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Stranger Registered: 03/04/06 Posts: 26 Loc: New Brunswick Last seen: 16 years, 10 months |
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Just recently I've been trying to see auras...which I'm pretty sure i've been doing unless I'm just seeing things....anyway I'm justa newbie so....
here <---I took my advice from this page on how to see them and then I checked out my own aura in the mirror....so I get this green aura right....then I close my eyes and it's red/orange....I'm like ok...open my eyes and i get the green aura, move and then I see a green outer color, a then layer of purple and then an inner layer of red....?? I've got 3 questions.... Why is it a different colour when I close my eyes?? Am I supposed to close my eyes like this site mentions?? Why do I have different layers of aura and what are they?? I've looked at a bunch of sites on the different colours that an aura can be and I'm gettin some really different answers to what one colour can be....anyone with experience be able to tell/show me what colour's what?
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¡(Bound to·(O))be free! Registered: 09/11/04 Posts: 10,888 Loc: I re·side [prim Last seen: 10 months, 23 days |
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Dunno, but found this..
http://www.psychics.co.uk/aura/aura_colours.html It would be a lot of explaining as so few got common ground, in this quest.. fear not, they/"we" are getting together.. "one became many, many became one, .. as many!" -Unknown..
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Stranger Registered: 12/28/05 Posts: 555 Last seen: 15 years, 7 months |
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how about just getting it 'checked' by someone who can? are there even such places?
oh, and if there are... I suggest seeing more than just one person... just to make sure its all not just a bunch of balooney
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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i observe that most people's auras normally are green or a blue-green color. different colors in auras is normal but you have to get good at seeing first to really percieve all the subtle differences in a person's aura. starting off, i couldnt even see the color just the white-light outline or enevelope as psychics call it. different lighting allows you to see auras better or worse depending on the condition. natural light being the best, flourescent being the worst.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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Just recently I've been trying to see auras...which I'm pretty sure i've been doing unless I'm just seeing things
You're just seeing things. In EVERY proper test of aura-seeing, where the subject whose aura is to be seen is placed randomly behind one of several screens just high enough to prevent the seer from knowing where he is, the seer scores exactly the same as random guessing and NEVER any better. This has been tried again and again and again with the same results. Often, the seers are genuinely perplexed at their complete inability to see auras when they don't know behind which screen a person is standing. But the explanation is simple: self-deception. They want magical powers to be real and convince themselves into believing they can see something that they cannot. They want to find magic rather than the truth, whatever it may be. This goes for EVERY psychic and paranormal power that has ever been tested under proper observing conditions. Sorry... By the way, if, after reading this, you are still convinced that you (or someone you know) can see auras, there is a $1 million prize waiting for you at the James Randi Educational Foundation if you can demonstrate actually doing it. I'll even pay your travel and lodging expenses to try for the prize if you can pass the preliminary test. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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※※※※※※ Registered: 12/22/02 Posts: 6,367 Loc: Europe Last seen: 8 months, 9 days |
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Who decided and how did they decide what colour means what?
And if aura cameras can measure aura's, why can't scientists measure it? Wishful thinking?
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Strange Registered: 07/03/05 Posts: 427 |
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Yeah I would have to agree: Self-Deception and money motivations. Sorry man, we all want to believe but the evidence is against us all.
-------------------- I do not grow anything illegal. I do not sell anything. I am, however, a very curious individual. I also try to be helpful.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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Quote: people like this would think differently if they actually took the time to see for themselves and then critizize instead of blatantly trying to disprove something they have no real recokoning of. ok so science isnt able to measure it yet so why not try to see? its easier than you think. hold your hand out in front of a blank wall or a white surface. try to look, through your hand. dont focus on your hand or pay attention to detail but try to really look behind it. if you look at the outline of your hand you should see a fuzzy white outline or hazy field extending a few mm past your skin. you next do this with a person.try and look through the person or behind them, and you will see the outline. once you see auras good on objects imposed before blank surfaces you can start seeing them anywhere. its not something you cant already see, you just dont NOTICE it. your mind isnt open to it, therefore its not a part of your reality yet. reality is all in the mind. oh and i think clairvoyance and other remote viewing techniques must not be the psychic bullshit you claim that they are if the US and Russian government both had extensive millitary operations involving these and other components of psychic warfare.
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Stranger ![]() Registered: 04/21/05 Posts: 4,587 |
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remote viewing techniques must not be the psychic bullshit you claim that they are if the US and Russian government both had extensive millitary operations involving these and other components of psychic warfare
Yes, during the cold war, DARPA did have a remote viewing program, but DARPA abandoned it due to the program being entirely unsuccessful.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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clairvoyance and other remote viewing techniques must not be the psychic bullshit you claim that they are if the US and Russian government both had extensive millitary operations involving these and other components of psychic warfare.
Sure, that must be why the North Koreans pulled the wool over our eyes for years developing nuclear weapons even as we paid them not to do so. And why Osama bin Laden continues to elude us. And why Saddam Hussein was found by old-fashioned legwork rather than by psychic mumbo jumbo. And why hurricane Katrina killed so many, including lots of psychics whose powers were not even sufficient to save their own lives. people like this would think differently if they actually took the time to see for themselves ... if you look at the outline of your hand you should see a fuzzy white outline or hazy field extending a few mm past your skin. blah blah blah I have taken the time to see for myself. I found only wishful thinking and lofty proclamations from frauds and self-deceived fools who, when placed in a solid test of what they claim they can do, fall flat on their face EVERY TIME. Prove me wrong. Click the JREF link in my post above and win the million bucks. Until you or someone else does that, all aura seers and every other mystic in the world is a nothing more than a BAG OF HOT AIR. Talk is cheap and that's all mystics ever do. Prove me wrong. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Strange Registered: 07/03/05 Posts: 427 |
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FYI, The US and Russian government are not godly sources of truth which you make out to be. They try experimental bs all the time and cover up their mistakes. Not trying to say you are wrong but I just can't see aura's as anything more than HPPD or bleeding colors.
-------------------- I do not grow anything illegal. I do not sell anything. I am, however, a very curious individual. I also try to be helpful.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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Quote: why would i want to waste my time proving someone is wrong to validate what i believe in? what foolishness! i have more faith in myself than that. all i can do is point you in the direction of TRY IT YOURSELF. and i seriously doubt you ever met a real mystic if all they did was talk. real mystics are in a cave in nepal somehwere deep in meditation. how can you tell me what i experienced wasnt real if YOU'RE NOT ME!. was it just a coincidence that i knew the exact girl i was going to lose my virginity to before i had even talked to her, or SEEN her before? was it coincidence that i waited a few extra seconds at that green light because something wasnt feeling right, and then two seconds later a COP goes fULL SPEED through a blind intersection on a HILL!!? fuck you buddy. for you to try and invalidate the experiences of people you dont know or have never seen before is bullshit. im not worried about proving anything because eventually you will experience these psychic capabilites yourself whether you like it or not. lets just hope when it does happen you dont buckle under your own disbelief. mark my words, winter solstice 2012. thats all i have to say. prove yourself wrong, start meditating. which is something i highly doubt you do or will be good at but you should try anyways.
Edited by ShroomDoom (03/29/06 02:02 PM)
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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why would i want to waste my time proving someone is wrong
Uhm... to win a million bucks? ![]() mark my words, winter solstice 2012. thats all i have to say. LMAO, another end-of-the-world prediction. Get in line: ![]() http://www.shroomery.org/forums/ -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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Quote: who said anything about the end of the world? ![]() how many more fools are going to misinterpret this important date as a doomsday prediction? wait...im not even going to go there... oh and i love how you left out the last part of that sentence you quoted. nicely done asshole. you should really heed the advice about mediation. Edited by ShroomDoom (03/29/06 02:13 PM)
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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How about you put your money where your mouth is. Can you see auras or are you all talk?
Apply for the JREF Million Dollar Prize. All you have to do is what you claim you can do. I'm already on record as willing to pay your travel and lodging expenses to south Florida for the formal test if you pass the preliminary test which is administered local to you. What do you have to lose? -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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hahah. first of all, i cant see auras in every condition. only certain lighting and certian people. and i can definately not percieve auras past solid objects which is probably what they will have me do. and im confused? how can they validate whether or not you saw an aura if there is no scientific instrument to measure them yet? sounds like a trap to me. people like monks and yogis who are really adept at such vision would never subject themselves to such stupidity, even for a million dollars. like i said, i dont feel the need to prove anything. take it or leave it. these things are in the realm of experience and are beyond the need to be preoven or disproven and people like you are regressive in trying to accomplish such feats. prove love. prove to me that two people are TRULY in love. that would be something.
![]() even if we could prove auras, SO...WHAT? if they dont exist me and a lot of people have a serious eye/psychological issue.
Edited by ShroomDoom (03/29/06 02:26 PM)
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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Quote:Silly rabbit, you think the government wants to catch bin laden? Or that he's even alive still? Or that he was really behind 9/11? The government HAS to have its people scared and occasionally dead in order to maintain power and control and wage wars...... they almost pulled a 9/11 on their own people so they could have a "reason" to invade Cuba. It's called operation northwoods and is acknowledged by even the most mainstreamed and propogandic of news stations. You can find it in on ABC'S website clear as day that the government has in the past planned to kill it's own people and blame it on terrorism to wage wars. Now not having attained psychic powers I can't vouch for validity, but those who truely have them don't give the first hell of making $1 million dollars and getting the attention of the entire world put on them. If I could read minds and remote view with accuracy and levitate I wouldn't compromise it all by going to a scientist and demonstrating it to him. Likewise GREED is an obstacle which would logically keep the average man from attaining such powers in the first place, ensuring that those who develop such powers are already pure of heart and not the sorts of people that would probably have a single desire for money. oh anyway while doing tai chi I saw this girl's aura, it was a very nice purple. I then tried to set up an orange aura around me and saw it expand a little bit. -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 02:28 PM)
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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first of all... [excuses for why he can't do what he says he can do]
Why am I not surprised. i can definately not percieve auras past solid objects which is probably what they will have me do You haven't even bothered to read the link. Each test is custom designed specifically for each applicant WITH THE COOPERATION AND APPROVAL, IN WRITING, OF BOTH THE JREF AND THE APPLICANT before the test goes forward. In other words, your specific test will be designed WITH YOUR COOPERATION AND APPROVAL in advance so that it will be fair and definitive. All you have to do is whatever you say you can do. If you do what you say, you go home a millionaire. It's really that simple. In most cases, the JREF will ask YOU to design the test and they will only append whatever they think is necessary to prevent any possibility of cheating. how can they validate You and JREF will agree in advance, in writing, on exactly what constitutes a win. That's how they validate it. Whatever you say you can do is the determinant. Either you do it, or you don't. like i said, i dont feel the need to prove anything Not even to win a million bucks? Alright... sounds like a trap to me Let's see: 1. You take the preliminary test nearby where you live, so all you have to invest is a little time. 2. If you pass the preliminary test, Diploid gives you an all-expense paid vacation to south Florida for the formal test. 3. If you can't see auras, you go home, again at Diploid's expense. 4. If you CAN see auras, you go home a millionaire and Diploid becomes your first groupie. Yep, sounds like a trap to me too.
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government. Edited by Diploid (03/29/06 03:08 PM)
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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Now not having attained psychic powers I can't vouch for validity, but those who truely have them don't give the first hell of making $1 million dollars
Not even the ones who write book and movie deals and set up psychic hot lines for millions of dollars? Alright...
