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LegalizeTodd
Revolutionary

Registered: 10/20/05
Posts: 28
Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP
#5445567 - 03/26/06 10:50 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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AFOAF is having MAJOR problems with colonization. Any help would be MUCH appreciated.
He/she/it is using WBS in quart jars with polyfill/tyvek. Over 50 jars have now failed(!!). 
On the first 20+ jars, it was guessed that the jars contracted bacterial contamination (- Wetspot?) due to not being soaked long enough. So, on the last 30, WBS was soaked for 36 hours, rinsed, and PCed for an hour or so at 15 PSI. Inoculation was done in a glove box within a few days of sterilization.
All colonization has occurred in a TiT incubator at approx 82 degrees.
Here are pictures:


Questions? COMMENTS?
Edited by LegalizeTodd (03/26/06 10:53 PM)
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ZEPH
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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: LegalizeTodd]
#5445676 - 03/26/06 11:34 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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humm what strain? i am doing a bunch of strains and my maz look just like this but my hawaian my blue meines have good rizomorphic growth its wierd.. i hope there not contamed... its my first atemped at wbs
imo id definetly spawn them to some poo if they dont smell when u open them..
i thought wetspot was from being too wet and somehow that particullur strain of bactiria got in durring inoculation?
Edited by ZEPH (03/26/06 11:38 PM)
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LegalizeTodd
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Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: LegalizeTodd]
#5445698 - 03/26/06 11:45 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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First 20+ were a combination Costa Rican & Golden Teacher (and about 5 birthed successfully), last 30 were all Treasure Coast (looking like 2-3 will fruit, maybe)
-------------------- "Everything comes apart if you know where the screws are"
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LegalizeTodd
Revolutionary

Registered: 10/20/05
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Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: ZEPH]
#5445709 - 03/26/06 11:51 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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I'll share my theory, as well:
The first batch was contammed from endospores not killed bc of too little soaking (best idea at this point, I think). The second, well, my guess is that the Spore Syringes contammed after about 4 months of waiting in different fridges. How about that?
Just want to get this straight before moving on with LC (Costa Rican) to another batch. There's only so much failure a person can stomach.
-------------------- "Everything comes apart if you know where the screws are"
Edited by LegalizeTodd (03/26/06 11:53 PM)
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ZEPH
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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: LegalizeTodd]
#5445807 - 03/27/06 12:09 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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hehe my syringes are 2yrs old lol look at my grow if ya want its mush grow in growlog forum
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LegalizeTodd
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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: ZEPH]
#5445971 - 03/27/06 12:35 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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well atleast I know its not that. anyother ideas? when I crack the jars open its a musty bacteria smell totally unlike mycelieum so i know its a contam should i get this thread moved to the contam forum?
-------------------- "Everything comes apart if you know where the screws are"
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ZEPH
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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: LegalizeTodd]
#5446001 - 03/27/06 12:48 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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fuck now im worried
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LegalizeTodd
Revolutionary

Registered: 10/20/05
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Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: ZEPH]
#5446004 - 03/27/06 12:49 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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well i hate to say it man but ive done 50 jars that failed just like this and even tried casing one to no avail. so best of luck lol but if it looks like this with no risomorhphic growth it may be a loss.
-------------------- "Everything comes apart if you know where the screws are"
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ZEPH
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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: LegalizeTodd]
#5446008 - 03/27/06 12:51 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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yeah i think my maz are screwed then but my hawian and my blue menies look good
maby i should have did pf cakes and spawn to poo ....whats the saying why fix whats not broke?
Edited by ZEPH (03/27/06 12:53 AM)
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coda
Banjo Goiter


