelligent, but is blinded by the hate and throwing up the shields. However, I understand we don't live in an ideal world, and that this word is clung to by those who wish to preserve the barrier. Chappelle took a lot of heat from the leaders of the black community. These are the people who are unable to let go of the past and move on. I don't see how things can improve between different countries and creeds with the current mindset. Like that of RedNucleus. Any hate you feel that is justifiable is nothing more than self pity.
This is all easier said than done, but I'll do my part. I am frequently told that I am lacking in tactfulness. People need to get over themselves. It's something I'm working on myself.
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gettinjiggywithit
jiggy
Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
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Re: Nigger [Re: kotik]
#5593723 - 05/05/06 11:32 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
kotik said: i wonder if half of the people who post here are just bots, without any experience in reality.
I wonder that myself a lot. Not just because people read like bots, but because I read something about research on AI being done through places like internet message boards to test believability as a human being, while they work on a believable body. I wish I would've saved the link.
Then I think things like, if the world uses the net for more then half of its socializing and information source, people who may want to manipulate society on a mass scale, could use that technology and not even need to create the more complicated believable human bodies for their AI programs.
(Crazy thoughts I know. Yet, people do crazy things in the vain of seeking power and control over others). Not that I beleive that is actually happening, yet, it could.
Anyway, yes, the act of correcting ones own mis-takes they feel bad about, by correcting the other person and not themselves, during an apology, is common and empty. It really only serves to set up making insensitivity mist-take number two.
It's like choosing to set fire to some guys house and then, apologizing by saying, "I'm sorry your experiencing your loss because your house is made out of wood and flammable materials, dude."
The more people do it to others, the more people start to rebuild their "homes" that pyromaniacs carelessly set afire, with concrete. Then they loose living in the materials that can flex and bend and that are soft. Then they too end up coming across like virtual BOTS up the road.
The makings of a concrete robotic jungle indeed.
I wonder what the psychology is behind believing the way to correct yourself when you realize you made a mis-take, is to tell another they are wrong and thinking, you have made a beneficial self improvement in the process (self correction).
Palmersec,
tell him hes in his right to feel the way he does, it was careless of you to say it and that you are sorry and then stick out your hand as a peace offering. End of story. Move on all the wiser.
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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palmersc
Stranger
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Quote:
gettinjiggywithit said: Palmersec,
tell him hes in his right to feel the way he does, it was careless of you to say it and that you are sorry and then stick out your hand as a peace offering. End of story. Move on all the wiser.
You're right. This is the only solution which makes sense. I am not here to tell people they are wrong just to make myself feel better. Although there may have been some of that unconsciously. That goes back to getting over myself and helping others. However, I cannot help in feeling that nothing good comes out of it. We're back to square 1.
Maybe love can prevail when confronted with hate.
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SirTripAlot
Semper Fidelis
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Re: Nigger [Re: palmersc]
#5593929 - 05/05/06 12:25 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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The group of people that say the word "nigger" the most, are the blacks themselves.
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
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FungusMan
I81U812
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DoctorJ
Registered: 06/30/03
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remember SWAMI?
or should I say, Synthetic Western Analytical Mechanical Intelligence
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Nigger [Re: DoctorJ]
#5594204 - 05/05/06 01:29 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Ah the lovely Swami. Where has he gone?
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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DoctorJ
Registered: 06/30/03
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i dunno
maybe he's getting his emotion chip installed
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Diploid
Cuban
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Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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Re: Nigger [Re: palmersc]
#5594421 - 05/05/06 02:12 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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I concluded that the hate was within him.
Keying your state of offense off a word (especially when no offense was intended) is like basing your self-worth on what someone else thinks of you.
Why would anyone give another such power and control over themselves?
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Nigger [Re: DoctorJ]
#5594456 - 05/05/06 02:23 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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He's gone on to enlightenment. He is now both man and woman, androgynous. He is the one who was prophesied to come. He may walk among you and yet you do not know him.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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kotik
fuckingsuperhero
Registered: 06/29/04
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wait dude... so.. the messiah is a tranny?
pre-op or post-op?
-------------------- No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Posts: 95,368
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Re: Nigger [Re: kotik]
#5594524 - 05/05/06 02:41 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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post I think, that's where he/she's been.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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leery11
I Tell You What!
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Quote:
gettinjiggywithit said:
Then I think things like, if the world uses the net for more then half of its socializing and information source, people who may want to manipulate society on a mass scale, could use that technology and not even need to create the more complicated believable human bodies for their AI programs.
Wow... maybe that's why so many people on here support B ooo sh?
Scary thought actually.
-------------------- I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo! ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!
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Deviate
newbie
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Re: Nigger [Re: leery11]
#5594624 - 05/05/06 03:11 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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In today's America, being a white male is a disadvantage. The fact that if you're of a different color skin or the wrong gender only puts you behind some guy who isn't as qualified getting ahead through Affirmative Action.
this isn't true at all. i attended a debate on affrimative action a while back and this wasn't even used as an argument against it, its been so clearly proven wrong.
