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InvisibleLinkA
Intrinsically No Good

Registered: 07/28/99
Posts: 2,314
Loc: Lost Woods, Hyrule
Dunking a PF cake in a vacuum
    #5459235 - 03/30/06 11:50 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

I had someone send this to the support system, as they're having problems registering right now. I didn't want to ignore it, nor did I want to add it as real tech, so I figured I'd let you guys check it out.

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Although I usually stick to using rye berries I still occasionally use the PF Tek style 1/2 pint jars and BRF/VERM mix for test batches. I have an unusual method for dunking which I would like to share.

Using the biggest glass jar I could find I mounted a car tire air valve in the lid. After filling the jar with ice water and cakes I hook a small vacuum pump up to car tire valve and turn the pump on until I see bubbles exiting the cakes. After they sit for a couple minutes I release the vacuum and remove my cakes which are nicely rejuvinated.

It took a little playing around to get it right but it is possible to rejuvinate many cakes in very little time. The biggest concern of course is water logging the cakes but with a little testing and paying attention to what is happening this concern is placed at a minimum.

I hope that this information will be useful to your members and visitors to your site.


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Wonder had gone away, and he had forgotten that all life is only a set of pictures in the brain, among which there is no difference betwixt those born of real things and those born of inward dreamings, and no cause to value the one above the other.  -- H.P. Lovecraft "The Silver Key"


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InvisibleDragonaut

Registered: 06/24/04
Posts: 6,190
Re: Dunking a PF cake in a vacuum [Re: Link]
    #5459295 - 03/30/06 12:05 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

...is he pumping air in, or out? :confused:


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:dragon:


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OfflineIGnosticAbhorI
Stranger-er

Registered: 11/06/04
Posts: 4,899
Last seen: 8 months, 4 days
Re: Dunking a PF cake in a vacuum [Re: Dragonaut]
    #5459303 - 03/30/06 12:07 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

I see bubbles exiting the cakes.




In?....lol

No idea really...But that's my guess...

What a strange post.

-Gnostic


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Invisiblemusher_420
Stranger

Registered: 08/01/05
Posts: 2,691
Re: Dunking a PF cake in a vacuum [Re: Dragonaut]
    #5459313 - 03/30/06 12:10 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

He said he is dunking in a Vacuum. He must be pumping the air out of the jar. Seems like a good way to do a quick dunk and get your cakes back into the FC.


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My Humidifier Reservoir Expansion Tek

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Offlinestarseed1066
officially hosed

Registered: 04/13/05
Posts: 325
Loc: close enough to get mysel...
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
Re: Dunking a PF cake in a vacuum [Re: musher_420]
    #5459337 - 03/30/06 12:18 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

that's a fantastic idea.


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Under his instruction, I taped drumsticks to his head and turned him into a sort of mummy, or perhaps a caterpiller in a cocoon. He remains this way for about three hours, making bizarre noises, pretending to be a new species that must learn to walk and talk and eat, etc. And he communicates with other life forms by way of the antennae on his head. Eventually we jam a tube from a waterbong into it's mouth and figure he's learned all he needs to know.


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Offlinehyphae
born to grow
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Re: Dunking a PF cake in a vacuum [Re: Link]
    #5460649 - 03/30/06 04:59 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

It's been done and works very nicely.


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InvisibleDragonaut

Registered: 06/24/04
Posts: 6,190
Re: Dunking a PF cake in a vacuum [Re: hyphae]
    #5463476 - 03/31/06 10:51 AM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Is the vaccuum applied all at once, or gradually? Could a sudden collapse and then re-expansion of the mycelial cells do damage to the network, thus having a negative impact on fruiting?


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:dragon:


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OfflineMush_Moe
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Registered: 04/05/06
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Re: Dunking a PF cake in a vacuum [Re: Dragonaut]
    #5482939 - 04/05/06 01:26 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

OK i finally managed to register for the forums, not sure why I could not earlier but I blame it on the shrooms. :o

Anyways I have been using a homemade vacuum jar to dunk my cakes for quite awhile and it has been very successful.

I never tried cranking up the vacuum to the point that it might cause damage. I simply turn the pump on until I see the bubbles starting to slowly stream from the cakes and then turn the pump off and wait a minute or so. By watching the number of bubbles coming from the cakes you can tell how much water is going in.

