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OfflinePsilocybeingzz
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Talking with scientologists about drugs.
    #5574226 - 04/30/06 02:21 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

So I am walking dow the street in Vancouver after picking up a peyote button, and some Kratom etc.

And I see a guy waiting to be tricked by one of Scientologies little helpers, the man is sitting, and holdiong 2 things that look like tin cans connected to a machine, that looks like a bad fisherprice toy for babies, really ugly to.

I say... "its a scam, a way to make money, you have to pay to asscend though the levels", the man, already with looks of doubt on his face stands and leaves.

Then the little scientology guy comes up to me, his eyes are wild, and so wide, he almost looks insane, or like he is about to attack me, I am sure I see hate in his eyes, yet he is smiling, almost like Satan would smile, were he real (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

My GF tightens her grip on my arm as this little freak approches us, and honestly, althought he wasent very big, I was kinda scared to, he was creepy.

He tells me about how they have science, and I tell him that his machines "measure" forces that dont exist.
I explain that you can just "use the word science as if you are invoking truth itself"

"In science you strive for objective reasearch, you cant take your view of something, make something up , and call it science, science, only has power and meaning if its SCIENCE, not opinion!!
(sadly it would appear opinion in some cicrles is just as good as science these days (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif) )

I tell him there is nothing wrong with being critical of psycology, but it should be healthy , not phobic.

He spits forths so much funny bullshit , what I really wish is that I would have picked up an mp3 player with voice record, I wish I had clips of this conversation, but I will talk to this guy again I have to, check some of this shit out.....................


"We wont even let people that have done LSD in their past into the highest levels of scientology, because LSD ruinds your mind"
I explain that its not ture, I talk about MAPS(.org) defend the use of mushrooms in cluster headaches, explain that for some people these drugs offer profund "religous" or spiritual experiences, and you cant just write off the experiences of other cultures, past and present, and people, around you.
I say all of this more or less, to no effect.

"we have programs to cleanse your mind of the MEMORIES of doing psychedelic mushrooms"

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
Well fuck ,thats comforting, now all of my problems are solved, all I have to do is pay a fee , and forget all of those good times with friends, the laughing, the insights, the highly philosophical mornings by myself, absorbing what took place the night before, all I have learned about myself, and other people.


I talked about L.Rons sons, no effect, the fact L.Ron just made it all up, and I hear the word SCIENCE again, as if the word, put in any context, used any way, still has meaning.

Thank god for ........................scientology? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/devil.gif)


He just cant understand, that what some people need is therapy, with a real doctor, and for some, even people with serious childhood trauma , LSD, etc etc, often HELP.

I would urge you all to read the amazing, but old, book Psychedelic drugs reconsidered.
There is a thread over at the shroomery with tons of great medical and psychological mushrooms info as well , I will copy some, even if I am .....preaching to the choir.


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Offlinetheuser
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #5574249 - 04/30/06 02:30 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I think LSD could ruin your brain if you did to much of it. I'm sorry you were assaulted.

If I had saw him coming towards my woman and me with a crazy look, I might have broke his nose. :shrug:


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:heart:


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InvisibleBLAST_420
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: theuser]
    #5574326 - 04/30/06 02:55 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I would have told the guy to fuck off and leave me alone, then I would have made fun of his BS right in front of him.


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #5574341 - 04/30/06 03:00 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

This was one of my biggest problems with Scientology as well: the drugs issue.

But in Scientology's defense, "Therapy" is no more objective and scientific (the entire field of psychology/psychiatry for that matter) than an E-meter.

Mental Health "Science" often makes the mistake of using highly subjective things like emotions and generalized reactions as a constant. It is obvious to anyone that the term "attention span" is completely subjective, but a large portion of the world accepts it as a sound fact produced by rigorous scientific study.

If anything, Psychology is the study of the human mind within an ever expanding and changing society, which even then is impossible to nail down accurately and completely.

So I ask you as many of you sit here and scoff at "how stupid and gullible those Scieno's are" that you are no better, nor less gullible for placing belief into a pseudo-science.


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InvisibleNoetical
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #5574354 - 04/30/06 03:02 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

You have such a hard on for psych


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InvisibleStonerguy
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #5574566 - 04/30/06 04:17 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

psilocyberin said:
But in Scientology's defense, "Therapy" is no more objective and scientific (the entire field of psychology/psychiatry for that matter) than an E-meter.