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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jiggy Registered: 07/20/04 Posts: 7,469 Loc: Heart of Laughte |
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Hey Dip,
I was wondering what science tech was used to determine the true color of an aura from a false one. During the testing you mentioned, how did they know the "aura seer" was wrong. I'm not aware of any equipment approved by popular science to give legitimate aura field measurements regarding color frequency vibration. If there is such technology that discredits and discounts "seers", why don't people just use that? I'm aware of a lot of resonant field images technology out there but none that gets the "thumbs up" from hard core skeptics they don't even believe we have an electromagnetic energy field. How are they discrediting the seers with something like aura colors. How are they proving them wrong? What is seeing or measuring them correctly that they approve of as a validator? On another note to the posters, your colors will change almost hourly depending on energy levels and moods and external stimulation so what a seer tells you that are one minute, won't necessarily be the same the next hour. Paying for a picture or reading is a waste. You want an indicator of the health of your auric field? Check your mood and overall disposition frequently. Like you need someone to tell you have a lot of muddy dark red in your field if you know you are prone to anger and repressing it, thats a given. You don't need someone to tell you that you have a lot of bright clean greens in your field. If you feel and are super healthy and vital, thats a given. You don't need someone to tell you that you have a lot of yellow in your field. If you are highly creative, thats a given. You don't need someone to tell you that you have a lot of blues in your field. If you are usually calm, relaxed and peaceful, thats a given. Passionate about something? bright clean clear reds. Pinks- a lot of love Purples- lots of spiritual wisdom People don't need to see their own or have 'seers" read them for you. People just need to get better in tune with their own physical, mental and emotional states to know when things are clear, healthy and vital and when things are tanking. If your really interested in this topic "auric colors" spend your time studying whats out there on color light healing-Chromotherapy. There is science behind it and hospitals have been using it to heal jaundice in new borns. Once you learn a lot, you can get your own colored light set up using film sheets over lamps, colored bulbs, in your decor or clothing or for FREE in visualizations while meditating. Maintaining holistic health of the mental, physical, emotional and subtle energy bodies should be the goal, over a fascination with third eye seeing abilities. We know what is healthy for our physical bodies and what is not. We know what are healthy and constructive thoughts and feelings versus, depressive, toxic and destructive ones. Pay attention to what goes into you from the external, (how it effects you on all levels) whats going on internally and what comes from out of you if you want to better know and read yourself or others. On a side note, chromotherapy is huge in other progressive countries. The U.S. tends to keep repressed what pharmaceutical companies can't patent and make money off of. Colored light in visualization techniques is FREE and available to all rich or poor. More then that, be concerned about rips and holes in your auric field. If you have drains everywhere and openings for energy suckers to vamp off you, you will turn to shit with all your vital energy being tapped and drained from you. A simple thing to do is regularly take ten seconds to get centered and visualize yourself in a giant sphere and fill it up with golden light. It'll patch up all tears, and holes. It takes nothing to do it before you fall asleep, when you wake up and eat lunch. If you don't have the energy to take care of your body right, think and feel uplifting thoughts, it's all going to go down hill. First learn about how to draw from your own vital energy source, self rejuvenate and how to keep your field running tight and high. The biggest pay off is clarity and vitality on all levels. Anyone you know who is almost always, fatigued, gets sick a lot, has a lot of "accidents", is confused or negative is sure to have an auric field that looks like muddy torn up swiss cheese. You have to repair all that damage before you can start to turn things around. Simple technique- golden light fills. If your feeling really negative and yucky, run violet light like a flush through your system. Clean it all out first and make the repairs and then you can start working with other colors to highlight mood states that will work to your benefit in life. Work with clear bright reds for motivation and passion Work with bright clear greens for healing and physical health Work with bright clear blues for calming, relaxation and peace. Work with bright clear yellows to highten creativity. Work with bright clear oranges for heightened social excitement and an extroverted out going personality when you'd like one in a social environment. Work with bright clear light pinks for soft sweet love. (Prisons have been painting walls pink to keep the prisoners from getting overly aggressive and angry at each other) Work with bright clear whites, golds and purples for purifying and spiritual wisdom and clarity. Work with bright clear neutral browns, tans, greys and beige's, for grounding. It's easy quick and free to just get centered and focused and visualize them. Bath yourself in the colors. ![]()
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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Quote: those people are charlatans. Psychic development has to come with spiirtuality, anything else is magician like tomfoolery. A spiritual being gives his services for the betterment of mankind...... imagine if everyone could cultivate psychic abilities so they could be rich... there would be tons of people cashing in the million dollars. What I'm saying is I don't think you can cultivate those powers if you want to use them for greed. beside why not just win the lottery? Then you get to keep your powers a secret. -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human......
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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I was wondering what science tech was used to determine the true color of an aura from a false one. During the testing you mentioned, how did they know the "aura seer" was wrong.
The tests I'm talking about are far more fundamental than identifying what color an aura is. The tests I'm talking about are about whether or not someone can see auras AT ALL, nevermind about the color at this point. Typical aura seers claim they can see auras all around people including from the top of their head up several feet or some other similar claim that can be tested by putting someone behind a screen. In the test, 10 screens are set up that are just an inch taller than the person whose aura the seer claims to see. The person is placed at random IN FRONT OF one of the screens in full view of the seer. The seer then confirms he can see the aura. This is the experimental control which verifies that there is nothing strange in the room preventing auras from being seen, there is no odd weather nearby obscuring the auras, and there are no reptilian conspiracies preventing the seer from winning the million bucks. This control also prevents the seer from subsequently claiming reptilians or bad weather caused him to fail the test. Once it's thus established that the seer CAN SEE THE AURA WHEN THE PERSON IS IN FRONT OF THE SCREEN, the person is then moved at random BEHIND one of the screens. The seer, who does not know behind which of the screens the person is, then attempts to identify which is the chosen screen. It has never been the case that the seer guessed any better than random chance where the person is.
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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those people are charlatans
That's convenient. No Scotsman is a thief. But I know a thieving Scotsman. Aye, he's not a true Scotsman. So tell me, is every "true psychic" in the world such a flaming asshole that they won't at least win the million bucks if only to donate it to some needy charity? Or perhaps to benefit mankind with what would certainly be one of the most significant and useful discoveries in the history of science? -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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Quote: i know it's circular and dogmatic, you have to build circles to start somewhere....... my argument is simply that psychic abilities come from spiritual evolution, which is mutually exclusive to greed. i am not a source of authority on psychic abilities... I'm a skeptic. But in my framework I do not believe they can be achieved without spiritual motivation. I also think they would be suppressed by "science" much in the way global warming was suppressed via invasion and destruction of a lab recently by the Bush administration, and I also don't think that many if any at all could do anything miraculous if they even did have abilities. But.... what do I know? I don't know anything. I'm just saying why the hell would you out yoruself to such a hostile world by performing random miracles to the authority figures of your nation? The money would be much better won anonmously through lottery and donated to charity. anwyway though, my tai chi instructor was in a wheel chair until he started practicing and now has no pain. As said the Chinese have already explored much of energy phenomenon and have systems set up for which the mystical to naturally flow. Haven't you seen videos of Buddhists meditating in freezing weather where wet towels were put on them and they start steaming? I have unless I'm imagining things. i have experienced intense inner heat though through the solar plexus chakra, so intense I find it scary. -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 03:12 PM)
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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my argument is simply that psychic abilities come from spiritual evolution, which is mutually exclusive to greed
All the more reason for a "true psychic" to win the prize (and the dozens others around the world) and donate the money to a worthy cause. Why would such noble people sit on their powers rather than use them to benefit mankind? Makes no sense. I don't know anything. I'm just saying why the hell would you out yoruself to such a hostile world by performing random miracles Because such miracles could very well change the world for the better. History is full of accounts of selfless acts by ordinary people putting themselves in harm's way while trying to help others. Are all "true psychics" so selfish that not a one has ever sacrificed their privacy for the benefit of the world? anwyway though, my tai chi instructor I don't see the relevance. Superior PHYSICAL abilities say nothing about the existence of PARANORMAL abilities. There are many accounts of extraordinary athletes, but they were all natural, not supernatural. i have experienced intense inner heat though through the solar plexus chakra Maybe so, but given the amazing ability of humans for self-deception, how can you know that wasn't all in your head, especially since that heat cannot be measured by any objective test? -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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Quote: Perhaps so. I understand your reasoning. I'm sure they are using their powers if they exist. There is a young Buddha right now that has supposedly been meditating for several years. Quote: it's not about privacy its about persecution. And miracles has little to do with aura reading, telekenesis, simply "paranormal" or "psychic abilities" that randi is looking for anyway.... does it? If someone could walk on water and raise the dead they're probably doing it right now with no care for publicity, rather are just running around helping people. Why not also stay anonymous and do your work without people realizing that it's even really being done..... preventing disasters here and there, saving lives here and there, directing healing energy to others...... If Jesus came back I don't think he would go to a foundation to prove his legitimacy, I think he'd be out and doing things myself. Quote: so you consider chi to be physical? That's what tai chi is, utilization of chi. It would indeed be nice if chi were scientifically proven and measured, and I'm sure it will be some day. Quote: Why do you care? It IS all in your head. That is the entire point. The fact that systems like tai chi and qigong and yoga are excellent healing mediums that allow advanced and even basic practitioners to feel their own internal energies and are very very healthy and good at healing is well demonstrated. Maybe the chi is just the result of the mind noticing itself? Maybe it's a phantom quality not measurable and maybe it is all in your head as a result from gaining oneness with body and mind. if you don't want to believe you wont. and if you do you will.... and either way arguments will ensue until science can finally prove the existence of such things.... until then....... it's anecdotal evidence, combined with empirical evidence of the physical aspects of such things. tai chi can be shown empirically to be healhty....... as can yoga. but prana and chi may not necessarily be measurable. that's where faith comes in. whether you say it's imaginary or not, it's the same thing. real vs unreal. if you feel it and it heals you, and you use it to help others... does it really matter? Does it really matter if its meditation vs medication? Exercise vs mental focus. Physical vs mental? The mind under suggestion can heal on its own..... it's called placebo and is very well documented. Simple praying can heal. Does that make praying unreal? No. Does it make real? Yes, but only to those whom it works for personally. If a man uses dreams to explore his body and work out physical problems and becomes healthier.... are you going to say "no that's not possible?" it is NOT something we can measure... it is not something we even know how to measure, but we do know that hynposis and suggestibility and faith and placebo are all vehicles to the paranormal. it requires faith right now. if chi is physically measurable, or we are able to measure the metaphysical, then these issues will be resolved. i don't know why or why not the randi foundation hasn't established anything, but I do know that healing energies exist, if nothing more than in the imagination, and can be utilized for productivity, even if are nothing more than a hyper-focused mind. When the mind gains unity with the body the mind can influence the body. It's like learning to walk. But instead of learning to walk you are learning to regulate your heartbeat and interacting with subtler levels of your body through your mind. various practices are based specifically on attaining this union, as once reached you can symbollically fix yourself with your own attention. Quote: http://health.enotes.com/medicine-encyclopedia/meditation -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 03:47 PM)
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jiggy Registered: 07/20/04 Posts: 7,469 Loc: Heart of Laughte |
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Well, I must say that it is at least a good test for exposing greedy frauds is right.
Anyone with legitimate skills would clearly understand the flaw in the test and wouldn't go near it with a ten foot pole. Energy is everywhere and some disembodied spirits can pack a wallop stronger to sense then that of a weak human. Besides, anyone with integrity will help you to do for yourself instead of setting up a Dependant relationship where you need them to do for you what you can do for yourself. People who are to lazy to take their general well being or in sighting into their own hands are also a part of a larger problem here diploid. The systems of schools, governments, science medicine, religions, military, authoritative parenting, have all sent the message out to people that you are WEAK, DUMB, USELESS, Can't help or do for yourself without us and must live Dependant on the services of those better abled then you. So people are raised in this disgusting system of hierarchies, power, and control and turn to others for help, to do for them what they can do for themselves, and who is to blame when frauds take peoples money? The systems. You can keep discrediting frauds and they will keep coming and so will the consumers of them until you discredit the systems that support fraud to happen in the first place. Humans are raised to not trust themselves and to believe in and lean on outside sources of "authority". Hammer away at that system buddy!
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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Anyone with legitimate skills would clearly understand the flaw in the test and wouldn't go near it with a ten foot pole.
Where's the flaw? The test tests whether or not they can do what they claim they can do. It's simple. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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There is a young Buddha right now that has supposedly been meditating for several years.
Sounds selfish. That does not help mankind in any way. If Jesus came back I don't think he would go to a foundation to prove his legitimacy, I think he'd be out and doing things myself But by his public actions, if they were real and not tricks, he would quickly become known world wide. If there were real psychics in the world helping people, the same would happen to them. it's not about privacy its about persecution My point stands. Rosa Parks, Gandhi, Christ, and countless others throughout history have willingly endured persecution for the benefit of their brothers and sisters. Why not one single psychic? Why not also stay anonymous and do your work without people realizing that it's even really being done Because someone who could actively and at-will perform irrefutable miracles would shake this planet to its core. That person would likely be seen as a genuine representative of God by Muslims, Jews, Christians, and [fill in the blank], and serve as a formidable uniting force in a world desperately in need of it. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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jiggy Registered: 07/20/04 Posts: 7,469 Loc: Heart of Laughte |
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I explained the flaw and you totally ignored it.
Why did you choose to focus on that comment instead of where I underlined the real cause of the problem you hate. Do you have anything to say on that because if not, you aren't doing the good you think you are, but rather, sometimes, support the underlying problem and then blame those who take advantage of a system you ignore being in play. Whats your message dip, that we are to turn our trust, belief and power over to science and science frauds? I gotta run to Tae Kwon Do class now. I'll have more to say latter.
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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Whats your message dip, that we are to turn our trust, belief and power over to science and science frauds?
My message is that we should turn our trust to critical thought and rationality. That means not believing in something that people talk about but are unable to show you. If I try to sell you the Brooklyn Bridge, wouldn't you want to see the deed first? -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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I think it's good and well to be dubious of much of the new age crowd but for those who have reason to believe in energy and therefore auras from personal experience, why not? I wouldn't ever trust an "aura-reader" or a "psychic" if they set up a hotline or pay service... I would trust acu-puncture or any dedciated practitioner of an energy cultivation tradition that had advice to give me on my energy development. and I would probably go in for reiki if I knew a practiioner, because I could clearly feel what they were doing to me as I can clearly feel what's going on inside of me.... I'd know if they didn't know what they were doing.......
The thing is most respectable teachers won't say "ahhhh you have a bad chi blockage, give me $20 and i will fix it for you" they just teach you what they know so you can have as much knowledge as they do, and do with it what you will. -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 04:44 PM)
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Stranger Registered: 03/04/06 Posts: 26 Loc: New Brunswick Last seen: 16 years, 10 months |
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Well that's the thing...I've always been able to see the envelope once in awhile without trying...I always kinda dismissed it...but just lately i've been actually concentrating....i've been seeing intense wonderful colours....extending past the envelope...
