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OfflineJackattack
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Should I do Ayahuasca?
    #5425578 - 03/21/06 02:27 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Ive heard of it's healing properties and now Im interested cause ive beeb really depressed lately and need some kind of relief. I know ayahuasca is intense and im prepared for it.


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OfflineDrone
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: Jackattack]
    #5425753 - 03/21/06 03:10 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

your not supposed to trip if your depressed, it can make it worse.


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OfflineTurricaN
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: Drone]
    #5425772 - 03/21/06 03:14 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I would reccomend against it. Tripping is something that you should do in a positive mindset.


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OfflineschmutzenS
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: Jackattack]
    #5425803 - 03/21/06 03:20 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I am one depressed, pissed off, ornery mofo... tryptamines and exercise are the only two 'moderately' long-lasting forms of relief I get.  I was reading last night that n,n DMT actually creates new serotonin and/or receptors... sorry I don't have a link. 

But seriously, just the preparation for a heavy trip is usually enough to pull me out of my funk.  If you are prepared, I say go for it :grin:


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Offlinestemmer
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: schmutzen]
    #5425967 - 03/21/06 03:54 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Here is a link that should give you some info about what its like for a depressed person to take ayahuasca. It also has info about the studies that show that, unlike the crude medications usually given to those who suffer from depression, this drug can cure depression, or at the least help it along. It also has some info about how ayahuasca is known to actually create more receptors for serotonin uptake.

I would take this article seriously. They are not kidding around when they use the word exorcism

http://www.nationalgeographic.com/adventure/0603/features/peru.html


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OfflineschmutzenS
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: stemmer]
    #5426154 - 03/21/06 04:47 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Thanks :thumbup:


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Invisiblekaniz
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: schmutzen]
    #5426252 - 03/21/06 05:09 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Generally speaking, it is not advised for people with depression or pre-existing medical conditions to take psychedelics for "recreational" reasons - as it may end up digging up a whole lot more shit then what they want to deal with while having a good time.

That being said, if you are approaching it as a healing tool, to resolve issues, and not just looking for a fun time : that is another issue IMO.

I've had people tell me "you shouldn?t be doing LSD, you've had depression and anxiety attacks in the past", but cant help but laugh, as I've found psychedelic use to actually be a help in dealing with these issues.

Point to ponder in the history of LSD:

One of the first uses of LSD, was in testing in psychiatry, and some of the first test-subjects were alcoholics. General consensus today is ?alcoholics shouldn?t be doing LSD, they have other issues to be dealing with?

And hell ? at that time, the doctors were expecting the alcoholics to have ?bad trips? ? they wanted to find a non-lethal way to make them hit rock bottom, and thought that giving them LSD, they would have a bad-trip, hit a ?rock bottom?, then tell them ?If you keep going down this path, that is what your life will be like?

But, surprisingly ? the alcoholics ended up /enjoying/ the experience, and were able to understand the root of their problems, and in the end ? actually had a higher success rate of being cured of alcoholism then AA meetings (something like 50% vs 20%)

The use of psychedelics can lead to a better understanding of yourself, and the root of your problems, and help you find ways of facing these issues and over-coming them. If you are just in it for a ?good time? ? this may be heavier then what you want to deal with. But, if your treating it as a healing tool ? it has a potential to be highly useful.


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Invisiblekaniz
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: kaniz]
    #5426271 - 03/21/06 05:13 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

also, this may be a bit over-board for what you are looking for, but there are places that offer Ayahuasca healing retreats, where you learn alot about the substance and can get guided trips by shamans.

One site that I know of with info is Ayahuasca Healing. This may be something worth looking into for you.

Also, I am sure if you did some digging around, you could possibly find something a bit more traditional and a little less 'touristy' - but just something to consider.


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OfflineJackattack
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: kaniz]
    #5427829 - 03/21/06 10:18 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

kaniz said:
also, this may be a bit over-board for what you are looking for, but there are places that offer Ayahuasca healing retreats, where you learn alot about the substance and can get guided trips by shamans.

