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Xtroome
Stranger
Registered: 03/17/06
Posts: 4
Loc: Cali
Last seen: 17 years, 11 months
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20 Minute Pelletized Straw Substrate
#5454978 - 03/29/06 12:25 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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New account, somewhat experienced grower. I have used Hpoo which is nice to use every once in a while, but I find it a pain to work with because of the time required to pasteurize and parts of my hands becoming stained brown after working with it. I have also worked with straw logs which are nice, but usually only produce one flush, are harder to humidify, and cutting up the straw and storing latge bales is a pain.
The reason of this post is not to debate the different bulk substrates and how easy or hard they are to work with or if straw does or does not affect potency. It is instead meant to provide a simple and quick solution for bulk spawning. This process can be done solely in bathroom, in the amount of time a shower would take. It is quick to colonize and produces good results.
Critter country can be found at a Pet-Co as pet litter. It is fairly cheap at only 10 bucks for 20 pounds.
Unlike other straw pellets, like Straw Net, critter country contains no added chemicals or binders. It is simply ground up wheat straw pressed into little pellets. The straw is also heat treated which seems to take care of pastuirzation.
The straw is ground up and pressed into pellets. It would be nice to have it ground less but oh well, it works.
The best and easiest way to prepare the pellets is to put them in nylon mesh bags available at hardware stores for paint straining. The pellets are hydrated in the sink under hot tap water. The water will become very cloudy and almost muddy as the dust and other small particles are washed away. Several rinses under hot water are performed as the bag is squeezed and mixed. The pellets will expand quite a bit so make sure not to fill the bag too much. I have both just used the straw once expanded and soaked for 20-30 minutes. It seems to not make a noticeable difference.
After the straw is wrung out and squeezed very hard to remove most of the water it is placed into a tub. This gets it close to field capacity.
Calci Sand is a source of calcium carbonate to increase the ph found at Pet-Co. I don?t have a Ph meter and am not sure how much this helps. I have tried spawning without any buffer and it didn?t seem to change much for colonization. A purer source could be used in combination with a Ph meter but again I go with what?s simple and cheap.
A light sprinkling over the surface.
I have used 50/50 straw to Coir with good results and very fast colonization. I have also done 60/30 straw coir again with very good colonization. I have also done 100% straw which took a bit longer to colonize since it was more compact, but again it did completely colonize after a few more days.
Coir is hydrated in the same mesh bag, which works great for coir and one of the best ways to hydrate it in my opinion.
Everything is mixed up with my hands. Clumps of straw are broken up and tried to make as fluffy as possible. The mixture should be hydrated to around field capacity, just like any other bulk substrate. Too much water can cause very slow colonization and bacterial contamination.
One quart of WBS spawn is added per tub and mixed very well. The mixture is then patted down lightly to remove crests and valleys, but not so hard to overly compress.
Here is a close up of the mixture. It is thicker than other substrates but is not ?muddy.? If you end up with mud that can be from not rinsing enough or being overly wet and compressed.
A piece of tinfoil is then pressed over the surface of the casing and holes are poked all over the place. I have had some casings where I checked them everyday and others where I checked after a few days, neither has made a difference in colonization.
Day1
Day 2
Day3
Day5
Another tray almost done ready for a casing or to fruit.
I never took pictures of past flushes but will do so in the next few days. In the past I have used a peat\verm casing layer, but am currently trying out no casing layer in order to cut a few days off the fruiting time.
Any questions comments or improvements would be appreciated. Also once I get over 10 post and access to the grow log, it may turn into one, just have to see.
Xstroome
Edited by Xstroome (03/29/06 02:14 PM)
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HyphalTryptamin
Stranger
Registered: 05/07/05
Posts: 390
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Re: 20 Minute Palletized Straw Substrate [Re: Xtroome]
#5455026 - 03/29/06 12:37 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Where is the pasteurisation in all of this?
Why are you using coir as substrate? I know it can be used for this, but doesn't have that many nutrients and is generally intended to case with...
Inventive ideas though - goodluck
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Xtroome
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Registered: 03/17/06
Posts: 4
Loc: Cali
Last seen: 17 years, 11 months
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Re: 20 Minute Palletized Straw Substrate [Re: HyphalTryptamin]
#5455416 - 03/29/06 02:27 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
HyphalTryptamin said: Where is the pasteurisation in all of this?