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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Quote: very good. this is a sign of progress. soon you wont even have to try to see colors or past the envelope with concentration, because it will happen automatically. i do it in class all the time with my professors. sometimes i will tune out what they are saying and just watch their aura for a bit. sometimes though it does get distracting because you see it without wanting to see it and you're like wow and a whole chain of distracting thought can stem from that. keep up the good work.
Edited by ShroomDoom (03/29/06 05:05 PM)
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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for those who have reason to believe in energy and therefore auras from personal experience, why not?
Because they are deceiving themselves. This is evidenced by their ability to see auras where wishful thinking is the likely cause and their inability to see anything at all in simple controlled tests like the ones I described above where only a real ability, not an imagined one, would pass. Believing that imagined things are real is harmful. Look at the state of the world today. Most of our problems stem from irrational religious beliefs in non-extent things. It's beliefs in non-existent things that leads suicide bombers to blow themselves up in crowds, and countries to go to war, and groups of people to commit genocide against other groups of people. If the people of the world, and the Middle East particularly, could see past their superstitions and embraced critical attitudes toward belief in things that do not exist, it would go a long way toward making this a better world. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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yes believing that a bio-electric field surrounds humans is harmful and looking at this believed field is harmful too. heck even thinking that you can see it is very bad. why millions are mislead into this each year...
its SOOO DETRIMENTAL!!! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH ![]() what is society coming to?!
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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i do it in class all the time
As is usual with mystics, all talk and no action even with a million dollars on the table and nothing to lose. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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yes i do look at a professors aura in class all the time but not with him standing BEHIND A SCREEN
. clearly i cant give you much more than words because, you see, this is a MESSAGE BOARD. i think your challenge is rediculous and an ill spent million dollars which could be helping a lot of people right now. no one is ever going to pass it, and people that can really percieve beyond ordinary reality laugh at such rediculous attempts to bring spiritual things to rationality. im not a mystic just a meditator. a spiritual aspirant. kiss my ass buddy you dont know me.
Edited by ShroomDoom (03/29/06 05:31 PM)
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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jackass
Ad hominems are the recourse of those with poor arguments. You can't refute my position and so, in frustration, you attack me instead. ![]() clearly i cant give you much more than words because, you see, this is a MESSAGE BOARD. I've given you a way to put action to your words and win a million dollars along the way. Did you miss that part a few posts back? i think your challenge is rediculous and an ill spent million dollar Ill spent by searching for the truth? which could be helping a lot of people right now Hypocrite! If you can do what you claim, then you could win the million dollars tomorrow, and spend it helping anyone you want. Why don't you? I'll tell you why. Because like many before you who claim psychic abilities, you are a fraud.
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government. Edited by Diploid (03/29/06 11:04 PM)
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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Quote: WHERE DID I CLAIM TO BE ABLE TO SEE AURAS THROUGH SOLID MATTER HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM? i used jackass because i had to reiterate the fact several times that I CANT SEE AURAS THROUGH SOLID MATTER.i hate repeating myself, especially to people like you. sorry if i seemed to be on the "attack". and there you see, i had to do it again which is really starting to piss me off, jackass. ![]() oh yes im a fraud youve found me out, better pack this up and take my aura cleaning kits for the price of 19.95 +snh to the next town..whew. darn.
Edited by ShroomDoom (03/29/06 05:40 PM)
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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i used jackass because i had to reiterate the fact several times that I CANT SEE AURAS THROUGH SOLID MATTER.i hate repeating myself
As do I. So I'll leave it to you to read above where I explained that you would not have to see auras through solid matter to win the million dollar prize. All you would have to do is to actually see them as you claim. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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this is a waste of time. and its putting me in a bad mood, which is unlike me. i dont need to prove what is beyond this reality, what is beyond your normal mode of perception, what you call imaginary or nonsesne because it all will speak for itself in time, and none of this right now is essential anyways. its not important atm.
gooday sir. sorry if my words insulted you. Edited by ShroomDoom (03/29/06 05:45 PM)
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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Quote: So is there a conspiracy of spirits making people trying to take the test fail? I can only imagine that a person could say "I see two, one over curtain a and one over b. Retest in a different location/when the spirit leaves?" Tests are repeated often for a reason. Even tried-and-true tests for tried-and-true theories. (Though, most often, it's more for education then to attempt to disprove said theory) Quote: It's detrimental because you're falling into a habit of not looking at things critically. Quote: So, by your logic, your are a jackass. You see, the test is not to see an aura through a screen. It's to see the edges of an aura/chakra over the head of a person, with the screen obscuring just the person. If you can see auras a few inches out, as many claim to, especially those who see claim to see chakras do, then this should be no problem. -------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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by my logic everyone's a jackass. except you, youre just another asshole bitch cunt motherfucker.
![]() ok so the test seems more of a possibility now that i understand it. i would only have one request in taking it, that the person who is being viewed have a particularly strong aura, because most people have weak auric fields. if that could be comprimised ill take the damn challenge and spend all the money on an LSD laboratory. and dont you preach to me about looking at things critically, im a product of 8 years of catholic school and heavy christian indoctrination and to be where i am now took a lot of critical thinking. not to mention im in college and i question every bit of material and information that i read, constantly to the point where its distracting from the material im suppost to be learning. Edited by ShroomDoom (03/29/06 05:52 PM)
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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this is a waste of time. and its putting me in a bad mood, which is unlike me
One sure sign that your beliefs may be wanting is when you get upset at them being questioned. [Note to audience: Here another mystic making bullshit claims, then running away in a hissy fit when I call their bluff rather than summarily proving me wrong and winning a million bucks along the way with a simple demonstration of their powers.] -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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fucking extremists....cant we all find a happy medium somewhere between logic and spirtuality? might i suggest reading the Dalai Lama's "the universe in a single atom"
im not upset that my beliefs are being challenged.im upset that i got pulled into this bullshit and almost went along with it. im upset with myself for feeling the need to even in the slightest validate spirtuality to an extremist like you. why do i feel the need to prove to you or anyone else something i experience on a daily basis? its not right, because its not essential or important to the hapiness or the causes of happiness for either of us which is my immediate concern. may you all have both. Edited by ShroomDoom (03/29/06 06:00 PM)
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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You, Diploid, have failed to comment on my elaboration as chi of a phenomenon of having your mine tuned into to subtle bodily processes and the ability to then manipulate to stimulate health throughout the body.
what is so delusional about this, given the health benefits of activities that encourage the utilization of chi such as qi gong, yoga, tai chi, various forms of buddhist meditations, even chakra oriented new aged meditations. The health benefits are well documented, people can shut off senses at will, the mind believing fully can transcend normal limits and do some rather complex things, people have healed cancer through laughter. Etc. Imaginary or not, it works. What is your take? -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 05:59 PM)
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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Quote: Excellent on both counts. Singlehandedly prove something really, really awesome, shaking the scientific world, and making acid. I can only imagine that they'd let you use whoever you wanted (after, of course, ckecking to make sure there's no foul play). Quote: You claim craploads of criticism in your life, but consider: The human mind is a powerful thing. Nobody yet has been able to proove aura-seeing ability. Hallucinations, image burn-ins, and all sorts of visual irregularities are common and well-documented. So are psychic frauds. Which is more likely- You being the one person to be able to see auras, or through come positive feedback loop of wanting to, decieving yourself, and seeing a little fuzzyness around your hand, you've managed to "see auras"? -------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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ok so the test seems more of a possibility now that i understand it.
So you're arguing a point without having even read the posts I've been making. ![]() i would only have one request in taking it, that the person who is being viewed have a particularly strong aura And again, you make it clear that you haven't read a thing I've said. YOU CAN DESIGN THE TEST. YOU CAN SELECT THE PERSON WHOSE AURAS YOU CLAIM TO SEE. YOU CAN DESIGNATE THE LOCATION, THE LIGHTING, THE TEMPERATURE, THE WHATEVER YOU WANT. All the JREF will do is impose whatever restrictions are required on the test YOU DESIGN such that you will be unable to cheat. That's it. Nothing more. I can't make this any simpler without losing entropy. Now, are you going to take the test or refuse to read this post as well and just make up more excuses? -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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look up^^^^^^^^^
and you will see why i refuse to take the test. and why many yogi and meditators will refuse. maybe if if aura seers were logical and scientific and flashy and greedy assholes youd have better luck. regardless of what is said here or done or even if my belief changes i still wont be able to stop seeing auras and i still wont be able to hide from the spirit world. what a waste of precious moments. edit: im willing to bet maybe what im seeing is ionized particles and moisture but im definately seeing SOMETHING. Edited by ShroomDoom (03/29/06 06:10 PM)
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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Quote: You guys are missing the issue! Both are the same thing. Imagination becomes real to the one experiencing. If you USE your ability to see auras in combination with trusting in your subconscious judgements it will help you figure things out. WHY does your brain paint someone a certain fucking color! It's the same reason you dream of your boss being a devil.... there's meaning to it if you let there be meaning to it. Is it imaginary? Sure...... is it wrong? Your mind is sending you information about a person that is subtle and beneath conscious awareness....... and its sending it to you in a system. Dreams are as real as you let them be, they are your brains working map of reality. The same is true for auras... if you figure out what the colors mean to you and apply them to your relatoinships with other people they can teach you things about how you view other people. Maybe your professor talks really pompously and the aura reflects that....... synesthesia....... it has to come from somewhere. Maybe someone is really pissed off, your brain picks up on the subtle cues and he flashes red right before he goes into a tantrum.... the brain is simply putting together useful patterns based upon what you're observing. It's ALL in subjectivity. What is this fucking argument even about? It does not mean that you are RIGHT in what the aura you see tells you, but it DOES mean that the aura signifies something, because you believe in auras and put faith in them to signify to you. It's like trusting intuition. It's like trusting feeling. It's like knowing someone is pissed off even when they are hiding it from you. It's like thinking something right before your friend says because your conversation lead for it to happen... but in stead of just feelings or hunches it's direct synesthetic "hallucinations" i.e. translation of those subtler processes of the mind into imagery. I mean if it's obvious to you someone is in pain, and that pain is then translated into an auric field... how is the auric field wrong exactly? You have two different perceptions of reality to work with. Imagine if you could simultaneously have access to dream consciousness and real consciousness while awake. you could sift through the dreams that are happening real time with reality in case your conscious brain missed something, and you can go in and get it back. Will it be 100% accurate? No of course not, but it's the best your perceptions can do. I don't get what this debate is over. real or unreal doesn't matter. Placebo alone can heal people! Nothing more than sugar water...... this denotes paranormality in and of itself if you ask me. I mean also what the hell do you make of photographic memory? I'm sure there are some people that could glance over this post once and remember it in detail. There are some that could even draw up complex hallucinations of it and actually see it..... there was an autistic woman that built blueprints in her head naturally and viewed her world through her symbolic dream like interactions of it, because of this she was able to solve complex problems and make efficient designs that most people were unaware of. The brain filters out almost all of the information it receives, if you have a way of getting access to it before it dissipates you can use it to your advantage, it's still going to be biased and maybe not helpful enough to win you a million dollars, maybe so. -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 06:15 PM)
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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all experience or phenomena is mind. i agree with you.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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You, Diploid, have failed to comment on my elaboration as chi of a phenomenon of having your mine tuned into to subtle bodily processes and the ability to then manipulate to stimulate health throughout the body.
I thought I did comment on that. If you define 'Chi' as above, then it is not mystical. It is a function of the person's ability to turn inward and control their body using natural processes of neurology and physiology. Great! But if you define 'Chi' as something magical and mystical and that some tai chi master can manipulate and detect in another person and use it to diagnose and cure illness, then when tested, the tai chi master totally fails to demonstrate this, I call it self-deception and wishful thinking. people can shut off senses at will, the mind believing fully can transcend normal limits and do some rather complex things Those things are very impressive, but they are not magic. people have healed cancer through laughter Source to a peer-reviewed medical journal, please? While state of mind certainly bears on people's health and their rate of recovery from illness, if laughing alone could cure cancer, it would mean the end of the discipline of oncology. Or did you mean that laughter can help people recover after treatment with medical intervention (read: science)? -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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and you will see why i refuse to take the test
So, you posses the ability to win the million dollars and donate it to starving children in Africa, but you refuse to do it? And you called ME an asshole...
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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Quote: No. When empiricism and rationalism contradict faith, in a rational society, faith MUST yield. Quote: But what if you're wrong? What if Diploid is a truth seeker who feels sad that you could be misled? Consider it from his POV for a moment. Here's this guy who might be made wiser by the abandoning of these (quite frankly) idiotic beliefs. Nobody else seems to be trying to illuminate him, so I will. More then that, your sense of skepticism is hurt by this kind of thing. Quote: Several things I can draw from that. Firstly, and foremost, the things you mentioned are an exercise that decreases stress, increases mood/feeling of wellbeing, increases circulation, encourages deep breathing, etc., which are all excellent things for the body. Secondly, I do believe that the mind is powerful enough to alter its perceptions of reality, encourage the healing of the body, etc. However, the eyes are not physically capable of perceiving other then the visual piece of the EM spectrum. Thirdly, by the law of averages, some people will appear to be healed by everything. Consider (just an example, these numbers are out of my ass) that, in a year, 1/1000 people get cancer. Consider that 1/50 people spontaneously go into remission. Consider that 1/30 people practice some form of meditation/new-age-y things devoutly, and that 1/5 of those are "blinded by the light" enough to believe that everything good happening to them is due to those practices. In the US alone (300 million people) there would then be 200 people/year attributing their sudden remission to their practices. By the law of averages, this will happen. -------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong.
