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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: fastfred]
    #7195654 - 07/19/07 12:04 AM (16 years, 9 months ago)

for what its worth, aspirin does work on EMIT, reducing apparent cocaine at least, .according to this link http://www.clinchem.org/cgi/content/abstract/40/8/1512

Anyone know wtf nadh has to do with the test though? the abstract wasn't clear.

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OfflineJeremy_Davis
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: fastfred]
    #7197750 - 07/19/07 12:45 PM (16 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

fastfred said:
Vegetarians can eat fish, which is high in creatine. Otherwise vegetarians are often in such poor health that they can't pass many types of medical tests.

The best advice for any vegetarian is to take supplements. Most vegetarian diets should be supplemented anyway if you care much about your health.


-FF




What's up FF? I always love your posts, but this one I have to say disturbed me a little. I've been vegetarian since 2000, don't eat fish either, basically nothing that had a face on it...and my reasons are many, but this is not the time or place. Anyway, I go to my physician and get my blood work pulled every 6 months or so, and I (90%) of the time am right where I should be nutrient wise, no B12 problems, no protein issues - I just make a point to know what I'm eating (yes, I'm a food-label reader!). I don't take supplements, but I have started making those "Alive!" Whole Foods shakes recently, so that may be considered like a supplement, even though it is only from food sources. Anyway just needed to chime in here that my personal experience has been different.

Also I took a nutrition course in college many years back - changed my life.

Light and Love,
JD


--------------------
Jeremy Davis
Educational Concerns for Hunger Organization, Inc.
Check out the ECHO mushroom blog page to see our lab, growing facility, and more-www.echotech.org/greta

Edited by Jeremy_Davis (07/19/07 12:46 PM)

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Invisiblefastfred
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: bhamlaxy]
    #7201358 - 07/20/07 06:28 AM (16 years, 9 months ago)

JD, I'm not trying to diss your choices. Most of the health problems from being vegan stem from the poor availability of good vegetarian food. As a society we haven't made a decent effort at making healthy food commonplace, let alone healthy vegetarian food.

Man evolved on a high protein, high fat, high iron diet. We've only had agriculture for the last 10,000 or so years of our 2,500,000 years on this planet. That is to say that we've had agriculture for only 0.4% of our evolutionary history.

Switching from the diet which you are evolutionary suited to requires a lot of planning and care. You need to spend a lot more time on diet issues if you want to remain healthy. Most people simply don't put that much time or thought into their diet, and that causes a lot of problems. People who casually switch to vegetarianism without a good understanding of nutrition WILL get sick most of the time.

A good case is vitamin B12. B12 is not found in vegetable sources. There is no vegetarian source for it. You have to take supplements of B12 to survive on a vegetarian diet for more than a few years.

A vegetarian thrown into the wild or back in time a thousand years simply could not survive.

B12 is just one example, there are other nutrients that require careful diet or supplementation to maintain proper levels.


-FF

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OfflineJeremy_Davis
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: fastfred]
    #7201802 - 07/20/07 09:42 AM (16 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

fastfred said:
JD, I'm not trying to diss your choices.  Most of the health problems from being vegan stem from the poor availability of good vegetarian food.  As a society we haven't made a decent effort at making healthy food commonplace, let alone healthy vegetarian food.

Man evolved on a high protein, high fat, high iron diet.  We've only had agriculture for the last 10,000 or so years of our 2,500,000 years on this planet.  That is to say that we've had agriculture for only 0.4% of our evolutionary history.

Switching from the diet which you are evolutionary suited to requires a lot of planning and care.  You need to spend a lot more time on diet issues if you want to remain healthy.  Most people simply don't put that much time or thought into their diet, and that causes a lot of problems.  People who casually switch to vegetarianism without a good understanding of nutrition WILL get sick most of the time.



QFT - Nice man!