One site that I know of with info is Ayahuasca Healing. This may be something worth looking into for you.

Also, I am sure if you did some digging around, you could possibly find something a bit more traditional and a little less 'touristy' - but just something to consider.



Doing an actual ayahuasca ceremony would be amazing but unfortunately I do not have the cash for that. I will be doing this in my room but the bad thing is that I still live with my parents so Ithink Im gonna tell my mom that Im gonna do this so she won't freak out if I end up having a bad trip.


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OfflineJackattack
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: stemmer]
    #5427847 - 03/21/06 10:20 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

stemmer said:
Here is a link that should give you some info about what its like for a depressed person to take ayahuasca. It also has info about the studies that show that, unlike the crude medications usually given to those who suffer from depression, this drug can cure depression, or at the least help it along. It also has some info about how ayahuasca is known to actually create more receptors for serotonin uptake.

I would take this article seriously. They are not kidding around when they use the word exorcism

http://www.nationalgeographic.com/adventure/0603/features/peru.html



Thank You for posting that Im am PUMPED now.


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Offlineastabooty
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: Jackattack]
    #5427924 - 03/21/06 10:33 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

doing it at home with the parents around is a bad idea imo, unless if they are aware that you are tripping and have experience with you tripping.
during my ayahuasca trip i was puking my guts, obviously felt like crap, and was more terrified and confused at points than i have ever been...not saying it was a bad trip tho :wink:


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OfflineJeffersonDarcy
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: astabooty]
    #5427967 - 03/21/06 10:39 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Ok, well smoked nn-DMT has some definate anti-depressant qualities.

I have never done ayahuasca but I would assume it does too.

in general, tripping when you are feeling bad isnt the best idea but IMO DMT is somewhat different from other psychedelics in that its a natural brain chemical.


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OfflineTadpole
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: stemmer]
    #5428720 - 03/22/06 05:26 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)



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Invisiblekaniz
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: Jackattack]
    #5428725 - 03/22/06 05:34 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Jackattack said:
Quote:

kaniz said:
also, this may be a bit over-board for what you are looking for, but there are places that offer Ayahuasca healing retreats, where you learn alot about the substance and can get guided trips by shamans.

One site that I know of with info is Ayahuasca Healing. This may be something worth looking into for you.

Also, I am sure if you did some digging around, you could possibly find something a bit more traditional and a little less 'touristy' - but just something to consider.



Doing an actual ayahuasca ceremony would be amazing but unfortunately I do not have the cash for that. I will be doing this in my room but the bad thing is that I still live with my parents so Ithink Im gonna tell my mom that Im gonna do this so she won't freak out if I end up having a bad trip.




I know what you mean, I'd love to do that also but cant afford it. Think I may do one as a treat to myself once I graduate University.

Although, I would question - is your mom OK with your use of psychedelics? does she know you do them? While I know every parent is different, if I was to tell my mom "I'm doing some Aya", and then explained to her it was a psychedelic expierence, it would probably take ALOT of effort for her to be OK with it - if not impossible.


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OfflineJackattack
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: kaniz]
    #5428769 - 03/22/06 06:27 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

kaniz said:
Quote:

Jackattack said:
Quote:

kaniz said:
also, this may be a bit over-board for what you are looking for, but there are places that offer Ayahuasca healing retreats, where you learn alot about the substance and can get guided trips by shamans.

One site that I know of with info is Ayahuasca Healing. This may be something worth looking into for you.

Also, I am sure if you did some digging around, you could possibly find something a bit more traditional and a little less 'touristy' - but just something to consider.



Doing an actual ayahuasca ceremony would be amazing but unfortunately I do not have the cash for that. I will be doing this in my room but the bad thing is that I still live with my parents so Ithink Im gonna tell my mom that Im gonna do this so she won't freak out if I end up having a bad trip.




I know what you mean, I'd love to do that also but cant afford it. Think I may do one as a treat to myself once I graduate University.