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RedNucleus
Causal Observer
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Re: Nigger [Re: Deviate]
#5594657 - 05/05/06 03:24 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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It is easier for black applicants to get into my university than white applicants. There are many scholarships that target a certain race only. NONE are white only.
Whites are disadvantaged through affirmative action by definition. It is very clear cut: blacks get an advantage. That's what affirmative action IS
-------------------- Namaste
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MushmanTheManic
Stranger
Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
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Unfortunately, most blacks grow up in shitty areas with shittier opportunies. Affirmative Action is a backasswards idea to give blacks better opportunies by letting them have better access to universities rather than fixing the root of the problem.
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kotik
fuckingsuperhero
Registered: 06/29/04
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Quote:
Affirmative Action is a backasswards idea to give blacks better opportunies by letting them have better access to universities rather than fixing the root of the problem.
amen. if schools were properly funded, and science, math and etc. were emphasized, it would be a MUCH better step towards progress than addressing the symptoms alone (AA).
-------------------- No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.
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Fospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
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Re: Nigger [Re: kotik]
#5594868 - 05/05/06 04:56 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Feel free to object to anything I said then.
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story
Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
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Swami is now a Swamilita?
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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Deviate
newbie
Registered: 04/20/03
Posts: 4,497
Last seen: 8 years, 6 months
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Quote:
RedNucleus said: It is easier for black applicants to get into my university than white applicants. There are many scholarships that target a certain race only. NONE are white only.
Whites are disadvantaged through affirmative action by definition. It is very clear cut: blacks get an advantage. That's what affirmative action IS
they get an advantage to to offset the disadvantage they had from going to worse school/haivng less money/being discriminated against, etc. in other words, its like a weighted gpa. if you took harder courses than i did but had a lower grade point avergage, it wouldnt necessarily mean i was a more qualified student. also, in places where it was ruled that race could not be used at all as a criteria for admissions, whites were at a disadvantage because asians had better grades.
Edited by Deviate (05/05/06 07:48 PM)
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Deviate
newbie
Registered: 04/20/03
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Quote:
MushmanTheManic said: Unfortunately, most blacks grow up in shitty areas with shittier opportunies. Affirmative Action is a backasswards idea to give blacks better opportunies by letting them have better access to universities rather than fixing the root of the problem.
of course and those that support affirmative action also support fixing the route of the problem but let's be honest with ourselves, the problem is not going to get fixed overnight. until then we may take certain mesures to help end the cycle of povery many blacks are trapped in right now. doing this benefits everyone, not just blacks.
Edited by Deviate (05/05/06 07:46 PM)
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Fospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
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Re: Nigger [Re: Deviate]
#5595927 - 05/05/06 09:48 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Deviate said: this isn't true at all. i attended a debate on affrimative action a while back and this wasn't even used as an argument against it, its been so clearly proven wrong.
If a University/Employer does not meet his quota for the # of blacks; asians; native americans; whatever, he will stop hiring white people. And if at that time, a white job candidate will apply at the same time as a black job candidate, even if the white candidate has better credentials, due to AA, the employer's decision will be overturned to hire the black candidate.
This isn't true? That's the whole premise behind AA!
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Deviate
newbie
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Re: Nigger [Re: Fospher]
#5595957 - 05/05/06 09:55 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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my post was in response to the statement ''In today's America, being a white male is a disadvantage'' and this was proven false so easily that it wasn't even used as an argument by the professor who was completely against affirmative action. he himself said it was false. even with affirmative action, being a white male is a still huge advantage in our society. i wish i had the statistics handy to prove this but obviously i dont remember them now.
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Fospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
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Re: Nigger [Re: Deviate]
#5596004 - 05/05/06 10:10 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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In the example I provided in my previous post, being a white male is clearly a disadvantage.
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Deviate
newbie
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Re: Nigger [Re: Fospher]
#5596042 - 05/05/06 10:21 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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well of course its possible to find a situation wheres its a disadvantage but you stated ''in today's america being a white male is a disadvantage'' and that simply couldn't be further from the truth. the statistics demonstrated that the slight instances where it could work against you did not have any appreciable affect on white males as a whole. being white still worked overwhelmingly in their favor.
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
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Posts: 10,689
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Re: Nigger [Re: Deviate]
#5596058 - 05/05/06 10:25 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Good post Deviate.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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Fospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
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Re: Nigger [Re: Deviate]
#5596238 - 05/05/06 10:56 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
well of course its possible to find a situation wheres its a disadvantage but you stated ''in today's america being a white male is a disadvantage'' and that simply couldn't be further from the truth.
On what occasions is it not the truth?
You're confusing being black with being in poverty. Few establishments this PC day and age will purposely hire whites out of racist causes. FACT: if a black guy and a white guy live in the same neighborhood, as a WHOLE, the black man has a higher chance of getting into any institution.
