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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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OfflineGomp
¡(Bound to·(O))be free!
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Registered: 09/11/04
Posts: 10,888
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: mr_kite]
    #5524352 - 04/17/06 11:12 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

"..this is eternity!"
-Unknown :p


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5524406 - 04/17/06 11:22 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

MushmanTheManic said:
Doesn't matter.
If God isn't beyond human experience then God should be empirically verifiable.



God is subjectively verifiable.


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OfflineShroomerious
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: Gomp]
    #5524414 - 04/17/06 11:24 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

"I do agree with a sentiment that I think you're trying to convey, that Truth shouldn't be forced on anyone. If they are willing to listen, then sing to them, otherwise just smile. "

Exactly that:-)


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OfflineShroomerious
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: Shroomerious]
    #5524426 - 04/17/06 11:26 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

"History has shown that science is always manipulated and used for wrong purposes

1) That is not the fault of science.
2) You could make this argument about nearly anything. "History has shown trees are always manipulated and used for wrong purposes. Catapults, fortresses, spears, etc."
"

True, but honestly, did you read only that sentence? Because on the rest of the paragraph I explain what I mean.


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OfflineShroomerious
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: Shroomerious]
    #5524433 - 04/17/06 11:27 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

"God is subjectively verifiable. "

That, and only that.


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OfflineBasilides
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5525784 - 04/17/06 04:48 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

MushmanTheManic said:
Doesn't matter.
If God isn't beyond human experience then God should be empirically verifiable.




It is the divinity within that experiences the Divine Source. It is not physical, it is the heart that reaches it.


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"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."


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OfflineDeviate
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Registered: 04/20/03
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5525909 - 04/17/06 05:16 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

MushmanTheManic said:
Knowing God isn't beyond the human experience at all.

Prove it to us, then.
Take a picture of God.




take a picture of consciousness. take a picture of a feeling i had in my dream last night. you can't. that doesn't mean it was beyond human experience.

Quote:

Doesn't matter.
If God isn't beyond human experience then God should be empirically verifiable.





how did you reach this conclusion when there are many aspects to human experience which are unverifiable?


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: mr_kite]
    #5525982 - 04/17/06 05:32 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

mr_kite said:
My original post was total bulshit by the way, just to see what would come out of it. I have to say I'm as astonished as I hoped i'd be  :runaway:
Even if you read the first post, did you not notice it didn't make sense at all? It WAS BULLSHIT? Or do you not need to make sense if you mention God?




:lol:

:thumbup:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: Deviate]
    #5526000 - 04/17/06 05:35 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Deviate said:
but this "God" can be known through experience.




God can be known through experience.... known as what?

Quote:


i think you are mistaken in assuming that because  a concept has no use to you, it is useless for everyone.




I state that it is useless in terms of communication with others.

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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OfflineDeviate
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #5526017 - 04/17/06 05:39 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

God can be known through experience.... known as what?




as God? i dont see what you're asking.



Quote:

I state that it is useless in terms of communication with others.




and i state that you are wrong, it is useful.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: Deviate]
    #5526053 - 04/17/06 05:46 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Deviate said:
as God? i dont see what you're asking.




If God can be known as God, then what is God?

Quote:

and i state that you are wrong, it is useful.




It isn't useful to the extent that it is a term that does not represent an explicable concept. One cannot explain God, and there is much ambiguity that results from that inability.

There might be an iota or two of usefulness in using the phrase, but not enough for it to be deemed effective in conveying any given idea. :wink:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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InvisibleMushmanTheManic
Stranger

Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: Silversoul]
    #5526112 - 04/17/06 06:00 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

God is subjectively verifiable.

My knowledge of Gnosticism is poor. :frown:
Would you argue God is part of our psyche, God exists 'externally' but can only be experienced through introspection, or what?

It's hard to understand topics about "God" when don't know which "God" is being talked about. I seem to know what God is not, but haven't a clue what you people think God is (or how this God is experienced.)

take a picture of a feeling i had in my dream last night. you can't. that doesn't mean it was beyond human experience.