I agree. I think it is more mind over matter type stuff, like you are going to a doctor for a reason so in your mind you tell yourself your getting better(Like when doctors prescribe antibiotics to people with a virus)


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yawn...
SG


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OfflineHarmonic_Order
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: Stonerguy]
    #5575081 - 04/30/06 07:32 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Scientology, a wide-spread organization with "isolated incidents" of breaking and entering, intimidation of witnesses, extortion, blackmail, torture and mistreatment of its lower echelon (yes, I can cite source)
Yeah, sign me up for that
They came around here at the same time and place as the Lyndon LaRouche zanies
One of them approached me at the train station
At the time, I had a mohawk
I could only think of the hissing mohawk guy from Mad Max the Road Warrior
So I grimaced and hissed at her


--------------------
.oOo. Are you high? .oOo.
.oOo. You look like you're on some kind of drug .oOo.


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: Harmonic_Order]
    #5575266 - 04/30/06 08:33 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Can you show documented proof of convictions regarding your allegations that are from reliable new sources?

Im seriously interested.


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OfflineHarmonic_Order
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #5575570 - 04/30/06 10:01 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

(sigh)
Yeah, I can.
Let me get the documents out, this may take a while.

You a Scientologist or something?

[edit] hold on--convictions? Well, let me take a look. But if you believe that strongly in our justice system, I hear Tim Leary got convicted of trying to brainwash America's youth. You believe that? I have sources citing historical documents, legal documents, personal accounts, etc. You have some vested interest in winning this conversation? Just curious.


--------------------
.oOo. Are you high? .oOo.
.oOo. You look like you're on some kind of drug .oOo.


Edited by Harmonic_Order (04/30/06 10:04 PM)


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OfflineHarmonic_Order
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: Harmonic_Order]
    #5575791 - 04/30/06 11:04 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Okay, first part: intimidation of witnesses, malevolence towards underlings and blackmail.
Paul Krassner researched and wrote a book called "The Rise of Sirhan Sirhan in the Scientology Hierarchy."
He intended to reveal his discovery that Sirhan Sirhan, as well as Charles Manson, had both belonged to Scientology.
Krassner announced the intended publication, and the Church of Scientology slapped him with a "three-quarters of a million dollars lawsuit."
The Church then used the suit to leverage Krassner to print an apology article in "The Realist," a Scientologist-owned magazine, but Krassner didn't go for it.
Even before they levied the suit, he had decided not to publish the book.
It later came out in Scientologist records that the Church had earmarked Krassner for an "Operation Dynamite"--code meaning they intended to frame him for some crime as punishment.
Although they eventually rejected that plan, the fact that they even had a code for framing someone tells you a thing or two.

Also, a former member of Scientology's Sea Org, a flotilla of ships that L Ron fled to after legal troubles in the US, recounted his experience. After a lengthy listing of the questions that go along with that box with the wires, in his own words:

"All that information could certainly be used as a source for blackmail. Hubbard had based Scientology's file system on that used by the Nazi spy chief Richard Gehlen. The Ethics exam includes the following disclaimer which an auditor is supposed to read aloud: 'While we cannot guarantee you that matters revealed in this check will be held forever secret, we can promise you faithfully that no part of it nor any answer you make here will be given to the police or state. No Scientologist will ever bear witness against you in court by reason of answers to this security check.' However, one auditor swears that he has often seen pre-Clears' files with information circled, along with notations like, 'We can use this." Indeed, one man had confessed to skimming $25.000 a year from his business, but when he attempted to quit Scientology and get back $40,000 worth of future auditing he'd signed for after getting little sleep for four days, he was told that if he pursued his claim, they would reveal his tax-cheating to the Internal Revenue Service."

Hubbard apparently had so many troubles with various governements' legal actions that he became expatriot. He created a floating nation called Sea Org and made himself the dictator. Krassner's article reveals that as punishment for trying to get his pasport and leave, L Ron had Sirhan silenced, handcuffed in a corner and starved. When he couldn't stand it anymore, Sirhan said he didn't want his passport back and so he regained his freedom.

This comes from Krassner's account of his investigations for that book, an article called "L Ron, Sirhan, Manson and Me." That came out post-2003, and you can read it in "Abuse Your Illusions," Published by Disinformation Press.

