|
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
|
creamcorn
mad scientist


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
|
Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! 6
#5574833 - 04/30/06 06:00 PM (17 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Ok. All the newbies ask it. "How can I speed this up?" Well, here you go. This isn't a tek per se, its more of a collection of tips that even a first timer can use, although it does assume you're very familiar with the pf-tek method, and preferably have gone through it at least once... using all these tips should get you similar results. Using some of them will still help improve things!
Phase 1: Jar preparation - Pack your jars loosely kids. That can't be stressed enough. Spoon your mix in and absolutely do not pack it down one bit. Inspect your jar before putting the dry verm layer on top. If you see a big gap somewhere, or a clump of BRF or otherwised packed section, dump it back into your mixing bowl and fill it again so it looks consistent. An extra minute or two effort here can save you days. - Use wide mouth jars if possible. The bottom, which is usually most stubborn to colonize, gets started much faster. Your needle reaches perfectly to the half-way point, rather than near the top too. - Try 5 holes in a wide mouth! It works wonders. Space them evenly. Draw a star on top if you want to help visualize where to put your holes. As you can see in the picture I didn't do a very good job at that on this jar Its not critical though. - Use coffee! It is like rocket fuel for BRF jars. Its tried and tested with grains, but you can use it in a BRF jar too. 25% freshly brewed coffee to 75% water works quite well. Tip: There's 4 tablespoons in a quarter cup, so on a per-jar level thats a tablespoon of coffee per three tablespoons of water. I'm sure you folks are smart enough to figure out how to get that ratio in larger measurements. - Bake your ingredients first. Lay out the BRF in a pyrex dish or baking pan, as well as a whole bunch of verm in another. Bake at 275 for about 30 minutes. Two purposes here: the main idea is to bake the moisture out. Verm out of the bag is already damp. BRF is to an extent too. Moreso once the packages have been opened and they have sucked moisture out of the air. This way you know every time you're starting with an identical baseline in dryness with your ingredients. The second purpose, it gives you a head start on sterilizing. You know your ingredients are clean when you start. Please don't misconstrue this as a means to skimp on your boiling or pressure cooking. You still must sterilize as normal once the jars are prepared.
Phase 2: inoculation - Use liquid culture. Learn it and love it. Its easy even for newbies, don't be intimidated by it. Its the most efficient way to use spores, and shaves time off like you wouldn't believe. - Make sure to get as much mycelium from your liquid culture into your syringe as possible! The more the merrier! Whats left in your LC jar will grow back if the nutes aren't spent. - Be generous with the LC when innoculating. 2.5CC per jar is great. Divide the amount out by your holes to figure it out. That's .5CC per hole when using 5 holes. You'll need about 3 syringes full to do a dozen jars. A fantastic thing happens when using this much: it drips all the way down to the bottom. Colonization starts in stripes across the jar reaching around the bottom right away, rather than little round spots like with spores.
Phase 3: Incubating - For the love of god, use a proper tub-in-tub incubator. This is the best $25 dollar and 15 minute investment you could possibly make in this hobby. Hold jars at a steady 82-84F. - Get that damn tape off! I like the following method: cover jars in foil when boiling/pc'ing, no tape here. Tape after you inoculate, preferably with micropore tape (medical tape, you can find it near the band-aids). After 3-4 days when colonization really takes off, take the tape off! I like to turn it sideways, and put it back on at an angle from the ring to the lid, sort of like a "tent" over the hole. It leaves the hole totally breathable, yet acts sort of like a dust cover. See the picture for what I mean. - Try not to peek so much! I know its hard to help, especially starting out. It doesn't have anything to do with letting light in, but everything to do with keeping your heat in and steady. Every time you open up your TiT you let heat out and it takes time to build back up.
Here's some pictures for you. This bad boy is a B+ that was inoculated on the 24th, that's a mere 6 days ago. Some of you know when starting from spores at 6 days you're lucky to see tiny little fuzz balls starting. Should be done by day 10 if not sooner! The proof is in the pictures here that these tips work:
Side view:

Bottom view:

Top view (note 5 holes, and the little "tape tent" method I explained, the holes are underneath, but they're not actually covered since the tape isn't stuck down onto them):

Happy growing!
Edited by creamcorn (04/30/06 06:43 PM)
|
WIZOLZ
Poor with Needs


Registered: 03/20/06
Posts: 290
Loc: Monte Carlo
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: creamcorn]
#5574859 - 04/30/06 06:14 PM (17 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Your one helpfull fella CC...These tips are an excellent collection of things to take into consideration, if not follow exactly when working with PF projects. I havnt seen that baking step before when preping the Jar mix, although, I actually did do this when preparing my first PF jars about a month ago. What surprised me was how quickly it obsorbed the water when it was added and how much it fluffed out compared to just regular BRF and Verm. If I could get a 1/2 pint to colonize fully in 6 days, that would be great! I'll have to go with that coffee tek next time, sounds beneficial for sure. Of coarse, by that time I'll have the LC ready. (Started today)
Zooooooooooom Zoooooooom
Edited by WIZOLZ (04/30/06 06:21 PM)
|
monstermitch
Growing in Bags Doesn't Work


Registered: 02/10/06
Posts: 3,911
Loc: Arizona Bay
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: WIZOLZ]
#5574948 - 04/30/06 06:54 PM (17 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Great collection of tips for brf jars, and well explained.
I have some brf sitting around from a while ago, I'll give it a go step for step your way. I have some stevia, algit, and black mustard seed that I use in other methods. Do you see any benefit to using additives such as these?
With no h/poo, I figure the substrate could use some help in the nute dept.
--------------------
|
creamcorn
mad scientist


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: monstermitch]
#5574979 - 04/30/06 07:03 PM (17 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
no direct experience with additives besides coffee in brf jars to give a good answer, but i don't see how they could hurt. one thing all those ingredients you mentioned have in common is a high protien content, specifically tryptophan. now that the fda allows sale of pure l-tryptophan as a suppliment again i've been toying with the idea of adding that to the water for a potency boost. we've been discussing it quite a bit in this thread. should it work well, that will be the next step towards the easy preparation of the ultimate pf jars i certainly won't reccomend such things until its been tested and proven though.
but i say use what you got, don't see it as causing any harm.
|
monstermitch
Growing in Bags Doesn't Work


