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OfflineSDP
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Any comments on combing Syrian Rue, Mushrooms & San Pedro
    #5512209 - 04/13/06 12:33 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Hello. I was wondering what your thoughts were on combing 3grams of syrian rue with 3 grams of mushrooms and 9 inch san pedro cutting (all prepared and taken properly).

Do you think throwing in the extra little bit of cactus would make the trip better, or interfere?

Thanks...

-SDP  :stoned:


--------------------
Teonanacatl, open up my eyes
This sacrament, this prayer, beyond the world of lies
Guide me clearly through that which I dont understand
Give me strength to find the path
Help me fight any demons as you flow through me wholely
This is my prayer, that you protect me from evil, and bring me closer to peace
And open up my eyes, so i can see things as you do
Amen


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Invisiblekija
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Re: Any comments on combing Syrian Rue, Mushrooms & San Pedro [Re: SDP]
    #5512416 - 04/13/06 01:48 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

maoi and mesc is a no no fromw what ive read.


--------------------
Am I breathing up or down? says the speaking fictional character.


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Invisiblegiz
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Re: Any comments on combing Syrian Rue, Mushrooms & San Pedro [Re: kija]
    #5512452 - 04/13/06 02:01 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

here is a quote from trout:

First, you are quite correct that combining MAOIs with other psychoactive drugs can lead to dangerous medical problems including serotonin syndrome, hypertensive crisis, and other related serious issues.

Second, it is important to note that not all MAOIs are equal in what they do and how they do it.

I have a more complete discussion of this in my book Sacred Cactis and Some Selected Succulents and the forthcoming version will have more, but here is a brief overview.

Tyramine is not believed to be dangerous with harmine or harmaline since it readily displaces either one. The harmala alkaloids are highly selective and highly reversible MAOIs. They are quite different than some of the prescription drugs such as Phenelzine (Nardil) or Tranycypromine (Parnate) which actually bind irreversibly to the MAO enzymes. With irreversible MAOIs, restoration of normal MAO metabolic function requires that more of the enzymes be produced by the body.

Moclobemide is a pharmaceutical, reversible MAOI that has far fewer food restrictions associated with it and has been used by some in their non-medical exploration of sacred cactus, however there is far too little data about these experiments to say it is safe. Moclobemide is probably the pharmaceutical MAOI most widely used for unapproved experiments with psychoactives, yet there is still far too little data: one would want hundreds or thousands of clear reports of the combinations, not just a few dozen lightly documented cases. The variability between individuals and plant sources are just too great to suggest 'safety'.

It is often said that moclobemide is less 'sedating' and more 'stimulating' in its effects than the harmala alkaloid MAOIs, but it is unclear what this might mean for health safety issues.

Many combinations of drugs with MAOIs can, in fact, be quite dangerous and those experimenting with MAOIs should be aware that they are taking risks.

Of course, whether mescaline (also showing some MAOI activity itself) is safe in combination with any significant level of tyramine has not really been established.

I think it is reasonable to be concerned about combining cactus and MAOIs. The primary reason I've encountered for why people want to use MAOIs with cactus is that they want to be able to use less cactus and get strong effects. A primary reason given is that cactus alone makes them nauseous or that there is a perceived body load. However the reports I've received sugguest that nausea is actually more pronounced in most people who take cactus with MAOIs. Many people do not experience either nausea or vomiting with trichocereus cactus alone.

There is also commonly reported to be more of a body load, more somatic distress and the addition of a strongly sedative component from the combination. One person told me that it actually put them to sleep a couple of hours after onset. The combination of harmala and cactus does apparently work well for some people, though, and they do not seem to have any problems. Dose, careful titration, prep, individual biochemistry? Who knows?

Unfortunately these issues are complicated by the problems with biochemical analyses of the cactus and extrapolating from individual tests. It's probably a mistake to extrapolate any one analysis to mean anything for the broader class of cacti.

Many of these cacti seem to show substantial variation in both their content and composition within any given species and even within a single clone. Reasons for this are not clear as the issue has barely begun to be studied.

Within just the published analysis of T. peruvianus:

1. Agurell reported over 50% of the alkaloid he recovered was tyramine but they also reported finding a TOTAL alkaloid content of between 0.01-0.001% and did NOT find ANY mescaline.

2. Pardanani reported recovering 0.82% mescaline from their peruvianus which was a recovery of 3268 mg of mescaline contaminated with DMPEA, along with 34 mg of tyramine and 40 mg of 3-MeO-tyramine.