And I don't feel like staying up with this subject anymore. Time to smoke a bowl, surf for pr0n, and hit the hay.


--------------------
.oOo. Are you high? .oOo.
.oOo. You look like you're on some kind of drug .oOo.


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OfflineSoulSurfer
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: Harmonic_Order]
    #5575949 - 05/01/06 12:07 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Hey man I live near Vancouver. What I want to know is, where the fuck do you get peyote buttons!!!  :crazy2:


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:sunny: :sunny::sunny:


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Offlineilikebigbuds21
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #5575954 - 05/01/06 12:09 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Even if you did want to, how the hell can they erase the memories of psychedelic experiences?


--------------------
I don't think
I just drink

Cowgold said:
Blacks don't eat mushrooms. You can't be black. It's impossible.


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Offlinegregorio
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #5576170 - 05/01/06 01:34 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Psilocybeingzz said:

Then the little scientology guy comes up to me, his eyes are wild, and so wide, he almost looks insane, or like he is about to attack me, I am sure I see hate in his eyes, yet he is smiling, almost like Satan would smile, were he real (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)






That is something that I have noticed about people from that cult---that look that they all have in their eyes. Kind of like they been brainwashed or something. They all have that look in their eyes and that same smile.

It's creepy.


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OfflinePsilocybeingzz
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #6444628 - 01/10/07 09:32 AM (17 years, 22 days ago)

Quote:

If anything, Psychology is the study of the human mind within an ever expanding and changing society, which even then is impossible to nail down accurately and completely.

So I ask you as many of you sit here and scoff at "how stupid and gullible those Scieno's are" that you are no better, nor less gullible for placing belief into a pseudo-science.





Its NOT pseudo-science. Scientology IS.

I am very critical of psychology, but let me ask you something, have you ever visited someone in the psych ward?? Ever spent large amounts of time there??

I had allot of preconceived notions, and I had allot of theories on the right way to do things from reading all sorts of philosophy and science about the mind, then I realized, this is all very complex, and the more I learn, the less I know(so to speak)  So before you attack psychology(in a Scientology thread no less) think about how HORRIBLE Scientology really is, I have been following this cult for years.

And YES , they DO cover up child abuse, and beatings of adults....they pretty much run the town of Clearwater Florida, as that was L.Rons plan... to take over a town. And they lie about, sue and threaten people that get in their way.

Scientology is nothing short of a criminal institution. And for those of you that might assume I am just reacting to a southpark episode, I am not, it was funny, and I was happy to see it, but I have been following the actions of this SICK CULT, for years.  They should be stripped of any tax exempt status they have. 

This is an old thread, but most of all, I just wanted you all to get a chance to read about my crazy experience with these people, if you are not impressed that I bumped an old thread, or whatever, go to the top of your screen and press BACK.  :tongue: :sun: :heart: :thumbup: :grin: :stoned:


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InvisibleMushmanTheManic
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #6445717 - 01/10/07 03:42 PM (17 years, 22 days ago)

I talked with a OT7 about psychology and Scientology. (She was one crazy bitch.) There actually didn't seem to be many conflicts between the two. Much of Scientology is actually quite similar to psychotherapy. She was insistant that psychology was an evil, maliceful institution that was trying to destroy mankind. Even when Scientology and psychology agreed on something, psychology was still wrong, but some how Scientology wasn't. :shrug: I've concluded Scientologists hate psychology merely because of dogma and not for any rational reason.

This chick's husband also tried to convert my sister to Scientology (my sister works for him.) Fucking cults.


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InvisibleKerbouchardS
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #6445795 - 01/10/07 04:11 PM (17 years, 22 days ago)

I'm so jealous you can just walk down the street and buy peyote buttons!
Are they freshly calloused? are they in condition to be replanted? You're a lucky guy :cool:


--------------------
"War Doesn't Decide Who's Right... It Decides Who's Left."


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OfflinePsilocybeingzz
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: Kerbouchard]
    #6445849 - 01/10/07 04:31 PM (17 years, 22 days ago)

They are in pots, and range in price, from 15-30$ from what I have seen.