Registered: 02/10/06
Posts: 3,911
Loc: Arizona Bay
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: creamcorn]
#5575001 - 04/30/06 07:10 PM (17 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
thank you creamcorn.
I have read the thread and I respect what RogerRabbit has done with his efforts. He attests to no real evidence in potency gain, so I place no merit in it. And yes, I know they are all high in protein and tryptophan, that's why I got them.
Yeah, I'll use them, and now the coffee too. Sounds great. the available tryptophan I can find is really pricey though. Hope someone will track down some cheaper. I'll keep my eye on that thread too.
Thanks again creamcorn.
Just was wondering
--------------------
|
creamcorn
mad scientist


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: creamcorn] 1
#5703822 - 06/02/06 11:51 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
just a little bump here for those who haven't seen this. i've also gotten a lot of feedback (all good!) and some questions on the coffee aspects, so i'll clear those up and give you some mycoporn inspiration!
first off, the coffee formula isn't very sensitive. don't worry about how exact you measure it. don't worry how strong or weak you brew your coffee, just brew it like you'd normally drink it and that's "close enough"... don't stress on brands of coffee or quality, it really doesn't matter. i'm beginning to suspect its the high nitrogen content, along with other nutrition in coffee that's playing a part here. you can probably use decaf with exact same results. there's more coffee related experiments on the way, stay tuned. (a case in progress right now, a couple crumbled cakes spawned to a pastuerized coir/coffee ground mixture, should see pins there shortly and will post on it...)
well i'm totally convinced coffee is awesome for colonization speed. but people have also asked how the fruiting is.
on average the cakes with coffee pin in about 5 days after a dunk. this regularly beats out non-coffee cakes by 2-3 days. i dunk 12hr and double end case (verm on top, tray of moist verm on bottom). i occasionally "feed" the tray of verm on the bottom with water from an eyedropper, maybe two or three times throughout the fruiting cycle.
potency as far as i've observed so far is as good if not slightly better than straight brf. haven't had time to eat all these guys yet to come to a real conclusion there. 
these pictures are from the same batch of jars the example jar in the first post was from. its been so long because they've been hanging out in the fridge a while waiting for room. my jars colonize so fast these days it takes much longer to fruit. especially because i *always* get 3 good flushes, and have gotten as many as 6!
first flush, intense pinsets!

cake on its second flush, not so shabby eh?

third flush, only get 3-4 shrooms off a cake, but they're monsterous and tend to outweigh an abundant flush of smaller ones. here's two 30+ gram specimens that are absolutely gorgeous. not a bad size to be regularly pulling from a cake, huh?

keep the questions, comments, and success stories coming, i love it
|
IGnosticAbhorI
Stranger-er

Registered: 11/06/04
Posts: 4,899
Last seen: 8 months, 5 days
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: creamcorn]
#5703886 - 06/02/06 12:15 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
I wouldn't attribute everything to the coffee.
I remeber when RR first posted about it in Adv. Cult. way back when and everything was rather inconclusive.
IME, I get about the same results...Although it's rather difficult to get scientific results since lots of peeps don't have controls and such for their projects. However, it doesn't seem to harm anything (coffee), so 
Nice fruits BTW 
I wonder if RR or anyone else has tried casings utilyzing coffee...As in dunking the cakes in coffee solution before breaking them up and spawning or casing....
-Gnostic
|
creamcorn
mad scientist


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: IGnosticAbhorI]
#5703907 - 06/02/06 12:21 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
well I confidently attribute it to the coffee. its not huge, but its noticable. consistently faster colonizing cakes, quicker to pin, and more prolific fruiting, compared side by side to cakes of the same strain in the same FC grown literally side by side. this is after many many dozens of cakes, not just the ones i'm showing here... these were just handy examples.
i have closely studied those original thread(s) about the coffee and you're right, there certainly weren't conclusive results. but we're talking a little different.. that was mostly in reference to soaking grains in coffee water, here i'm using standard pf cakes, substituting plain water with a coffee solution... i don't recall anything from those threads about anybody trying it this way. i've experimented with many different concentrations of coffee water too to get where it is today at the 25% reccomendation. coffee (spent grounds) has long been used in commercial cultivation, so i think its usefulness is long known yet often overlooked.
take it as you will, but i garuntee you won't see any harm done, and have a hunch you'll be pleased with the results you do get
|
WIZOLZ
Poor with Needs


Registered: 03/20/06
Posts: 290
Loc: Monte Carlo
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: creamcorn]
#5706435 - 06/03/06 01:19 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Good to see your still adding to this thread CC. I also much enjoy the experimentation factor involved with cultivation, though, I must admit, I'm still an amateur at this point. None the less, its fair to say that although mycelium prefer these well documented grow mediums (BRF, RYE, HPOO etc.) it is not entirely restricted to them. I used a 1/8 cup of orange juice in a BRF cake and though it didnt colonize any quicker, or more efficiantly (lots of mico-piss) it still validated the ability to fruit, which it is now in a small OJ contanier...^_^
God love these little mushrooms...
-------------------- ---------o----o----o-------o------------------------o--o-o- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Requim for a Dream - Paul Oakenfold --------------------------------------------------------------- "The mis/abuse of any form of power, is the worst form of ignorance" ------------------------------------------------------------- WIZOLZ - Lover with a Killer's Smile
|
kilroy
Hightimes



Registered: 04/26/06
Posts: 768
Loc: Deep within my spirit
Last seen: 13 years, 3 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: WIZOLZ]
#5706466 - 06/03/06 01:30 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Ever since I found this thread I have been using coffee in my brf jars and I must admit it helps the colonization alot. Thanks CC and I usally include a link to this thread when new people ask questions about speeding up thier jars. GJ keep it up
-------------------- IS NOT THE JOURNEY OF THE TRIP JUST AS IMPORTANT AS REACHING THE DESTINATION.
|
IGnosticAbhorI
Stranger-er

Registered: 11/06/04
Posts: 4,899
Last seen: 8 months, 5 days
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: kilroy]
#5706703 - 06/03/06 04:53 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Indeed.
What bugs me most is knowing exactly what it is in the coffee (if it's anything at all)
Caffinee? Something in the bean itself? That's what drives me nuts.
However, without a scientific study with controls and certains things mointored closly and without using an isolated strain, you can't say for a fact that it's due to coffee. However, you can't say that it isn't due to the coffee either 
Either way ...Great thread regardless
-Gnostic
|
creamcorn
mad scientist