Although, I would question - is your mom OK with your use of psychedelics? does she know you do them? While I know every parent is different, if I was to tell my mom "I'm doing some Aya", and then explained to her it was a psychedelic expierence, it would probably take ALOT of effort for her to be OK with it - if not impossible.



I have no idea to tell you the truth but even if she doesn't Im still doing it anyways.


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Invisiblekaniz
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: Jackattack]
    #5428989 - 03/22/06 08:26 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

You may want to consider not telling her then. Looking from a parents perspective, who has no knowledge of these things, and having their kid come up to them and say

"Mom, I've been feeling depressed lately, and would like to do Aya to help resolve these issues", to them may sound like

"Mom, I'm depressed and starting to do drugs"

And even though that is not the case, if your mom has no idea of these things, and falls into the "all drugs are bad" camp - telling her you are doing this may not be a good idea, as who knows what types of repercussiouns it could lead to. Last thing you want is your mom asking if your doing pot, and other drugs, thinking your an addict and throwing you into rehab - extreme situation and probably wont happen, but it is something to consider.

You may want to consider another option of.

a: Waiting untill your mom will be gone for the entire day, and trip then. If you dont tell your mom, or you do it anyways, and she see's you running to the bathroom and vomiting (which is very common with Aya), she may over-react and try and get you to the hospital. You dont need hospital attention, but she may think that you do - and last thing you want while deep in an Aya trip is your mother hauling you to a hosptial and pumping your stomach.

b: Do you have any friends that you could go over to their place and trip, and have them act as a trip sitter?

One of the most important parts of tripping, and especially if you are trying to do a healing trip - is having a good setting to trip in.

I'm not saying dont do Aya, it could very well be very benifical for you, but you should put some thoughts into the when, and with who you do this with.

Now, who knows - your mom end up being very cool and supportive of it. You know your mom best and will be able to guess her possible reactions more so than me.

I just now from my expierence with my parents, my mother would have my head if she knew I used psychedelics. She freaked out and yelled at my father for having a 6pack in the fridge before.


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OfflineJackattack
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: kaniz]
    #5429425 - 03/22/06 10:49 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Okay thanks for your help I think your right. I have a buddy but he doesn't have his own place. We go camping all the time. Would it be a good idea to do this while camping instead? The only thing im afraid of though is being confronted by a Park Ranger while tripping on ayahausca.


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Invisiblekaniz
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: Jackattack]
    #5429547 - 03/22/06 11:28 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I've never done Aya myself, so my limit of advice can only go so far, as I am unsure of how easy it will be to interact with others while on the trip. Maybe someone who has 1st hand expierence can offer a bit more insight on this one. I know on other substances (LSD, Mush, etc), I could handle it - but every substance is different, and I'm not sure how I'd be able to interact with others if needed while on Aya.

But, some things to keep in mind - in many trip reports I have read, Vomiting, and diarrhea are pretty comming 'purging' stages of the trip - so you may need to find a way of dealing that comfortably while camping, as I am sure running to a porta-potty wont be the most appealing options available.

Also, it would be a very good idea for you (if you havnt already), read up on Aya on erowid - read through the expierences, uses, etc, so you can have some idea of what to expect. And also - get your friend to do the same, so he knows what to expect from you.

Also, he may be able to read up on things of how to help the tripper. I have read various things like Shamans using tobacco smoke and saying certian phrases to help pull people back from bad-expierences that have gotten too intense. Maybe do some reading on the ritualistic use of it - it will be a good source of information and advice.

I have had a strong interest in Aya for awhile now, but have yet to try it - waiting for the right time/setting and sitter to do it with, I wish I could give you some more 1st hand expierence/information to help out, but just relaying some of the infomration I've gathered in my own research.

Just try and prepare well - and best of luck.


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OfflinerDr4g0n
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: kaniz]
    #5429653 - 03/22/06 11:55 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

dude that national geographic story on aya is awesome. im raised christian, and i still believe in jesus and all taht stuff, but i can see how all the other religions are so similar. so many of the things that were mentioned in that story about what the shamans believe and do makes so much sense.