Quote:
the statistics demonstrated that the slight instances where it could work against you did not have any appreciable affect on white males as a whole.
You keep referring to these statistics as a source, without posting any backing yourself. Real great way to make a foundation for your data.
Where is the remaining percent out of this chart of yours of where being white helps you get into an establishment? And someone's bias opinion that all the major corporations will only hire white people doesn't count.
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Deviate
newbie
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Re: Nigger [Re: Fospher]
#5596329 - 05/05/06 11:17 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Fospher said:
Quote:
well of course its possible to find a situation wheres its a disadvantage but you stated ''in today's america being a white male is a disadvantage'' and that simply couldn't be further from the truth.
On what occasions is it not the truth?
You're confusing being black with being in poverty. Few establishments this PC day and age will purposely hire whites out of racist causes. FACT: if a black guy and a white guy live in the same neighborhood, as a WHOLE, the black man has a higher chance of getting into any institution.
Quote:
the statistics demonstrated that the slight instances where it could work against you did not have any appreciable affect on white males as a whole.
You keep referring to these statistics as a source, without posting any backing yourself. Real great way to make a foundation for your data.
Where is the remaining percent out of this chart of yours of where being white helps you get into an establishment? And someone's bias opinion that all the major corporations will only hire white people doesn't count.
i already posted the statistic that a study found people with resumes that had white sounding names and a criminal record were more likely to be hired than people with resumes that had black sounding names. just the fact that you are suspected of being black already puts you at a worse disadvantage than having a criminal record. i dont have sources because i attended a live debate. my whole point is that the argument that affrmative action is bad because it puts whites at a disadvantage wasn't even made. youre correct in that there is a difference between socioeconomic status and race but the idea that blacks face additional challenges than just being poor.
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Fospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
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Re: Nigger [Re: palmersc]
#5596383 - 05/05/06 11:30 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
i already posted the statistic that a study found people with resumes that had white sounding names and a criminal record were more likely to be hired than people with resumes that had black sounding names.
First of all, an application (unless it's to a government branch) only asks you if you were convicted of a felony (because it's required by law), not if you had a criminal record. Saying that an ex-con will have a better chance than a clean black man just because his name sounds white is ridiculous.
Also, most black guys do have white sounding last names. Any employer who hires someone based on the sound of their name is too small (or stupid) to be included in any AA survey data.
Second of all, there is no foundation to your argument, at all. All you're saying is "Some guy whose opinion matters because he's important said this, and that's what makes this fact". Don't have their information on hand? Recite it, paraphrase it, but give me the barebones of the argument (which means where, when, and how many people surveyed type data, not 'who said what'). Can't remember it? Then don't use it as an argument.
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,689
Loc: On the Border
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Re: Nigger [Re: Deviate]
#5596391 - 05/05/06 11:32 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Once again Deviate, as the whitist white man that ever lived I say you have a good post. I do not need to comment beyond agree with your views. I once lived in poverty. The Egyptian man who ran the local grocery store near the projects (I lived very close to there) gave me a break in price because I was white. He told me this himself....and he was not white but brown.
-------------------- "A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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Deviate
newbie
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Re: Nigger [Re: Fospher]
#5596450 - 05/05/06 11:50 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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First of all, an application (unless it's to a government branch) only asks you if you were convicted of a felony (because it's required by law), not if you had a criminal record. Saying that an ex-con will have a better chance than a clean black man just because his name sounds white is ridiculous.
Devah Pager won the ASA distinguished dissertation award (2002) for finding that Whites with felony criminal records are hired for employment at a rate higher then Blacks with no criminal record. (Even when controlling for SES and educational attainment). (Princeton Sociology) Bertrand and Mullainathan (2002) found that by answering help-wanted ads in Boston and Chicago by sending resumes with “Black-sounding� names and “White-sounding: names that White names elicit 50% more callbacks then Black names and that Whites with higher quality resumes further improve their hiring rate by 30% while Blacks with higher quality resumes have no improvement in hiring. (Chicago School of Economics)
http://72.14.207.104/search?q=cache:2n6M...s&ct=clnk&cd=11
Also, most black guys do have white sounding last names. Any employer who hires someone based on the sound of their name is too small (or stupid) to be included in any AA survey data.
this article suggests there is an appreciable difference in terms of black vs white sounding names:
Blacks, however, have chosen increasingly distinctive names over the past century, with the trend accelerating during the 1960s.