3. An HPLC analysis from Health Canada reported even less mescaline from theirs along with what seemed to be an isoquinoline as the major alkaloid. Eight phenethylamines and other unidentified alkaloids were present also but much detail was lacking.

To put it in a nutshell: every analysis of peruvianus I've seen has failed to agree with each other. In fact the only analysis within a single species where there a consistent result is when that species has only been analyzed one time.

- Trout


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Offlineshneck
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Re: Any comments on combing Syrian Rue, Mushrooms & San Pedro [Re: SDP]
    #5512496 - 04/13/06 02:17 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Hmm... What's your tolerance, dude?
3g rue + 3g shrooms is kinda gross by itself (at least for me personally). Adding SP to already mighty combo can be definitely challenging.
Check this, might be of use:
http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=20166
http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=2374
http://users.lycaeum.org/~iamklaus/combine.htm

Peace.


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OfflineSDP
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Re: Any comments on combing Syrian Rue, Mushrooms & San Pedro [Re: shneck]
    #5512905 - 04/13/06 04:30 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Taken high doses many times... 4-7gs... taken 3gs rue w/ 3 shrooms, 3 with 4, and 3 with 7, had a great time each time, so the 3 with 3 should be something very comfortable for me... from the sounds of it though i may be better off not throwin in the cacti... :smile:

Thanks for all the input!!

-SDP  :thumbup:


--------------------
Teonanacatl, open up my eyes
This sacrament, this prayer, beyond the world of lies
Guide me clearly through that which I dont understand
Give me strength to find the path
Help me fight any demons as you flow through me wholely
This is my prayer, that you protect me from evil, and bring me closer to peace
And open up my eyes, so i can see things as you do
Amen


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Offlineshneck
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Re: Any comments on combing Syrian Rue, Mushrooms & San Pedro [Re: SDP]
    #5512975 - 04/13/06 04:57 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Well, if you handled 3 and 7 fine, probably you might go with the cacti just as well, might be a great experience. Guess, it were Shulgin that described that kind of combo, I remember he was very enthusiastic about it.
Will check tommorrow and post the link if I find it.


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OfflineSDP
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Re: Any comments on combing Syrian Rue, Mushrooms & San Pedro [Re: shneck]
    #5513991 - 04/13/06 10:02 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Sounds awesome. We ended up cutting up about a 14 inch piece between the two of us... skinned + cut off and into little chunks. Will be trying everything tommorow. Read the links, pretty good info. My frined and I are talking about munching some of the pieces and seeing how it goes, then maybe munching more... definately starting small, if at all.

-SDP


--------------------
Teonanacatl, open up my eyes
This sacrament, this prayer, beyond the world of lies
Guide me clearly through that which I dont understand
Give me strength to find the path
Help me fight any demons as you flow through me wholely
This is my prayer, that you protect me from evil, and bring me closer to peace
And open up my eyes, so i can see things as you do
Amen


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Offlinepantsboy
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Re: Any comments on combing Syrian Rue, Mushrooms & San Pedro [Re: SDP]
    #5514048 - 04/13/06 10:16 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Your eating the cactus and not extracting it?

Be prepared to puke! Especially if you are going to be taking it with all the other drugs mentioned.


--------------------
Acid doesn't hurt when you're on fire. :frown:




"Mushrooms are only similar to penises in their appearance." - LeBron James (2013)

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"Bus squelching is not to be laughed at."


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OfflineSDP
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Re: Any comments on combing Syrian Rue, Mushrooms & San Pedro [Re: pantsboy]
    #5514894 - 04/14/06 06:43 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Well, was gonna dose the 3gs rue, T+45min then 3gs mushroom, then wait a 20-30 min, then maybe down sone san pedro juice (Boiled down cactus goo juice from 13 inches cactus, goin 2 ways, roughly 1/2 a dose each).

The cactus is still up in the air, but if its a go later, yea im definately gonna be watching out for the stomach cramps, hehehe.

-SDP


--------------------
Teonanacatl, open up my eyes
This sacrament, this prayer, beyond the world of lies
Guide me clearly through that which I dont understand
Give me strength to find the path
Help me fight any demons as you flow through me wholely
This is my prayer, that you protect me from evil, and bring me closer to peace
And open up my eyes, so i can see things as you do
Amen


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