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OfflineDavid_vs_Goliath
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Loose Change video 9/11
    #5476901 - 04/03/06 10:10 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

I don't know if anyone has heard of this new documentary circulating the internet right now but it is mind blowing. It talks about a possible conspiracy on 9/11 and has some excelent "evidence" to "prove" it. I would highly suggest giving it a chance. Once you watch the first 10 minutes you will be hooked. I recently showed the video to an ultra conservative friend of mine who was in shock. Right or wrong this is very interesting stuff. :mad:

Quote:






--------------------
"People living deeply have no fear of death."
"Love the animals, love the plants, love everything. If you love everything, you will perceive the divine mystery in things. Once you perceive it, you will begin to comprehend it better every day. And you will come at last to love the whole world with an all-embracing love."
"Our problems are man-made, therefore they may be solved by man. No problem of human destiny is beyond human beings."


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Offlinedaimyo
Monticello

Registered: 05/13/04
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: David_vs_Goliath]
    #5476913 - 04/03/06 10:14 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

It's been out for a long while, and there's at least 20 threads about it already.

I think there might even be a part two out now.


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"I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man."


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InvisibleGijith
Daisy Chain Eater

Registered: 12/04/03
Posts: 2,400
Loc: New York
Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: David_vs_Goliath]
    #5476914 - 04/03/06 10:15 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

thanks dude!


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what's with neocons and the word 'ilk'?


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Offlinedaimyo
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: Gijith]
    #5476925 - 04/03/06 10:18 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

No part two I guess, just a second edition.


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"I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man."


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OfflineInTheFlesh714
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: daimyo]
    #5479821 - 04/04/06 04:46 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

yep, i posted one about this video too, its good, mostly bullshit but great work


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OfflineACN45
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: InTheFlesh714]
    #5480508 - 04/04/06 08:32 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

what i dont understand or at leats havent picked up on yet is why would the government blow up the trade centers? i mean they could have gotten away with just as much if the planes would just have hit the trade centers and they had not fallen, dont you think? I just dont see a motive. I do believe that they knew it was commin though.


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero

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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: ACN45]
    #5481688 - 04/05/06 06:13 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

> why would the government blow up the trade centers?

To build up support for action in the middle east, leading towards instablilty in the region, thus causing a volatile oil market resulting in huge profits for anybody in the US energy market.

Oh wait, I dodged your question just like every other conspiracy theory answer... sorry.  :grin:  (He asked why blow them up, which I didn't answer.)


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Just another spore in the wind.


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OfflineDarcho
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: Seuss]
    #5481922 - 04/05/06 08:19 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Why blow them up? Maybe you should ask Larry Silverstein, the man who owned all of the World Trade buildings as of July 24th 2001.

If you follow the link, you will see that it is claimed that Silverstein only invested $14 million of his own money. When the buildings were destroyed, he received approx. $5 billion in insurance money. Supposedly, he took out the insurance policy not too soon before 9/11. Just search google for "Larry Silverstein" and "insurance policy".

A $4 billion plus profit is not too bad, don't you think? All it took was.., well, I think we know that part.


Edited by Darcho (04/05/06 12:51 PM)


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OfflineACN45
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: Darcho]
    #5482616 - 04/05/06 12:06 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

so your saying the government went through all of these efforts so Larry Silvestein could get rich? Doesnt make sense to me.


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OfflineDarcho
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: ACN45]
    #5482811 - 04/05/06 12:51 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

No, I am sure there would be more to it than that. However, this could be a reason as to why the buildings were demolished, and not just hit and not fallen.


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OfflinePsilocybeingzz
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: Darcho]
    #5483214 - 04/05/06 02:53 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

There are other videos that make good points as well.
http://www.guerrillanews.com/
I will watch the whole video later , I am in a cafe right now and I have to leave, but so far it looks good, and operations northwoods is th perfect example of sick state the US government is in, simply disgusting.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: Darcho]
    #5483435 - 04/05/06 04:00 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Darcho said:
Why blow them up? Maybe you should ask Larry Silverstein, the man who owned all of the World Trade buildings as of July 24th 2001.

If you follow the link, you will see that it is claimed that Silverstein only invested $14 million of his own money. When the buildings were destroyed, he received approx. $5 billion in insurance money. Supposedly, he took out the insurance policy not too soon before 9/11. Just search google for "Larry Silverstein" and "insurance policy".

A $4 billion plus profit is not too bad, don't you think? All it took was.., well, I think we know that part.