Why are you using coir as substrate? I know it can be used for this, but doesn't have that many nutrients and is generally intended to case with...
Inventive ideas though - goodluck
The creation of the straw pellets involves a heat treatment to kill all fungus, mites and any other pests, as it says on the back of the bag. This seems to take care of the pasturization. Also the hot water rinse, while not long enough to really kill everything, definatly dosen?t hurt. In this case, the coir is more used to fluf up the straw. I have found it is not required but helps speed up the colonization and helps in water retention. In the future I would like to try some vermucilite as it is cheaper than coir, but it might make everything too thick.
Xstroome
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S33D
this side up
Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 511
Loc: skylabONE
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Re: 20 Minute Palletized Straw Substrate [Re: Xtroome]
#5456255 - 03/29/06 06:19 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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I use that same brand but Cat Country instead of Critter Country. Works great. I heat up a liquid fertilizer and add that instead of just water. about 14 dollars for 20lbs of shredded wheat straw
-------------------- If my calculations are correct, when this baby hits eighty-eight miles per hour... you're gonna see some serious shit. ~Dr. Emmett Brown
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FooMan
Registered: 02/02/05
Posts: 8,957
Loc: Earth
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Re: 20 Minute Palletized Straw Substrate [Re: HyphalTryptamin]
#5456342 - 03/29/06 06:37 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
HyphalTryptamin said: Why are you using coir as substrate? I know it can be used for this, but doesn't have that many nutrients and is generally intended to case with...
Coir works pretty good. I just posted about it HERE.
To the original poster: I like this idea. Have you ever mixed it h/poo? I think your results would be much better with that mix and you'd get more flushes. As far your issues with the poo, check out the link in my sig for an easy way to pastuerize. It takes about as much effort as you already do with the coir and straw pellets.
-------------------- Quick WBS Prep
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ke1n
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Registered: 11/15/05
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Re: 20 Minute Palletized Straw Substrate [Re: FooMan]
#5457894 - 03/30/06 12:39 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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great idea i think i am going to try it out, especially since it eliminates having to past. the shit
-------------------- Everything that is posted, including pictures and text, are a result of fictional storytelling using images found online and/or created using the latest graphics software. I am a fictional writer who likes to explore the internet world. ------------------------------------ http://www.adobe.com/
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Dem_Bones
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Registered: 02/12/05
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Loc: Oklahoma
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Re: 20 Minute Palletized Straw Substrate [Re: S33D]
#5458000 - 03/30/06 01:23 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
S33D said: I use that same brand but Cat Country instead of Critter Country. Works great. I heat up a liquid fertilizer and add that instead of just water. about 14 dollars for 20lbs of shredded wheat straw
What do you mean by fertilizer ????? you arnt adding plant fertilizer are you!! FUNGUS IS NOT A PLANT ,THATS WHY THAY EACH HAVE THRER OWN KINGDOM, you are closer to fungus than it is to a plant adding fertilizer will not help at all and can really hurt the urea nitrogen is toxic to micilla and the copper sulfate is all so very toxic to fungus, if it is not green you dont give it fertilizer, dont beleave me just drink some
-------------------- At the bottom of this page is a search bar to search all the post and threads on the forum so you can see all the other 500 people who asked the same thing.use the top search too it has shroomery approved FAQs USE IT YOU CAN DO IT !
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IGnosticAbhorI
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Registered: 11/06/04
Posts: 4,899
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Re: 20 Minute Palletized Straw Substrate [Re: Dem_Bones]
#5458067 - 03/30/06 02:05 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Dem_Bones said:
Quote:
S33D said: I use that same brand but Cat Country instead of Critter Country. Works great. I heat up a liquid fertilizer and add that instead of just water. about 14 dollars for 20lbs of shredded wheat straw
What do you mean by fertilizer ????? you arnt adding plant fertilizer are you!! FUNGUS IS NOT A PLANT ,THATS WHY THAY EACH HAVE THRER OWN KINGDOM, you are closer to fungus than it is to a plant adding fertilizer will not help at all and can really hurt the urea nitrogen is toxic to micilla and the copper sulfate is all so very toxic to fungus, if it is not green you dont give it fertilizer, dont beleave me just drink some
I doubt he meant PLANT fertalizer...
Common sense would tell you that if he did, then he wouldn't have had colonization....
