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kilroy69
POKER GOD


Registered: 11/19/00
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Loc: Jackson,MI. And not in pr...
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Victim wielded knife at police-Jackson MI
#5540707 - 04/21/06 11:17 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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When jackson cops say freeze they mean it.
Gun drawn, Officer Lisa Medina backed away from Theresa Cram, shouting at her to drop the knife.
Cram charged and was only a few feet from Medina when she and Sgt. Kevin Hiller, who was standing to the side, fired their Sig Sauer 9mm pistols at the 50-year-old woman, killing her Wednesday morning outside Cram's house on Steward Avenue.
At least two rounds were fired, possibly three.
The unfolding of events -- from officers knocking on the door to Cram lying in her driveway in her blue jeans and T-shirt -- took just seconds, said Jackson Police Chief Ervin Portis.
"Both officers have indicated they felt threatened," Portis said. "You have to use whatever force is necessary in order to defend your own life. I think the officers did everything they could in order to retreat."
A roommate called police Wednesday morning and said Cram was chasing another roommate around the house with a knife. Medina and Hiller -- both trained negotiators -- were among the first officers on the scene about 9 a.m. With the roommate involved in the fight and three other officers standing by outside, the pair knocked on the door to talk with Cram.
Bob Cram, Theresa's 59-year-old brother, said she had a history of mental-health problems dating back at least 25 years, had spent time in a residential mental hospital for schizophrenia and was taking medication.
"She was a good person, but she had her problems," he said. "She was hearing voices, and it got to the point where they controlled her life. She thought people were out to get her all the time."
Cram also indicated his sister had violent episodes in the past when she would hold a knife and try to slash at anyone who came near her. He said those situations ended without injuries when someone would remove the knife from her hand.
But it ended tragically -- both for police and the family -- when Cram came storming from the house Wednesday morning
-------------------- Yeaaa im still alive.
Edited by kilroy69 (04/21/06 11:18 AM)
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barfightlard
tales of theinexpressible



Registered: 01/29/03 
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Re: Victim wielded knife at police-Jackson MI [Re: kilroy69]
#5540716 - 04/21/06 11:20 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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If she attacked them I can understand shooting her, but to the point of death no way. With all of their police training they couldn't place a bullet in her shoulder or leg.....common
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"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks
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kilroy69
POKER GOD


Registered: 11/19/00
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Loc: Jackson,MI. And not in pr...
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Re: Victim wielded knife at police-Jackson MI [Re: barfightlard]
#5540733 - 04/21/06 11:24 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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Thats what I am thinking. Did ya have to kill her?
-------------------- Yeaaa im still alive.
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The_Red_Crayon
Exposer of Truth


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Re: Victim wielded knife at police-Jackson MI [Re: kilroy69]
#5540841 - 04/21/06 11:57 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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Cops are supposed to serve and protect if they want to kill people they can go to Iraq where its perfectly acceptable.
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ShroomFan
nn dmt

Registered: 03/12/04
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Re: Victim wielded knife at police-Jackson MI [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
#5540872 - 04/21/06 12:06 PM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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cops should be trained to the point where that lady could have been taken down with bare hands
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kilroy69
POKER GOD


Registered: 11/19/00
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Re: Victim wielded knife at police-Jackson MI [Re: ShroomFan]
#5550646 - 04/24/06 10:15 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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they called for a beanbag gun but apparently there are only 2 in jackson county and no tasers at all. The woman rushed them before they could get the beanbag gun. My question is why is there only 2 that the cops have access to?
-------------------- Yeaaa im still alive.
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gregorio
Too Damn Old


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Re: Victim wielded knife at police-Jackson MI [Re: kilroy69]
#5550962 - 04/24/06 12:28 PM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
kilroy69 said:
At least two rounds were fired, possibly three.
The unfolding of events ---- took just seconds, said Jackson Police Chief Ervin Portis.
"Both officers have indicated they felt threatened," Portis said. "You have to use whatever force is necessary in order to defend your own life. "
Cram also indicated his sister had violent episodes in the past when she would hold a knife and try to slash at anyone who came near her.
They only fired 2--3 shots??
If someone came at me with a knife I would empty the entire clip into them. 
The whole scene unfolded in just mere seconds, they didn't realy have a choice to be that selective in where they placed their shots.
The moral to this story: Don't bring a knife to a gunfight.
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Bikerfool
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Re: Victim wielded knife at police-Jackson MI [Re: kilroy69]
#5551021 - 04/24/06 12:50 PM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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FUck it, they're justified.
-------------------- Just an angsty teen contributing to the pubs decline with contentless posts.
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fresh313
journeyman