Researchers who have looked at Census records have found that 100 years ago, the 20 most popular names were largely the same for blacks and whites; now only a handful are among the most popular with both groups. Names like DeShawn and Shanice are almost exclusively black, while whites, whose names have also become increasingly distinctive, favored names like Cody and Caitlin..... If nothing else, the first paper, by the NBER's Roland Fryer and the University of Chicago's Steven Levitt, based on California birth data, provides probably the most detailed snapshot yet of distinctive naming practices. It shows, for instance, that in recent years, more than 40 percent of black girls were given names that weren't given to even one of the more than 100,000 white girls born in the state the same year.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/09/29/national/main575685.shtml
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Asante
Omnicyclion prophet
Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 87,229
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Re: Nigger [Re: Fospher]
#5597497 - 05/06/06 11:11 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
this PC day and age
Take a look in this spirituality forum. Then go to the Politics forum. Then go to OTD.
"This day and age" isn't at all Politically Correct, most people here seem to dislike or loathe PC-ness.
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
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BlueRidge
fungus amongus
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Re: Nigger [Re: palmersc]
#5597732 - 05/06/06 01:26 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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for the original poster,
you used a word apt for miscommunication, no one is right or wrong. if you dont want a confusing situation, dont use it around someone you dont know too well.
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Fospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
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Re: Nigger [Re: Asante]
#5599148 - 05/06/06 10:02 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said:
Quote:
this PC day and age
Take a look in this spirituality forum. Then go to the Politics forum. Then go to OTD.
Okay ... is that supposed to be some retort to what I said? And I already do visit those three forums. Them + cult + privacy and security are the only ones worth looking at here.
Quote:
"This day and age" isn't at all Politically Correct, most people here seem to dislike or loathe PC-ness.
Maybe that's because people here are drug users and most represent the counter culture, no wonder they're not agreeing with the masses.
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MushmanTheManic
Stranger
Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
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Re: Nigger [Re: Fospher]
#5599276 - 05/06/06 10:42 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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nigger.
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Stonerguy
I smoke penis
Registered: 05/29/04
Posts: 5,538
Loc: Lost
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"Sticks and stones break your bones, but words cause fucking riots"
So an african american (Has NAACP tried to make this socialably unexceptable yet?) got made because you said nigga? If I am racist for saying that we didn't put blacks into slavary, their own goddamn "brothas" and "sista" sold them to us. If we should give pitty to any race at all it would be indians(the ones from america) and/or jews. Both their races at some point in time have been killed in mass quantities.
Also why the fucking can't everyone be a god damned american? What is with this bulshit where you have to state what race you are almost everyone will have the word american in it, except cacajun....
-------------------- yawn... SG
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Fospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Registered: 02/09/05
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LOL
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Lakefingers
Registered: 08/26/05
Posts: 6,440
Loc: mumuland
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Re: Nigger [Re: Fospher]
#5600211 - 05/07/06 05:48 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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It's easy for you to say all this at a webboard dominated by middle-class whites.
Suprisingly only a few posters have mentioned the emotional level -- the simple thing that the guy was hurt, regardless of what ideological bullshit you, he, or society has about "nigger".
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Mushroom_Mike
AGAPE LOVE
Registered: 02/23/04
Posts: 532
Loc: Australia
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it's just a body. and it's just a word.
the only thing that truly matters is the vibe that is given with the words spoken.
and that's the bottom line in my eyes.
-------------------- always remember.... to respect the fungus!
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Mushroom_Mike
AGAPE LOVE
Registered: 02/23/04
Posts: 532
Loc: Australia
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im half black half white by the way, so fuck ya'll. ill say nigger all i wan and i'll say cracker all i want.
to the white people im a nigger. and to the black people im a white boy. its pretty fuckin gay. its just a mother fucking body to me. ignorant souls make it out like our bodies are who we are, NOPE. sorry. wake the fuck up and see the truth. its just a body. the KKK leaders of today will be your black folks being called niggers of tomorrow. its called karma.
-------------------- always remember.... to respect the fungus!
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
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Re: Nigger [Re: Fospher]
#5600331 - 05/07/06 08:09 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Fospher said: No. A word is a way to convey an idea, as of today it is currently our best. By telling someone something, I'm not merely making air resonances to vibrate my vocal chords producing a sound, I'm relating a thought.
How very observant. The fact remains that the word has the meaning we give it. It is the responsibility of the individual to properly interpret meaning when it is expressed. The word itself has no meaning, it is the context in which it is used and the accompanying body language and manner in which it is expressed.
If it was being proposed as an insult and in a negative context, then the situation would have escalated in a confrontational manner, as the black person would have been offended and the white person would have had the intent of provocation.
Based on the description of the situation, all I see is someone using a word in a non-threatening, non-offensive manner, perhaps with a tinge of humor, and then the other person getting emotionally upset for no reason.
Boo fucking hoo!
Quote:
If you started telling a bunch of pizza oven/jew jokes to an Auchwitz survivor, nobody would find it funny, even if you did not mean any harm.
So now you are the ultimate source on what would and would not be found humorous?
How tragic.
Quote:
Why don't you follow your own advice, and walk around Southside Chi-town with a sign that says "I HATE NIGGERS" (a la diehard), and tell some thugs that they're just being irrational and get over themselves? Put your theory to test, you know.