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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Quote: Well I would indeed say it's "mystical" because most people do not believe in it, it cannot be directly observed, and yet people clearly use it in their personal lives to improve their health and vitality. Given enough time I think science will prove and be able to observe everything "mystic" and or "parnormal" about the mind/body links etc. Quote: I don't disagree...... this would make a much better test than aura reading. Though many teachers won't even accept payment for teaching people tai chi, I doubt they'd feel like doing it scientifically. They of course can heal people by teaching them the art and closely monitoring their progress. Quote: You seem to be defining magic into a hole of impossibility. These things would once be thought magic and are a staple of any magickal practice. Quote: I don't know and I shouldn't have used anecdote. What I meant is that people can survive "incurable" disesase. The point to drill is in there would be a time in which people would flat out reject the notion that by mind and willpower alone one can direct the healing processes of the body. Now it is pretty much almost accepted by the masses. There would have been a time when westerners and even scientists would look at practitioners of exotic martial arts, magic rituals, etc, as crazy and decry any possibility of mind influencing physical body. And it would so happen that there would be a time when it would have been impossible to measure scientifically. Consider lucid dreaming. It has been practiced since the beginning of time yet very few have had lucid dreams and it isn't until recently that it has even been proven to be a scientific possibility....... consider a time when science could not measure such abstract things: the current skeptic has open room to decry lucid dreamers as lunatics since by chance he and no one he knows can lucid dream or has ever had a dream... furthermore society DEFINES dream as a state of unconsciousness which severely limits the imagination from thinking anything to the contrary, and because the current scientific equipment does not allow for the testing and measuring of consciousness during sleep. In fact there are still people that state lucid dreaming is impossible due to arbitrary definitions of "sleep" and "dream" as unconscious states. If society only accepted what is already proven no one would discover anything new. Maybe telekenesis isn't possible, but we can't shut our minds on everything just because the times make it impossible to measure all pheonomenon that human beings claim to experience. Give it some time. I do want to point out again that someone with powers strong enough to clearly predict future or manipulate the present, really dramatic things that this foundation so direly wants to measure...... are going to be reluctant to divulge such things in the first place. Though the more extreme and godly a power sounds, the less likely it is to be legitimate. -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 06:33 PM)
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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Quote: This debate assumes that real and unreal matter. The thesis is that auras are an objective thing. The antithesis is that auras are subjective. As I said, this debate assumes empiricism is a way to know the world, that there exist things that are not purely subjective to you. -------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong.
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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but how can empiricism cross into the subjective?
dreams are real but we cannot record them, only map the neurological processes. the best we can do is draw pictures of them and write stories about them. we know they happen, though. do you have a link to the aura study that details how it was failed? -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 06:38 PM)
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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Quote: Empiricism does not deny that you may have had dreams, but denies that they actually (physically) happened. Essentially, anything that one experiences that is not objective is subjective. If that's not what you're asking, I'm not sure what you are. I believe Diploid provided the link above. -------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong. Edited by Xanthas (03/29/06 06:44 PM)
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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mmm what i'm saying is dreams may exist in your head but can provide valuable information about physical reality.
and let's say something weird happens in your house while you're dreaming and you dream about it........ it happens. what i'm saying is auras may be subjective but that does not mean that they cannot give you verifiable information. But I haven't seen them enough to have any say on whether or not they do........... I mean first off if you can see chakras, you have to be looking at a person that is intimately familiar with their chakras so that when you say "his solar plexus is open" the person can verify that yes, their solar plexus is open. So I don't know. I do think it could be scientifically proven.... but then again how do they know that that person isn't in it with you for the money since you have to select people similar to you with similar abilities? I also do think that people would shy away of such greedy purposes and would be more likely to demonstrate it for free or not at all. What use would it have if you COULD see chakras? What use to science? If you could diagnose disease with auras then yeah. -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 06:48 PM)
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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You seem to be defining magic into a hole of impossibility
I define magic as anything that is claimed but that has no rational mechanism by which it occurs and that no one can demonstrate in controlled conditions even though they claim the ability to do so. Seeing auras, for example. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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im gonna eat this grain of salt. and then go back to looking at auras. xanthas and leery you both have been more than helpful.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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Consider lucid dreaming. It has been practiced since the beginning of time yet very few have had lucid dreams and it isn't until recently that it has even been proven to be a scientific possibility
But the things we're talking about here ARE measurable. It is a simple matter to test whether or not someone can see auras. Same for telepathy, remote viewing, telekinesis, laying on of hands, psychic surgery, dowsing for water, [fill in your favorite mystical mumbo jumbo]. These things are testable and have been tested over and over without the tiniest shred of evidence that they are real. Disbelieving in them is not closed-mindedness, rather it's common sense given the available evidence. I do want to point out again that someone with powers strong enough to clearly predict future or manipulate the present, really dramatic things that this foundation so direly wants to measure...... are going to be reluctant to divulge such things in the first place. Then why not do it anonymously and save countless lives and untold suffering at the hands of earthquakes, tsunamis, and hurricanes? Doesn't the fact that this has never happened tell you something? -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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all the common sense and logic in the world will never get you to "the source/supreme consciousness/collective consciousness."
common sense is not what spurred my great journey with the mushroom.
Edited by ShroomDoom (03/29/06 07:12 PM)
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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umm yes it does. you seem like you are being overtly argumentative to me... i don't think people can fly around and pick people up off rooftops during hurricane like superman.
and i'd like to see the anti-aura study you've been referencing so i can get a feel for what we're talking about.... its becoming confusing and unclear. -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human......
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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(Somewhat off topic, but I do believe there existed a group of oneironauts who provided great evidence for the existence of lucid dreams. It was found that one can control movements of the eyes in reality by looking around during dreams. One can use eye movements to communicate information from within a dream to the outside world.)
-------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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I mean first off if you can see chakras, you have to be looking at a person that is intimately familiar with their chakras so that when you say "his solar plexus is open" the person can verify that yes, their solar plexus is open. So I don't know. I do think it could be scientifically proven.... but then again how do they know that that person isn't in it with you for the money
Testing the seeing of chakras as you describe above is functionally no different than testing telepathy. One person (the chakra observer) claims to know what the other (the person opening their chakra) is thinking. There are already many well-established methods for testing this that preclude any possibility of cheating. What use would it have if you COULD see chakras? What use to science? If you could diagnose disease with auras then yeah. You can't know what potential benefits may come from a real demonstration of this. For one thing, it would instantly create an entire new branch of scientific inquiry, the fruits of which could eventually benefit mankind in ways we can't even imagine. The principles, if real, could be applied to medicine, art, literature, music, who can say. It makes no sense to keep such an ability to oneself. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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Quote:that's correct. Stephen Laberge conducted such eye movement experiments. What I'm saying is we had to wait for technology to catch up thousnads of years with basic human practice for lucid dreaming to be even accepted as a real phenonmon, rather than a prevailing view that such things are imipossible. and indeed i would understand why many think lucid dreaming is impossible, direct transitions of consciousness from awake to dream are rather difficult. what i'm trying to say is if people have auras, science will be able to READ auras eventually. and i do believe it has been documented that our bodies emit various forms of energy fields.... has it not? -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human......
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If it fits inyou ![]() Registered: 03/20/06 Posts: 97 Loc: Pennsylvania...u Last seen: 11 years, 8 months |
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Quote: like a "flick eyes to the left once for 'A', twice for 'B'" etc? --------------------
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※※※※※※ Registered: 12/22/02 Posts: 6,367 Loc: Europe Last seen: 8 months, 9 days |
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ShroomDoom, you should read the rules and the idea behind this forum. This forum is for a discussion about ideas, don't make it a personal thing.
If you choose to post in this forum be prepared to have your ideas and opinions challenged, refuted, disputed, rebutted, analyzed, shredded, pooh-poohed, and yes - even supported. If having your beliefs, opinions, and positions scrutinized critically makes you uncomfortable, this is not the forum for you.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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im open to criticism but...jesus.
maybe i was just having a bad day? ok this is me "fucking off" watch closely or you might miss it.
Edited by ShroomDoom (03/29/06 07:25 PM)
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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Quote: true but people can already use chakras [if if they only exist subjectively] to heal, as they can use tai chi to heal as they can use meditation and visualization to heal as they can use prayer to heal. Such things have been studied a bit though, I recall looking at prayer specifically. -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 07:24 PM)
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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Quote: Ever consider that there might not be one? Or that humans are not always logical beings? (I also disagree with Diploid's use of the phrase "common sense". Logic is a far better term, as many aspects of "common sense" are more accurately termed "cultural myths". Quote: Firstly, why not? Secondly, someone who was strongly psychokinetic (or could commune with the elements, whatever) could maybe stop said disaster? (or ask it nicely to go away?) Thirdly, I think psychokinesis, if not able to be used like that, would be one of the least useful of the abilities. Remote viewing could allow one to see the disaster brewing. Precognition, if it exists, should strongly respond to such a dramatic event. Another point, why would such a development of powers necessitate the giving up of all contact with money? As has been said many times before, why not both A) Prove something remarkable to the scientific community and B) do many good works with a million dollars? -------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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Quote: all the time. but i dont know which idea is scarier me believing in one and there not being one, or vice versa. im just going to have to continue the search.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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umm yes it does. you seem like you are being overtly argumentative to me... i don't think people can fly around and pick people up off rooftops during hurricane like superman.
That's not what I'm suggesting. I'm suggesting that someone with the ability to predict natural disasters could warn coastal countries before a tsunami devastates the lives of millions. Why has this never happened? and i'd like to see the anti-aura study you've been referencing so i can get a feel for what we're talking about.... its becoming confusing and unclear I gave the link twice already. Also, read the JREF Discussion Board where people claiming magical powers tell the JREF exactly how they would like to be tested and exactly what will constitute a win. In 40 years that the JREF $1 million prize has been on the table, not one person has ever done what they claimed they could do. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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im perfectly ok with all of this stuff remaining in obscurity and under the context of metaphysics. if god came down to earth tomorrow and said "i exist! and so does blah blah blah blah blah" that would be rather dissapointing. i like the whole idea of the quest for knowledge and self-realization.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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(I also disagree with Diploid's use of the phrase "common sense". Logic is a far better term, as many aspects of "common sense" are more accurately termed "cultural myths".
Heheh... "common sense" was a reactionary phrase I find myself using because whenever I use the word logic in this forum, the mystics all tell me that logic does not always apply to the real world (whatever that means). The phrase "common sense" was a preemptive move.
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Friend of the Medicine ![]() Registered: 06/07/04 Posts: 4,435 Loc: A Psychedelic St Last seen: 1 year, 8 months |
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i hate how you label people with an open mind towards metaphysics....
we're not mystics...just seekers. Edited by ShroomDoom (03/29/06 07:39 PM)
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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Quote: Actually, there's a rather distinct difference between claims of auras and claims of lucid dreaming. In one, a person claims to have had a subjective experience in which, during the barrage of dream-imagery, they became aware that they were dreaming. If I claim that I see a zebra dance through my house, but didn't consume any drugs, yet you had only ever heard of hallucinations being experienced by people on drugs, saying my experience (which I never claimed happened objectively) is false is based on false premises. The other is a claim of an objective thing. This can be proved or disproved. Quote: More like "rapidly up and down for when you attain lucidity, rapidly side to side before waking yourself up." Quote: Yes, but science is in the business of finding out what exists objectively. If tai chi or whatever only work by reducing stress, increasing general health, etc., then science wants to know. If it actually has the effect of what people claim it does, then science also wants to know. I also remember looking at prayer/meditation. They were found to be predictably no better then each other/placebo. -------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong.
