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Pirate_Patrick
Stranger

Registered: 04/20/05
Posts: 342
Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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My opinion on veganism.
#5446009 - 03/27/06 12:52 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Chickens and Steer dont have a point in existance except to feed predators. The Wildebeasts in Africa provide food for Lions, Hyenas and Humans. Cattle in America provide us with food. People have been eating animals for as long as history has been recorded. People will continue to eat animals for as long as humankind exists. It's the natural way of life since the dawn of mankind.
However the treatment of animals in most cases is shit. Taking farm animals, placing them in small buildings in close proximity to each other in unsanitary conditions, and pumping them full of hormones and steroids is utter bullshit. The only reason people do that is turn a profit and sell the meat cheaper. It's a total disregard for the animals that feed us. We humans are the only species capable of deep emotions and intelligent reasoning rather than animalistic responses. Because of that we need to treat animals with respect and dignity they deserve.
It's not the veganism thats stupid, it's the moralistic elitist attitude behind veganism thats retarded. It's the same attitude some Christians, Muslims, Conservitives and dictators have. People will hate the belief if it's associated with one who thinks they are morally superiour. The "If you don't believe what I believe then you are wrong and therefore I am better then you" attitude is what makes so many people hate vegans and their beliefs. That is all.
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theuser
DON'T LOOK

Registered: 08/04/05
Posts: 5,859
Last seen: 3 years, 11 months
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I don't like to hunt animals. I like to watch them doing their shit in the wild. With that said, I looooooove a pre-hunted, pre-packaged, hunk of juicey raw animal meat for $5.99 at Albertsons.
Mmmmmm, that sizzle sound when I plop that sucker on the grill. Tasty!
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Edited by theolduser (03/27/06 01:04 AM)
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Wysefool
I AM SKELETON JELLY

Registered: 12/26/02
Posts: 6,643
Last seen: 5 months, 26 days
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I was thinking this earlier too, I wish they would just have a bunch roaming in the wild and hunt them for food and then package and give it to us. At least give them a chance!!!
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trils0n
Stranger

Registered: 02/21/06
Posts: 21
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Re: My opinion on veganism. *DELETED* [Re: Pirate_Patrick]
#5446047 - 03/27/06 01:17 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Post deleted by trils0nReason for deletion: Reducing social media presence.
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Vvellum
Stranger

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 10,920
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I have found most vegans and vegetarians that I have encoutered do not have the "holier than thou" attitude that you speak of whereas meat-eaters do. meat-eaters will get in your face and annoy the shit out of you. that is when vegans tend to step up - in response.
vegans and vegetarians, for the most part, are simply taking care of themselves and trying to live a better life not convert you.
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Pirate_Patrick
Stranger

Registered: 04/20/05
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Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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Re: My opinion on veganism. [Re: trils0n]
#5446086 - 03/27/06 01:38 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Well you can buy free range cattle, chicken and eggs. They don't give the animals drugs and are fed grains rather then proccessed hormone treated feed.
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Vvellum
Stranger

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 10,920
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Quote:
Pirate_Patrick said: Well you can buy free range cattle, chicken and eggs. They don't give the animals drugs and are fed grains rather then proccessed hormone treated feed.
http://www.vegsource.com/jo/qa/qaeggs.htm
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Shroomism
Space Travellin


Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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I eat a little meat.. though I try to go for organic as much as possible (and as much as I can afford it..) You should watch this video if you want to see where most of our meat comes from, and why it is so cheap - http://meat.org/
And about the plants have feelings too thing... that's such a played out cop out. Show me a plant with a heartbeat and a central nervous system. I have no problems eating meat for sustenance... but the modern meat industry is fucking disgusting. If you kill it yourself in the wild.. more power to you. But if you ask me.. we should eat people too, make it fair.
And hey.. that would help the overpopulation AND starving people problems at the same time. Talk about a win/win situation. Two birds with one stone and all that jazz.
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EmpTyCLosEtSpAcE
yatahey