Anyways.
It's awesome that it's prepasturized (heated w/e)...Looks like something worth trying out no doubt.
I'm not so sure about that Ph though...I've always BURNED mycelium b/c I mess up the Ph when needing a buffer =-o.
Thanks for the post and write-up.
New to the site, but not new to the ops...hah
Read around man, there's a bunch of good stuff on this site worth taking a gander at.
welcome to the shroomery btw...
tc man
-Gnostic
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Hippie3
mycotopiate
Registered: 11/06/99
Posts: 3,090
Loc: mycotopia.net
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Re: 20 Minute Palletized Straw Substrate [Re: IGnosticAbhorI]
#5458311 - 03/30/06 05:50 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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i like it, Xstroome . well written, well illustrated and useful. can't ask for more. thx for sharing it
-------------------- Admin @ mycotopia.net Mycotopia
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S33D
this side up
Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 511
Loc: skylabONE
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Re: 20 Minute Palletized Straw Substrate [Re: Dem_Bones]
#5458903 - 03/30/06 10:00 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Maybe "fertilizer" was using the wrong word. "Liquid nutrient solution" that sounds better. Dehydrated manure pellets, kelp meal, and canola oil.
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IGnosticAbhorI
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Registered: 11/06/04
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Re: 20 Minute Palletized Straw Substrate [Re: S33D]
#5459020 - 03/30/06 10:46 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
S33D said: Maybe "fertilizer" was using the wrong word. "Liquid nutrient solution" that sounds better. Dehydrated manure pellets, kelp meal, and canola oil.
:clap:
My thoughts EXACTLY.
-Gnostic
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ke1n
Stranger
Registered: 11/15/05
Posts: 359
Last seen: 14 years, 8 months
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Re: 20 Minute Palletized Straw Substrate [Re: IGnosticAbhorI]
#5460471 - 03/30/06 04:27 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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So Xstroome, you you don't pasturize the straw palettes in any way?
-------------------- Everything that is posted, including pictures and text, are a result of fictional storytelling using images found online and/or created using the latest graphics software. I am a fictional writer who likes to explore the internet world. ------------------------------------ http://www.adobe.com/
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Xtroome
Stranger
Registered: 03/17/06
Posts: 4
Loc: Cali
Last seen: 17 years, 11 months
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Re: 20 Minute Palletized Straw Substrate [Re: ke1n]
#5461087 - 03/30/06 06:31 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
FooManShroom said: To the original poster: I like this idea. Have you ever mixed it h/poo? I think your results would be much better with that mix and you'd get more flushes. As far your issues with the poo, check out the link in my sig for an easy way to pastuerize. It takes about as much effort as you already do with the coir and straw pellets.
No I have not tried poo with it but think I will in the future. Before I used to do a 50/50 straw and poo and got some great flushes, but this was back when I could work outside on a burner and large pot. If I can find a crock pot or roaster like agar has I will prob give a 50/50 a shot and see what happens.
Also as antoher poster mentioned, I wouldnt use any type of plant fertilizer. It would be crazy for someone to try to grow plants on straw or horse manure. Plants do well with there own thing and mushrooms do well with their own things.
Quote:
IGnosticAbhorI said: It's awesome that it's prepasturized (heated w/e)...Looks like something worth trying out no doubt.
I'm not so sure about that Ph though...I've always BURNED mycelium b/c I mess up the Ph when needing a buffer =-o.
-Gnostic
Yeah, I would not start pouring hydrated lime into the casing without a ph meter, but this calcium carb is more like sand which will be longer term time release and not really bump the ph all too drastically. If anything I figured, it would not hurt at all, and if they do end up going, multiple flushes could help deal with acidity.
Quote:
ke1n said: So Xstroome, you you don't pasturize the straw palettes in any way?
Nope no real pasteurization on my part. Some might consider running them under tap water as hot as it goes a sort of pasteurization but I doubt it has much of an effect because of how little it spends. I still do like to use the hottest water from the tap since even if it isn?t doing any good it defiantly isn?t hurting. If someone wanted to mix everything up an then pasteurize at around 150-180 I doubt that would hurt at all and would prob be even better, then again, it defeats the point of being able to do all the work in a bathroom in a short amount of time.
I should have some pictures of fruits in the next few days.