What theory of mine would I be putting to the test? Obviously, there is a distinct difference between the situation that you are proposing and the one that we are discussing here. Obviously, your situation is mere provocation. My point was that, in the relevant situation, there was no intention of provocation, and that it is the responsibility of the black person to apply his perceptions of reality to realize that, and to get over himself and shrug his shoulders, and claim "Big fucking deal! Life is too short to inflict suffering upon myself when no one intended on inflicting it upon me!".
Oh my fucking god, someone used the word "nigga", let's ruin our experience of life because of it!
Even if someone was intentionally attempting to degrade me, I'd fucking shrug, man. Life is too short to allow others to ruin you emotionally.
Peace.
-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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I agree. This post nailed it.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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fresh313
journeyman
Registered: 09/01/03
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its about respect, u say nigga roud white people not roud black people, sometimes it slips, but alot understand.
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MushmanTheManic
Stranger
Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
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Quote:
fireworks_god said:
Quote:
If you started telling a bunch of pizza oven/jew jokes to an Auchwitz survivor, nobody would find it funny, even if you did not mean any harm.
So now you are the ultimate source on what would and would not be found humorous?
Non-sequitur.
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mr_kite
The Watcher
Registered: 09/16/02
Posts: 2,577
Loc: shambhala
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Quote:
Non-sequitur.
I agree.. I also think it's inappropriate to be so sneering and non-productive when you take your own discussion so seriously.
I've yet to see Fireworks God give any ground at all in any debate, let alone conceed even partial incorrectness/inaccuracy. But maybe I've just not seen those posts. How does he do it? Well, he doesn't really, but I think he achieves that illusion quite succesfully. It's all about presentation and selective argument
Ooops I write too much
-------------------- let yourself be silently drawn by the stronger pull of what you really love
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Nigger [Re: mr_kite]
#5602253 - 05/07/06 07:23 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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He is the love child of Veritas and myself. We had to let go of him because we were young and unmarried and bowed to the pressure of our very religous parents. Now he has come back into our lives to seek his revenge.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,855
Loc: Pandurn
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Quote:
MushmanTheManic said: Non-sequitur.
Bullshit. He is asserting what "everyone" would not find humorous. I scoffed at the fact that he proposes himself to be the ultimate source on what would and would not be found humorous.
Can it be substantiated that an Auchwitz survivor would never find a Jew/pizza oven humorous? Of course not. Is it perfectly plausible that one would find it humorous? Most certainly.
Not everyone has a stick shoved up their fucking ass, even those who suffer great tragedies. In fact, humor can be a very powerful treatment in dealing with tragedy. Such a survivor who could laugh and see the humor in a joke about a Jewish pizza in an oven would certainly be the true survivor of Auchwitz, eh?
Peace.
-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Go son.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
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Re: Nigger [Re: mr_kite]
#5602326 - 05/07/06 07:41 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
mr_kite said: I agree.. I also think it's inappropriate to be so sneering and non-productive when you take your own discussion so seriously.
Non-productive? Yes, discussing the topic at hand and engaging in debate of that topic is non-productive, while standing at the side-lines and trolling individuals who you do not agree with (mostly because of the fact that they have previously challenged your own ideas and you could either not emotionally handle it or were unable to effectively respond) is the shining example of productivity.
Quote:
I've yet to see Fireworks God give any ground at all in any debate, let alone conceed even partial incorrectness/inaccuracy.
I've yet to see you become involved in any discussion that I am participating in and actually contribute to the topic at hand, without first and foremost commenting on me personally, my behavior, my emoticon usage, or my spelling and grammar.
If you feel the need to analyze myself to such an extent and make it known (you obviously do, as you do it ), feel free to pm me and/or post about me in a forum where it is acceptable.
Quote:
But maybe I've just not seen those posts.
Selective reading?
Quote:
How does he do it? Well, he doesn't really, but I think he achieves that illusion quite succesfully. It's all about presentation and selective argument
Hhhmm... presentation... the act of representing your expressions for others to consider.... selective arguement.... the act of making a decision as to what points you wish to respond to.... wow... let me think... something every single person here does.
In a thread of over six pages, you only responded to me personally, and presented analyzation and commentary on me. Selective arguement? Let's not be hypocritical.
Peace.
-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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ouch!
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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MushmanTheManic
Stranger
Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
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Within the context of his post, I cannot find any evidence to support the assertion that he views himself as "the ultimate source on what would and would not be found humorous." He seemed to be using an example to illustrate his point.
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,855
Loc: Pandurn
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Quote:
MushmanTheManic said: Within the context of his post, I cannot find any evidence to support the assertion that he views himself as "the ultimate source on what would and would not be found humorous." He seemed to be using an example to illustrate his point.
Let's analyze this one.
Quote:
If you started telling a bunch of pizza oven/jew jokes to an Auchwitz survivor, nobody would find it funny, even if you did not mean any harm.