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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Quote:this all goes far too abstract. someone with such abilities would to me transcend their very human nature and have no need to stay on a human level.... at this point karma comes heavily into play and i'm reminded of a story in which an arhat goes to save a village from being murdered by shrinking the people and putting them in a bowl, only to find when he returns to wherever he came from that all the people in the bowl are dead. the buddha said that they could not escape their karma. now viewed from a cynical mind you'd say "that's just an excuse" but you have to understand buddhism. with transcendence of ego comes omniscience but in order to transcend ego ALL karma must be stopped..... you cannot interfere and you cannot save people from their own misfortunes. secondly if on 9/10 you told everyone to leave new york how many would? There was a composer who right before 9/11 frantically wrote a musical piece out of a fever of inspiration..... but such things can be seen as coincidence.... obviously on any given day if you say "there's going to be a disaster" you're going to be right sooner or later. onely it may mean that you are sensitive to such things but two-ly it may mean that the future is not also written in stone, or maybe it was just a coincidence. hell you know what... no one will believe this but i predicted a school shooting in ohio based off my dreams and it shortly happened thereafter, i even posted about it on a message board before it happened but you know what..... the dream... it was vague...... it was not enough for me to claim that I am a psychic.... only that I pieced something together and it happened to be right, nothing more or less....... now I have had enough things like that happen to know that if my dreams want to they will go that way, but I am not arrogant or foolish enough to claim that I can regularly divine the future from my dreams, or to even be able to tell beforehand if a dream will or won't be valid. take it how you will. did you ever stop to think that disasters happen to the people they happen to for a reason? This is the answer as to why someone... namely a human being, wouldn't be able to do such things....... not to say it's a definitive answer, who knows what.... it's the only way i can answer you. Quote:and how do they prove this "Th world will end tomorrow unless I choose for it not to........ *waves his hands dramatically* there... now we're all safe." But maybe they could and if so they do. Quote:mmm yeah ..... well okay let's look at a show called "the lone gunmen". planes were almost flown into the world trade center by a shadow government wanting to create the illusion of terrorism if i recall correctly, the episode aired in 2000. then it happened a year later in real life. Nothing stopped it. Just because you see something coming ... or KNOW something is coming because many people did know either intuitively or from fact or from intelligence reports... doesn't mean you can stop it. How do you get people to listen? Remember the Twilight Zone where a man finds himself in the times of Lincoln and tries to warn everyone of the assassination and they lock him up becasue he's going crazy that no one will listen? Seriously dude if I flat out told a group of people not to go somewhere because something would happen how many of them would? I'll give you another one. I dreamed of a football game being bombed.... the location was wrong... but something almost happened. I warned the proper authorities in the dream and told them to leave knowing fully well that most wouldn't. I didn't think anything of the dream... just a curiosity like "hey wonder if this will happen." it almost did....... within 5 days of the dream max I'd say. I didn't have enough information, not the name of the bomber, not what he looked like...... not even enough of a conviction to go out and warn people...... I didn't know it was going to happen. And I can't know... I can't know until it does and the occurences are too sparing for me to have an "ability" or a "power" but nonetheless enough for me to pay attention to these dreams when they do come up, just in case. Plus if everyting I dreamed came true drugs would be legal by now..... not even a small fraction of them come true... perhaps it is just because I have better recall than most people that I see more co-occurences? Quote: like i said, because you would be a guinea pig, because of karma, because of spiritual development, because of the fact that if these things are really only a small number of beings are likely to posess them.... because WHY DO YOU NEED MONEY? If I can fly............. ummm.... do I really want a million dollars? Fuck that I can fly...... I can spend my whole life happy that I have proven physics wrong....... why do I need money? For science it would be a noble affair, but if someone could fly... would the government leave them alone? This is the government that poisons people with radiation to learn about the effects without their knowledge or consent.... such a prize to be had... the only flying man in the world that demonstrates his abilities to us. you'd better fly the hell out of America and ..... how long would it take to get that million? You'd have to set up a way for it to be wired all sorts of covert ways so you could pick it up wherever you fled to. or maybe you agreed to dedicate yourself directly to science but at your own terms and your own pace. you'd still be monitored. everywhere you go people would demand that you fly for them because they are still skeptical.. why? The odds of being able to levitate are so low that someone who is able to already has something more precious than a million dollars and the spiritual teachings that led him to that realization are more important than scientific knowledge. If you want to levitate attain enlightenment....... the text is already there...... you'd just come off as an anti-christ to the public's eyes................ if the NORMAL AVERAGE JOE could fly then I don't see any reason why he wouldn't have proven it to Randi though, I will give you that....... -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 07:46 PM)
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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i like the whole idea of the quest for knowledge and self-realization.
But shouldn't that quest include sharply critical views of everything, especially extraordinary things? If something is true, it can withstand ANY scrutiny... any testing. The quest for knowledge is about finding the truth, not about being right. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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jiggy Registered: 07/20/04 Posts: 7,469 Loc: Heart of Laughte |
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Quote: Not that I am aware, not even sure what you are talking about related to what I said. Conspiracy ? With my understanding of all I've learned, experienced with technology that read fields and witnessed on the subject of reading subtle energy, I find the test valueless other then determining who is s foolish enough, greedy enough and fraud enough take it. If there is truly anything to this, An easy flaw in the test would be that the subject, may be sensing some thing behind a screen in energy only, that isn't physically there that has a higher out put, then something that actually is. Right off the bat, at least for me, I think the test is highly prone to probable errors. How can someone set up a legitimate test for who can see auras in color when there is NOTHING out there to prove them wrong other then a living physical object behind a screen or not. Thats lame and only a fraud not having a clue would agree to take it. If someone was in a highly angered emotional state in one of the empty spots an hour before the test took place, an able sensitive would pick up in residual energy, the presence of a body of energy there, more strongly, then an actual body generating a weak field. This is no different then a bed staying warm for a while after the body leaves it or the smell of smoke lingering in a room long after the cigarette has been put out and removed from the room. How easy would it be to mistake thinking a lit cigarette was in a house when it wasn't, if one truly was earlier? Easy. How easy would it be to mistake a warm shirt someone recently took off with a warm shirt still on the body if they were blind and only allowed to feel the shirt itself? EASY mistake to make. The blind screen test proves squat. How do we know what else is floating around in the aethers detectable by a sensitive, like auras that could be mistaken for one or if all humans put out enough energy to be easily distinguished from residual or something else possible disembodied there, from behind a screen? These are skeptical and critical questions I ask of the test itself. Why arn;t you guy more skeptical and critical of the tests and potential flaws not considered by those who may lack critical knowledge about the subject being tested that could make a difference. What do you personally know about how the human body emits energy, let alone about how another could perceive it through other means and how prone to human error such an ability would even be? Until we all know if and how it all works a dot what level of accuracy it does when it does, how are we going to be able to test for it? The tests are parlor tricks just the same until then. I personally don't mind if people believe in auras or abilities to see them or not. I can't see them myself nor do I even want to at this point in time. With all the MAJOR problems to be addressed in the world, that's a silly thing to fuss over. Why not go about proving what government, school, military, corporate, and institutionalized social systems are deceiving and failing us and robbing us all of billions and human lives. I jumped in here because I was curious about what technology they were using for validation in the tests diploid mentioned. Turns out, they weren't even using any so its a super joke. For those tests to mean anything to me, an auric field would have to be scientifically validated FIRST, and science would have to have accurate detection equipment developed FIRST, before we could test, who truly has an ability and who doesn't. If we had all of that, why bother with peoples abilities prone to human error or the potential for frauds. The test he mentioned is just as much smoke and mirrors. Magicians come in all shapes and sizes. You guys trust the word of the guys who say such a test should show proof of something, without them or us having any understanding of what the mechanics of the subject is even scientifically all about. I trump you and dip in the critical skepticism department. I think those who accepted to take such a test are definitely phony baloney's and I think those giving the test are pseudo scientists without a clue. They are all phonies! ![]() Next I am going to reply to dip and would prefer to discuss a more deeper and critical underlying issue here.
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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Only if the idea of karma is correct. However, it may not be. Free will may not exist (as I hold). Then such powers would be free to be used without karmic restrictions. But hell, I'm pre-supposing that such powers are not tied to any single religion.
Agreed, though, that inklings of something happening are likely to be viewed by most people (including me) as coincidental. To be proved, it must be reliably testable. If one person accurately predicts many disasters, it gets looked at far closer then a myriad of people predicting craploads of things on many different days, one of which happens to be spot on. Also, wouldn't one with such powers be somewhat immune to the puny and purely materialistic powers of a government? If you're assuming eastern philosophy, as it looks you are, the person, if they've actually attained enlightenment, would be freed from the cycle of death and rebirth, and their only goal at that point would be to help as many people as possible do the same, the way the buddha did. I love you, Diploid. -------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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I find the test valueless other then determining who is s foolish enough, greedy enough and fraud enough take it.
So, if someone claims they can see auras three feet above people's head, then someone six feet tall is placed behind a screen that is six feet, one inch high and the claimant can't tell if someone's behind the screen or not, this is valueless? Alright... -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government. Edited by Diploid (03/29/06 08:19 PM)
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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Quote: All the problems you postulate are easily fixed. Firstly, the analogy's you present are bad. I can definitely tell the difference between both the shirt on a body and a lit cigarette/room which had one in it. In both cases, the properties you're looking for (heat, smell) are dramatically diminished with even a short amount of time. Secondly, did you not read the part about the person crafting the test?* If said "sensitive" can see things in the room, they can wait until they dissipate or move the test. Nothing to it. Quote: I don't claim to know too terribly much, but I know what I do know, and those are two points critical to this idea. 1) The human body does not emit radiation in visible light. 2) The human eye is only capable of seeing a small slice of the EM spectrum. Thus the name, "visible" light. Quote: So, you're saying that we have to have the technology that requires the existence of something in order for you to accept the nonexistence of something?** The test is in no way a joke. With the information given to the scientific community, a test that would be viable is created. Give more information on how this phenomenon, realistically, can be tested then. Quote:*** *Looks to me like I trump you in the reading department. **And the possibility department. ***And the critical thinking/skepticism department. -------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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So, you're saying that we have to have the technology that requires the existence of something in order for you to accept the nonexistence of something?
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Fish Can Fly ![]() Registered: 03/29/06 Posts: 1,269 Loc: Right in front o Last seen: 17 years, 8 months |
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Auras are interesting
But I wouldn't want to see them Far too distracting -------------------- There is no valid reason why you should be reading this
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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Quote: Correct from eastern philosophy, however unlikely they would use tricks and miracles to convert and liberate...... according to a guy who studies Buddhism or is a Buddhist or something of the sort that gives Dharma talks here it's a valid option, as he referenced Jesus while mentioned Amitabha and the Buddha... saying Jesus was about miracles where the Buddha just cared for spreading teachings to liberate..... but he may have been reaching out to any Christians in the audience. Now if you're a human with powers? We assume powers are real.... we assume then that the government knows of these powers and is very adept in using them already..... this opens the door for governmental sacrifices, brainwashings, the illuminati, and various other conspiracy theories which hold the government uses high amounts of black magic to manipulate and get what they want and I'd say for the person with powers enough to prove their validity but still largely human and un-evolved.... no he wouldn't stand a chance against the government. But are such powers only doled out based upon merit? If so then this person would have them and any agencies of "evil" or "control" would not and then you would be correct. -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human......
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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For those tests to mean anything to me, an auric field would have to be scientifically validated FIRST
Jigz, the test is not to see if auras exist. The test is to see if the guy claiming to see them actually CAN see them. Whether or not auras exist is irrelevant. Whether or not the guy can see them is the only thing being investigated. Read that part again because it's important and you keep missing it: Whether or not auras exist is irrelevant. Whether or not the guy can see them is the only thing being investigated. The test is of the GUY not of the AURAS. No technology is needed for this test other than a screen able to obscure a person while leaving the aura above his head visible to the seer. Obviously, someone failing this test does not disprove the existence of auras. It only disproves the guy's claim. However, if you test many people convinced they can see auras and not one of them can pass the test, it's reasonable to conclude that they're likely either lying or kidding themselves about their abilities, and while it says nothing about the auras themselves which may or may not exist, it does make any reasonable person question why, if they exist, no one who claims to see them actually can. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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Quote: I think it was more like in order to test someone's ability to read the various forms and types and varities of auras and energies we would have to be able to have some good proof that auras can indeed be picked up..... as in what he/she is saying about residual energy..... energy is not exclusive to humans.... while we could easily test anyones proclaimed ability to see human auras and I think science doesn't need techonology to rule that out.... to really validate whether or not they are doing so or picking up on other things or not picking up on other things we would need to fine tune our understandings of human energy. becasue frankly, humans do emit energy....... emotions start as chemical reactions and electric impulses..... and it would be helpful if we could quantifiable measure such things in order to ascertain just WHAT people are picking up on, if people are picking up on something. but yes that is a flawed statement because extraneous factors could be accounted for by making sure no one was in the room for a long period of time, various other things could be fidgeted around.... numerous aura readers could be tested and numerous targets used..... just to see if they really are picking up on where a person is.... It does not seem like a terribly flawed study to me..... but I do agree that if there are auras and I say they are, we should develop the technology to accurately measure them...... the body does emit energetic fields.... if not on the most subtle of levels via feelings..... think it out..... someone putting their hand right by your face and waving it around, it feels like they are touching you... it's like picking up on energy.... and on some level they feel that they are touching you even though they aren't... it's like energy is crossing and synpatically, chemically, as far as the very essences of perceptions go there MUST be some sort of discernable phenomenon related to the body and its immediate surrounding fields...... you have all these nerves charged paying attention to their immediate surroundings, if something gets near them they send impulses..... i dunno i'm not good at thinking about this right now. I do have to say that you need a large sample size to determine this! Like said many aura readers will be drawn away from Randi just becasue of the greedy prospect, whereas if a genuine large scale study were done the more "legitimate" practitioners would be more likely to show up. we would need a large handful of readers tested with the same measures in a large scale study to determine something one way or the other. all this tell us is one reader failed...... how many readers have they seen? THE MONEY IS a factor and you know what.... if someone would pay me $1 million and I were just an average Joe I might go just to see if I could guess right.......... but you know if it's a more mundane sounding real experiment for scientific worth saying "aura readers wanted" without pay..... that weeds out all the posers and street magician type loonies that may not be very disciplined in what they are doing or may be flat out crazy.... the money is an issue biasing the sample population. a huge one..... because it's a fucking million dollars! -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 08:48 PM)
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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Leery11, do you actually believe everything you're saying, or are you debating from various positions just to debate? What you're saying sounds largely inconsistent from post to post, and even within the same post.
Quote: Glad you enjoyed/caught it. -------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong.