Xtroome
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Rahz
Alive Again
Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,285
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Re: 20 Minute Pelletized Straw Substrate [Re: Xtroome]
#5461227 - 03/30/06 07:07 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Nice pictorial, and good thinking with the straw pellets. I've done something similar with crushed cob, but the fruits weren't worthy for the ammount of substrate used. I still use cob as secondary spawn. Like, WBS spawned to cob, cob spawned to final sub. It basically let's me get a 20:1 spawn rate, whole process takes under 2 weeks. I imagine straw pellets would work even better as far as final fruit size/potency.
What's the consistancy? Do you think boiling would break it apart?
Rahz
-------------------- rahz comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace "The object of opening the mind, as of opening the mouth, is to shut it again on something solid." - Gilbert Keith Chesterton
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AKtoker
Shibby
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Re: 20 Minute Pelletized Straw Substrate [Re: Xtroome]
#5465589 - 03/31/06 09:28 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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any updates? I'm interested to see how this turns out
does that vita sand have magnesium in it?
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S33D
this side up
Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 511
Loc: skylabONE
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Re: 20 Minute Pelletized Straw Substrate [Re: Rahz]
#5465907 - 03/31/06 11:48 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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It doesn't need to be boiled. Just add liquid let it soak and it will break up when you mix in your spawn.
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ke1n
Stranger
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Re: 20 Minute Pelletized Straw Substrate [Re: S33D]
#5483080 - 04/05/06 02:08 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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I tried this tek and as soon as it got wet enough to break up it turned into mucky shit-feeling stuff. When i squeezed it with my hand to get the water off it simply seeped between y mfingers. I dont kow if that is how it is supposed to be but to absorb some of the moisture i put in some unsterilized coir and spawned with almost 1:2 ratio of WBS.
I was concerined about the coir but we'll have to see what happens.
Xstroome, is that basically how you do it?
-------------------- Everything that is posted, including pictures and text, are a result of fictional storytelling using images found online and/or created using the latest graphics software. I am a fictional writer who likes to explore the internet world. ------------------------------------ http://www.adobe.com/
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Xtroome
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Last seen: 17 years, 11 months
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Re: 20 Minute Pelletized Straw Substrate [Re: ke1n]
#5483125 - 04/05/06 02:21 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
ke1n said: I tried this tek and as soon as it got wet enough to break up it turned into mucky shit-feeling stuff. When i squeezed it with my hand to get the water off it simply seeped between y mfingers. I dont kow if that is how it is supposed to be but to absorb some of the moisture i put in some unsterilized coir and spawned with almost 1:2 ratio of WBS.
I was concerined about the coir but we'll have to see what happens.
Xstroome, is that basically how you do it?
No that is not how I do it. I do it as seen in the pictorial. I have tried to just add water but found just like you that it turns into mush. To fix that I stared using the mesh bag in order to rinse out some of the dust that causes to to be more mushy. Also with the mesh bag it will stay together when you try to get some of the extra water out and not run through your fingers. I would still let yours run its course. If it is not too wet it should still colonize and your 2:1 spawn ratio will help. Hopefully everything will turn out.
Xtroome
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ke1n
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Re: 20 Minute Pelletized Straw Substrate [Re: Xtroome]
#5483486 - 04/05/06 04:10 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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thanks man, i did as you did but with a pillowcase instead of a mesh bag, and rinsed it several times. I should have squeezed it more but hopefully the coir absorbed enough of it.
PEace
-------------------- Everything that is posted, including pictures and text, are a result of fictional storytelling using images found online and/or created using the latest graphics software. I am a fictional writer who likes to explore the internet world. ------------------------------------ http://www.adobe.com/
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DaCultivater
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Re: 20 Minute Pelletized Straw Substrate [Re: ke1n]
#5483704 - 04/05/06 04:57 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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so you rince the coir seprate? or in the same bag at the same time? you don't rince teh coir? how do you not get contam like thins with no streilisation of anything? what are your steril teks? are you saying that since the substrate colonises so fast there is no time for contam to start? have you ever had contam, whats your % sucsess rate if so?
lol sorry for all the questions but if this works consistantly, it could be revolutionary (in my eyes at least)
-------------------- as they said in some movie(i don't remember which one); a belief is a dangerous thing, people will kill over it; instead of believing you need to find your facts and then have an opinionated idea that you are willing to change in light of new evidence
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