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: IGnosticAbhorI]
#5719156 - 06/06/06 02:27 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
IGnosticAbhorI said: Indeed.
What bugs me most is knowing exactly what it is in the coffee (if it's anything at all)
For starters coffee has a high nitrogen content. This is why it's an awesome additive to compost used for mushroom growing, and why its used as plant fertilizer too. A high nitrogen content in hpoo is one of the reasons it works so well. Check this too, coffee has an array of amino acids, vitamins and minerals. We don't think of coffee itself as being very nutritive - but there was a study released recently that most Americans get a majority of their antioxidants from coffee! It's actually rather nutritionally diverse and even though there's certainly things in it useless to a mushroom, there's things useful to it (like phosphorus, which is an all important element when creating psilocybin.)
Quote:
Caffinee? Something in the bean itself? That's what drives me nuts.
Totally doubt its the caffeine. I've been meaning to put that one to rest as I've got a literal "jug" full of lab grade caffeine anyhdrous powder sitting around the house I could certainly experiment with.
Quote:
However, without a scientific study with controls and certains things mointored closly and without using an isolated strain, you can't say for a fact that it's due to coffee. However, you can't say that it isn't due to the coffee either 
Excellent point. That's why that is pretty much how I did it - a tissue culture grown out in LC, and used to start many jars with varied amounts of coffee and controls with none at all. I'm totally dorking and assign a "tracking number" of sorts to my jars and keep a little log book so I know exactly what has what in it, which cake is which, etc. Results have been coming in and continue to do so; got a stockpile of 'em in the fridge and I run a control example along side some of the coffee ones and have repeated a few times, am going for the 4th try at the moment and am pretty confident its going to agree with the first three runs through I wasn't satisfied with the lack of conclusion in previous threads so I did my homework.
Quote:
Either way ...Great thread regardless -Gnostic
Thanks. There's more to come.
I'm working on figuring out "how much is too much"... coffee grounds, if left as grounds, are an excellent source of slower releasing nitrogen. We want our N levels around 2.7% (I forget where I read this but I know I've read it!) I'm trying to figure out how exactly to tweak a regular old PF substrate to have something in that neighborhood by actually adding spent coffee grounds right into the mix. A few early experiments so far show myc gobbles it down at alarming rates while colonizing. Problem is its also acidic, and while myc doesn't seem to mind, bacteria also love it - I can tell you if you want to lose 70% of your jars to bacteria, go ahead and add coffee grounds to them. So part of the process here next is figuring out a pH buffer (thinking gypsum) and doing some pH testing to come up with the right amounts to suggest an easy-to-follow recipe.
Should be interesting. Again its like all the discussions with all the tons of possible additives out there, and this is no miracle pill, but I think this one is pretty appealing because you don't have to hunt around for exotic ingredients in health food stores or anything, just grab those left over coffee grounds in the pot from your morning brew and you're on your way to happier mushrooms
|
retro_killa
[d-_-b]

Registered: 02/23/06
Posts: 332
Loc: Texas
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: creamcorn]
#5746595 - 06/13/06 05:54 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
wow i like it alot i hope mine turn out to look that good
-------------------- - Get outdoors it's amazing! - Enjoy life to the fullest \m/ d-_-b \m/ - RESPECT
|
twiggedoubt
twigburst


Registered: 10/10/01
Posts: 2,387
Last seen: 16 years, 8 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: retro_killa]
#5746984 - 06/13/06 07:32 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Too many variables to say that for sure, you would need to do every jar measured to the mg of every substance, you would have to have many control jars, you would have to measure the water/coffee's weight, you would have to measure its mass to the ul. You would have to but each individual jar in a temperture controlled environement. Not saying it isn't true, just saying it would be a waste of time trying to prove it, whatever works for you, if you think it works thats all that really matters, but it can't be written in stone that it works.
|
kilroy
Hightimes



Registered: 04/26/06
Posts: 768
Loc: Deep within my spirit
Last seen: 13 years, 3 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: twiggedoubt]
#5747002 - 06/13/06 07:35 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
The coffee replacing a 1/4 of the water seems to really make mine go quicker.
-------------------- IS NOT THE JOURNEY OF THE TRIP JUST AS IMPORTANT AS REACHING THE DESTINATION.
|
creamcorn
mad scientist


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: twiggedoubt]
#5747111 - 06/13/06 08:00 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
so you're telling me after several dozens of jars, its just a coincidence that every single one with coffee consistently outperformed every single one without (all in a semi-controlled experiment mind you... isolated clones, they were all incubated in the same incubator, they were all grown in the same FC, so they were subject to the same exact growing parameters anyway)... there's simply no need to measure minute details beyond all that.
are you familiar with statistical analysis? many things are proven every day in our world without such anal experiments. do you think they clone humans and keep them in environmentally controlled cages to test new medications? of course not. and every person is unique. yet they come to conclusions as to which medications are effective and which are harmful all the time. (haha granted i didn't DO a statistical analysis either, but i didn't have to, if you understand how they work and how "confidence intervals" are defined, you'd realize that the results i received given the number of samples didn't even merit one, the answer is pretty obvious.)
i appreciate an eye for detail but i also appreciate being realistic.
you don't have to believe me, nobody does... i've got nothing to gain by helping strangers out on some internet message board. i don't even claim credit for the idea in the first place, as it wasn't mine. so take it as you will. several folks have given it a try and noticed a marked improvement, but you don't have to believe them either. i don't think it works, i know it does, and as i finish out the last of the control jars still hanging around in the fridge i'll never do it the "old" way again
|
SenselessRebel
Stranger


Registered: 05/20/06
Posts: 189
Last seen: 17 years, 3 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: creamcorn]
#5914426 - 07/30/06 08:39 AM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
|
|
i know noones been on this thread for a while but CC man you need to chill for a sec. mad props on the nice compilation of things to tweak pf jars. im definitely going to do the coffee thing. if it doesn't hurt then why not do it!!!
but on the matter of weather it helps: twigged out its right to a certain degree and so are you CC. i think twigged is going a little little bit toooo far with the measurements but he is right that if you wanna be able to 110% prove weather it helps speed up growth or not then you pretty much need to get it down to the .01 of a gram or down to the microL. and you doo need to make sure that everything stays constant except for the one variable you are testing. CC, this is in no way an attack on you and this is in no way a siding with twiggedout. all im saying is that i know the basics for scientific design. keep every variable constant in all your trials and in your control except for the var. your testing.. science runs through my fam too... my father is a shrink and has been for a damn long time. he is a professor (and does studies in many other things but i'm not trying to give away my face nor his). and if i dare say it, he's pritty famous in the shrink field,(but as a personal joke that i make with him, how famous a shrink can be hahaha) but yea and i vol. in a lab with the gov't and i dig science down to the bone. so if you do have a way to keep a constant temp in that incubator (no matter how the growth of mycelium tryes to fluctuate(sp??) it) thats one major thing cuz everyones place is different and everyones growth will change the temp differently. everyones methods are different too but ifyou get everything as exact as possible and have the only variable be the amount of coffee you got in that shit and you have several trial jars for each (at least 3) and you have the same amount of controls as trials and you prove it!!! well then damn my friend you have come across something that puts your name in the books of growing mushrooms (unlesss someone has already done a true test on this and proved it one way are another i just stumbled here today) but yea great thread and i hope you work up your self and are invested in this enough to actually do a scientific test!!!!! if you do dude and you want help setting it up by all means i'll help you and im sure there are mycologists and other scientists up in here!!! later CC -SenselessRebel
|
creamcorn
mad scientist