Registered: 03/22/06
Posts: 99
Last seen: 16 years, 10 months
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Re: My opinion on veganism. [Re: Vvellum]
#5446110 - 03/27/06 01:54 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Meh, I like meat and I'll always eat it. I DO make an effort to eat only meat that I have personally killed. That way I know it died as painlessly as possible. While I respect an animals "right" to not be tormented, as a predator I do kinda view them as commodities.
-------------------- I can't imagine what the cops are going to think when they come in and see a couple hippies on some guy covered in puke and shit screaming i'm dying as we tell him it's ok he'll like it.-Chinacat72
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hawksapprentice
Yearns to Snowboard


Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 3,195
Loc: Oregon
Last seen: 8 months, 6 days
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Re: My opinion on veganism. [Re: Shroomism]
#5446194 - 03/27/06 03:11 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Dude, saying that plants dont deserve rights because they survive in a different way is total bullshit. They are still a living thing, regardless of wether they have a CNS or Heart. They have life functions, they are just different from what you are used to.
That is a very ignorant view.
-------------------- "I celebrate the Earth, my home, my mother, my grave, and as long as men are Man they must, if they would preserve the integrated being, do the same---[and preserve]--this rank casual hungry smelly sweaty lusting transitory body, my oozy pulpy liquid-bag-swollen body, bones, blood, hair glands, my bejeweled sex; I love and celebrate it all. never to let men forget that they are animals as much as gods---that is one thing I shall say." Edward Abbey
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JonnyOnTheSpot
Sober Surfer


Registered: 01/27/02
Posts: 11,527
Loc: North Carolina
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Quote:
Pirate_Patrick said: Chickens and Steer dont have a point in existance except to feed predators. The Wildebeasts in Africa provide food for Lions, Hyenas and Humans. Cattle in America provide us with food. People have been eating animals for as long as history has been recorded. People will continue to eat animals for as long as humankind exists. It's the natural way of life since the dawn of mankind.
However the treatment of animals in most cases is shit. Taking farm animals, placing them in small buildings in close proximity to each other in unsanitary conditions, and pumping them full of hormones and steroids is utter bullshit. The only reason people do that is turn a profit and sell the meat cheaper. It's a total disregard for the animals that feed us. We humans are the only species capable of deep emotions and intelligent reasoning rather than animalistic responses. Because of that we need to treat animals with respect and dignity they deserve.
It's not the veganism thats stupid, it's the moralistic elitist attitude behind veganism thats retarded. It's the same attitude some Christians, Muslims, Conservitives and dictators have. People will hate the belief if it's associated with one who thinks they are morally superiour. The "If you don't believe what I believe then you are wrong and therefore I am better then you" attitude is what makes so many people hate vegans and their beliefs. That is all.
i agree. it's not wrong to eat an animal, but it is wrong to torture and deform them for profit, mainly because it's unnecessary
i tend to respect vegans and vegetarians that do it for health reasons a lot more than the preachy 'save the animals' types out there. their arguments are always so full of holes, and they never see them because they blind themselves, in most cases anyway.
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Shroomism
Space Travellin


Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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I was making a point.
And where the fuck did I say plants don't deserve rights? In fact.. where in my post did I say anything about rights? Don't twist my words and then call it bullshit. I think you should adjust your reading skills.
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Left Nut City
Stranger

Registered: 03/27/01
Posts: 2,360
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Re: My opinion on veganism. [Re: Shroomism]
#5446347 - 03/27/06 05:39 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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I was strictly vegan for 6 months once. At the end of the 6 months I honestly felt low energy and was listless. I am no longer vegan.
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Shroomism
Space Travellin


Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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If you're not going to eat meat.. you need to adjust your diet significantly to compensate for the lack of complete proteins, iron, B vitamins, and essential fatty and amino acids. This means lots of raw nuts, whole grains, and a wide variety of fresh fruits and vegetables and pasta and legumes. I.e - a healthy, balanced, diet that people should eat anyway regardless of it they eat meat or not. Most of the vegans I've known... got sick and low on energy because they didn't eat the proper foods/ate crap denatured foods full of preservatives and sugars and hydrogenated oils. You can be perfectly healthy without eating meat. You just have to eat properly.. and 90% of the people that go vegetarian or vegan, don't.. because they are uninformed on proper nutrition. Also I don't think veganism is especially healthy.. because cheese and eggs are the shit.
Like this one chick I knew that went vegan. All she would eat was like crackers and french fries and candy and crap like that. And she would drink lots of soda and coffee and shit. And she wondered why she felt like crap all the time..... That's not healthy.. and there's virtually no nutrition in that. It's like the opposite of a healthy diet. Vegetarian or Vegan or Carnivore.. Just because you eat or don't eat meat doesn't mean you are automatically eating healthy. I could eat nothing but fast food for a week and I would feel like shit too. Meat has nothing to do with it.
Water is important too.
I also had a friend that only ate meat and cheese and the occasional bread product i.e taco shells. He is not in good health.
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Shroomism
Space Travellin


Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Re: My opinion on veganism. [Re: Shroomism]
#5446365 - 03/27/06 06:12 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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And for anyone who thinks you can't be a vegetarian and be healthy.. talk to this guy
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OneMoreRobot3021


Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 61,024
Loc: the sky
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You know what I fucking hate about veganism?
The idea of making tofu taste like meat. And calling it tofurkey. Or tofu bacon or whatever.
Just admit it - if you eat that, you WISH you were eating meat!
-------------------- Acid doesn't give you truths; it builds machines that push the envelope of perception. Whatever revelations came to me then have dissolved like skywriting. All I really know is that those few years saddled me with a faith in the redemptive potential of the imagination which, however flat, stale and unprofitable the world seems to me now, I cannot for the life of me shake. -Erik Davis
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Boom
just a tester

Registered: 06/16/04
Posts: 11,252
Loc: Cypress Creek
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Re: My opinion on veganism. [Re: Shroomism]
#5446527 - 03/27/06 07:29 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Is Goldberg really a vegetarian??
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Amber_Glow
Sat Chit Anand

Registered: 09/02/02
Posts: 1,543
Last seen: 10 years, 10 months
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Just because something has been accepted for a long time does not make it right. For a long time we raped, murdered, and enslaved, but we have moved past that.
You say eating meat is so natural. I challenge you to go 'naturally' kill any animal. With your slow legs, your lack of claws, lack of sharp teeth, etc. I suspect you will need something unnatural (a weapon of some sort). Our ape ancestors do not eat meat.
What is our point in existence, but to feed predators? I hope we are overrun by an alien civilization that will enslave and eat us. I hope they eat you first. But that would be OK, right?
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JonnyOnTheSpot
Sober Surfer


Registered: 01/27/02
Posts: 11,527
Loc: North Carolina
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Re: My opinion on veganism. [Re: Amber_Glow]
#5446593 - 03/27/06 08:09 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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fuck the animals. i don't give a fuck.
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CherryBom
Yoga Gypsy


Registered: 12/26/98
Posts: 11,177
Loc: Ontario
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That's a great attitude.
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Mezcal
Registered: 08/11/05
Posts: 1,980
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Re: My opinion on veganism. [Re: trils0n]
#5446658 - 03/27/06 08:39 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
trils0n said: I'm vegan. I like meat, it tastes good. As for the vegans who won't eat meat because they feel bad for the animals or animals deserve equal rights whatever, I think that argument is very strange. I always say don't plants deserve not to be eaten and just left in peace? As far as im concerned a living thing is a living thing. Many vegans seem to be concerned about eating 'natural' and organic foods, but not eating meat is very unnatural, humans always have and will always eat meat.
I don't eat meat because most meat comes from factory farms that cause massive amounts of pollution, not to mention being pumped full of antibiotics and hormones, and thats not something I want my money to support. I don't want to support the burning and clearcutting of rainforests so more cattle can graze so some fatass can get cheap hamburger for 3 cents less.
Word.
I've been vegan over 7 years now and I'm in very good shape. Admittedly, when I got interested in veganism I was hardline for animal rights, but now I believe I "keep it up" more for environmental reasons.
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ToolTroll
tourettic


