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DICK
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Down with the system!!
#5453490 - 03/28/06 10:54 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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This is a question for all you people out there... After watching the movie V for Vendetta (if you havent seen it, go...NOW) I wondered... What if someone actually brought anarchy to all of us? Well for the sake of the argument, lets not say total anarchy but more like freedom.
What if a freedom fighter like no other arose and fought for the people using terrorist tactics (be aware that this exactly what V did, so by terrorist, erase all negative connotation) to overthrow this oppresive system that only gets worse each day? Would you side with him? Support him? Or be against him?
His/her motive wouldnt be to then become 'president'/dictator and take over the country... his motive would be pure and simple... to bring true freedom to the people who live in this land and to let them shape the country as they, THE people see it right... as a TRUE democracy
Discuss.
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DoctorJ


Registered: 06/30/03
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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: DICK]
#5453499 - 03/28/06 10:58 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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man if the redneck crackhead proletarian masses of this country tore down the government, the new government erected shortly thereafter would probably be a million times worse.
sad but true
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notapillow
I want to be a fisherman


Registered: 09/29/03
Posts: 31,129
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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: DoctorJ]
#5453520 - 03/28/06 11:02 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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true dont worry the earth will take care of us one way or another
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daimyo
Monticello

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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: DICK]
#5453529 - 03/28/06 11:05 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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- Define freedom
- Explain the means that would be used to obtain the end
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"I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man."
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DICK
Stranger
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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: daimyo]
#5453590 - 03/28/06 11:19 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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By freedom I mean, living by the constitution that we have so severely adultered through history...
Or living without the constitution but by a set of moral codes every human should follow... A consciense
I know it sounds impossible, but thats because we are so used to this governement. Weve become complacent... And we only feel 'pressured' by it when it attacks us personally.
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Tattoo
Thread Killer


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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: DICK]
#5453617 - 03/28/06 11:27 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Well that isn't exactly total freedom- the end result of anarchy would have to end with some semblance of order for people to survive outside of an alpha male/group gatherer scavenger society. I say total freedom needs to be earned in order to provide perspective, so you kind of have to bite the bullet and implement some level of social order- the most lenient being, don't kill me, don't steal from me-
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one nigga run, two nigga run
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daimyo
Monticello

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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: daimyo]
#5453633 - 03/28/06 11:32 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
DICK said: By freedom I mean, living by the constitution that we have so severely adultered through history
- What amendments, if any, stay?
- Whose interpretation will we go by?
Quote:
DICK said: Or living without the constitution but by a set of moral codes every human should follow... A consciense
- Who decides what is moral, and what is not?
- More to the point, what is moral, and what is not?
Quote:
daimyo said: Explain the means that would be used to obtain the end
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"I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man."
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DICK
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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: Tattoo]
#5453668 - 03/28/06 11:39 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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of course of course... and even though I wish to fully believe in anarchy, I know its imposible since there are truly bad people out there tht live to cause others harm. But, part of it is governement induced fear.
Imagine a place where if it so required, there is a leader... Not a dictator, not a king, president etc... But a leader of all people. A wise man does not seek power to himself but promotes advancement in society. Instead of a country where instead of sex, drugs violence and degrading social behavior is promoted in movies music etc... A land where people spend half their days working a dead end job and whole of their freetime glued to a tube... Imagine a place where the potential of each individual is encouraged.
This is only skimming the suraface... But the idea is there.
Oh and just to make things clear, Im not saying "ban all degrading music and entertainment..." this things will continue to exist but over time people themselves will 'mature'...
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DICK
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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: DICK]
#5453690 - 03/28/06 11:45 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Basic human rights... ammendments that we can all as one person agree on.
Or reinvent the wheel if we must, but as one voice.
I know it sounds farout to believe that we can all agree on one thing specially considering were all different but, I believe if we were all to sit down and rationalize... we could all reach that goal.
Many of todays mistakes are due to media misinformation and manipulation... with all that gone, I know in the core of it all, people as a whole just want the best.
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daimyo
Monticello

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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: DICK]
#5453701 - 03/28/06 11:48 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Are you sidstepping, or did you not understand my questions? I apologize if any clarification is necessary, but I will be more than happy to provide it.
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"I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man."
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EmpTyCLosEtSpAcE
yatahey