He asserts that nobody would find it funny. Obviously, he is using an example to illustrate his point, and yet, he is also claiming that no one would find it humorous, as though he were a divine source of knowledge on what "someone" would find humorous.
Now, what am I missing? That he is not proposing what some generalization would not find humorous? Because I thought I caught that, and the fact that someone would have to be an ultimate source of what is to be found humorous in order to assert what "someone" would find humorous.
Does the fact that an experience was tragic necessitate that an individual will not find humor in a joke that is intended to be humorous? I don't think so.
Peace.
-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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MushmanTheManic
Stranger
Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
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Now, what am I missing?
Relevancy.
"So now you are the ultimate source on what would and would not be found humorous?" is an ad hominem veiled under a red herring and utterly besides the point. The issue seems to be whose is responsible for the meaning of a word, the speaker or the listener, not whether Fospher is omniscience.
Furthermore, since "it is the responsibility of the individual to properly interpret meaning when it is expressed", it is your fault he is omniscient, anyway.
Edited by MushmanTheManic (05/07/06 08:43 PM)
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,855
Loc: Pandurn
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Quote:
MushmanTheManic said: "So now you are the ultimate source on what would and would not be found humorous?" is an ad hominem veiled under a red herring and utterly besides the point.
Incorrect. It was addressing an assertion that he made. It is not an ad hominem in that it perfectly portrays a logical point, that, as he is not an ultimate source on what everyone would and would not find humorous, his assertion that no one would find it humorous is baseless.
It was also not a diversion to draw attention away from the issue at hand - look to Mr. Kite if you want a trollish red herring. My comments on his assertion that no one would find that joke hilarious are as much of a red herring as his assertion is, honestly. Are we not allowed to comment on side issues, even as they are pertinent to the main issue?
Quote:
The issue seems to be whose is responsible for the meaning of a word, the speaker or the listener, not whether Fospher is omniscience.
The issue itself concerns the word nigger, and the situation which was described. Obviously, there are a myriad of related issues that all play a part in the discussion at hand. My comments regarding his assertion are an aspect of that, just as his assertion is.
Is it that hard to see how his assertion that no one would find a related joke humorous and my questioning that he has no means by which to know that relates to the topic of this thread, which involves controversial words and jokes and the manners in which others interpret them?
Peace.
-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Maybe I'm missing something but it seems totally relevant to the topic at hand. Does any individual have to react to a particular statement in the same way that another would.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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New2Shroom
Stranger
Registered: 05/06/06
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Imagine the uproar [Re: Icelander]
#5604534 - 05/08/06 10:55 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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if we had an official month dedicated to "white history" - In my experience most of the ignorant hatred is on the other side of the fence (going to a primarily black school I experienced this often).
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mr_kite
The Watcher
Registered: 09/16/02
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No I didn't immediately pick you out, I was posting way back at the start of the thread. Then you replied to my post so when I came back much later, I read what you said and posted again.
I did pick you out later because I disagreed with you. Sorry I don't agree with the way that you think and project ideas, but I just don't. I don't think I was over the top or any more agressive than you have been, and certainly you've been more outright insulting about me than I have been about you, but challenge me if you think differently. I'm not here for a fight anyway, lets just try and chill the agro. I'll shut up a bit..
-------------------- let yourself be silently drawn by the stronger pull of what you really love
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Veritas
Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
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Re: Nigger [Re: mr_kite]
#5606516 - 05/08/06 08:36 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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You did not respond to the content of his post to you, you immediately started describing his posting style in insulting terms, and you were blatantly off-topic. Other than that, you were clearly answering his earlier post.
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MushmanTheManic
Stranger
Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
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Re: Nigger [Re: Veritas]
#5606749 - 05/08/06 09:47 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Shhh... let this thread die in peace.
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
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Posts: 24,855
Loc: Pandurn
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Re: Nigger [Re: mr_kite]
#5606930 - 05/08/06 10:39 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
mr_kite said: No I didn't immediately pick you out, I was posting way back at the start of the thread. Then you replied to my post so when I came back much later, I read what you said and posted again.
Yes. You made one post at the beginning of the thread, six pages ago. I questioned your statements. Six pages later, you make one reply directed solely at me personally and containing nothing that pertained to my reply.
So, you did not immediately pick me out... you eventually picked me out to discuss. Great, glad we clarified that.
Quote:
I did pick you out later because I disagreed with you. Sorry I don't agree with the way that you think and project ideas, but I just don't.
Yes, great, you don't agree with me, we know that already. I guess it is far too much for you to address the points and ideas that I raise in pertinent discussion that you disagree with? That is what we do here, after all. You disagree with someone, and then you stand up and proclaim why.
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I don't think I was over the top or any more agressive than you have been
Yes, I'm a friggin ball of rage here.
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, and certainly you've been more outright insulting about me than I have been about you, but challenge me if you think differently.