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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Quote: I dont' know....... what am I saying? I'm growing tired ......... I mean I don't believe any one set thing here, other than in energy in the form of chi/prana described by practiioners that cultivate it..... the rest is just random posting and speculation and whatnot. What I believe: -psychics should be able to prove themselves scientifically -many will choose not to based upon their beliefs and the $1million involved. -the $1million will attract more greedy and less developed people and repel the spiritually evolved who have no desire for it. -large scale studies need to be done without a huge money bias to attract those genuinely wanting to contribute to science...... and should involve complete confidentiality. -due to rewarding the money confidentiality becomes a complex issue. -mystics often don't care for science, nor do religious individuals. that's about it. -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 08:52 PM)
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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Quote: I know that we do emit energy in the form of heat, and we have an electric field surrounding us, however, the human eye is not capable of seeing this. The thing about someone *almost* touching you is a combination of minute differences in heat/air travel over your skin relative to the surrounding area, possibly static, and most importantly, your mind. A large scale study would prove nothing but that many people cannot see it. The test is not to determine if the general population can see auras, it is to determine if any individuals, (who would be rare) can see them. Nor would removing the money. The "sensitive," I imagine, would not be required to take the money. I bet the institution would be more then happy to keep it. -------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong.
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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the human eyes cannot see it, of course not.
the third eye can, if it exists. and i have opened it, literally..... but it was during an almost sleep state so I will withold judgement... but I do believe in chakras. and what I said was a large sample of people who volunteer to do it that claim those abilities.... like the DMT studies.... they had to recruit people with extensive psychedelic experience, not normal people. to me the money makes it look like a trap to the paranoid eye...... who knows. -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 09:08 PM)
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jiggy Registered: 07/20/04 Posts: 7,469 Loc: Heart of Laughte |
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Quote: Thank You for that wonderful example. According to you, all I need to do is see the deed first before I turn over my money and the bridge is mine right? ![]() Not quite. There is this french guy who frauded many people out of money, most notoriously known for frauding himself out as a Rockefeller, whos been on the news, documentaries and was in prison. I forget his name. One of his cons, which was so easy for him to pull off, was that he suckered some guy into believing he was a wealthy real state mogul, owned a particular large condominium building and sold it to a guy for $3,000,000. cash with a phony DEED. In his career, he bilked about 60 million out of rich people, no one got any of their money back and he only did about 6 years in jail. Yes fraud of the rich and poor will be a fact of life until we understand better why and how it happens in the first place. This french con man was dumped off in a European orphanage by his dad at age 5 and grew up without any family to guide him through life. When he was dumped on the streets to fend for himself, he turned to conning people. Take the rich and "intelligent" people he conned. They were all raised to believe that all that glitters is pure gold and diamonds and worth a lot, including its word it seems. Blinded by money and foolish greed they are as well. The con man said it was his best trick, to get the people to believe they were taking advantage of him and his wealth and that he was stupid and they could make off of him. Now, look at how many, hundreds of thousands of kids in Asia are orphans living in the sewar systems. Did you even know about this diploid? As these children grow into adults, what are they going to do to keep surviving? Many will be hustling and scamming people. What else can they do? What is this social structure that allows for children to be orphaned to raise themselves in sewers and hustle to get by? What other stories are behind other types of con people? Look at how many "gullibles" are raised, to blindly believe in "authorities" and to not question "authority figures". We all were. You think parents and schools are teaching their kids to use critical thinking and reasoning skills? No, they are telling them to do what they are told or else, and they are telling them that this is how the world is because we say so. Challenge us and you'll get punished, an F or sent to detention. Look at this government that tells us they need to spend billions of our tax money on military defense and for our security and protection, all the while, the governments are the ones starting the freaking wars we all need protection from in the first place. HELLLOOOOOOOOOO people of planet earth. Anybody home and listening? Talk about Con Men. They tell us they need to take money out of our pay checks to give us Medicare all the while, their corrupt systems, allow for the FDA to shove poisons down us and keep healthier prevention options and INEXPENSIVE CURES, not poison that mask symptoms, off the market, so they can line their pockets from pharmaceutical lobbyists to boot, keeping sick people sick all the while. We are suppose to trust that our governments and doctors backed by medical science are taking the best care of us right? ![]() They are legalized frauds and cons and their systems of control rear us to have absolute belief and faith in them. That's worse then the lady down the street with a sign in her yard charging 10 bucks for an aura reading. Don't you have bigger fish to fry? Can't you see how you are a part of that ugly system if you suggest we should believe in the "higher authorities" parlor tricks, all the while distracting us from their fraudulent and corrupt ways by drawing attention to the two bit relatively harmless small time fraud claiming to see auras for chump change? Look at how many boys are still raised to believe they need women to cook and clean for them. How easy are they to manipulate money from by women with those skills. Look at how many girls are still raised to believe they need good looks to give them worth to make it in this world. Do you have any idea how many put their lives at risk and spend BIG BUCKS BIG BIG BUCKS, getting Lipo suction, tummy tucks, laser hair removal, breast enhancement, etc. The government and medical science institutions and societal BS fraud us out of more lives and money and use their school systems to set up gullible and fearfull of "authority figures" citisens and allow for free media brain washing to do more financial, mental physical, emotional and bodily damage to humankind then these random "psychic frauds" will ever come close to holding a match too. They are about as significant as whale piss in the ocean compared to the Big players. Consider starting posts about social, parental, educational, government, military, science medicine, fraudulent money bilking, needless death of the gullible they create, if you care so much about fraud and people being harmed by frauds. Consider applying your critical thinking skills and rationality to warning us about those systems con schemes.
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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becasue frankly, humans do emit energy
This says nothing; all matter emits energy. and it would be helpful if we could quantifiable measure such things in order to ascertain just WHAT people are picking up on Well, before we get to the point of quantifying what people are picking up on, a necessary first step is to establish that they are picking up on SOMETHING. So far, everyone tested who THOUGHT they were picking up on something (auras?) has failed to demonstrate it when properly tested. someone putting their hand right by your face and waving it around, it feels like they are touching you This is simply radiant heat from the hands being felt on the face. It can be photographed by infrared cameras, it can be measured, and it can be reproduced at-will. There is a rational theory by which it happens. The theory can be tested and falsified by experiments, and its predictions can be verified. It's nothing special. It's not mystical or magical because it is a natural phenomenon. Auras, on the other hand, are supernatural. I do have to say that you need a large sample size to determine this! Forty years and hundreds if not thousands of aura-seeing applicants to the JREF isn't a large enough sample size? How about the tests conducted in university labs over the last hundred years. How about the many tests conducted by other skeptic organizations like: The Premanand Challenge: http://www.indian-skeptic.org/ht The Australian Skeptics Challenge: http://www.skeptics.com.au/index The Science and Rationalists' Challenge: http://humanists.net/avijit/prab none of which has ever found a single claimant who can do what they say they can do. we would need a large handful of readers tested with the same measures in a large scale study to determine something one way or the other. Done. They all failed. See above. the money is an issue biasing the sample population Investigators at universities and other institutions have conducted tests for no money (because they had none to give). Same result. Do you not see a pattern here? Take an objective look at what you've been saying in the face of an avalanche of evidence suggesting this is all fantasy. Rather than accept that it looks bad for auras, you wiggle and dance around every point because you want auras to be true. Get past that. Stop looking for auras and start looking for the truth, whatever it may be. It's a more fruitful search... and a more interesting one.
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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Quote: Learn to read. That. Is. Not. What. He. Said. Quote: Ever think that this is, maybe, a fun hobby? (My apologies, Diploid, if I don't speak for you) -------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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Quote: According to you, all I need to do is see the deed first before I turn over my money and the bridge is mine right? Nope. According to me, you shouldn't believe I own the Brooklyn Bridge until I show you the deed. And after I show you the deed, you should concede that I MAY own the bridge subject to further verification. The counterpart to auras is that you shouldn't believe in them until someone definitively demonstrates an ability to see them. Even then you should hold only provisional belief until further tests by independent examiners can reproduce the initial results consistently and rule out cheating. It's not about disbelieving; it's about making sure it's real before believing. Can't you see how you are a part of that ugly system if you suggest we should believe in the "higher authorities" parlor tricks You don't read a word I say, do you? [sigh] -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government. Edited by Diploid (03/29/06 09:42 PM)
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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Quote: well in light of evidence (which i have not the time to look at now) i will have to retract my claims then, except: "This says nothing; all matter emits energy." Yes and I would wager humans emit certain forms of energy which others can pick up on. As for the hand to face...... that mechanism applies to the movement of energy..... or blood, or awareness, or whatever it is that energy FEELS like..... I suppose it may be easily picked up by such similar methods if someone were to put focus in part of their body, I would be interested to see. I just have to ask, have you never felt energy while under the influence of psychedelic drugs, falling asleep, or throughout normal life? All I'm saying is that I hope and think that this can be quantified somehow..... as I referenced you a link a while ago heat measures were raised by 61% in Tibettan Buddhist Meditators. I am not against science but I do see how I have been contradicting myself..... if truely this subject has been studied extensively rather than just a handful of people by this foundation then I will give it a rest. I can move a tingling light energy throughout my body at will, it even has a sound to it.... if put above the throat. -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/29/06 09:41 PM)
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jiggy Registered: 07/20/04 Posts: 7,469 Loc: Heart of Laughte |
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Quote: Yes, it is valueless to me. It sounds like they are testing claims to detect physical human bodies behind screens. If people make those claims and fail those tests then, yes, their claims to do that are crapola. We are talking about auras here. I already covered what would have to be in play for a test to mean anything to me. Science will first have to validate auras and be able to detect them as well as color frequencies in them FIRST, in order to prove if someone who claims to see them can't. In the meantime, there is nothing else to go on but peoples personal experiences to validate them to and for themselves. No one has a gun to anyone elses head to believe in them. Whats the big deal anyway? Athletes train to visualize themselves performing to perfection and to see themselves winning. Are they deceiving themselves or is that a part of high performance training for personal success? They pay people to help them to do this. I don't hear anyone crying about it. So some people claim to see energy colors that indicate and give insight to the state of their own or another's well being. So what? Its not so far fetched. We know we emmit energy, we know energy as frequencies, we know the sun light energy carries frequency waves of the color spectrum we can see with the help of a prism. We know we are evolving beings with tons of dormant and active DNA yet to be understood for what it does or can do for us. I'm certainly not in any position to think we know all there is to know about human potential. I still am waiting for someone to tell me where the light we see with when we imagine and dream comes from. We don't have light bulbs in our skulls. It's dark in there. How does that work? I was watching the Discovery Health channel last week, and some neuro surgeon doing brain surgery on someone with Tourettes, said, "What we know about the human brain is still Sketchy." His exact words. And I am going to act like I know what it is and isn't capable of? I don't think so. ![]() ![]()
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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Yes and I would wager humans emit certain forms of energy which others can pick up on.
That would be a truly wonderful discovery and I will be the first to jump for joy at the opening of a grand new landscape for science to investigate. Until then, it's in the same camp as the Flying Spaghetti Monster: lots of people claim He exists, but nobody can introduce us. as I referenced you a link a while ago heat measures were raised by 61% in Tibettan Buddhist Meditators So can I. I just have to go jogging, while monks can do it sitting still. This is observable, explainable, physiology. It can be induced by doctors with drugs. The only thing special about it is the monks' amazing control over their bodies. Auras, on the other hand, have never even been objectively observed by anyone. I just have to ask, have you never felt energy while under the influence of psychedelic drugs Of course I have, but I'm not gullible enough to think that an experience that happened WHILE I WAS ON A HALLUCINOGEN was anything other than a HALLUCINATION. ![]() For me to accept something, it has to withstand scrutiny. That means dead sober, in broad daylight, and reproducible. Anything less and it's only a "maybe so, maybe not", and on hallucinogens it's "almost certainly not". -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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It sounds like they are testing claims to detect physical human bodies behind screens.
No, they're testing if some guy who says he can see auras above people's head can actually see them. Tell me something. If you were tasked with testing someone's ability to see auras, how would you go about doing it? Note that I'm not asking you to test if auras exist. I'm asking you to test if some guy who says he can see them three feet above everyone's head actually can. How would you do this? [Note to audience: Jiggy will not answer my direct simple question.] -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government. Edited by Diploid (03/29/06 10:23 PM)
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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Quote: Nor will he, apparently, respond to me any more. If I am not mistaken, I asked that same question. -------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong.
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jiggy Registered: 07/20/04 Posts: 7,469 Loc: Heart of Laughte |
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Nice Job, Xanthos, getting into personalisms for an entire post reply adding NOTHING to the discussions.