Quote:


A good case is vitamin B12.  B12 is not found in vegetable sources.  There is no vegetarian source for it.  You have to take supplements of B12 to survive on a vegetarian diet for more than a few years.
-FF




You know I was hearing that when someone told me about the Weston A. Price foundation. I think they are www.westonaprice.org or something like that. They've got a lot of really interesting, yet questionable information there. I looked into that a lot at the time, and from what I was able to find there are B12 sources in nature.

I don't know if this will surprise you, but mushrooms are actually a source, of all species. And I eat mushrooms several times a week. The concentration is not that high, but it is there.

I may have to do some more research to find out about this B12 again, because it's been a while. I'll be happy to post my sources when I find them whether they are favorable to my opinion or not :thumbup:.

Also I just went in for blood work this morning, so I'll have a look at that soon. But I specifically asked about B-12 last time I was in there in February or January, and the doctor said everything was perfect. I will make sure to ask about this again.

Now that I think about it though, aren't breakfast cereals fortified with B vitamins a lot? I'm not super big on cereals, and the ones I eat are ones I view as healthy, but maybe I'm also getting it from there, since I'm not taking any supplements, other than the Alive! and it's all plant sources...

Anyway FF, always happy to have a lively debate with you!


--------------------
Jeremy Davis
Educational Concerns for Hunger Organization, Inc.
Check out the ECHO mushroom blog page to see our lab, growing facility, and more-www.echotech.org/greta

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Invisiblefastfred
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: bhamlaxy]
    #7203241 - 07/20/07 04:33 PM (16 years, 9 months ago)

> I looked into that a lot at the time, and from what I was able to find there are B12 sources in nature.

http://www.vegsoc.org/info/b12.html

Quote:

Vitamin B12 is a member of the vitamin B complex. It contains cobalt, and so is also known as cobalamin. It is exclusively synthesized by bacteria and is found primarily in meat, eggs and dairy products. There has been considerable research into proposed plant sources of vitamin B12. Fermented soya products, seaweeds, and algae such as spirulina have all been suggested as containing significant B12. However, the present consensus is that any B12 present in plant foods is likely to be unavailable to humans and so these foods should not be relied upon as safe sources. Many vegan foods are supplemented with B12. Vitamin B12 is necessary for the synthesis of red blood cells, the maintenance of the nervous system, and growth and development in children. Deficiency can cause anemia. Vitamin B12 neuropathy, involving the degeneration of nerve fibers and irreversible neurological damage, can also occur.
[...]

The only reliable unfortified sources of vitamin B12 are meat, dairy products and eggs. There has been considerable research into possible plant food sources of B12. Fermented soya products, seaweeds and algae have all been proposed as possible sources of B12. However, analysis of fermented soya products, including tempeh, miso, shoyu and tamari, found no significant B12.
Spirulina, an algae available as a dietary supplement in tablet form, and nori, a seaweed, have both appeared to contain significant amounts of B12 after analysis. However, it is thought that this is due to the presence of compounds structurally similar to B12, known as B12 analogues. These cannot be utilized to satisfy dietary needs. Assay methods used to detect B12 are unable to differentiate between B12 and it's analogues, Analysis of possible B12 sources may give false positive results due to the presence of these analogues.

Researchers have suggested that supposed B12 supplements such as spirulina may in fact increase the risk of B12 deficiency disease, as the B12 analogues can compete with B12 and inhibit metabolism.

The current nutritional consensus is that no plant foods can be relied on as a safe source of vitamin B12.

Bacteria present in the large intestine are able to synthesize B12. In the past, it has been thought that the B12 produced by these colonic bacteria could be absorbed and utilized by humans. However, the bacteria produce B12 too far down the intestine for absorption to occur, B12 not being absorbed through the colon lining.





> I don't know if this will surprise you, but mushrooms are actually a source, of all species.

http://www.animalsuffering.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2885
Has a little blurb on it.

I don't know if they've ever done a lot of research on it, but it's likely that insect and fecal contamination provide most of the B12 in mushrooms.