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: SenselessRebel]
#5915166 - 07/30/06 02:42 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
SenselessRebel said: so if you do have a way to keep a constant temp in that incubator (no matter how the growth of mycelium tryes to fluctuate(sp??) it) thats one major thing cuz everyones place is different and everyones growth will change the temp differently. everyones methods are different too but ifyou get everything as exact as possible and have the only variable be the amount of coffee you got in that shit and you have several trial jars for each (at least 3) and you have the same amount of controls as trials and you prove it!!! well then damn my friend you have come across something that puts your name in the books of growing mushrooms (unlesss someone has already done a true test on this and proved it one way are another i just stumbled here today) but yea great thread and i hope you work up your self and are invested in this enough to actually do a scientific test!!!!! if you do dude and you want help setting it up by all means i'll help you and im sure there are mycologists and other scientists up in here!!! later CC -SenselessRebel
well.... thanks for the props. but yeah the coffee thing wasn't my idea in the first place, not only has it been discussed lots on here previously, but its something commercial growers have known about for ages. so i in no way take credit for any of it, credit is due to all those who figured it out and played with it first. i just screwed around to find an appropriate mount to put in a pf cake, which by no means is a big accomplishment on its own... just a tip, on a message board, for people to try 
anyway, as far as the experimental design... you're missing the point as well as the other poster. ill just put it out there: who cares what the temps are for the experiment? they're near optimal, and relatively constant. perhaps not perfect. but they do not have to be for you to perform a valid experiment. that's what control jars are for. experimental jars AND control jars, go in the same incubator at the same exact time. so if the temp fluctuates for one category, it does so in an identical manner for the other category... because they're being treaded the same way. they were fruited side by side at the same time in the same FC too, so experienced the same temps, humidity, fae, all that.
if i split things up in some way, and tested controls first, then tested coffee second... or had two incubators to keep them separate, yeah then id have problems and it wouldn't be a valid experiment - and in fact wouldn't thave valid controls anymore. (i guess i make too big an assumption when i say "control" that people really know what it means, and all the subtleties that go with it.) thing is, i went through several rounds of this, with coffee jars and control jars, side by side every time, so they were both subject to the same conditions and things like temperature, etc can be thrown right out the window because its not significant to the outcome. if you're so interested in science, learn about good experimental design. you'll see that by doing things like this, many factors can simply be ignored with validity, because they effect the experimental and controls in the same exact way. its really the purpose of using controls. the problem with comparing things to your father's field is that, there's really no such thing as a perfect control in psychology. or in medicine, like i mentioned further back in the thread. you can give people placebos and such, but look how often the placebo recipients still 'experience' the intended result... every person is different (even identical twins come close but are still different people due to unique life experiences) so instead we use large sample sizes and statistical methods to filter out the "noise" in the experiment... its really two different ways (scientific, and statistical) to go about it, and often both types are used together. but at the end of the day, any type of experiment, can be designed to provide valid results, if you understand the nature of what you're working with.
not meaning to get off the subject too much but people keep picking at this like im trying to defend a thesis or something... maybe its my fault for not explaining how i did the experiment in the first place, but i never really thought it was all that big a deal and wasn't even the initial intention of the thread (remember, its a thread about preparing pf jars, just so happens i experimented and found the coffee to be beneficial, so i threw it in as one of the tips... was never meant to be a long explanation of how i came up with that idea, was just sharing it for those who wanted to try ) besides, its really a simple experiment i did and people need to understand its possible to come up with valid conclusions without having big budget research grants and expensive analytical machines and specialy labs built full of phD staffers... just use a little common sense when you design an experiment, and then it can tell you something - its really that simple. and can be appled to lots of things people argue back and forth about on the boards here, so anybody else that wants to try to experiment on some of the mycology "myths" and "vaugeries" they absolutely should (haha just be prepared for everybody to dispute your results)
|
SenselessRebel
Stranger


Registered: 05/20/06
Posts: 189
Last seen: 17 years, 3 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: SenselessRebel]
#5918284 - 07/31/06 11:30 AM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
i know i in no way was giveing you credit for developing the tek and as well i didn't know you had them all side by side all in the same inc and FC. i thought you did several runs and came to the conclusion. so for that point i was incorrect. if you do have them in the same conitions then many vars can be ignored becasue they remain constant through out all the trials. what ever im done here but yea i only inputed cuz i thought you were like trying to prove, for 100% all the time, that coffee will make a benificial difference in the growth of the mushrooms. whatever im done with the cock fight later CC and good tek -SenselessRebel
|
fastfred
Old Hand



Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: SenselessRebel]
#5918401 - 07/31/06 12:15 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Nice thread CC. I might have missed a few points, but I had a couple questions about your experimental design.
I'm assuming you used monoculture as you mentioned that you used an isolated sub-strain. Just hoping you would confirm this and detail that part a little.
You note faster pinning... Could this be simply because of the faster colonization or did you birth each one at 100% colonization?
Can you detail a little more on your concentration experiments? And how confident you are that 25% is the optimal concentration?
Thanks, and good work CC.
-FF
|
creamcorn
mad scientist