Its known around these parts that when all you can do is get into personalisms, you have lost all intelligent arguments. If you were referring to dips debunking as his personal hobby for fun and entertainment, did it ever dawn on you that maybe aura seeing is a personal hobby for fun and entertainment to posters here? ![]() I don't know one shroomerite that charges money for aura readings. I think where both yourself and diploid thought I didn't read what he said is because, I used the same argument you guys are using for not being just as skeptical and critical and demanding of the test measures used. Why be so quick to buy into its authenticity to prove something not real without really investigating further if its an accurate measure for testing such a claim to see auras? There is nothing scientific about a bias position that can skew results or the interpretation of them or not allow for mistakes to be made in the proper testing procedures due to lack of knowledge regarding the nature of whats being tested. Without the technology that can do it, there is nothing to compare a claim too. We don't yet know how it should work and under what conditions and what could throw it off, until we develop the techy version. You can bet Xanthos that if someone wants to pick at Frauds and just limits it to ESP claims, I am going to raise awareness on Larger Fraud systems to be more concerned about for anyone who truly cares about people being frauded and deceived out of money and sometimes, their own lives. ESP claims are small potatoes by comparison. Why not enlighten ourselves to the blatant mass fraud we all have been subject to, like it or not. All the more, if all I said made no sense to you, it goes to show how many people are not even aware of being scammed by legalized systems. It should be addressed where fraud is discussed and people think they are not gullible or even not a contributing supporting factor of a much larger fraudulent system. Diploid, I know you see a lot of that too. We've talked about it before. Aren't we all better served if we spend more time discussing, and exploring how it happens at the root cause and not the symptom level? As far as the topic of some shroomery members saying they have had experiences with seeing auras, we know they aren't out to fraud anyone and just find it fascinating and want to discuss it with others. We are all in this together, exploring reality through philosophy and spirituality here in this forum. The science forum is two doors down and on the right. ![]() If we step back and let them all who have had such experiences feel free to share them, we might all learn something more about a possibility or human potential. ![]()
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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We are all in this together, exploring reality through philosophy and spirituality here in this forum
One of the cornerstones of philosophical discussion is the asking and answering of probing questions intended to highlight and draw out the flaws in another's argument if any exist. Quote: QED -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government. Edited by Diploid (03/29/06 10:42 PM)
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Blaspheme,blasph Registered: 11/19/05 Posts: 267 Last seen: 16 years, 8 months |
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Quote: I wanted a response to my previous post. You posted since then, ignoring my post entirely. I pointed that out. Quote: There's a difference. Diploid advocates critical thinking. Claims of aura reading do just the opposite. Quote: Once again, I advocate that you read the precious posts. I'll summarize, if you're that averse to such. 1) The idea is to test if people can detect auras. 2) The testees help design the tests. What makes this useless/biased? What criticism can be levied against it, when the testee can alter the test to his/her preference. Why does this need an already detectable aura? Quote: That's all well and good, but this is not the topic. In this thread, aura claims are being debated. Not fraudulent Frenchmen or government greed. Quote: I would venture a guess and say that a severe lack of critical thinking skills and laziness among the general populace is the root cause. Quote: This forum is debate oriented and designed for those who seek a lively discussion full of dissenting opinions and rebutted arguments. Personal attacks will not be tolerated. If you seek a forum to express your ideas without any criticism, try our Mysticism, Religion & the Paranormal forum. The Mysticism, Religion & the Paranormal forum is a few clicks away. Quote: I do believe that learning about the same is the entire point of this debate. Thus, if humans do not have a possibility/potential, and are merely deceiving themselves, that is also knowledge gained. One person believes 50 things, and 25 of those things are wrong. Another believes 25 things. All of them are correct. Which one is wiser? [Also not, that gettinjiggywithit did not answer the question.] -------------------- If you don't ask the question, you always get it wrong.
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jiggy Registered: 07/20/04 Posts: 7,469 Loc: Heart of Laughte |
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Quote: Are we on stage? There must be 12 questions I have asked you so far that went unanswered by you. You have dodged much, I have dodged nothing.To answer your question, I am not that simple if you haven't noticed after a year and a half. ![]() I would be asking why we were wasting time testing a claim to see 3 foot over head auras. What is the point use and purpose. I would first want to know what we were after and then why. If I believed in the cause and wanted to roll with it, I would then have to do a shit load of research on the subject to be able to formulate a test I would feel comfortable with providing results you could bank on either way. Sure it sounds logical to use the screen test. Based on what I do understand about ESP phenomenon, it doesn't work in a linear physics fashion but in quantum mechanics. You know enough about quantum mechanics diploid, more then me, to know how unstable, unpredicatble and random that field is. I can see plausible reasons for someone with such a hyper sensing ability to see something there without a human body as I have stated. I can see plausible reason for someone with such a hyper sensitivity to maybe not see something there where a human was behind the screen. What I know about this stuff, the guy already is a FRAUD. I wouldn't waste my time with him. Seers I have followed who I believe in, say some peoples auric fields generate about a half inch from the physical body and they have seen others with a field 50 feet out. Say this guy only experienced seeing an average of 3 feet and its some common norm and say we tested him with nobody behind the screen and he got that right, and then with somebody behind the screen who happened to have a half inch aura, he wasn;t able to see and so said no one was there and got it wrong? His results would match those of guessing participants and tell us nothing about his actual ability if he had one. I think we would first have to have the scientific equipment to be able to detect the field of each subject behind the screen while they were behind it to account for possible errors as such. How would you catch someone with a half inch auric field that could botch the results of the screen test today? We need the scientific tools FIRST before we can start proving people right or wrong. I think any other form of testing is potentially flawed with guess work at the testers end until then.
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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I would be asking why we were wasting time testing a claim to see 3 foot over head auras. What is the point use and purpose.
The point is to determine if his claim is true. What part of that are you having trouble with? How would you catch someone with a half inch auric field As usual, you don't give my question enough attention to even understand it before pouring out a long narrative that has nothing to do with the question. *** THE GUY CLAIMS HE CAN SEE AN AURA THREE FEET HIGH ABOVE EVERYONE'S HEAD. THREE FEET! THREE FEET! THREE FEET! *** Not average, not more, not less. THREE FEET. If you change my question before answering it, you are not answering my question. Did you accidentally change THREE FEET to HALF INCH or was that deliberate? And that was just the first in a long string of things you changed, deleted, and added to my question that are not there. It is not possible to have a philosophical discussion with you. I give up. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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jiggy Registered: 07/20/04 Posts: 7,469 Loc: Heart of Laughte |
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What reply of yours to me did I miss? Are you sure you made the reply out to my name and not someone elses?
Help me find it and I'll address it. How do you know a person who may be able to read auras isn't doing so critically? That's a huge assumption to make. Who ran the test in this case? If it was Randys group, many participants of his test have said that when the day came, they were not allowed to set it up and or take it as originally agreed too. Right there the results are null and void. If I claim I can jump 15 feet and you agree to test me on it and at the last minute tell me I have to wear a mesh suit or do 20 feet and then say I failed when I can't, thats making false claims. If for real, the testee can set it up and the tester agrees and then the testee fails, they wasted everyones time and made a fool of themselves. Why are claims of aura seeing abilities being debated? The poster was sharing his personal experience with it, not asking if it was really happening to him or not. None the less he posted in here at his own risk of being questioned and challenged and here we are. In the course of the debates/discussions, I see people being accused of deception, be it of the self or to those who believe in others making claims. We all are susceptible to being scammed and frauded out of money by much higher powers with control over us. So why finger point as if any of us are above it. It would serve us all better to understand the nature of it then to pass quick judgments. No one learns from threads packed with judgments. Laziness on the lay person was an interesting answer to my question about the root cause of rampant fraud in the world at the highest of levels deemed "trust worthy". Critical thinking skills lacking is a given. I still see those as symptoms to a root cause. Why is the public at large lacking critical thinking skills and to lazy to challenge the systems at play? This goes philosophically deeper. I never said I had a problem with lively debate. Obviously, I enjoy it. This debate is too scientific oriented for a spirituality and philosophy forum. If this topic was posted in the science forum, it would've been laughed out the door or moved to MR&P. I don't see many on the challenging side, using philosophical or spiritual based arguments to challenge the posters post. If people wanted scientific enrichment they would be reading there. memebers come here for philosphical and spiritual enrichment. Thats why I gave the reminder that this isn't the science forum. So, you honestly believe that the test example dip shared to disprove one mans claims, render the possibility and potential in all humans null and void for past present and future? What did we learn from it but that one made made a claim and couldn't prove it. How does that information help you in life Xanthos? I'll answer your last question too. The one who guessed 25 correct out of 25 versus 25 out of 50 answered 100 percent of the 25 questions asked of him correctly and the other answered 50% of the 50 questions asked of him correctly. Who is to say that if the one asked only 25, would not have answered the additional 25 the other guy did incorrectly too? Your question can bare zero evidence of who is more wise.
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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jiggy Registered: 07/20/04 Posts: 7,469 Loc: Heart of Laughte |
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Quote: Easy. I am having trouble understanding who cares if he can or not and why they would waste their time with such a test. Obviously our priorities in life are radically different. You asked me a hypothetical question and I answered it honestly. Was I suppose to be a hypothetical person who cares about proving such claims of aura seeing wrong? Quote: I don't see you working to hard to understand a thing I have typed. Great for you if short simple answers fulfill your thirst for knowledge. I have no problem reading volumes of information and prefer them to short bits leaving to much room for me to make assumptions to fill in the blanks. I gave good reasons for how I would handle it and what I would take into consideration if I decided to roll with testing him. If the screen test was good enough for you, I have no problem saying, it wasn't any where near well thought out or critical enough for me to bring results I would be satisfied with. Quote: Now for certain you have not been paying attention. If the guy says he can see 3 foot overhead auras and a body behind the screen really has one only a half inch field from his body, the man making the claim to see 3 foot over head auras will NOT see his and will say there must then be no body behind the screen. That proves nothing to measure his 3 foot seeing ability claim. Do you really, not understand this possible scenario that could botch a test of his claim to read them at 3 feet, given you said, presume that auras are real? Quote: Maybe if you were philosophizing we could begin a philosophical discussion on the topic. So far you have been coming from a sloppy scientific test base on the subject matter. The screen test is sloppy by my standards and I am a scrutinizing BITCH when it comes to critical for-sight related to trouble shooting potential problems with ideas. When it comes to serious objective validation of something, I don't do quick simple tests or relate to mental laziness or short sightedness either. I do my homework and take my time to think through as much as possible to cover my own ass, when my professional work ethic, MONEY or HEALTH is on the line. You don't see or know that side of me because I have nothing on the line to loose engaging in discussions on a message board. Look at what happened with Titanic because of someones inability to forsight weakened steal and how it can become weakened. Not cool! I wonder why would you expect a short simple answer from a person notorious for thinking too much and too many complicated thoughts? You just showed your ability to for-sight probabilities with the information at hand could use some work there. ![]() If you prefer short simple answers to how one would handle a serious objective scientific test to validate such a paranormal claim, perhaps you should engage in discussions with 3 year olds. In my experience, they tend to give short simple answers and would run a high probability for providing them to you. ![]()
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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Praetorian ![]() Registered: 06/09/03 Posts: 1,652 |
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In order to create "aura goggles" we would first have to establish they exist.
Since people claim to see aura's, some of these people were tested and all failed. So A) claimant reported to see aura's, B) failed the test for seeing aura's. The claimant lied. That simple. "If the guy says he can see 3 foot overhead auras and a body behind the screen really has one only a half inch field from his body, the man making the claim to see 3 foot over head auras will NOT see his and will say there must then be no body behind the screen. That proves nothing to measure his 3 foot seeing ability claim." Just FYI, that statement needs a lot of punctuation to make it more clear. And what does a "half inch field" have to do with the test? -------------------- As the life of a candle, my wick will burn out. But, the fire of my mind shall beam into infinite. ![]()
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I Tell You What! Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 8 years, 9 months |
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Quote: The energy "hallucinations" are a result of masses of previously unaware sensory and neural information information, in this case physical, coming to awareness and overloading it. They do not come from nothing, hallucinations cannot come from nothing they come from scrutiny of your perceptions of what already is. Agere disgaere? Yuo cna sitll read tihs I await science to make breakthroughs with it too..... but most people don't have a lot of energy floating around or any chakras open, I don't...... -------------------- ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (03/30/06 01:59 PM)
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Beyond Registered: 05/07/04 Posts: 6,697 Loc: Between Last seen: 3 years, 16 days |
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whew, what happened here ? Pandora's box ?