If you follow the link? IF YOU FOLLOW THE LINK? Are you fucking kidding me? You wrote "the man who owned all of the World Trade buildings as of July 24th 2001." He doesn't own one ounce of trade center debris, much less the buildings that used to be there or the land they were built on. He rented them from the Port Authority of NY/NJ. He leased the buildings for less than 2 months before they were destroyed. He's still on the hook for the lease plus the cost of reconstruction (he was responsible for maintaining insurance). Could you be more clueless? Profit? He's fucked. The insurance companies screwed him by claiming both plane crashes were one incident and essentially halved their liability. 4 billion isn't enough to rebuild. "Supposedly, he took out the insurance policy not too soon before 9/11." Well yeah, seeing as how he didn't become the leaseholder NOT TOO SOON before 9/11. Sometimes some people's ignorance just makes me amazed.


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OfflineDavid_vs_Goliath
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: zappaisgod]
    #5483537 - 04/05/06 04:19 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

The New American Century
you might want to check out this website, i suggest clickin on the Statement of Principles. check out the date it was written 1997. Scroll to the bottom and look at the men who are associated.

http://www.newamericancentury.org/

Also check out this listing the people involved and their jobs and connections
http://www.thefourreasons.org/pnac.htm


Elliott Abrams Gary Bauer William J. Bennett Jeb Bush

Dick Cheney Eliot A. Cohen Midge Decter Paula Dobriansky Steve Forbes

Aaron Friedberg Francis Fukuyama Frank Gaffney Fred C. Ikle

Donald Kagan Zalmay Khalilzad I. Lewis Libby Norman Podhoretz

Dan Quayle Peter W. Rodman Stephen P. Rosen Henry S. Rowen

Donald Rumsfeld Vin Weber George Weigel Paul Wolfowitz


Quotes from statement
"We aim to change this. We aim to make the case and rally support for American global leadership"
"We are in danger of squandering the opportunity and failing the challenge. We are living off the capital -- both the military investments and the foreign policy achievements -- built up by past administrations. Cuts in foreign affairs and defense spending, inattention to the tools of statecraft, and inconstant leadership are making it increasingly difficult to sustain American influence around the world."
"We seem to have forgotten the essential elements of the Reagan Administration's success: a military that is strong and ready to meet both present and future challenges; a foreign policy that boldly and purposefully promotes American principles abroad; and national leadership that accepts the United States' global responsibilities."


AND THE KILLER
"Further, the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event ? like a new Pearl Harbor."
This quote has been recently removed from the mission statement...

Check out wikepedia's article on the organization
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_for_the_New_American_Century


--------------------
"People living deeply have no fear of death."
"Love the animals, love the plants, love everything. If you love everything, you will perceive the divine mystery in things. Once you perceive it, you will begin to comprehend it better every day. And you will come at last to love the whole world with an all-embracing love."
"Our problems are man-made, therefore they may be solved by man. No problem of human destiny is beyond human beings."


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: David_vs_Goliath]
    #5483601 - 04/05/06 04:34 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

I did check Wiki. This is what it said about the "KILLER"
"A line frequently quoted by critics from Rebuilding America's Defenses famously refers to the possibility of a "catastrophic and catalyzing event ? like a new Pearl Harbor" (page 51). This quote appears in Chapter V, entitled "Creating Tomorrow's Dominant Force", which discusses the perceived need for the Department of Defense to "move more aggressively to experiment with new technologies and operational concepts? (page 50). The full quote is as follows: "Further, the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event ? like a new Pearl Harbor." Some opponents of the Bush administration have used this quote as evidence for their belief the US government was complicit in the 9/11 terrorist attacks. See the article 9/11 conspiracy theories for further information on this topic. Many critics also claim the PNAC believed this "new Pearl Harbor" would justify war on Iraq."
What it says, to paraphrase slightly, is that some whack jobs have glommed on to this to support their lunatic theories. More moronity.
Please try to bring a better game next time.


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OfflineDavid_vs_Goliath
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: zappaisgod]
    #5484500 - 04/05/06 08:46 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

your post just had no point to it, you reiterated everything I said and at the end you added that it is "moronity". Thank you for your information


--------------------
"People living deeply have no fear of death."
"Love the animals, love the plants, love everything. If you love everything, you will perceive the divine mystery in things. Once you perceive it, you will begin to comprehend it better every day. And you will come at last to love the whole world with an all-embracing love."
"Our problems are man-made, therefore they may be solved by man. No problem of human destiny is beyond human beings."


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Offlinebeatnicknick
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: David_vs_Goliath]
    #5484840 - 04/05/06 10:17 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

They had very good reason to blow up the buildings. You see, terrorists are not just people that hate freedom, no they plenty like freedom just like any other human being, 9/11 was really not about that, no one would kill themselves over that, though you've heard out of the bush administration, repeated over and over again. "They just hate freedom." Haha get one of them to say that! I'm sure they'd fight comfort, happiness, and religious freedom too.