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: fastfred]
#5918447 - 07/31/06 12:33 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
I did use a cloned substrain via LC on them... B+ strain, was only tested with that one particular culture - so I suppose different strains might react a little differently, never took it that far.
The jars were refrigerated as they reached full colonization, then birthed together in groups of controls & experimentals, as there was room for them in the FC. it happened over the period of several weeks, so some of them were held under refrigeration for a few days, others were held for a few weeks. the ones that colonized quicker obviously were refrigerated slightly longer than the ones that took longer, so who knows, the quicker pinning could be in part related to that if you believe in the cold-shock camp... all of them experienced refrigeration for at least 24 hours so i think anything beyond that shouldn't have much effect anyway, a stalled jar is a stalled jar IMO...
I tested 10%, 25% and 50%. 10% was a barely noticable increase, not enough to attribute it to the addition of the coffee and could have been due to other variance. 25% there was a noticable increase. 50% gave me lots of problems, a good majority of the jars ended up with bacterial contamination - but not all, so I don't think it was the inoculant or sterilization procedures so much as the acidity making it more suceptible. So 25% seemed to be a safe bet. 50% or even more might just work great if I could get them to reliably go, could have possibly been prevented with the addition of a pH buffer, assuming the jars became prime targets for the bacteria because of the acidity.
All this was really just an informal test for myself, well before I came up with this thread, never intended this to be a pf-coffee-cake thread but i suppose i should have done a better job to back up the suggestion to use it way back when i made it in the first place.
i have gotten tons of PMs from people who have tried this, and many agree there was a noticable difference so i'm confident i don't stand alone here. if anybody is feeling industrious it would be cool to see other concentrations of coffee tested... i just have some other projects at the moment and dont really intend on re-visiting it any time soon. i'm happy enough with colonized pf jars consistently in 10 days flat.
|
fastfred
Old Hand



Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: creamcorn]
#5918514 - 07/31/06 01:02 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Thanks for the response. It seems like a pretty well done experiment. I think it was done well enough to be proof positive for me.
One thing I would point out, as far as experimental design goes, is that every jar has to follow the defined protocol.
While you could write the protocol to do it the way you did, you might be accused of using too lose of a protocol. You could just birth them at 100% and track the times for all of them, but assuming that you don't have precise temp control you could be accused of insufficiently controlling the environmental variables. To get around that you would have to log the temps and show a high P value for a temperature correlation.
IMO it would be best to split it into two experiments. One for colonization and one for fruiting speed. Then you'd have to start the non-coffee ones first with the right delay between them and the coffee ones to get them birthed at the same time.
Of course, that's a bit of work and I realize you weren't planning to publish this. Great experiment though, it's good to know that the coffee debate is more or less settled.
-FF
|
creamcorn
mad scientist


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: fastfred]
#5918580 - 07/31/06 01:30 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
I've long been sold on coffee, well before ever trying to put it in cakes... my wbs grows get hydrated with coffee water, and more recently have been tossing used grounds into bulk subs... something about it is just easily digested by the whole fungi kingdom, look how quick your coffee pot will mold if you don't take the used grounds out!
an interesting read about how coffee farms are fertilized... they use so many of the same things to treat their soil as we do... manures, bloodmeal, bonemeal, fishmeal, seaweed, even coir... and, more recycled coffee. lots of nitrogen gets pumped into those fields, so it only stands to reason a lot of it ends up in the coffee beans themselves. beneficial fungi and bacteria are used in the process to break down the nitrogen into forms usable by the coffee plants so perhaps that's part of the reason its already in the 'correct form'...
|
treeyei
spork


Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 124
Loc: out
Last seen: 6 months, 19 days
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: creamcorn]
#5924195 - 08/02/06 01:43 AM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
about the two tub idea. I read this feelow say this: (((no need for an extra tub. Just add one more inch of geolite and another inch of water, then submerge the fish tank heater into the geolite . In fact i use one inch of geolite at bottom and two inches of perlite on top, i like perlite humidification much more than geolite when using this tubs.)))
What do you think of this idea as compared to two tubs?
-------------------- Everything I post (or have posted) on this website is fictional, even this sentence.
|
creamcorn
mad scientist


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: treeyei]
#5924782 - 08/02/06 09:03 AM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
i think you're describing a fruiting chamber, rather than an incubator, which are two very different things. take a closer look and get the differences straight.
|
Dr_Weird
Medicine Man


Registered: 03/11/06
Posts: 75
Loc: My Laboratory
Last seen: 24 days, 18 hours
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: creamcorn]
#5946409 - 08/09/06 01:39 AM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
I found out that coffee shaves at least 3-4 days off my colonization times (except for the stubborn b+). I've been using it ever since creamcorn linked to this thread from mine (thanks man!) I use the 25/75 coffee to water approach, though another older thread talks about using 50/50. Anyways, I can only do my substrate work late at night so the coffee has two purposes!
|
soma_seeker
Stranger in aStrange Land


Registered: 04/02/06
Posts: 367
Loc: Down under
Last seen: 3 months, 20 days
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: Dr_Weird]
#5946522 - 08/09/06 03:50 AM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
has anyone tried this with instant coffee? do u think there would be a significant difference?
sorry if covered elsewhere, didn't come across it.
-------------------- Taking a psychedelic is analogous to life, if you dwell on reaching the end you'll never enjoy the trip!
|
etam
it's a hobby...


Registered: 04/24/06
Posts: 1,126
Loc: East Coast
Last seen: 15 years, 3 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: soma_seeker]
#6013780 - 08/30/06 09:59 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
I'm sure instant coffee would work fine. It just doesn't taste so good. .
Quote:
soma_seeker said: has anyone tried this with instant coffee? do u think there would be a significant difference?
sorry if covered elsewhere, didn't come across it.
|
dampkring
Traveler

Registered: 08/23/06
Posts: 78
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 17 years, 4 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: creamcorn]
#6014939 - 08/31/06 09:52 AM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Great post! I swear by using 2cc rather than the standard 1cc. I don't know why I have never thought of using 5 holes. I am going to give this a try next time. I remove the tape after the first week and put a surgical mask over the tops (held with a rubber band.
-------------------- The poor have to labour in the face of the majestic equality of the law, which forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread. Existence would be intolerable if we were never to dream. Anatole France
|
mrsage
new hand



Registered: 09/16/06
Posts: 269
Loc: Closer
Last seen: 16 years, 11 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: dampkring]
#6097265 - 09/24/06 11:51 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Thank you sir! I will definately try out the coffee trick on my next batch of jars.
Cheers!
--------------------
Yea maybe sometimes I do feel like shit I aint happy about it, but I'd rather feel like shit ...than be full of shit! - Suicidal Tendencies
|
Pr0_X
CultivationLifer


Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 617
Loc: Igloo's and polar bears
Last seen: 16 years, 1 day
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: mrsage]
#6139519 - 10/06/06 06:18 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
I have to correct something...
baking BRF is a bad idea, it will cook some of it and render it uselesss. Also, it's just a waste of electricity. Sterilization of the jar's is enough to kill any mold spores/bacteria that land in the cake mixture. Also, Straw water/hpoo water does not speed up cake colonization or produce larger flushes or do much of anything expect add another vector for contamination.
Havn't tryed the coffee yet but it sounds neato
-------------------- It's okay to hurt my feelings cause you know, they're so numb anyway. but I guess it's what I get for being to fuckin stupid to stay away - Jake - Support the FSR at www.fsrcanada.com and www.fsre.nl
|
creamcorn
mad scientist