![]() I am also a bit skeptic on the method used to prove if auras exist with a screen. What if, if the body works like a lightbulb. Aren't there occasions, when you put something in front of the bulb, you even can't see the shine/aura around it ? Like the moon in a humid night. If you put something before the moon, outside of the atmosphere, you won't see the corona, right ? I have no idea of how to prove an aura to exist, only, perhaps with two or three seers, who independently write, what they see about many test-persons. But of course, the aura could be based on complex conscious information patterns about the testee's clothing, body posture, facial expression and much more... And would that be wrong ore useless ? NO ! We first should find a category, where to put aura into, before testing if it exists. I could bring some philosophies about the spiritual side and why 'they' avoid to be tested, but that is another topic ![]() BTW:Thanks Jiggy for the wonderful color-description. I see you have worked on that and while I have not really, yours is of great value for me. Thanks --------------------
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jiggy Registered: 07/20/04 Posts: 7,469 Loc: Heart of Laughte |
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Pyska,
How funny you tell me that statement you quoted of mine would be more clear with more punctuation, when you clearly haven't read through this thread. I think at least three times, I have already said, that I think all of the testees were frauds. That's all it proved. I've spoken at great length of how prevalent fraud is in this world. Oh well, I don't know how you critical skeptics do this with such things 24/7. It's lousy energy to be in and hardly a challenge. Close the mind and heart up enough with Occam's razor and you can make nothing exist anymore. Live small live large, whatever, its your life. I'm going to float back up to where the air is lighter, there's more room and freedom to roam, where I know the technology already exists and I've worked with it and people who heal through the subtle energy body fields for a living. For beleivers in the human energy field and those of you who have started to see them pretty well, or at least develop a sensitivity to feeling them, you will LOVE Barbara Brennan's manual, "Hands of Light, Healing through Human Energy Field." Her illustrations rock and the information in there of all the templates and so much more is extremely insightful, informative and useful for your own self healing energy work. Demand for her skills became so great, she decided to open up an institute in Florida to teach others. She was a NASA physicist. Another NASA Astro Physicist who worked on the Apollo missions and developed tri vector and sub space technology for it developed the frequency resonance technology I worked with that does more then I could elaborate on. Here's how to get her book- http://www.barbarabrennan.com/we Leery, you mentioned thinking all of your chakras are closed. I doubt that, however, this woman has done 20 years of research with frequency resonance and developed some frequency CDs to open, heal and balance the chakras that are mind blowers. She has sets for other things too. I have the Chakra set and some more. www.harmonyera.com Her book on her research is a great read too. I haven't used them in a while, and am probably due for a tune up, but it is amazing to know the feeling of what its like to have them all open and balanced. I wish the whole world had access to them. My third was blocked up bad at the time I got them. I actually experienced so much pain and discomfort when that one was being busted up and released, I had to turn the CD off. Proof enough for me. Took me five plays to get through it. I felt it working during and after. My whole family did too. We all mellowed out when I first got them and played them daily. ![]() Her DNA activation CD is a screamer. I could hardly handle that one. It's been years since I played it. I should pop it in again and see what happens. All sorts of cool things happening out there people. Life moves on beyond the closed doors of minds and hearts. It doesn't hurt to open some up and do some exploring of new vistas. None of this is going to bite ya all if you explore and play around with it. I'm alive, well and better then ever as a result.
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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jiggy Registered: 07/20/04 Posts: 7,469 Loc: Heart of Laughte |
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You're welcome blue. I enjoy talking about color light and sound wave healing.
I'm ten minutes into the DNA CD and ahahahahahahaha I can barely stand it. My lungs feel like they are going to burst out of my chest and my skull, shit its like nails down a chalk board. My arms and legs are buzzing something intense and feel like they are floating up on me. I wish I could invite you all over to experience these CDs. There are sample plays at her web site. You don't get all of the tones in the samples. They change throughout the CDs though. Crystal Toning bones are big with the Tibetan monks. There is a long history of tonal "frequency resonance healing" going all the way to ancient Egypt and the Hathors. I knew a lady in Kauai who could tone. WOW that was intense to feel the unearthly sounds that came out of her. She did a toning healing scan on my mom, and aimed at her hip for a while , which I thought was odd, and later remembered, my mom came to visit with sciatic pain so bad, she almost didn't come. I asked her later how it was. She looked at me quizzically and said, "It's GONE". It never came back. That woman was a very awakened galactic with some serious skills. My daughter just came flying out of her room going, and she was laughing. I asked her how she felt and she said, "mellow buzz", major pressure head, and her nerves are now starting to get shaky. She's amped up running and jumping around. It's funny. 20 inutes in now I feel like I am pinned back in a chair going 300 mph with some fun G-force pulls. My cats freaking out now. It's funny. We're about 30 minutes in. The tones are getting higher. Everything is smoothing out for us now, feeling very mellow calm and quiet. I'm floating on a cloud of some serious bliss juice now. This is sweet, I'm getting waves of relaxation flowing through me. My body feels like it is rolling in waves from head to toe. Wild. I'm too relaxed to type anymore.
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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The energy "hallucinations" are a result of masses of previously unaware sensory and neural information ... They do not come from nothing, hallucinations cannot come from nothing...?
No, I don't agree. Hallucinations come from your imagination; the same place dreams, art, music, and emotions come from. They are 100% your imagination. They feel intense only because the drugs are tickling the parts of the brain responsible for making things up. They are not real or they would be detectable by someone outside your head. This has even been more or less confirmed by injecting people with radioisotope-tagged glucose, sticking their head in a computed tomography machine, and observing the regions of the brain where the drug is active. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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Easy. I am having trouble understanding who cares if he can or not and why they would waste their time with such a test
WHY someone wants to conduct the test should have no bearing whatever on HOW the test is conducted. When you go to the grocery store, you don't take a different route depending on whether you're going for eggs or for bread. The WHY you're going to the grocery store has nothing to do with the ROUTE you take to get there. I'm asking you what your route is, and you're demanding to know if it's for eggs or bread before answering me. This is flawed thinking and why our discussion is futile. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government. Edited by Diploid (03/30/06 04:37 PM)
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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I am also a bit skeptic on the method used to prove if auras exist with a screen.
Here is another example of why mystic-heads make no progress and why science-heads get frustrated. The test is to see IF THE GUY CAN SEE AURAS, not IF AURAS EXIST. I must have made the point a half dozen times so far, yet every other post, a mystic-head makes the same reading comprehension error over and over again. This isn't difficult: the test is to see if the guy can see auras, not to see if auras exist. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Beyond Registered: 05/07/04 Posts: 6,697 Loc: Between Last seen: 3 years, 16 days |
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[...]Hallucinations come from your imagination; the same place dreams, art, music, and emotions come from.[...]
Interestingly, these things do not stem directly from imagination, they are only represented there. We get it from there with our conscious attention, what, of course, can interact back on our imagination again, to get more out of 'something'. If we look closely, even our direct perception of 'reality' is covered (or filled up, brought to perspective and context) by parts of our imagination. For some it is more for some it is less. But someone can assume, that the reality and the imagination mix there somewhere on our screen, in front of our eyes. The informed focus will make the key. Where the 'causes' of these 'imaginations' lie, is still discussed and very various, I think. Ah yes, and it is the same to say, if the man can see something there, or if that something there exists, at least in this case Please spend more concern to the important parts of my posts
-------------------- Edited by BlueCoyote (03/30/06 04:50 PM)
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Teh Cat.... Registered: 09/07/04 Posts: 5,908 Loc: My Youniverse... Last seen: 14 years, 11 months |
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Soooo let me get this straight, you only get the million dollars if you prove that auras exist....?
-------------------- "The most important things in life that are often ignored, are the things that one cannot see...." >^;;^<
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Beyond Registered: 05/07/04 Posts: 6,697 Loc: Between Last seen: 3 years, 16 days |
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I think that is the gimmick of all his site, yes
![]() If you prove that someone can do something supernatural, you have the proof that this phenomena exists. That is it, all about, and it is not wrong. --------------------
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Teh Cat.... Registered: 09/07/04 Posts: 5,908 Loc: My Youniverse... Last seen: 14 years, 11 months |
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.
<==== I can see the aura in my self made fractal-alien-cat avatar, and I don't even have to concentrate (anymore)....
-------------------- "The most important things in life that are often ignored, are the things that one cannot see...." >^;;^<
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jiggy Registered: 07/20/04 Posts: 7,469 Loc: Heart of Laughte |
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Quote: You decided to interpret and assume why I would ask why we were testing and then saw your own assumption and interpretation as being flawed. You have yet never even asked ME, why I would want to know why. Your analogy was flawed is right. It made no sense nor bore any relation to anything I have yet to even say. ![]() Do you always ask people questions and answer for them in the same breath and then call the answer you stuck in their mouth flawed? What is that? ![]() Will you allow me to answer the question you asked me for myself? When it comes to assigned tasks and work, not my leisure exploratative time, I thrive on proficiency, extreme organization, and time management. Regarding being assigned a task, I must know what the goal is, what the task giver is ultimately after. I can see the best way, once I learn what the goal of a task is. Say I was a hair stylist and was assigned the task to style someones hair, I would ask why they wanted it done, to know how to serve the goal for doing so best. Are they attempting to score favor with punk rocker, or a stuffy conservative mother in law, or out to seduce some GQ billionaire jet setter. Knowing why they want their hair styled makes a difference to how the task will be performed to best serve their ultimate goal. What if she is a clueless 19 year old who asks for a pink Mohawk because she thinks their rad, and I find out she is meeting her ultra conservative mother in law for the first time and would like to make a favorable impression. I am going to guide her into choosing a more modest style and explain why that would best serve her goal. If I help my clients meet their goals successfully, I meet mine as a professional successfully. Do you better now understand why I would first want to know why we were even testing the guy? I disagree with your statement that says, WHY someone wants a test performed has no bearing on HOW it should be performed. Without answering the why, how do you know what your ultimate goal to be achieved is. Without knowing the goal to be achieved, how do you know how to best get to it? What if a friend was hanging out at your house and asked you for 5 bucks and said he would be right back. Say you asked nothing and he came back from blockbusterster with a DVD you already have in your collection. Had you bothered to ask why he wanted the money and where he was going you could've saved him the money and the trip. Your knowing the why would've changed the how of getting to his goal for the better.
-------------------- Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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※※※※※※ Registered: 12/22/02 Posts: 6,367 Loc: Europe Last seen: 8 months, 9 days |
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Quote: The "aura" around a lightbulb you described is there because of the intense light from the lightbulb itself. If you don't see that light, you don't see the aura. That does mean that there has to be a very bright lightsource to create the aura around it. This bright aura-light source is missing in the human aura: the body is not that bright lightsource because they only see aura's around people.
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Cuban Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 19,274 Loc: Rabbit Hole |
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Soooo let me get this straight, you only get the million dollars if you prove that auras exist....?
Noooo, for the zillionth time now. You get the million dollars if you do what you say you can do. -------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Beyond Registered: 05/07/04 Posts: 6,697 Loc: Between Last seen: 3 years, 16 days |
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As long we do not know what exactly they see, we could try some experiments, like if the original poster, or the one, who watches the auras of his teachers will hold his thumb before the teacher and looks if he can still see the aura. Or, 'occasionally' make some big dude school friend walk directly in front of the teacher. So we could see if it is possible, to see, if watching an aura without the person is possible at all
![]() And for the strong light-similarity, the moon does not produce strong light, but its aura/corona is visible in specific conditions (high clouds or humid atmosphere)
--------------------
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Beyond Registered: 05/07/04 Posts: 6,697 Loc: Between Last seen: 3 years, 16 days |
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Quote: Let's call it out for debate ! Does the proof of someone doing some supernatural thing equal the proof of the supernatural thing itself ? I say, of course it does ! --------------------
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※※※※※※ Registered: 12/22/02 Posts: 6,367 Loc: Europe Last seen: 8 months, 9 days |
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Quote: Yes, but moon coronas are still visible when you don't see the moon.
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Beyond Registered: 05/07/04 Posts: 6,697 Loc: Between Last seen: 3 years, 16 days |
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Quote: That's why I propose different modes of testing. I wrote, if one blocks the sight to the moon outside the atmosphere. Meaning, the corona exists, but can be blocked without overleaping the aura itself by the blockage. Meaning, pushing one big guy of his class in front of the teacher, or putting a screen in front of the aura-giver Perhaps, the vision of aura is dependent on direct vision of the subject, that has to be checked first and in how far it can be blocked (distances, thumb or guy, inside atmosphere or outside of it). If it can be blocked like this, of course there is much more room for speculation. If not, Randis setting would be appropriate. -------------------- Edited by BlueCoyote (03/31/06 09:07 AM)
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Teh Cat.... Registered: 09/07/04 Posts: 5,908 Loc: My Youniverse... Last seen: 14 years, 11 months |
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Quote: Alright, I figured out my plan to PROVE that there are auras, to as where I can see them, and everyone else can see them - so I can get me a million bux.... All I will need is a very very fine mist of water around the dooods head poking out from behind the curtain, and a strategically placed full spectrum lightbulb..... TAAAaaa DAAaaaa....! :InsertNormalRainbowIconHere:
-------------------- "The most important things in life that are often ignored, are the things that one cannot see...." >^;;^<
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Flip Horrorshow Registered: 11/28/04 Posts: 9,230 |
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I read this whole thread.
Why isn't this in the space monster forum?
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Sexy.Butt.McDanger Registered: 03/12/02 Posts: 24,855 Loc: Pandurn Last seen: 1 year, 12 days |
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Quote: I truly feel sorry for you. ![]() ![]() Peace.
-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Butterfly Registered: 01/31/06 Posts: 143 Loc: Texas - where el Last seen: 17 years, 9 months |
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Quote: you fail to say why you don;tthink auras exsist -------------------- i have less ego than you do!
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Sexy.Butt.McDanger Registered: 03/12/02 Posts: 24,855 Loc: Pandurn Last seen: 1 year, 12 days |
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He's suppressing the fact that his aura is a vibrant rainbow of color.
That is, he doesn't want to admit that he's gay. ![]() ![]() Peace.
-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Butterfly Registered: 01/31/06 Posts: 143 Loc: Texas - where el Last seen: 17 years, 9 months |
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Quote: I can arouse any straight man - do I get a miollon dollars? -------------------- i have less ego than you do!
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Beyond Registered: 05/07/04 Posts: 6,697 Loc: Between Last seen: 3 years, 16 days |
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Seriously, if someone can see auras or happen to perceive supernatural or supernaturally influences things by his/her own will (with relevance to the outside perceivable world), they should do some simple previous tests by their own, to get some grip on the external/environmental conditions, which could influence the experience.
Then, if you think, it is still influencable/perceivable by your own will, then call Randi
-------------------- Edited by BlueCoyote (04/02/06 04:29 PM)
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Not that I am aware, not even sure what you are talking about related to what I said. Conspiracy ?