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Re: Victim wielded knife at police-Jackson MI [Re: kilroy69]
#5551046 - 04/24/06 12:59 PM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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in detroit a while back they killed a deaf/mute man with a rake. A RAKE. ill see if i can dig it up.
Detroit police officers on Tuesday shot and killed a deaf and mute man whom they say was ?menacing? them with a garden rake. Relatives and neighbors who witnessed the shooting of 39-year-old Errol Shaw Sr. said police ignored their shouts that the man could not hear or speak and their pleas not to shoot him. The fatal shooting is the latest for the Detroit Police Department, which leads the US in police killings.
?I was screaming down the street, ?He's deaf, he's deaf, he's deaf,'? said Katina Crumpton, Mr. Shaw's 24-year-old niece. She said her uncle was surrounded by four or five police officers who fired at least twice while he was 15 feet away from them. Ms. Crumpton also said that Shaw's mother, Annie Shaw, screamed at the officers not to shoot her son. Both women's pleas were cut short by gunfire, she said. ?It was a cruel, crying shame what happened here today,? Ms. Crumpton told the Detroit Free Press. ?This madness has to stop.?
Police said they were summoned to a house on the city's northwest side Tuesday afternoon by a report that Shaw was armed with a butcher's knife and chasing his parents, with whom he lived. When police confronted Shaw, they say, he ran to the back of the home to get rid of the knife, and then returned with a metal rake. Police claimed they fired when Shaw swung the rake at them. After the shooting, no knife was found.
A police spokesperson claimed that the officers did not know Shaw was a deaf-mute. Several neighbors, however, confirmed that they heard people screaming at police before the shooting that he couldn't hear them. When asked about these statements, Deputy Chief Herman Curry said no one had given that information to investigators. His remarks were disputed by Shaw's niece who said she gave detectives detailed information after witnessing the shooting.
Neighbor Kim Armstrong confirmed this account, telling the Free Press that she heard the shouted warnings while standing outside her home several doors away. ??He's mute, he's deaf, he can't hear,' then three shots?pow, pow, pow,? Armstrong recalled for the local newspaper. ?It was unnecessary. He didn't have a gun?he had a rake,? she said.
Witnesses also denounced police for waiting too long to take Mr. Shaw to the hospital, only a few short blocks away. They said police officers did nothing to save the man while he lay bleeding on the side of the house. One neighbor said all they did was shoo flies away from his bloody wound. It is unclear whether police even called an emergency vehicle?because none showed up. Mr. Shaw was finally taken in a squad car to the hospital where he died of gunshot wounds later that evening.
Ms. Crumpton said detectives appeared ?nonchalant? as she told them what happened and that other officers stood around laughing and joking.
Neighbors insisted that Mr. Shaw?known as ?Errol the yardman? because he did lawn work and odd jobs to earn a living?was not violent. Donald Friday said, ?He was no problem. Their reaction was utterly ridiculous. There's no way in the world that he could have attacked them. I was hurt. Now I'm angry.? Deputy Chief Curry could also give no explanation why police did not use chemical sprays to apprehend Shaw, even though they were equipped with them.
Shaw's son, Errol Jr., said he was told that his father was with his parents and that Shaw's mother told a neighbor to call the police. Shaw's parents said the officers had no reason to shoot their son. The parents have reportedly refused to cooperate with investigators and are going to hire an attorney to sue the department.
Last May, FBI statistics were made public showing that Detroit police officers kill citizens at a higher rate than police in any other big US city. Detroit had a rate of 0.92 fatal shootings per 100,000 residents, far higher than New York and Los Angeles, two cities recently scandalized by revelations of widespread police killings, frame-ups and brutality.
In recent years there have been several cases in which Detroit police have killed or severely wounded senior citizens, teenagers and mentally ill persons, and then were exonerated by internal police investigators and the prosecutor's office, after claiming they had fired in self-defense. Mayor Dennis Archer, a close ally of the Clinton administration, has repeatedly defended the integrity of the internal police inquiries.
i got arrested a month after it happened and i gave the cop so much shit about it as i was in the back of the car gettin takin to the station.
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