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Offlinefirsttimer101
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Need help dealing with rampant bacterial blotch!!!
    #5538704 - 04/20/06 06:26 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

I really don't know what to do at this point. I prepped some rye jars about a month ago and the vast majority contamed with bacterial blotch (wet spot). I used two of the jars that had not contamed (or so I thought) to inoculate a dozen freshly prepared jars. The second batch of rye jars were meticulously prepared...clean air (provided by an Oreck), clean surfaces, clean tools, clean glovebox, everything was perfect. I know that overly wet conditions foster the growth of wet spot, so I made sure that very few rye kernels burst during the simmer and allowed the rye to dry out as much as possible before pressure cooking. I also soaked the rye for well over 24 hrs., another important step in preventing wet spot. Well, after all that I just noticed that one of my jars is coming down with wet spot. I really don't know what to do at this point. Should I toss out all the jars and start the isolation process over again with a fresh syringe? Or should I toss out my bag of rye and and buy a fresh bag? Thanks for the advice.


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Need help dealing with rampant bacterial blotch!!! [Re: firsttimer101]
    #5540562 - 04/21/06 10:22 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

How long did you keep the PC at 15psi? If you kept it there for 90 minutes after a 24 hour soak and simmer, you can be sure the bacterial endospores were killed off at that time.

In my experience, the biggest cause of bacillus is wet filter material on jars. I can't emphasize that enough, because it bit my butt for six months before I figured it out. In my case, I was using plastic lids with synthetic filter disks, which with plastic lids must be placed on the inside of the jar where it gets wet from not only condensation, but gets grain juice on it when you shake the jars. Bacteria can grow and colonize right through wet filter material, whether it be filter disks, polyfil, tyvek or even a verm layer. Remember, bacteria are floating in the air all around us, and out bodies are covered with billions of them. We puke them out by the millions as we breathe. Filters must stay absolutely dry. That's why I recommend using the original metal mason jar lids, with two small 1/16" (1/2 mm) holes drilled into the lid, with the filter disk or tyvek above that and the metal ring screwed on last. This setup keeps your filter dry. Another thing is to be sure to remove the foil after you remove your jars from the PC. Foil will keep the filter material below it damp. Good luck.
RR


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Offlinefirsttimer101
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Re: Need help dealing with rampant bacterial blotch!!! [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #5540661 - 04/21/06 11:00 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Thanks for taking the time to post that. The second time around, I did everything I could to keep the polyfill filters dry (I had read one of your previous posts about the importance of keeping filters dry). Two layers of aluminum foil were placed over each jar and as soon as the pressure inside the PC went down, I removed the lid and sprayed down the filters with Lysol. Because the PC was still very hot, the filters dried in a few minutes.

Could my rye be at fault? Maybe my rye is loaded with bacteria and even a good pressure cook cannot kill off all the bacteria. I realize this is an unlikely possibility, but I just don't know what else it could be.

One other possibility I've been thinking of...I'm using a 2 year old Mirro cooker with a rubber gasket. The gasket has given me trouble in the past i.e. a seal will not form and water drips down the side of the cooker. However, this particular problem hasn't been plaguing me recently. Besides, I don't start the 1 1/2 hour count until a seal has formed and water vapour is only escaping out the top.


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Need help dealing with rampant bacterial blotch!!! [Re: firsttimer101]
    #5541446 - 04/21/06 03:56 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

I can say it's not the pc, and I've never seen rye that wouldn't sterilize. Don't spray the filters with lysol, just let them dry. The problem could be that you're using less than sterile technique when you inoculate your jars. Did you make your own syringe or use one from a vendor?
RR


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semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison


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Offlinefirsttimer101
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Re: Need help dealing with rampant bacterial blotch!!! [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #5541683 - 04/21/06 05:09 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

I really appreciate you taking the time to help me out.

I bought the syringe from a vendor and started the isolation process maybe 3 months ago. I'm thinking that maybe my original jars were contaminated and I've been passing along the bacteria through the grain to grain transfers. All of my efforts to reduce the chances of contamination are completely useless if I'm introducing contaminated spawn.

The problem is definitely not my technique. I am meticulous in my preparations...everything that goes into the glovebox is 100% sterile. I've been using the exact same technique for over a year, and bacterial overgrowth has only become a problem in the last few months.

I've read that birdseed is less prone to bacterial contamination. Should I give WBS a try?


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Need help dealing with rampant bacterial blotch!!! [Re: firsttimer101]
    #5541990 - 04/21/06 07:19 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Stick with rye. That makes sense that you're transferring the bacteria. A jar with bacteria will be extremely hard to break up. A healthy jar will separate into individual kernels with a few whacks against a fully inflated tire. A good jar will also have a very pleasant fresh mushroom smell.
RR


--------------------
Download Let's Grow Mushrooms



semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison


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