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: Pr0_X]
#6139926 - 10/06/06 09:53 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
The point of the baking is to get the moisture out. Do an experiment for yourself and weigh a bit of BRF then bake it as I suggest and weigh it again. Remember that 1ml water = 1 gram. You'll notice BRF out of the package contains a surprising amount of moisture. If you live in a humid area and/or don't seal up your container of BRF well, it will absorb even more from the air. Its a bit of a perfectionist thing but if you really want to nail your moisture content, its helpful to bake it to that totally dry baseline first. That's the purpose of it... not to sterilize. Like I said you get a head-start on the sterilization as a side effect, but the point is to dry it so you're working with the same level of moisture in your starting ingredients each time.
As for rendering it useless when cooked, that's not true either. If that were true than all the cooked food you eat would be useless... not the case eh? I can tell you for 100% certain it works even overcooked - one of the first times I baked my ingredients I had the heat way too high, the BRF turned a dark brown and smelled kinda off... just for experimentation sake I used it anyway, and I can tell you it colonized and fruited just fine. So baking the BRF lightly and NOT to the point of browning/burning it as I explained, is certainly not a problem from a nutritive standpoint. But trust me, I test and experiment with things thoroughly well before I ever suggest others try them.
Skip the pre-bake if its not for you, do whatever works (and it certainly works fine if you skip that step.) Its just a little more "scientific minded" to assure you're using the same exact recipe each time and not leaving moisture content to chance, and I just prefer it from the consistentcy standpoint.
|
kdmmontana


Registered: 11/09/10
Posts: 1,114
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: creamcorn]
#13683268 - 12/25/10 02:19 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
To the TS:
Ive used coffee in my BRF PF Jars and theyve all outmatched the others by far. After only 15 days (vs 25-30) after knocking the mycelia is already at the bottom of the Jar...
It works...
|
windowpaine
pyschonaut


Registered: 12/05/10
Posts: 14
Loc: NC, USA
Last seen: 12 years, 9 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: kdmmontana]
#13683309 - 12/25/10 02:34 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
LOL. My shrooms would like a vente half-caf please. I'm totally going to try a 25% coffee hydration next time.
|
kdmmontana


Registered: 11/09/10
Posts: 1,114
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: windowpaine]
#13683522 - 12/25/10 03:49 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
I think you should, I was amazed because I doubted that it would grow at all. Im making all my PF Jars with coffee from now on! 
Someone should include this in a TEK:P
|
CAP_TURTLE
Adventurer



Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 1,135
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: kdmmontana]
#13683628 - 12/25/10 04:29 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
I'm not sure what your other factors are but, my jars fully colonize and consolidate for nearly a week in 15 days. No coffee. So maybe it was something else you did or if it seriously speeds it up, maybe there are other things you can tweak to drop that 15 days down to 10 i dont know. Just thought I'd share. The only time it took longer was when i tamped down my jars.
|
Har-Si-Ese

Registered: 12/24/10
Posts: 30
Loc: Boonies
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: CAP_TURTLE]
#13683798 - 12/25/10 05:31 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
I'm on day 16 right now and most of my BRF cakes (shot with LC) are almost done. Hey Cap, what temp are yours set at? I think that may be the difference in time between mine and yours. Just curious.
|
CAP_TURTLE
Adventurer



Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 1,135
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: Har-Si-Ese]
#13685787 - 12/26/10 07:48 AM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
I kind of try for around 80 but tbh I dont know what temp they have been setting at for this last batch. I'll set a thermometer by them and check today. Do you tamp down your jars and what strain are you using. Maybe what you are using is known to be a slow colonizer. I'm gonna try messing around with some coffee my next round though, with pf cakes and grains, and i'll be sure to share my results with you.
|
kdmmontana


Registered: 11/09/10
Posts: 1,114
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: CAP_TURTLE]
#13685984 - 12/26/10 09:24 AM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
I think the variety im using is simply growing slower than others. The variety im growing now is called "The Star Gazer" (some nickname), and its a cubensis. I think my main issue with the first batched was the temps. Now I have a metal safe, placed near a radiator that seems to keep a perfect temperature. I think it was the temps, but even before that they grew slightly faster.
I used honeywater and coffee for the last 7.
Im going to be more careful about temperature now:)
Im not sure what you mean about "tamp", but I assume its tape, there are two layers of microspore tape on my jars, as adviced. It doesnt seem to affect growing speeds at all. Rather they seem to be dependant on water and heat. The last batch had a slightly higher water content, im thinking its that, because the first 20 jars werent that wet. Just my guess..
Edited by kdmmontana (12/26/10 09:27 AM)
|
CAP_TURTLE
Adventurer



Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 1,135
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: kdmmontana]
#13686044 - 12/26/10 09:55 AM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
When I say "tamp" I'm refering to what is written in the original pf tek. It calls for you to fill the jars to the rim then tap the bottoms of the jars till the substrate level falls to 1/2" or so below the rim. I did this years ago and in my first set when i started again before i realised people weren't doing this anymore. I did another set of jars nearly 2 weeks later not doing this and both sets colonised fully at the same time. Now as for your micropore taping the holes, I also experimented with this and not having the micropore tape over the holes (my holes are fairly small, the size of a small nail) provided for faster colonisation it seemed and even if it wasn't the micropore tape isn't necessary so long as you have the added dry verm layer and aren't playing with your jars too much(though I was often guilty of this and still had no problems). So to sum it all up if your "tamping" your jars, try not doing it. And maybe try removing the micropore tape, although if it was me and my cakes were almost colonised I would just leave it on for this round as the added fae in your jar could cause premature pinning. It did for me but i also turned them upside down :/ also probably drawing in fresh air. Sorry for the book. lol
|
Gulfripper
Stranger

Registered: 10/14/09
Posts: 346
Last seen: 8 days, 13 hours
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: CAP_TURTLE] 1
#13686104 - 12/26/10 10:23 AM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
If your doing the regular 2:1:1 fo 5 brf jars. Where would you add the spent coffee and how much?
|
CAP_TURTLE
Adventurer



Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 1,135
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: Gulfripper]
#13686148 - 12/26/10 10:39 AM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Gulfripper said: If your doing the regular 2:1:1 fo 5 brf jars. Where would you add the spent coffee and how much?
I thought maybe he was talking about using actual diluted(probably pretty heavily diluted) coffee in place of the water?
|
Victarius
So I herd you liek Boxxy


