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Invisibleknowhereman
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Registered: 01/03/06
Posts: 386
Loc: USA
Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Noetical]
    #5466051 - 04/01/06 12:47 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Hmmm uh i think the 33 cents each person should have gotten with the $5 back just went to the manager's tip because who wants to carry around 33cents. So the manager got a $2.99 tip?? hmmeeeh?


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InvisibleCowgold
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Posts: 12,486
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Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Krishna] * 1
    #5466053 - 04/01/06 12:47 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

25 + the managers tip of $2 = $27 plus the 1 dollar each change ($3) = $30


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InvisibleKrishna
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Registered: 05/08/03
Posts: 23,285
Loc: oakland
Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Cowgold]
    #5466058 - 04/01/06 12:50 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

yes, but still - (10-1)X3 +2 = 29. and you can't say that the story can't be looked at by that equation... both describe the situation fully


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InvisibleLakefingers

Registered: 08/26/05
Posts: 6,440
Loc: mumuland
Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Triad]
    #5466060 - 04/01/06 12:51 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Triad said:
Is this proven to be a paradox, or should I keep trying to find a way around it :laugh:




Paradoxes don't need to be proven. Usually they rely on the stupidity of humans, their seeming paradoxicality, or their ability to deceive perception.

At Dictionary.com you can read (boldface is mine):

Quote:

par?a?dox  n.

  1. A seemingly contradictory statement that may nonetheless be true: the paradox that standing is more tiring than walking.
  2. One exhibiting inexplicable or contradictory aspects: ?The silence of midnight, to speak truly, though apparently a paradox, rung in my ears? (Mary Shelley).
  3. An assertion that is essentially self-contradictory, though based on a valid deduction from acceptable premises.
  4. A statement contrary to received opinion.





1. Applies to the first post
2. Applies
3. Does not (the deduction used in the argument is not valid)
4. It seems this applies to, because the received opinion is that it's not a paradox.


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InvisibleStonerguy
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Registered: 05/29/04
Posts: 5,538
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Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Krishna]
    #5466068 - 04/01/06 12:54 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Ok it dosn't work b/c the 2 dollars were the deal. 9*3= 27 + 3 for the dollar they got back. Or 25+3+2 b/c this is the time frame after. You are mixing 2 differnt parts to the storry a past and a current.


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OfflineTriad
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Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Krishna]
    #5466070 - 04/01/06 12:54 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

You can look at that story with that equation, but it's still wrong. :laugh: It's like saying,
1)A man has 2 apples
2)He gives his wife 1 apple
3)2 apples + 1 apple = 3 apples
4)Where did the extra apple come from?


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OfflineKaleidoscope
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Registered: 12/02/05
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Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Lakefingers] * 1
    #5466072 - 04/01/06 12:55 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

the question is not where the last dollar went...but where that one penny went.

8.33 x 3 = 24.99


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InvisibleCowgold
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Registered: 04/04/05
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Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Krishna]
    #5466077 - 04/01/06 12:56 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

कृष्ण,LOL said:
Yes, but still - (10-1)X3 +2 = 29. and you can't say that the story can't be looked at by that equation... both describe the situation fully




The 2 is already in the 27. Add 3 not 2.

10x - 1x = 9x X = 3 9X= 27 went to the motel (that includes the $2) Now, add what the dudes kept, $3. 27 +3 = 30


There's no paradox.


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InvisibleLakefingers

Registered: 08/26/05
Posts: 6,440
Loc: mumuland
Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Krishna]
    #5466078 - 04/01/06 12:56 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

कृष्ण,LOL said:
yes, but still - (10-1)X3 +2 = 29. and you can't say that the story can't be looked at by that equation... both describe the situation fully




If you read my refutation of the paradox you'd see that what you state above is not actually contained within the premises of the "paradox". You're interpreting it as that particular equation because you misread the prose.

Math and logics are less vague than prose, don't confuse them.


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OfflineNickSoapdish
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Registered: 04/15/05
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Last seen: 13 years, 21 days
Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Kaleidoscope]
    #5466080 - 04/01/06 12:57 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Kaleidoscope said:
the question is not where the last dollar went...but where that one penny went.

8.33 x 3 = 24.99




It's not actually 8.33, but 8.33333333333333 repeated, so it's not really a penny missing, but a fraction of one, which just gets rounded out of existence


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InvisibleStonerguy
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Registered: 05/29/04
Posts: 5,538
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Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Kaleidoscope]
    #5466082 - 04/01/06 12:58 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Yall are on the assumption they paid equally 25/3 is 8.3 repeating so someone had to pay more than the other/s.


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yawn...
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OfflineTriad
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Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Triad]
    #5466083 - 04/01/06 12:58 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Yeah, .99 repeated = 1.


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InvisibleCowgold
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Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Stonerguy]
    #5466092 - 04/01/06 01:00 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

They paid 9 each to avoid the .3333 shit. That's why the motel dude got a tip.


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OfflineTriad
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Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Triad]
    #5466097 - 04/01/06 01:02 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

x = .99...
10x = 9.99...
10x - x = 9
9x = 9
x = 1

At least I think thats how it goes.


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InvisibleNoetical
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Registered: 11/28/04
Posts: 9,230
Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Cowgold]
    #5466100 - 04/01/06 01:02 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

$9 each

two of them threw in for the tip and the other paid the extra buck for the room


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InvisibleDieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Krishna]
    #5466110 - 04/01/06 01:06 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

oh not this again. this isnt even close to a paradox in any way mathmatically, its just a corrupt use of converting the english language into an equation.

I like what Triad put above, thats an internet forum classic

.9999....=1 , which is true


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InvisibleCowgold
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Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Triad]
    #5466109 - 04/01/06 01:06 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Triad said:
x = .99...
10x = 9.99...
10x - x = 9
9x = 9
x = 1

At least I think thats how it goes.




10x - x = 10

if x = .99...

then 9x = 8.99,,,


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InvisibleLakefingers

Registered: 08/26/05
Posts: 6,440
Loc: mumuland
Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Triad]
    #5466111 - 04/01/06 01:06 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Triad said:
You can look at that story with that equation, but it's still wrong. :laugh: It's like saying,
1)A man has 2 apples
2)He gives his wife 1 apple
3)2 apples + 1 apple = 3 apples
4)Where did the extra apple come from?




Yeah, your point is that the logic is faulty. But actually it's like saying:
1) Three men have ten apples each
2) They give all thirty apples to a woman
3) The woman says "keep 5, I only need 25"
4) The men give the woman two of those extra five and keep one each
5) They gave her 25 apples, plus they kept one, and gave her two. 
6) ...One of the apples disappeared. Where did it go?

As you see the set of individual men and the set of the three men as a whole is confused. Since most people don't read very well, logically, or mathmatically, it seems to be a paradox -- the sets are confused and properties are attributed to them which are not logically valid, nor logically implied, in the argument. Reread my previous post.


Or people could read my post, but 'man is blind to truth'.


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OfflineTriad
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Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Cowgold]
    #5466119 - 04/01/06 01:09 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Wtf?

10x = 9.99...
x = .99...

9.99.... - 0.99.... = 9?


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InvisibleLakefingers

Registered: 08/26/05
Posts: 6,440
Loc: mumuland
Re: mathematical paradox [Re: Lakefingers]
    #5466120 - 04/01/06 01:09 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

A few of you have been on to this:

forget the .3333333 part. That doesn't prove or disprove the argument. We don't need to know how the money would be divided between the three to prove that the premises are invalid and contradictory.

For the third time: the problem is in the reader's clumsy interpretation of the "paradox".


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