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Invisiblekaniz
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: rDr4g0n]
    #5429688 - 03/22/06 12:06 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Havnt had a chance to read that article yet.
But, I've found that most religions tend to share alot of the same basic ideas and belifs, just with a different cultural lense putting their own spin on them.

I tend to think : I have a belief in something greater than myself, but not a belief in the corruption of man, and sadly ? many religions have fallen victim to the corruption of man and the struggle for power.


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OfflineschmutzenS
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: Jackattack]
    #5429966 - 03/22/06 01:24 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Jackattack said: Would it be a good idea to do this while camping instead? The only thing im afraid of though is being confronted by a Park Ranger while tripping on ayahausca.




I have drank the good tea twice while at a state park.  My opinion is that others campers make good company.  The rangers will circle the grounds, generally to make sure you are registered and to view your picnic table for signs of alcohol consumption.  The rangers in my state have those flashlight/pens that can detect blood alcohol levels within 300ft.

So basically, have rangers confronted you while camping at this place before? Can you camp close enough to the woods that you'd have some privacy to purge? 

There is a very slim chance (in my experience) that you will be coherent enough to speak with law enforcement while in the bardos.  Communication is a foriegn language.  I know this and it is a chance i take, there are other places i could camp, but there are hicks and large animals in my neck of the woods. I would rather take my chances with the rangers and the (relative) safety of a public area, its a trade-off.  Your best bet would be to have your friend remain sane and watch over you, and you in turn can give him/her a watching for the next session.  If you are interested, my journal has two reports, Caapi and Aya.

Let the good times roll :laugh:


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Offlineastabooty
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: schmutzen]
    #5431138 - 03/22/06 05:58 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

speaking isnt the easiest on aya.


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Offlinestemmer
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: astabooty]
    #5431260 - 03/22/06 06:22 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I would follow the dietary and other drug precautions fully.

Beyond that, it should be very difficult experience for the thread maker. If you are depressed, you will have some moments of terror if you take anywhere near the aboriginal dose, wich after much experience with ayahuasca is somewhere around 7 grams of mushrooms but with a kick of magic. (and it feels a like bit above 500 mics of lsd).
If you have anxiety issues start VERY low.

For those who have not tried it and even to those who did not prepare the brew correctly(massive dose of maois are needed), I would say that it is for sure the most intense hallucinogen I will ever know.
It is so very intense, and unlike mushrooms, the amount of visual and cognative disturbance is MUCH higher per unit of physical discomfort. That is why it is so very easy to dose way too high.
To the thread maker: the only way to do it is to do it right. SO read up about it thoroughly, but dont expect the erowid trip reports to give you the right information.

If you are any one bit like the typical westerner and plan to take the aboriginal dose, I would do it at home and have a phone near by.
You will know when you have no more fear, and can walk freely in the beauty of the night without feeling like your about to pass out on the sidewalk. The first time I took a somewhat typical but higher dose, I very easily could have given up too soon and honestly, could have dialed 911 at certain points. I knew I didnt need to do that, the healing power was just so strong that it tore me apart. I reconstituted after that peak and was free to move about during the most intense trip I can even imagine. Pure psychedelic extacy. I went on a 5 hour walk, and discovered that the world had changed for me. I was like a little kid, yet I was ready for any problem that could come at me even in my most distant future, including death.


Edited by stemmer (03/22/06 06:26 PM)


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OfflineJackattack
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: stemmer]
    #5431442 - 03/22/06 07:15 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

At this park I have never had a park ranger confront us except for the mourning after when they came to collect the fees.


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OfflineschmutzenS
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: Jackattack]
    #5431460 - 03/22/06 07:21 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

There is way too much negativity attacthed to the area i live in. being around a lake, or river or just staring into the fire while camping really sets my mind at ease.



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Edited by schmutzen (03/22/06 10:30 PM)


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Offlinestemmer
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: schmutzen]
    #5431781 - 03/22/06 08:48 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

YOu either have not used yage or dont live alone.