I wont be getting them from there anymore, I might have a cheaper source, and I DONT live in Van. But its a great place. :smile:

The best thing about growing peyote in Canada is that its 100% legal, so I am taking full advantage of that :smile: And once you have a few buttons, some pedro grafting stock, peyote seedlings and perekiopsis, you wont need to BUY any peyote.

Just..... grow, graft, switch stock, pot. Repeat!!!
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Words to start your day with, everyday. :laugh:


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Offlinerazmablues
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #6446295 - 01/10/07 06:32 PM (17 years, 22 days ago)

scientologists have always pissed me the fck off.

ignorant bigots in my opinion, always trying to prove everyone else wrong, because of course theres an alien Zenu controlling the creation of planet earth...

in my sociology class, we disected scientologists and found that the group is positive towards most if not every trait of a cult, the list was provided by the text book.

i'm not done with those guys yet  :cool:


--------------------
soft silly music is meaningful, magical :heartpump:


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #6446378 - 01/10/07 06:48 PM (17 years, 22 days ago)

Quote:

Psilocybeingzz said:
Quote:

If anything, Psychology is the study of the human mind within an ever expanding and changing society, which even then is impossible to nail down accurately and completely.

So I ask you as many of you sit here and scoff at "how stupid and gullible those Scieno's are" that you are no better, nor less gullible for placing belief into a pseudo-science.





Its NOT pseudo-science. Scientology IS.

I am very critical of psychology, but let me ask you something, have you ever visited someone in the psych ward?? Ever spent large amounts of time there??




ever gone and spent any amount of time in a Scientology building? I dont really get what that question is supposed to prove.

Quote:

So before you attack psychology(in a Scientology thread no less) think about how HORRIBLE Scientology really is, I have been following this cult for years.




what a compelling argument. Im sure all of your "research" consists of reading second hand reports from Clambake and Xenu.net.

Quote:

And YES , they DO cover up child abuse, and beatings of adults....they pretty much run the town of Clearwater Florida, as that was L.Rons plan... to take over a town. And they lie about, sue and threaten people that get in their way.




I will agree that they are sue happy.... but everything else in the above quote is unfounded bullshit.
How do I know? I lived in Clearwater for a few years, and even played piano at a few of the Scientology funded buildings that were for public and charity use.
In all the years I lived there, nobody I talked to had a problem with Scientologists. It was no different than your average church down the road.

Quote:

Scientology is nothing short of a criminal institution. And for those of you that might assume I am just reacting to a southpark episode, I am not, it was funny, and I was happy to see it, but I have been following the actions of this SICK CULT, for years. They should be stripped of any tax exempt status they have.




Hmmm.... child abuse.... that does sound like a certain church.....<cough...catholic...<cough>... not Scientology though. Most Scientology churched have the equivalent of the mcDonalds Playground for children, as well as day care.

I have nothing against people disliking Scientology, but spewing lies based on the hatred and fiction of other people is kind of petty and seems like a waste of time.

And before you babble on about how I am part of their grand, diabolical scheme to brainwash everyone.... I am not a Scientologist.
But I am well read on the subject, as well as have way more personal experience with the beliefs and inner workings of Scientology than anyone else.

here is a little story about the EVIL SADISTIC ORGANIZATION..... their vatican is called Flag, and it is a renovated hotel in clearwater, FL. In the lobby there is a coffee shop / whole foods store where the majority of people get snacks, watch some movies and socialize. It seats probably 30-40 people.
Eveything is priced the same as any convenience store..... but there is no cashier. About every hour someone comes by and puts all the money in a cash register.

It isn't really a big deal, but it is kind of nice to know that the 300 plus people that go through there every day are honest. It is a very communal and relaxed society.... and while I agree there are problems with the religion, as there are any religion, the people and its parishoners are the most honest and solid people I have ever met.


Edited by psilocyberin (01/10/07 06:50 PM)


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OfflineIrdamage
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Registered: 11/19/05
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Re: Talking with scientologists about drugs. [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #6446518 - 01/10/07 07:22 PM (17 years, 22 days ago)

Good posts everyone. Specially Psilo. Its very easy to forget that not every scientologist is L Ron Hubbard or Tom Cruise. On a related topic, does anyone else find Issac Hayes resigning from South Park due to the scientology episode a little hipocritical? simply for the fact that it finally got around to turning his religion into a satire.(Behind a long list of others)


Edited by Irdamage (01/10/07 07:22 PM)


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