Registered: 12/16/10
Posts: 226
Last seen: 9 years, 6 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: CAP_TURTLE]
#13686168 - 12/26/10 10:50 AM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Flour is incredibly combustible.
Consider omitting that step for safety, the water content of BRF is likely negligible.
|
CAP_TURTLE
Adventurer



Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 1,135
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: Victarius]
#13686246 - 12/26/10 11:14 AM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Victarius said: Flour is incredibly combustible.
Consider omitting that step for safety, the water content of BRF is likely negligible.
|
kdmmontana


Registered: 11/09/10
Posts: 1,114
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: CAP_TURTLE]
#13686254 - 12/26/10 11:17 AM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
CAP_TURTLE said: When I say "tamp" I'm refering to what is written in the original pf tek. It calls for you to fill the jars to the rim then tap the bottoms of the jars till the substrate level falls to 1/2" or so below the rim. I did this years ago and in my first set when i started again before i realised people weren't doing this anymore. I did another set of jars nearly 2 weeks later not doing this and both sets colonised fully at the same time. Now as for your micropore taping the holes, I also experimented with this and not having the micropore tape over the holes (my holes are fairly small, the size of a small nail) provided for faster colonisation it seemed and even if it wasn't the micropore tape isn't necessary so long as you have the added dry verm layer and aren't playing with your jars too much(though I was often guilty of this and still had no problems). So to sum it all up if your "tamping" your jars, try not doing it. And maybe try removing the micropore tape, although if it was me and my cakes were almost colonised I would just leave it on for this round as the added fae in your jar could cause premature pinning. It did for me but i also turned them upside down :/ also probably drawing in fresh air. Sorry for the book. lol
I used the exact same method as you described, i tap the jars until the substrate is level and then I add the dry Verm layer. As for the holes, my holes are quite large, so they should do their air exchange just fine and the Micropore tape hasnt caused any problems. All jars have been growing just great with 2 layers. But we all have different experiences.
I have heard two versions of the Micropore story several times. Some people say use it, others dont. I havent so far seen any real cause not to use it so I am sticking with it. Later on I will whip up a batch of test experimental jars (and I will examine these methods carefully), but right now, im keeping everything stable...
As for the FAE, early pinning was an issue I feared, but Ive been checking in on my jars and they all seem healthy and no pins. So far, nothing has happened.
As for the coffee and honeywater that I used, this is how I did it. *this is merely a demonstration of my methods and no real advice, the PF TEK will be with you, always..":P
First I measure up my BRF and Verm and place them in to separate bowls, then I add the water to the Verm. I follow the recipes, except I pour in additional honeywater and coffee (not grounds, fresh from the pot) This causes of course, too much water, but this is solved simply by straining (using a collinder) until the Verm is carrying the correct amount of water. I used my eye for measurement, if there are only a few drops pooling at the bottom of the bowl when the subtrate is squeezed, its right about on the money. Then I add my BRF this is where I get careful, because too little BRF will cause a too wet substrate, so I add a little by little until I notice that its correct. Then I load my jars and into the steamer they go...
You could of course measure up the proper amounts of water directly and add the coffee and honeywater into that instead, but theres a downside to this and its that one never knows how much of the stuff actually goes in there. When I strain it, only miniscule levels remain in the substrate (and also, i dont have the problem of uneven dispersion) and personally, I think thats better. But the best is of course the PF TEK, simple and easy. I just found that this works for me:) All of the above were experimental and was used on 2 batches of PF Jars, both are doing great:)
Here are 3 Pictures of the coffee jars! Have fun!



I still dont know if there is any upside to using honeywater, but it doesnt seem to cause any problems so far:) But Im still waiting for a fact here.
Bless, Kdmmontana
|
Victarius
So I herd you liek Boxxy


Registered: 12/16/10
Posts: 226
Last seen: 9 years, 6 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: kdmmontana]
#13686322 - 12/26/10 11:37 AM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Bake your ingredients first. Lay out the BRF in a pyrex dish or baking pan, as well as a whole bunch of verm in another. Bake at 275 for about 30 minutes.
|
kdmmontana


Registered: 11/09/10
Posts: 1,114
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: Victarius]
#13686353 - 12/26/10 11:46 AM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
I can Imagine what it looks like in a fan oven..Woooosh!
Fecking great video!

Bless!
Edited by kdmmontana (12/26/10 11:56 AM)
|
Victarius
So I herd you liek Boxxy


Registered: 12/16/10
Posts: 226
Last seen: 9 years, 6 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: kdmmontana]
#13686394 - 12/26/10 12:01 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Oh my mistake, I was referencing the OP.
'Twas deed a clerical error!
For this terrible grievance, I shall trudge my way to the gallows, for a short drop and sudden stop :P
|
kdmmontana


Registered: 11/09/10
Posts: 1,114
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: Victarius]
#13686410 - 12/26/10 12:09 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Oh dear sir, that shallnt be necessary. I had a penny stuck in my ear and wasnt listening, i thought wrongly of thee dear sir..but shall it happen again..we shall duel with muskets instead of pistols..:P
By the way dear sir, hast thou taken a shine to my photographs yet, even tis it only the year of our lord 1546 and cameras havent been invented yet..wouldst thou say they look a merry sight..or are they awful...dear sir..
Edited by kdmmontana (12/26/10 12:12 PM)
|
Victarius
So I herd you liek Boxxy


Registered: 12/16/10
Posts: 226
Last seen: 9 years, 6 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: kdmmontana]
#13686466 - 12/26/10 12:26 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Oh captain! those witchcraft paintings are absolutely marvelous!
very even colonization with healthy mycelia, im green with envy. You used brew of the coffee bean to achieve such magnanimous results?
As for our duel, 10 paces and fire... with CANNONS!
|
kdmmontana


Registered: 11/09/10
Posts: 1,114
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: Victarius]
#13686480 - 12/26/10 12:32 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
tis was witchbrew of coffee bush yes, prepared with the recipe above dear sir...tis lighting my heart with a merry flame that thou hast envy..tis means my witchcraft was purposeful and right..shallnt you try it dear sir?
I raise you one on the duel, lets say 20 paces and BATTLESHIPS!
|
Victarius
So I herd you liek Boxxy


Registered: 12/16/10
Posts: 226
Last seen: 9 years, 6 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: kdmmontana]
#13686519 - 12/26/10 12:42 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
I hath been brooding to douse me grains in the steeped essence of coffee for quiet some time now. The pioneer heself, roger the rabbitbeard, persuaded me with his talks of grand booty to be had with brew.
As per our duel. I call your bluff and raise you 30 paces with... ORBITAL BOMBARDMENTS!
|
shroomtastic89
Dolla Dolla Bills Y'all