I'm sure that there's some plant source somewhere, it's just not likely that it's in your diet.

> aren't breakfast cereals fortified with B vitamins a lot?

They throw a lot of stuff into processed foods. A quick look on google showed that there are several popular cereals fortified with it.

The body really doesn't need a lot of B12 at all, and the liver can store a couple years worth of it. One problem is with children that have no stores of B12. I think all the soy milk formula is fortified with it now though.

> Anyway FF, always happy to have a lively debate with you!

Likewise.

You may have a lot more company someday. Rushing headlong into a population explosion like we are is sure to cause a food crunch. Meat is incredibly inefficient to produce compared to food crops, so when the crunch hits meat prices will skyrocket. In some poor countries most of the population is already effectively vegetarian because meat costs are so high and it's so much cheaper to buy rice and other grains.

Biofuels will also drive the price of meat up. Supply is not projected to meet demand, so grazing land will be converted to crop land, raising the price of cropland, the price of corn will go up, and a lot of the stover (corn stalks) that cattle eat will be diverted to ethanol production, thus raising the price of feeding cattle.


-FF

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OfflineJeremy_Davis
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: fastfred]
    #7218312 - 07/24/07 02:02 PM (16 years, 9 months ago)

All good stuff man, and very interesting too. I wasn't going to go back to Google on this, and let it lie, but damn man! I can't do it....must...debate...validity....arrrghhh!

So I found this
Quote:


Mushrooms cultivated on manure enriched compost will contain vitamin B12. If the mushrooms are not over washed before use they will contain some B12. There is 0.26ug of vitamin B12 in 100g of mushrooms. A serving of 4-6 mushrooms weighs 75g.




from here http://www.vegetarian.org.nz/page/vitamin-b12 (okay it's not the FDA :crazy:)

Do you think that the manure has B12 in it from the cow's natural bacteria and stomach flora or whatever, and then the mushrooms uptake the vitamin, or is that just not possible? Kinda got me thinking...

Anyway, I shot an e-mail over to Professor Robert Beelman at Penn State, as he's the food science professor at the school with the largest interest in mushroom growing in the US, and always tied in with the mushroom conferences and projects. I'll let you know if he sheds any light on this...

Have a great day FF!
Light and Love,
JD


--------------------
Jeremy Davis
Educational Concerns for Hunger Organization, Inc.
Check out the ECHO mushroom blog page to see our lab, growing facility, and more-www.echotech.org/greta

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OfflineJeremy_Davis
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: Jeremy_Davis]
    #7218342 - 07/24/07 02:12 PM (16 years, 9 months ago)

Well, now that this thread is totally de-railed, one last thing from me on this subject here (at least I think so).

FastFred you're right and I am wrong.

I got the reply back from Dr. Beelman. Here's what he said;

Quote:


I have seen one report indication that mushrooms contain trace levels of Vit B12 (0.6-0.8 micrograms per 100grams, d.w.  See Mattila et al.,  J.Agric. Food Chem, vol 49 (no 5) 2001.





So looks like there's not much there at all. Not even a whole microgram of B-12 in almost four ounces of mushrooms...Oh well.

Be well man :toast:

Light and Love,
JD


--------------------
Jeremy Davis
Educational Concerns for Hunger Organization, Inc.
Check out the ECHO mushroom blog page to see our lab, growing facility, and more-www.echotech.org/greta

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Invisibleparadox_
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: Jeremy_Davis]
    #7220884 - 07/25/07 03:16 AM (16 years, 9 months ago)

Wait...this was about a drug test?

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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: paradox_]
    #7220919 - 07/25/07 03:48 AM (16 years, 9 months ago)

yeah, I failed it

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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: bhamlaxy]
    #7225156 - 07/26/07 05:36 AM (16 years, 9 months ago)

> yeah, I failed it

Bummer. You didn't listen to me did you?