Its more serious than some might assume, is all I was saying really.


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OfflineschmutzenS
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: stemmer]
    #5431856 - 03/22/06 09:08 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

No i don't live alone, sorry for not taking things too seriously but my warped sense of humour is what keeps me going.

I honestly was not that frightened from my first MHRB and Rue session, i found it to be a quite pleasant experience, the huge dose of Caapi was terrifying, the latter actually having a complete emotional breakdown (in a good way) i cried for almost three hours - it was the most purifying experience i ever had.

I truely hope JackAttack has an afterglow that lasts many moons, and finds the underlying roots to his depression - and learns healthy ways to cope - if thats what he's looking to find.


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Offlinestemmer
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: schmutzen]
    #5431949 - 03/22/06 09:26 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

"I truely hope JackAttack has an afterglow that lasts many moons, and finds the underlying roots to his depression - and learns healthy ways to cope - if thats what he's looking to find".

Me too


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OfflineImNtCrzy
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: stemmer]
    #5432053 - 03/22/06 09:46 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I have had ayahuausca ( more specifically mimosa-Hausa ) a few times. From my experiences I would recommend you pay particular attention to your diet a few days before and a few days after. Also pay great attention to your journey, treat it with great respect.

One thing I found remarkable about aya that wasn't like any other hallucinogen I have taken is it is so direct-able, more so than L or mushies for sure. The way it seems to work for me is you help it along with intention and actual questions or meditation and the aya helps you go deep into a dream state... I wouldn't go into this expecting a shroom like or L like effect, you won't get it and may not get the full benefits of aya. They say that every time you drink aya you continue your last dream, I have to agree.

All that being said it can be dangerous traipsing around the mind, especially if it is in a vulnerable state. Sure you can not watch your diet have a beer afterwords or anything but I wouldn't. I'm not assuming you are not taking this seriously but especially with healing you must put great intention on your healing, ask the aya a question and listen to your heart.


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InvisibleVirgilKane
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: stemmer]
    #5432168 - 03/22/06 10:15 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Holy CRAP!

The older Shaman Don Julio in the article is the same Shaman that I drank with last July in Peru!!

The movie crew must have done the video later with another Shaman or they just didn't show Julio in the short scene on the NG site.  He's 87 years old and those guys were young.

I didn't go with that outfit though. I went with an individual that lives here in the states that takes a few trips to Iquitos every year to take people to have the Ceremony with Julio. He has drank with Don Julio for over twenty years and is like a part of his Family.  Hell, I can't remember offhand, but he may actually be part of his Family through marriage....

It was basically the same set up though...12 hour ride up the Amazon on a huge Riverboat, 45 mile ride up a smaller River in a Peque-Peque (motorized canoe),swimming with and catching/eating Piranha except we actually went to the village that Julio is originally from and stayed with the remainder of Julio's relatives that still live in the Jungle.  (He now lives in the city due to his age)

Needless to say, the accommodations weren't as posh as the ones described in the article,  :grin: but close (only one real toilet in the whole village and you had to haul you own water up from the River to flush it!) and the trip was astounding none-the-less!  It was the experience of my life!  We gathered the ingredients and sat around with Julio all day as he made the Ayahuasca and then drank that night.  Man, it's dark at night in the Amazon!!

I'm not sure if I should mention the guy's name here so I won't, but he still makes trips yearly and the cost is variable according to where he takes you, what all you do and how long you stay in the Jungle.  Feel free to PM me and I will gladly share with anyone the pertinent info on what was the most amazing experience that I've ever had.  Oh, he's also a professional journalist and has many cool "writings" on his website about his years in the Peruvian Cities/Jungles and his many experiences with Don Julio and The Vine...much like the one in the article in Stemmer's link.

Thanks for that link Stemmer! :thumbup:  You definitely made my day with that!  I'm all wound up to go again this Summer too!