I cannot experience your dreams!

how did you reach this conclusion when there are many aspects to human experience which are unverifiable?

Huh? Whether or not experience is verifiable is a whole different topic.


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InvisibleMushmanTheManic
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Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5526117 - 04/17/06 06:00 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Robert Anton Wilson said:

I distinguish between information, all that humans can check by experience, as distinct from noise, those "things" [or non-things, or nothings] that they can only make noises or chatter about.

Examples: {A} I can say "If you open that box on the table, you will find three chocolates inside." Going to the box and opening it, in the sensory-sensual continuum, will quickly confirm or refute my statement, because you will inevitably find [1] less than three chocolates, or perhaps none at all, [2] exactly three chocolates, or [3] more than three chocolates. Results [1] and [3] refute my statement; [2] confirms it.

But {b} I might also say "Opening God for similar investigation, you will find three persons inside," as in fact Romish Magick does say. No investigation of the sensory-sensual manifold can ever confirm or refute this. Scientific philosophers generally describe such statements [about things beyond conformation or refutation] as "meaningless". Following Korzybski, I call them noise, and I venture that we cannot fathom our situation in space-time if we habitually confuse ourselves by mixing type [A] statments, informaiton, with type {b} statements, noise. We may never achieve Total Clarity [short of infinity] but we should at least have the ability to distinguish between what humans can experience and what they can only blather about.

Distinguishing between these two types of statements seems necessary for sanity and survival, because all forms of illusion, delusion, mob hysteria, hallucination etc., dogma, bigotry, "madness," intolerance etc. "idealism," ideology, idiocy, obsession etc. depend upon confusing them.




Edited by MushmanTheManic (04/17/06 06:12 PM)


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Loc: Pandurn
Last seen: 1 year, 12 days
Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5526138 - 04/17/06 06:06 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

:thumbup:

I am going to clip some of that for my cause. :lol:

Crusade! :evil:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Invisibledblaney
Human Being

Registered: 10/03/04
Posts: 7,894
Loc: Here & Now
Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5526260 - 04/17/06 06:38 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

but haven't a clue what you people think God is

It is the ultimate Reality, which is infinite and eternal, and which our finite and temporary universe is dependent upon.


--------------------
"What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?"

"Belief is a beautiful armor
But makes for the heaviest sword"
- John Mayer

Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin.

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln


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OfflineDeviate
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Registered: 04/20/03
Posts: 4,497
Last seen: 8 years, 4 months
Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #5526384 - 04/17/06 07:12 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

If God can be known as God, then what is God?




refer to dblaney's posts.

Quote:


It isn't useful to the extent that it is a term that does not represent an explicable concept. One cannot explain God, and there is much ambiguity that results from that inability.

There might be an iota or two of usefulness in using the phrase, but not enough for it to be deemed effective in conveying any given idea.





despite the ambiquity, i still wouldn't go as far as to call it useless.


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OfflineDeviate
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: Deviate]
    #5526400 - 04/17/06 07:16 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:


I cannot experience your dreams!




nor can you take a picture of consciousness, that doesn't make it a useless term in my mind.


Edited by Deviate (04/17/06 07:19 PM)


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OfflineDeviate
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: Deviate]
    #5526415 - 04/17/06 07:18 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

We may never achieve Total Clarity [short of infinity] but we should at least have the ability to distinguish between what humans can experience and what they can only blather about.

Distinguishing between these two types of statements seems necessary for sanity and survival, because all forms of illusion, delusion, mob hysteria, hallucination etc., dogma, bigotry, "madness," intolerance etc. "idealism," ideology, idiocy, obsession etc. depend upon confusing them.




and we're saying that God can be experienced, not just "blithered about". otherwise, what would be the point?


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OfflineShroomerious
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: Deviate]
    #5527746 - 04/18/06 12:09 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Define what god can be experienced to see if we all agree.


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OfflineDeviate
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Re: What is life if not God-induced existance? [Re: Shroomerious]
    #5527863 - 04/18/06 12:33 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

dblaney already did so. of course, the same concept can be expressed in a multitude of ways but for the sake of simplicity i will not elaborate. i am in agreement with his definition.


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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


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