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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: DICK]
#5453740 - 03/29/06 12:02 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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I support any action that causes chaos/turmoil within ANY govt. Say "V" swoops down and does his thing, I'll support him. Hands down, I'll be marching right up along side him. But V isn't real and I don't trust any human to take power, then give it up or accept responsibility for the way he TOOK power. Machiavelli said a good leader must sink into evil from time to time as circumstances dictate, but must also step back out and be held accountable for his actions no matter WHAT the circumstance. How often does THAT happen? A society based on morality, respect, helping others, etc is all fine and good. But until we've evolved to the point where deciding WHO'S morality and idea's on respect we are to abide by is no longer an issue, it's IMHO complete fiction.
-------------------- I can't imagine what the cops are going to think when they come in and see a couple hippies on some guy covered in puke and shit screaming i'm dying as we tell him it's ok he'll like it.-Chinacat72
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Muppet69_420
Speed feeder


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Regardless of what anyone might say this country the "USA" or possibly other countries as well are so corrupted a revolution is needed, I personally dont like people here where iam standing against immigrations laws. Though thats not an issue in this topic.. im just saying :P. A revolt will come one day most likely leading to a civil war. There has to be the way this countries going. Or mother nature will do its work sometime in the future and it wont be nice to us or at least not entirely nice. The problem is is our heart bleeding liberals who go for mostly everything the gov. does or some stupid shit like these people against immigration laws, which is benefitting the rich more or just and putting some people in the mid class out of business. People need to stand up and start fighting back but people IMO are too afraid and those who are acknowledging these things are too few. I would stand with a individual like V.
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Quote:
I live to learn and learn to live. forget w/e was here b4 it was meth gibberish.... ....thats as old as my account... On that note fart in public and grin. Hail Shroomery!
Edited by Savako (03/29/06 12:42 AM)
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DICK
Stranger
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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: daimyo]
#5454736 - 03/29/06 11:06 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
daimyo said: Are you sidstepping, or did you not understand my questions? I apologize if any clarification is necessary, but I will be more than happy to provide it.
did i answer it with the post just above it? if not, explain
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daimyo
Monticello

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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: DICK]
#5454775 - 03/29/06 11:18 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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You say you define freedom as living by the constitution. I am asking what exactly you mean. The original, or as it is in it's present state? Or would you leave out some amendments? On this same subject, I am asking whose interpretation of the constitution, and it's amendments(if you're leaving them), are we, as a society, to go by?
You also mention living by a set of moral standards. I asked "Who decides what is moral, and what is not?" in your society. I also asked "what is moral, and what is not?" in an attempt to gain insight on your personal beliefs in hopes of furthering this discussion.
And finally, I asked you to "Explain the means that would be used to obtain the end". In other words, what methods will be used to in this revolution? Will people die? Buildings be blown up? Psych ops? Etcetera.
All I can get from your statements thus far are general comments about wanting a utopian society where everyone has a say. This has been hashed over for thousands of years. I think most can agree it would be nice in general, but I am after the specifics of your dream.
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"I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man."
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: daimyo]
#5454778 - 03/29/06 11:20 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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We just need a government who will allow us to do what we wish, as long as we do not harm others.
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OneMoreRobot3021


Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 61,024
Loc: the sky
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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: Redstorm]
#5454780 - 03/29/06 11:22 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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Which would first require that all human beings be capable of doing what they want without harming others..
And yes, we're capable..
But is it probable? Nah.
-------------------- Acid doesn't give you truths; it builds machines that push the envelope of perception. Whatever revelations came to me then have dissolved like skywriting. All I really know is that those few years saddled me with a faith in the redemptive potential of the imagination which, however flat, stale and unprofitable the world seems to me now, I cannot for the life of me shake. -Erik Davis
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



Registered: 10/08/02
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I'm not advocating a system of gov't that is for all practical purposes anarchy. Those who harm others would still be prosecuted under law just as they are now. The difference would be that those who do not hurt others will be left alone.
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OneMoreRobot3021


Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 61,024
Loc: the sky
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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: Redstorm]
#5454793 - 03/29/06 11:25 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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Who decides what hurts who else?
-------------------- Acid doesn't give you truths; it builds machines that push the envelope of perception. Whatever revelations came to me then have dissolved like skywriting. All I really know is that those few years saddled me with a faith in the redemptive potential of the imagination which, however flat, stale and unprofitable the world seems to me now, I cannot for the life of me shake. -Erik Davis
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



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Physical harm is obvious when it manifests itself and can be decided on a case by case basis, at it is now.
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OneMoreRobot3021


Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 61,024
Loc: the sky
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Re: Down with the system!! [Re: Redstorm]
#5454801 - 03/29/06 11:28 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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What about stalking someone?
-------------------- Acid doesn't give you truths; it builds machines that push the envelope of perception. Whatever revelations came to me then have dissolved like skywriting. All I really know is that those few years saddled me with a faith in the redemptive potential of the imagination which, however flat, stale and unprofitable the world seems to me now, I cannot for the life of me shake. -Erik Davis
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