Hhhm... yes. I replied to your post. Why, just for the purpose of substantiating your statements (I won't hold my breathe for you to do so on your own ), why don't we all sit down and read what my reply to you consisted of, eh?
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fireworks_god said: The word is a sound wave and an arrangement of lines. The word has the meaning we give it. If it was not intended as an insult, then it was not an insult. If the person was offended by it regardless, then that is their hang up.
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fireworks_god said: I'd tell him to get over himself.
That is, of course, referring to the black man.
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fireworks_god said: The black person comes off worse, becoming emotionally upset and resentful of another individual who meant no offense. How irrational.
As I stated, becoming emotionally upset as the result of a statement another made, intending no offense, is irrational. You state that you disagree with me, but you don't say why.
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fireworks_god said: Well let's just see. We have but one moment in which to live. Our existance is defined by this present experience. To think that inflicting a negative emotion upon ourselves and to lessen our awareness of reality by becoming consumed by it is unreasonable is to deny oneself in the ultimate manner. Seriously
Now, this is what you just said, once more.
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mr_kite said: , and certainly you've been more outright insulting about me than I have been about you, but challenge me if you think differently.
Wow, I truly have been most outright insulting towards you!
I see it all before me! Not one single reference to you in my reply to your statements! Jesus fucking Christ, what an insult!
Do you want me to create a poll, so we can get some objective perspective on this one?
I mean, honestly, do you see the "" and just deep down know that I am insulting you? If so, you are becoming just a little bit too paranoid over the whole emoticon usage thing.
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I'm not here for a fight anyway, lets just try and chill the agro.
Then don't violate the rules by directing personalisms agansit me when you have not in the slightest manner been provoked. It is like the drunk guy who goes into a bar pushing people, but assures everyone when an altercation occurs that "I'm not here for a fight anyways!"
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I'll shut up a bit..
Sounds like a great idea. Consider opening your mouth once again when you feel like actually contributing to the discussion at hand.
Peace.
-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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MushmanTheManic
Stranger
Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
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Shhhh
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Ashland
Space Cowboy
Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 315
Loc: North America
Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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I think the Boondocks put it best...
"Nigger is anyone who is an ignorant motherfucker."
Nigger =\= black person. It is offensive and definitely vulgar, and should not be interchangable with "black."
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mr_kite
The Watcher
Registered: 09/16/02
Posts: 2,577
Loc: shambhala
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
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Quote:
Yes. You made one post at the beginning of the thread, six pages ago. I questioned your statements. Six pages later, you make one reply directed solely at me personally and containing nothing that pertained to my reply.
So, you did not immediately pick me out... you eventually picked me out to discuss. Great, glad we clarified that.
Yes, great, you don't agree with me, we know that already. I guess it is far too much for you to address the points and ideas that I raise in pertinent discussion that you disagree with? That is what we do here, after all. You disagree with someone, and then you stand up and proclaim why.
OK Ill substantiate (spell it out to you). WTF? Heres my reply on page 4 of thread...
Quote: fireworks_god said:
Quote:
The word is a sound wave and an arrangement of lines. The word has the meaning we give it. If it was not intended as an insult, then it was not an insult. If the person was offended by it regardless, then that is their hang up.
I'd tell him to get over himself.
Quote: mr_kite said: As I said, that's being naievely idealistic. The word has not only the meaning you give it, but the meaning that society and history gives it. Would you say "fucking cunts" to your grandmother? Could you defend saying "fucking cunts" to your grandmother by saying you intended it with a diferent meaning? Unlikely. As I said, one has to be aware of the bigger picture as unfortunately society and the world in general is not as enlightened and objective as yourself. If you ignore other people's point of view, whether through ignorance or ideals, then that's extremely self-centered.
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Wow, I truly have been most outright insulting towards you!
I see it all before me! Not one single reference to you in my reply to your statements! Jesus fucking Christ, what an insult! Do you want me to create a poll, so we can get some objective perspective on this one? I mean, honestly, do you see the "" and just deep down know that I am insulting you? If so, you are becoming just a little bit too paranoid over the whole emoticon usage thing.
"look to Mr. Kite if you want a trollish red herring" i dont think Ive said anything in that manner about you. you...
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I'll shut up a bit..
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Sounds like a great idea. Consider opening your mouth once again when you feel like actually contributing to the discussion at hand.
heheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheh
So will you actually admit this time that you were at least partially wrong and that you simply didn't read the post I replied to you with? (pg 4) Or am I looking forward to another massive dissection of my post (how can you put so much time and petty effort into relying to me and then claim that I'm the one who's emotionally upset???)
Here it is: I think you're a twat, you think I'm a twat. Let's just leave it at that and not waste any more forum space. I'll say no more as long as you cut it too.
peas.