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OfflineVancouver
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: fastfred]
    #8707464 - 07/31/08 01:27 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

So I've got a piss test in about 25 days, I've been clean for 7 days now. But was a heavy smoker (6-9 joints a day) for over 2 and a half years.

Think if I follow what's been mentioned in here already I will pass it? Otherwise I'll be screwed out of a job that pays 10 grand a month =\

Edited by Vancouver (07/31/08 01:28 PM)

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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: fastfred]
    #8708004 - 07/31/08 03:13 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

fastfred said:
> yeah, I failed it

Bummer.  You didn't listen to me did you?





Sorry, was a joke :laugh:

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OfflineVancouver
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: johnm214]
    #8711621 - 08/01/08 11:19 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Anyone?

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InvisibleFurrowedBrow
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: Vancouver]
    #8712453 - 08/01/08 01:58 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

$10k a month!!!!!!!!!  Why even risk it man.  I would go here:

http://www.ureasample.com/buy-drug-test-solutions/store/comersus_viewItem.asp?idProduct=64

I have used it and a friend of mine has used it.  Neither of us had any problems with it.  It takes some effort to use it right and get it to the right temperature, but $100 to virtually guarantee a $10,000 a month job is great.  The only thing to worry about is if they watch you while you piss.  most pre-employment screenings wouldnt require it.  Although they watched me piss in the cup for a diversion program for Poss of mj.


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OfflineVancouver
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #8712827 - 08/01/08 03:20 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

My dad worked with this company before and they will be watching me. So I picked up a couple home piss test dipstick things andwill try it out in a week or two and then again before I take the test, maybe to see if I fail I can delay the test a bit longer. *crosses fingers*

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OfflineVancouver
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: Vancouver]
    #8739655 - 08/07/08 03:53 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

I've also got a question about the original method posted, does it have to be aspirin that you take or could it be tylenol or ibuprofen?

thanks

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Offlineemerich
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: Vancouver]
    #8741310 - 08/07/08 10:32 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Or, you could take this thing called AZO Standard. Generally used to treat yeast infections or kidney stones.. it flushes the kidneys. It makes you piss rustic orange and it does stain, so wear old undies. Comes in a box on the shelf at any supermarket. I prefer Meijer since im in the midwest, but walmart carries it also. I would assume that any pharmacy like walgreens and rite-aid does as well.

Easy way:

Take two mini-tablets every 6 hours for 48 hours. Take with a FULL glass of water. (atleast 16 oz) or drink atleast 16 oz in between each dose. It helps the stuff cling to your kidneys, which removes the THC from the fatty cells.. which makes you drop clean.
The next 24 hours the medication will finish it self out.

When you are pissing normal (without the rustic orange) you are ready to drop clean.

Just a note, my buddy took double doses over a 24 hour period and dropped clean the day after that, but he said it burned with a fierceness at the time of the drop. He did pass, but I wouldnt guarantee a success with just two days. Three days and it has worked for me every time.

Ill never let the bastards take my pot smoking away from me :crazy2: :thumbup:

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OfflineVancouver
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: emerich]
    #8745882 - 08/08/08 07:47 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Say you take it, once you start pissing clean how long is the duration that you can piss clean for? Any idea?

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OfflineVancouver
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: Vancouver]
    #8791052 - 08/18/08 01:35 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Uggh, I have been clean for approx 28 days now and still failing the take home piss tests. With my test coming up in the next week or so it's not looking so good.

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Offlineblue.mean.yen
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Re: How to pass a drug test [Re: fastfred]
    #10812108 - 08/06/09 03:26 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

> A good case is vitamin B12.  B12 is not found in vegetable sources.  There is no vegetarian source for it.  You have to take supplements of B12 to survive on a vegetarian diet for more than a few years.

not true, actually, the greatest source of B12 to earth is from the suns rays, just like vitamin D we absorb it through our eyes and skin. while the sun isn't a vegetable it certainly isn't an animal either :laugh:

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