Oh, I definitely wouldn't recommend drinking around anyone unless they are very experienced trippers or have familiarized themselves with the effects of drinking Ayahuasca!  You would probably scare them to death even if you were having a relatively smooth experience.  It can get very strange/scary watching someone go through this if you've never been around it before. Moaning, crying, purging...lifting your arms up to the Heavens in joy and thankfulness....:2cents:

I was "dreaming" for three hours and didn't dare try to stand or walk for an hour after I "woke up" in tears the first night I drank (purged many, many times), but the second night explained my first night's experience and I immediately woke up completely sober with a HUGE smile on my face! (Still didn't attempt walking for a while though!) :grin:  It's was incredible! 

Peace


--------------------
Absense of evidence is not evidence of absense...

"Religion is a defense against a religious experience"
              Carl G. Jung

 
"So really, ordinary reality is a kind of chemical habit, sanctioned by culture, which says it's okay to use certain drugs, eat certain foods, and have certain sexual behaviors. However, when you transcend all this pre-conditioning by returning to the original wisdom of the animal body, then you discover this immense dimension of opportunity. For some people, it is a frightening risk. To me, that's the psychedelic experience."
Terence McKenna


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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: VirgilKane]
    #5432343 - 03/22/06 10:55 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I think that kind of post is what this thread needed most. With a great quote at the end.

So true........

Those shamans know exactly what they are doing(for the most part).
If you want a cure for depression or other mental/physical problems, the shaman has more than a clue as to what dose you need. They also are always there for you when you are in trouble. The typical westerners phone equiped with 911 on speed dial doesnt even compare to the comfort of a shaman with a linguist sitting close to you.

With larger doses im sorry to say for all those looking for a serious legal trip, you need to know exactly what you are doing or you might regret it.
I used it alone for 2 days, (an all out brawl with the psyche). I did think I might die at some points. I, at my core thought I wouldnt come back, but knew what it meant to go so far, and expected to have some incredibly intense and spiritual after effects.
I will never use another hallucinogen again. And for those looking for visuals and a good time, I wouldnt recommend a good full dose of ayahuasca.
It will kick your ass.. The visuals themselves are enough to scare some people silly. If you dont know why you took the drug, you could have a real problem, and it will tell you why.


Edited by stemmer (03/22/06 11:10 PM)


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InvisibleVirgilKane
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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: stemmer]
    #5432468 - 03/22/06 11:26 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I fully agree from personal experience.  I would never do Ayahuasca alone knowing what I know now.  At least not the the Ayahuasca that I drank with the admixtures that were in it, but then again you could probably never get all those specific ingredients in the states anyway.

Here's a list of the ingredients that was in our mixture that was posted by our guide:

For that particular ayahuasca, Julio added Lupuna Negra--he describes it as the tree of light and dark, bringing those things to the mix; two pieces each of cumala and catawa bark, also from the light and dark sides--to help reach depths, and a piece of chuchuwasi, to add humor and a gentle touch to the mix.
Each piece of bark weighed roughly 4 ounces; Julio began with roughly 10 kilograms of cielo caapi and two kilograms of macho psychotria viridis--fresh leaves.
He cooks it down twice, then puts the liquids together and cooks that down until it's ready.



But yes, it fully and completely kicked my ass also!  I completely let go the first night and vowed to pay attention to the Shaman and his Icaro's the second night (that's why he's there!)in an effort to not go back...but somehow I knew that I would.  It was truly uncanny how he seemed to read my thoughts.  As I sat there the second night trying to fight the dreaming, telling myself that this was all in my head and nothing else, he would interject a chuckle in his singing.  I mean he did this exactly when the thought hit my mind...TWICE!!!  I kept telling myself that I would not lie down tonight!!  I would stay sitting upright facing Julio no matter what...shortly afterwards, without warning, I was on my stomach purging beginning my dream.  So much for that tactic!

It was very comforting to know that he was there to guide me and protect me because after all was said and done, some very weird stuff happened in that Jungle that night and it wasn't just in any one persons mind.  We all witnessed these things!  But we all felt safe also because Don Julio was there.