It really does not take alot of vacuum to achieve the required results and a high volume electric vacuum pump is not required. A friend built a contraption out of some junk pvc that vaguely resembles anything I would call a vacuum pump but it works quite well. My vacuum pump is a little overkill but was built from a old fridge compressor and uses an automotive vacuum advance unit for the one way valve. It only has to be flicked on briefly to provide enough vacuum.

The main thing to watch for is that you do not water log the cakes which can be quite easy if there is too much vacuum or the cakes are left in too long. It is alot easier to remove the cakes early and try again if they are not wet enough then it is to try and dry out water logged cakes.

Take care....


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InvisibleSimisu
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Re: Dunking a PF cake in a vacuum [Re: Mush_Moe]
    #5483025 - 04/05/06 01:52 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

nice entry :tongue:

welcome to the shroomery!


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OfflineZacharian
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Registered: 04/01/06
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Last seen: 17 years, 9 months
Re: Dunking a PF cake in a vacuum [Re: Mush_Moe]
    #5483749 - 04/05/06 05:08 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

How are you hooking the tire valve to the pump?  What does this pump look like?

Have any pictures?  Pls?

:smile:


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OfflineMush_Moe
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Registered: 04/05/06
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Re: Dunking a PF cake in a vacuum [Re: Zacharian]
    #5484421 - 04/05/06 08:09 PM (17 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Zacharian said:
How are you hooking the tire valve to the pump?  What does this pump look like?

Have any pictures?  Pls?

:smile:




I am sorry no pictures at this time but in reality it is actually quite simple.

First off the glass jar I used had a regular thin metal lid so I enforced it by expoxying a metal disk to the outside and then drilled a hole through both layers. Using a little lubricant I pulled the tire valve through the hole and that completed the lid. If you have seen these valves then you will understand that they pretty much seal themselves once installed.

I attached an old bike pump valve to the business end of my vacuuum pump hose. The bike pump valve is the type that allows me to clamp it onto the car tire valve which keeps it in place while I work the pump switch and watch the bubbles.

My vacuum pump was built for another project and then retired to the basement until I found I could use it for this. It was originally a compressor out of an old fridge which I converted over to a vacuum pump with plans I found on the internet. As I said my vacuum pump is a bit overkill for doing this and there are alot simpler solutions. The one my friend built out of junk pvc looks more like a big syringe then a vacuum pump but it works.

There are many designs for homemade vacuum pumps on the internet (I checked) which can be easily made with common materials. It really does not take alot of vacuum to achieve the proper results so pretty much any vacuum pump would work. We are not trying to collapse the jar or remove all the air from the jar but rather just lower the pressure a bit so it is less then the air that is inside our cakes. The higher pressure air bubbles in the cakes are then drawn out and replaced with water.

Although I have never tried I imagine it would be possible to make the cakes explode like a diver rising too fast if the vacuum was too great or too fast but I have never experienced this problem. Just keep the vacuum low, apply slowly and watch them bubbles. Usually when I release the lid there is a small woosh of air entering the jar but no more then there would be opening a new jar of jam for instance.

Am I babbling yet? O yeah what was the question?  :grin:


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OfflineDikaryot
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Registered: 09/27/20
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Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
Re: Dunking a PF cake in a vacuum [Re: Mush_Moe]
    #26957071 - 09/27/20 06:13 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

So I tried this for a rye cake:

After the second flush i weighed the cake to get 81g. I then dunked for 12 hours in water at room temperature and the cake absorbed roughly 12 ml water as measured by weighing (no prior surface drying with tissue paper, so the 12 ml is a high estimate). Afterwards I put the cake under water and applied vacuum (1-2 minutes) from a household vacuum sealer and observed the gas bubbles leaving the cake. Weighing showed that a further 18 ml had been taken up.

I am a little worried having waterlogged or suffocated the cake. Will have to see if I get a 3rd flush and how it compares to the first and the second.


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InvisibleZiran
The Hero of Time
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Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 02/03/16
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Re: Dunking a PF cake in a vacuum [Re: Dikaryot]
    #26957606 - 09/27/20 03:32 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

This thread is 14 years old. lets not bring stuff like this back from the grave. keep it simple


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InvisiblemushboyMDiscord
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Re: Dunking a PF cake in a vacuum [Re: Link]
    #26957621 - 09/27/20 03:32 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

This thread has been closed.

Reason:
...yeeeah..


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