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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: ZEPH]
#5446810 - 03/27/06 10:03 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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just for clarification SOAKING DOES NOT KILL ENDOSPORES.
I never soak my grains, ever, and i have ZERO contam issues. Id look to other parts of your procedure, did you simmer your grains long enough, did you rinse them off and drain them before pc'ing them, did your pc correctly, was your inoculation procedure sterile?
way to many factors yet for us to help you in your problem, but i can tell you that it wasn't because you didnt soak long enough.
-------------------- To get really high is to forget yourself. And to forget yourself is to see everything else. And to see everything else is to become an understanding molecule in evolution, a conscious tool of the universe. And I think every human being should be a conscious tool of the universe. . . . -JG i really am glad you came back to us instead of taking the other path. *hug* -A_S (RIP your final words to me will never be forgotten)
 Don't fuck with the laughing jesus.
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musher_420
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Registered: 08/01/05
Posts: 2,691
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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: LegalizeTodd]
#5446830 - 03/27/06 10:13 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
LegalizeTodd said: AFOAF is having MAJOR problems with colonization. Any help would be MUCH appreciated.
He/she/it is using WBS in quart jars with polyfill/tyvek. Over 50 jars have now failed(!!). 
On the first 20+ jars, it was guessed that the jars contracted bacterial contamination (- Wetspot?) due to not being soaked long enough. So, on the last 30, WBS was soaked for 36 hours, rinsed, and PCed for an hour or so at 15 PSI. Inoculation was done in a glove box within a few days of sterilization.
If your getting bacterial contamination I'm going to GUESS that you aren't fully sterlizing your jars.
With WBS, I NEVER PC for LESS then 90 minutes...AFTER the pressure cooker has reached 15 psi
Also make sure you rinse and drain your grain very well.
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HyphalTryptamin
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Registered: 05/07/05
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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: coda]
#5446943 - 03/27/06 10:49 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
coda said: just for clarification SOAKING DOES NOT KILL ENDOSPORES.
I never soak my grains, ever, and i have ZERO contam issues. Id look to other parts of your procedure, did you simmer your grains long enough, did you rinse them off and drain them before pc'ing them, did your pc correctly, was your inoculation procedure sterile?
way to many factors yet for us to help you in your problem, but i can tell you that it wasn't because you didnt soak long enough.
True, but what soaking is for, is to germinate the endospores, which can then be killed at 121C. I've found that a presoak helps alot with WBS, and if you're using it for spawning to poo, then you don't need to simmer it either. The likelihood is that your WBS is treated with some kindof anti-fungal chemical, this wouldnt be the first time people have been unsuccesful because of this.
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BigBlazer8586
experiencedmycologist

Registered: 06/02/05
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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: LegalizeTodd]
#5446963 - 03/27/06 10:53 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Your jars look way too wet. You can see how the grains are shiny and moist and many are sticking to the side where you can clearly see water. The grains should look dry after simmering, draining, and loading the jars. If your grains are still wet looking on the outside try sprinkling a litte vermiculite bit by bit until they appear dry. add slowly cause you can always add more but if you get too much its probably ruined. check out my pictures of my jars the grain should look very dry.
-------------------- I am a very sick person. All information contained above this line is fiction. Its all made up bullshit from the inner recesses of my strange mind.
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LegalizeTodd
Revolutionary

Registered: 10/20/05
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Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: BigBlazer8586]
#5447285 - 03/27/06 12:26 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Thnx for the great replys guys. The first set of 25 I followed DOC's wild birdseed tech and had slow colonization and only three or four made it out of the incubation chamber to fruiting.
On the second 25 I decided to not follow the tech but kept with the basics. aka I went from soaking for 36 to PCing immediatly and Im getting the same results although the grain does indeed look a bit more moist.
Is Simmering a must before the PC? My sterilization practices are pretty top notch during inoculation. I use a glove box and enough lysol spray to nuke a small country. Im really thinking its the
-------------------- "Everything comes apart if you know where the screws are"
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HyphalTryptamin
Stranger

Registered: 05/07/05
Posts: 390
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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: LegalizeTodd]
#5447497 - 03/27/06 01:15 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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No. you don't need to simmer. It's just an opportunity for the grains to pop after that in PC'ing. If you're bothered about water content then just lay down some hydrated and sterilised vermiculite at the bottom of your tray, to supply water to the mycelial network.
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LegalizeTodd
Revolutionary

Registered: 10/20/05
Posts: 28
Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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do you mean the casing trays? Cause im allready putting a layer on bottom and top. and im not spawning to poo at this time. what im worried about is that even after i pressure cook the jars for the correct amount of time im not getting sterilized conditions. Im starting the timer for the PC once the rocker starts rockin. what techs are you guys using?
-------------------- "Everything comes apart if you know where the screws are"
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HyphalTryptamin
Stranger

Registered: 05/07/05
Posts: 390
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Re: NO Rhizomorphic Growth!! HELP [Re: LegalizeTodd]
#5447655 - 03/27/06 01:48 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Yes, casing tray. It may be worth having a look at the rez-effect post too:
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/1939583/page/0/fpart/1/vc/1
Doc's Tek should be fine. You can always look at this:
http://www.shroomery.org/index.php/par/23526
for correct pressure cooking use.
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