Registered: 11/28/10
Posts: 573
Loc: USA
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: Victarius]
#13686540 - 12/26/10 12:48 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
great tips
|
kdmmontana


Registered: 11/09/10
Posts: 1,114
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: Victarius]
#13686556 - 12/26/10 12:54 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Yes, quite..
Tis RogerRabbitbeard Ive heard of..a mighty wizard none the less, I also took part in his witchcraft teachings..they say he lives far far away on a mountain..
As for the duel dear sir..you are being outrageosly pompous iwth you so called "orbital" borbardements, havent the dear sir heard that the earth is flat!? Tis is a great hedonism against his holiness the pope, tis requires me to take my quilt and ink and write his holiness on the matter...he shall not be pleased..
I raise you none the less, 40 PACES WITH AN ARMY OF ANGELS, OF GODS OWN STOCK!
|
Base Icks



Registered: 03/19/10
Posts: 6,191
Loc: Shroomshire
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: kdmmontana]
#13686568 - 12/26/10 01:00 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
|
Maharishi_2_U
Opt Out Super Fag


Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 6,316
Loc: The Streets
Last seen: 8 years, 10 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: kdmmontana]
#13686573 - 12/26/10 01:01 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Mmmmmmm kay
|
Base Icks



Registered: 03/19/10
Posts: 6,191
Loc: Shroomshire
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: Maharishi_2_U]
#13686586 - 12/26/10 01:07 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Its

Now get it right.
|
Victarius
So I herd you liek Boxxy


Registered: 12/16/10
Posts: 226
Last seen: 9 years, 6 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: kdmmontana]
#13686620 - 12/26/10 01:18 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
kdmmontana said: I raise you none the less, 40 PACES WITH AN ARMY OF ANGELS, OF GODS OWN STOCK!

I concede, no way to top that!
|
CAP_TURTLE
Adventurer



Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 1,135
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: Victarius]
#13690942 - 12/27/10 01:10 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
|
schweinhundert
blighter

Registered: 10/28/10
Posts: 22
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
|
|
I read great things about adding some gypsum to your brown rice mix in this thread. Seems to give a major boost, gonna try that and coffee next time! Read on: http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/11585613#11585613
-------------------- I told my wife that a husband is like a fine wine; he gets better with age. The next day, she locked me in the cellar.
|
Barakanaten
Ama-gi




Registered: 04/14/10
Posts: 6,163
Loc: PNW Mycosphere( Blessed C...
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: Base Icks]
#13708667 - 12/30/10 09:45 PM (13 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Victarius said:
Quote:
Bake your ingredients first. Lay out the BRF in a pyrex dish or baking pan, as well as a whole bunch of verm in another. Bake at 275 for about 30 minutes.
Quote:
kdmmontana said: I can Imagine what it looks like in a fan oven..Woooosh!
Fecking great video!

Bless!
Quote:
Victarius said: Oh my mistake, I was referencing the OP.
'Twas deed a clerical error!
For this terrible grievance, I shall trudge my way to the gallows, for a short drop and sudden stop :P
Quote:
kdmmontana said: Oh dear sir, that shallnt be necessary. I had a penny stuck in my ear and wasnt listening, i thought wrongly of thee dear sir..but shall it happen again..we shall duel with muskets instead of pistols..:P
By the way dear sir, hast thou taken a shine to my photographs yet, even tis it only the year of our lord 1546 and cameras havent been invented yet..wouldst thou say they look a merry sight..or are they awful...dear sir..
Quote:
Victarius said: Oh captain! those witchcraft paintings are absolutely marvelous!
very even colonization with healthy mycelia, im green with envy. You used brew of the coffee bean to achieve such magnanimous results?
As for our duel, 10 paces and fire... with CANNONS!
Quote:
kdmmontana said: tis was witchbrew of coffee bush yes, prepared with the recipe above dear sir...tis lighting my heart with a merry flame that thou hast envy..tis means my witchcraft was purposeful and right..shallnt you try it dear sir?
I raise you one on the duel, lets say 20 paces and BATTLESHIPS!
Quote:
Victarius said: I hath been brooding to douse me grains in the steeped essence of coffee for quiet some time now. The pioneer heself, roger the rabbitbeard, persuaded me with his talks of grand booty to be had with brew.
As per our duel. I call your bluff and raise you 30 paces with... ORBITAL BOMBARDMENTS!
Quote:
kdmmontana said: Yes, quite..
Tis RogerRabbitbeard Ive heard of..a mighty wizard none the less, I also took part in his witchcraft teachings..they say he lives far far away on a mountain..
As for the duel dear sir..you are being outrageosly pompous iwth you so called "orbital" borbardements, havent the dear sir heard that the earth is flat!? Tis is a great hedonism against his holiness the pope, tis requires me to take my quilt and ink and write his holiness on the matter...he shall not be pleased..
I raise you none the less, 40 PACES WITH AN ARMY OF ANGELS, OF GODS OWN STOCK!
Quote:
Victarius said:
Quote:
kdmmontana said: I raise you none the less, 40 PACES WITH AN ARMY OF ANGELS, OF GODS OWN STOCK!

I concede, no way to top that!
Quote:
Base Icks said:

 Coffee and gypsum does help the pf tek both are great additions.
--------------------
New to cultivation? Have a Question? Because AMU We Q&A Know AMU Genetic Library Easy Felt  AMU  Official PNW Mushroom Hunting Season 2011"...Though in all else he may be as Saintly as St. Francis, in the pursuit of these ends he is more Satanic than Satan. He will betray his nearest and dearest without the slightest twitch of flesh or spirit. He is amoral." -Definition of a mushroom hunter by ~Angelo Pellegrini
|
bateyes88
Professional Amateur



Registered: 09/15/10
Posts: 901
Loc: Anytown, USA 12345
Last seen: 6 years, 11 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: Barakanaten]
#13788278 - 01/14/11 08:16 PM (13 years, 17 days ago) |
|
|
A thread worth BUMPing! Now that I know what it means! (Ill never forget)see what I mean???
|
afrosheen
9Lives the cat



Registered: 03/06/10
Posts: 1,878
Last seen: 2 years, 3 months
|
Re: Tweaking PF jars for super fast colonization! [Re: bateyes88]
#13788461 - 01/14/11 09:02 PM (13 years, 17 days ago) |
|
|
How the hell did I miss this thread?
--------------------
|
|