-------------------- let yourself be silently drawn by the stronger pull of what you really love
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Nigger [Re: mr_kite]
#5607813 - 05/09/06 08:25 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Sounds like a good idea.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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fresh313
journeyman
Registered: 09/01/03
Posts: 2,537
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
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this thread is nigger rigged
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,855
Loc: Pandurn
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: Nigger [Re: mr_kite]
#5609485 - 05/09/06 04:51 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
mr_kite said: OK Ill substantiate (spell it out to you). WTF? Heres my reply on page 4 of thread...
Quote:
As I said, that's being naievely idealistic. The word has not only the meaning you give it, but the meaning that society and history gives it. Would you say "fucking cunts" to your grandmother? Could you defend saying "fucking cunts" to your grandmother by saying you intended it with a diferent meaning? Unlikely. As I said, one has to be aware of the bigger picture as unfortunately society and the world in general is not as enlightened and objective as yourself. If you ignore other people's point of view, whether through ignorance or ideals, then that's extremely self-centered.
In fact, I had read that reply once, when I didn't have time to reply, but when skimming six pages to find all of your postings, I overlooked it.
Certainly, a word's meaning truly exists in the minds of those who hear or read it and interpret and define its meaning. There is no objective meaning to the word, no matter what usage has existed before it. Obviously, prior usage may effect how someone will interpret the word.
However, realistictically, we are all attempting to convey pure thought and concepts through a limited means of expression. An individual needs to be able to exercise judgement as to the context and meaning that is being implied when someone else utilizes it.
Not to mention the fact that it is irrational to become emotionally upset, even if it was intended to be offensive.
Quote:
i dont think Ive said anything in that manner about you. you...
I was accused of creating a red herring. After offering reasoning on how my points were relevant to the discussion, I joked that it was you that created a red herring, with your personalisms directed agansit me. I included the adjective "trollish" because you repeatedly engage in this behavior without being provoked by me.
Do you care to explain exactly how that is most overly insulting of you, especially in comparison to your unbridled assault on me?
Quote:
So will you actually admit this time that you were at least partially wrong and that you simply didn't read the post I replied to you with?
No, I will not actually admit that, as doing so would be a lie. I read the reply two days before I replied again in this thread, and I never remembered your reply.
"This time", eh? Referencing which times I was wrong and refused to admit it? Or are you simply making unsubstantiated assertions as to my character again?
Quote:
Or am I looking forward to another massive dissection of my post (how can you put so much time and petty effort into relying to me and then claim that I'm the one who's emotionally upset???)
Yes, time and effort invested in a practice that one enjoys (discussing and exchanging ideas, expressing one's points and sharing perspectives) equates into being emotionally upset. Simply marvelous conclusion, do you come up with gems like these often? Great adjective as well, "petty" effort. Simply how trite it is that I would consider making statements and following through with them. I truly am a lost cause.
Quote:
Here it is: I think you're a twat, you think I'm a twat. Let's just leave it at that and not waste any more forum space. I'll say no more as long as you cut it too.
No deal. First and foremost, I do not think you are a twat. I think you are someone who, for whatever reason, cannot resist inappropriately commenting on my personality, my character, my behavior, my emoticon usage, and my grammar when I respond to your points in a thread.
Now, is it because you cannot engage in discussion? Because you don't feel the need to involve yourself when you are questioned? Is it because you become emotionally upset when your ideas are challenged? Is it because you envy me?
Who knows? It is mere speculation, and it could never be more than speculation. That is why I do not form conclusions, and then seek you out in a thread and lambast you, regardless of the rules and intents of this forum.
I refuse to stop replying to your posts when you express an idea here. If I feel the need to offer my perspective on the matter, I will continue to do so. If that bothers you, hey, there is an ignore function, after all.
Peace.
-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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mr_kite
The Watcher
Registered: 09/16/02
Posts: 2,577
Loc: shambhala
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
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Quote:
No deal. First and foremost, I do not think you are a twat. I think you are someone who, for whatever reason, cannot resist inappropriately commenting on my personality, my character, my behavior, my emoticon usage, and my grammar when I respond to your points in a thread.
What can I say, I guess I'm just jealous.
Big healthy manlove to fireworksgod. I'm quite resolved to liking you.
-------------------- let yourself be silently drawn by the stronger pull of what you really love
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,855
Loc: Pandurn
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: Nigger [Re: mr_kite]
#5609625 - 05/09/06 05:34 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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A change of heart?
Peace.
-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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mr_kite
The Watcher
Registered: 09/16/02
Posts: 2,577
Loc: shambhala
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
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Love thy enemy
-------------------- let yourself be silently drawn by the stronger pull of what you really love
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,855
Loc: Pandurn
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: Nigger [Re: mr_kite]
#5609651 - 05/09/06 05:41 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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mr_kite
The Watcher
Registered: 09/16/02
Posts: 2,577
Loc: shambhala
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
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You'll always be the nigga's bitch, muthafunster
-------------------- let yourself be silently drawn by the stronger pull of what you really love
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Nigger [Re: mr_kite]
#5610360 - 05/09/06 08:35 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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You guys are funny.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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