They're killing themselves for freedom from us, from things we've done to them, like keep our bases in places they've wanted us out like in Saudi Arabia, things that the Bush Administration could have easily triggered or if anything stopped. Then Bush has the warnings about 9/11 on his desk weeks before it happens and doesn't even alert the public about it, doens't even make a move? Then the day after 9/11 he's looking for connections to Al Qaeda and Iraq, the CIA and FBI cannot find any, they send the message to him and he bounces it back saying "Wrong answer." Those two things alone should be enough to make anyone flip their lid and make a big light bulb in there head go "Click!"

How much more obvious is it that the administration had some part in the execution of this, even if it was just not preventing it? Look at how they've benefited. The vice presidents company has booming profits while the entire country goes farther into deficits. This is because we're in Iraq, its extremely costly but not on those of the Bush administration, just to the family's of the kids sent there to die trying to "defend freedom."

What, is it impossible to have a crooked leader? Has it never happened in the past that a leader that was charismatic, idolisable, and was able to bring out nationalism in his people but was actually in it for crooked reasons, personal gain, and was inhumane about it?(Stalin, Hitler) How else could someone get away with all this? Is it not the first time that a government has so much control over corporations and money that they can keep the public convinced they haven't done a thing wrong (try and tell me radio stations and television shows like Fox News aren't reporting what the white house wants exactly for the people to hear) They claim to be fair and balanced, but what station wouldn't claim that if they were on a payroll with the government?

Liberals, if you were offered 40 million a year to have your own political show on fox news but part of the deal was that you present your reporting to coincide with that the word of the network, ultimately controlled by the republicans like the Bush Administration, wouldn't you take that job? It's easy to see that with the amount of money they have they control people, have there way, and they can do it by reaching out to millions and millions of people each and every day through boxes planted all around there house, called television screens.

It can be described as a mafia, the way they work their business, and you can't deny that modern mafias do exist and are very underground. So what makes the Bush Administration immune to possibility of running their business like that? Do you want to deny that possibility because Bush seems like a nice guy? They are simply a runner of organised crime, their business being:

They are for the corporations, they make corporations richer with things that hurt the every day man, there environmental policies that are polluting our world but in turn letting big business do whatever to the earth they need in order to grow their business, from logging once protected forests to dumping chemicals without proper procedure and care. Their tax cuts for the wealthy are an example of how they've gained the wealthy's support, and in turn the regular Americans support. So many Americans (33% approve of Bush) even after all this knowledge has been put out there deny that Bush is the least bit corrupt! They think that when everyone makes these obvious connections are simply because they are crazy. Yes, the 33% here are the normal ones. I always here it. "Those crazy leftists!" "They're just conspiracy theorists who want to ruin freedom, that's all!" Yet little do they know the man they voted for is screwing them up the ass, everyday, every single day. We're all crazy, is that their best defense? Is it because they either don't get it, don't want to get it, or are so stubborn they get it but don't want to seem like a dumbass? Well let me tell you no one seems like a bigger dumbass.

So to answer in a few paragraphs, why would they blow up the buildings, read above, over and over again until you leftover stubbon people get over the fact that the government is not some church-going rich folk who got elected, but are like the people that run gangs and mafias, with a smily gentle attitude and attractive personalities to make that idea seem out of this world ridiculous. But if you think about it, it makes complete sense, and if a mafia ever did run the government, they'd run it exactly like that.


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I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.


Edited by beatnicknick (04/05/06 10:27 PM)


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OfflineDarcho
PhysicallyDetermined

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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: zappaisgod]
    #5484876 - 04/05/06 10:24 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

Darcho said:
Why blow them up? Maybe you should ask Larry Silverstein, the man who owned all of the World Trade buildings as of July 24th 2001.

If you follow the link, you will see that it is claimed that Silverstein only invested $14 million of his own money. When the buildings were destroyed, he received approx. $5 billion in insurance money. Supposedly, he took out the insurance policy not too soon before 9/11. Just search google for "Larry Silverstein" and "insurance policy".

A $4 billion plus profit is not too bad, don't you think? All it took was.., well, I think we know that part.