Registered: 08/02/04
Posts: 2,326
Loc: N. Cack
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Re: My opinion on veganism. [Re: Amber_Glow]
#5446661 - 03/27/06 08:41 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Log in to view attachment
Yeah, I don't really buy into the whole "man has always eaten meat, and animals only purpose is to be our food". BS! We can't go on doing the things we've done for thousands of years, we have to learn and evolve. I don't think it is feasible to completely stop eating meat, but surely we can change the current factory farming system and the unethical, inhumane procedures in place. I am a ovo-lacto vegetarian, I eat cheese and eggs. I have not eaten meat for about six years, and I feel great. I do not eat fast food, I eat very little junk food, mostly grains and pasta and veggies and fruits, nuts and seeds, all the good stuff. I know that meat tastes good, I just choose not to eat it, mostly for ethical reasons. I try not to judge others diets, I don't try to convert the meat-eating fascists (jk). But I would like to see more folks eating less meat and just caring about where their food comes from. That's the main thing: people don't care, as long as it's on sale and packaged in individual servings, ready to be microwaved... Ha! It's a far cry from our meat-eating ancestors who had to organize together in communities to hunt for their existence. Anyway, this is a very heated topic, rightfully so because it's very important. To balance that out, here is a song from Ugly Duckling.
-------------------- "This whole idea that different is bad, that a change in consciousness is in itself harmful, is really one of the fundamental problems inherent in the drug war.” - Rick Doblin my cactus collection You vote with your dollars. Everyday. Vote responsibly.
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mndfreeze 
Shroomery Secret Service



Registered: 04/22/02
Posts: 20,529
Loc: PuppetMasterFlash
Last seen: 12 hours, 15 minutes
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I only eat beetle grubs and bark. MmMmMmm mMmmm good!
-------------------- Nothing says love like grannies prolapsed anus! quote]Urb said: I know... Its fucked up... Ill fix it minyana..[/quote]
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theorganicdomino
Psychedelic ZenBuddhist


Registered: 09/03/04
Posts: 1,855
Loc: Here & Now
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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Re: My opinion on veganism. [Re: mndfreeze]
#5446709 - 03/27/06 09:22 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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As a vegetarian I'm not so bothered about people eating meat as to the fact that so many people have no idea what in fact they are actually eating most of the time - in terms of the growth hormones and other nasties pumped into animals and the amount of additives and refined sugar chucked in their food.
I don't preach though - what's the fucking point! People have to make up their own minds. I chose to be a vegetarian on my own terms and will only give my opinion when asked.
Vegans though - they're fucking nuts!
-------------------- "You've got to get hold of the thread of marching time, pull the fuck thing down, get on the end of it and pang yourself to the infinitude of absolute mind" Ken Campbell - Furtive Nudist "The mystery of life is not a problem to be solved but a reality to be experienced" - Aart van der Leeuw
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Silversoul
Rhizome


Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
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I eat meat, but I've often felt conflicted about whether or not it's right. I do try whenever possible to eat free-range meat rather than meat from factory farms. I've thought about getting into hunting, as it seems a bit more natural and humane than raising some animal in a cramped farm to be slaughtered. And I imagine it's probably healthier.
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Pirate_Patrick
Stranger

Registered: 04/20/05
Posts: 342
Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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Re: My opinion on veganism. [Re: Amber_Glow]
#5447340 - 03/27/06 12:43 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Amber_Glow said: Just because something has been accepted for a long time does not make it right. For a long time we raped, murdered, and enslaved, but we have moved past that.
People in the world still rape, murder and enslave so I would have to say humans have not moved past it. Why do vegan hardliners awesome livestock and other animals have the same rights as human beings?
Quote:
Amber_Glow said: You say eating meat is so natural. I challenge you to go 'naturally' kill any animal. With your slow legs, your lack of claws, lack of sharp teeth, etc. I suspect you will need something unnatural (a weapon of some sort). Our ape ancestors do not eat meat.
Ok. I will go naturally kill an animal. So I will use my highly evolved brain and think of a way to kill an animal. Are you saying it is not natural for a human to think of a tool to help accomplish a goal(such as killing an animal)? Our ape ancestors didn't eat meat, but our humans ancestors did. Humans are in fact predators. You don't feel the same way about other predators do you?
Quote:
Amber_Glow said: What is our point in existence, but to feed predators? I hope we are overrun by an alien civilization that will enslave and eat us. I hope they eat you first. But that would be OK, right?
That's almost like saying you hope a group of {insert race here} overrun the world and enslave us all. Humans are at the top of the food chain, and will continue to be unless challeneged.
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XUL
OTD Janitor


Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 28,261
Loc: America
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
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thats interesting. In health class we are learning how stress is more than just stress, it effects our health. We were talking about how animals are treated, and if the stress effects the quality of the meat, and what happens when we eat meat that came from very stressed out animals.
isnt it like that for chickens or roosters or something? You have to suprise them when you kill them or the meat comes out all black and shitty beacuse they were releasing stress horomones?
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TRUMP 2020
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wery67564
Stranger
Registered: 01/14/06
Posts: 221
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huh, quite interesting view on why or why not be vegan. I myself am vegan and anarchist and tye my vegan moreso to my political principles than to my emotions on a "beast". Note that by anarchy, i refer to small consensus based groups and the removal of a centralized governing force. This in mind, one way i can show i don't approve of the current government is through "veganarchy". By not supporting government based industry, i take out one of the basic pillars of my support for government, this isn't shattering to them in any way, but at least i do something, like grow my own food to some degree than be an idealist without action...nothing wrong with eating meat in my opinion, just i don't do it, nor do i eat dairy, unless they are eggs from mah family farm, fresh free range eggs...mmmhmmm...
**edited to say yes i am fucking nuts, and an idiot too, but look at raw food practitioners...thats pretty extreme, but it works for them..
Edited by wery67564 (03/27/06 12:53 PM)
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Roadkill
Retired Shroomery Mod


Registered: 12/11/01
Posts: 22,674
Loc: Montana
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I have family members that are vegitarians. It's always interesting to me...to see what they are going to be serving. Some dishes they make are pretty good.
I really think it comes down to personal choice. Do what you feel is right for you... and don't judge what other people eat!~
I have always looked at the human race as the worst virus on earth. We destroy everything we get our hands on.
tc
-------------------- Laterz, Road Who the hell you callin crazy? You wouldn't know what crazy was if Charles Manson was eating froot loops on your front porch! Brainiac said: PM the names with on there names, that means they have mushrooms for sale.
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Silversoul
Rhizome


Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
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Re: My opinion on veganism. [Re: Amber_Glow]
#5447461 - 03/27/06 01:10 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Amber_Glow said: You say eating meat is so natural. I challenge you to go 'naturally' kill any animal. With your slow legs, your lack of claws, lack of sharp teeth, etc. I suspect you will need something unnatural (a weapon of some sort). Our ape ancestors do not eat meat.
That's just plain retarded. Asking a human not to use tools is exactly like asking a lion not to use its claws. Our large brains are our main evolutionary adaptation. It's what allowed our hominid ancestors to catch and eat meat in the first place, which in turn furthered the development of our brains via increased protein intake. The fact that you are able to speak this complex language that you use now would not be possible if our ancestors had not eaten meat.
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OneMoreRobot3021


Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 61,024
Loc: the sky
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Re: My opinion on veganism. [Re: Silversoul]
#5447464 - 03/27/06 01:10 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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I like eating cooked cow, a lot.
-------------------- Acid doesn't give you truths; it builds machines that push the envelope of perception. Whatever revelations came to me then have dissolved like skywriting. All I really know is that those few years saddled me with a faith in the redemptive potential of the imagination which, however flat, stale and unprofitable the world seems to me now, I cannot for the life of me shake. -Erik Davis
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Boom
just a tester

Registered: 06/16/04
Posts: 11,252
Loc: Cypress Creek
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Re: My opinion on veganism. [Re: Boom]
#5447486 - 03/27/06 01:13 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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I use my large brain to work, where I recieve money, so I can drive my car (not many animals can do that) to the supermarket. I use the money to purchase the flesh of slaughtered animals. I drive home, and burn it over a fire.
Sounds like evolution worked out for humans! Score!
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