If you follow the link? IF YOU FOLLOW THE LINK? Are you fucking kidding me? You wrote "the man who owned all of the World Trade buildings as of July 24th 2001." He doesn't own one ounce of trade center debris, much less the buildings that used to be there or the land they were built on. He rented them from the Port Authority of NY/NJ. He leased the buildings for less than 2 months before they were destroyed. He's still on the hook for the lease plus the cost of reconstruction (he was responsible for maintaining insurance). Could you be more clueless? Profit? He's fucked. The insurance companies screwed him by claiming both plane crashes were one incident and essentially halved their liability. 4 billion isn't enough to rebuild. "Supposedly, he took out the insurance policy not too soon before 9/11." Well yeah, seeing as how he didn't become the leaseholder NOT TOO SOON before 9/11. Sometimes some people's ignorance just makes me amazed.




Is he so fucked? Where are your sources? I at least posted one and offered a search string that would lead to many more. As of March 2006 Silverstein has been said to have received over $5 billion.

Clueless? Me? Perhaps, but I do not claim to know. I am simply passing along what is out there. If the information is wrong, then so be it. Take issue with the source and don't shoot the messenger. You have Alex Jones out there claiming exactly what I said (well maybe not exactly, but along the same lines).

So like I said the post you were responding to: IF YOU FOLLOW THE LINK. Notice how I did not claim that this knowledge was mine, but what was being claimed on a website, and a frequently used one at that (Wikipedia).

Lets look at this a bit further:

"The lease agreement applied to World Trade Center Buildings One, Two, Four and Five World Trade Center, and about 425,000 square feet of retail space. Silverstein put up only $14 million of his own money [2] and the $3.2 billion deal closed on July 24th. Larry Silverstein already owned 7 World Trade Center which was also destroyed in the attack."

The last sentence in this quote from THE LINK implies that Silverstein owned all the world trade center buildings. He already owned building seven, implying that he now owns the other buildings.

Next:

"Following the attacks, Silverstein was awarded an insurance payment of more than three and a half billion dollars to settle his seven-week-old insurance policy[3]. In addition, the Silverstein group sued the insurers liable for the World Trade Center for another three and a half billion dollars, claiming that by an obscure clause in their contract, the two planes constituted two separate terrorist attacks[4]. In total, Silverstein was awarded nearly $5 billion in insurance money following the destruction of the Twin Towers[5]."

^ Taken from the link I posted (but you should know this if you FOLLOWED THE LINK). The LINK THAT YOU WERE TO FOLLOW also provides sources for this material. Not sure how this Silverstein guy is totally fucked and stands to make null profit.

So maybe next time instead of making such an ass of yourself, you could FOLLOW THE LINK, and check out the sources, and then deconstruct them, not the person who is passing along the information. I also suggested a search string for google. If you search with that exact string ("Larry Silverstein" and "insurance policy"), you will see that there is a lot more to it than is mentioned in the wikipedia article. Most of the pages that come up will be on either side of the issue.

"Sometimes some people's ignorance just makes me amazed."

Perhaps it is time to give your ego a rest, and stop looking in the mirror, if you catch my drift.

Sometimes some people's inability to remain civil and not get over-excited just makes me amazed.

http://www.ny1.com/ny1/content/index.jsp?stid=203&aid=57821:

"Among the items being negotiated are agreements over who will build what at the site, how much rent Silverstein will pay, and how to divide what's left of nearly $5 billion in insurance money Silverstein was awarded after the Twin Towers collapsed."

Totally fucked there ^.

"Silverstein says he will stand by his commitment to start building the Freedom Tower in April, and he says he has enough money to move forward on all the projects on the site. However, even he acknowledges it's unclear what happens next."

He definitely does not have enough money to rebuild ^.

Now Silverstein did not make as much money as he wanted to, that is, he did not receive double the insurance payment, as he was attempting to receive. However, he still received a fairly large sum.


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero

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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: Darcho]
    #5485465 - 04/06/06 05:02 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

At least now we are talking about a motive I can relate with... greed/money. I still fail to see why the US government would do something like this so that a sole civilian would have a chance to get some insurance money. Sorry, just doesn't make sense without more to support the theory.


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


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Offlinebeatnicknick
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: Seuss]
    #5485491 - 04/06/06 05:46 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Dude with 9/11 they got the war they wanted, 30% of Americans still believe there was a tie between Saddam and 9/11 when we have yet to find a single one. They got the war, Haliburton got the no-bid oil, profits boomed, and the rich men got richer. There are many reasons why 9/11 helped the Bush Administration, without it things like the Patriot Act, the illegal spying, and many other things they've gotten away with would have never even been considered. 9/11 we live in a post 9/11 world 9/11 this 9/11 that 9/11 my ass it's being abused for power! :thumbdown:


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I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.


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Offlinekotik
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Re: Loose Change video 9/11 [Re: beatnicknick]
    #5485514 - 04/06/06 06:12 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

second edition is by far the best produced, and most fact driven documentary on the topic to date.


--------------------
No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.


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