Ayahuasca can take you to some places that I would never want to tread on my own.  Then again, that's just me....YMMV.

I'm just really glad that that chuchuwasi was in there!! (maybe coulda used a little bigger piece though) :grin:


Edited by schapper (03/22/06 11:38 PM)


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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: VirgilKane]
    #5432533 - 03/22/06 11:40 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I have never had much of a feeling of the physical rejection of ayahuasca. I have never puked(once when using caapi, the only time I used caapi). Then again, I have always used the maois and the dmt plants as a process rather than one brew. To avoid sickness involves much knowledge. And to avoid the purge makes it last far longer, although it is quite intense even when you puke it all out after 1.5-2.5 hours worth of having it in your system.


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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: stemmer]
    #5432571 - 03/22/06 11:52 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

One thing that was really odd to me is that I never felt "sick".

The first night when I purged so much it was always in conjunction with a negative vision that would appear and these were all based on my inner feelings/emotions. These would appear and when I could no longer stand them, I would purge and the picture would change. The longer and stronger they stayed, the more I purged.

The second night I never felt it coming at all. It just seemed to happen as a way to get my scared, stubborn ass to lie down and dream!

Shit, I never made it out of "my house" in those sessions...I had too much housecleaning to do to experience what was really "out there"....still do.


--------------------
Absense of evidence is not evidence of absense...

"Religion is a defense against a religious experience"
              Carl G. Jung

 
"So really, ordinary reality is a kind of chemical habit, sanctioned by culture, which says it's okay to use certain drugs, eat certain foods, and have certain sexual behaviors. However, when you transcend all this pre-conditioning by returning to the original wisdom of the animal body, then you discover this immense dimension of opportunity. For some people, it is a frightening risk. To me, that's the psychedelic experience."
Terence McKenna


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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: VirgilKane]
    #5432578 - 03/22/06 11:55 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Thats a good way to explain it. Im sure you knew why you were puking......


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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: stemmer]
    #5432597 - 03/23/06 12:00 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Yeah, I was just hoping that no one else did!

When I woke up I just automatically assumed that everyone who was there knew exactly what I had just experienced...that they had seen all the shit too. It was my whole world during it. Very, very real experience.

Still is a year later.


--------------------
Absense of evidence is not evidence of absense...

"Religion is a defense against a religious experience"
              Carl G. Jung

 
"So really, ordinary reality is a kind of chemical habit, sanctioned by culture, which says it's okay to use certain drugs, eat certain foods, and have certain sexual behaviors. However, when you transcend all this pre-conditioning by returning to the original wisdom of the animal body, then you discover this immense dimension of opportunity. For some people, it is a frightening risk. To me, that's the psychedelic experience."
Terence McKenna


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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: VirgilKane]
    #5432605 - 03/23/06 12:06 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Apparently some people will know. But thats a whole nother story.

Im with you on that one.

The shaman knows more than he eludes to at first. If he takes the drug along with you, it wouldnt be too weird for him to know your reactions, almost perfectly. He might not know the content but he can help you deal with it. What you just said about no-one else knowing is HUGE. Thats where the magic resides. Group thought, universal thought.

Many people firmly believe that the shaman knows more about your trip than seems apparent. When you need help with a higher dose of ayahuasca this can become more than just apparent.


Edited by stemmer (03/23/06 12:09 AM)


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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: kaniz]
    #5432645 - 03/23/06 12:24 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

kaniz said:
But, I've found that most religions tend to share alot of the same basic ideas and belifs, just with a different cultural lense putting their own spin on them.

I tend to think : I have a belief in something greater than myself, but not a belief in the corruption of man, and sadly ? many religions have fallen victim to the corruption of man and the struggle for power.




I honestly could not agree more with you on this.


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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: stemmer]
    #5432674 - 03/23/06 12:34 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

But thats a whole nother story.





LOL! Roger that!

Hell he knew, I could barely look him in the eye the next day!

Although he didn't drink with us, our guide told us that after 50 years of drinking, all Julio had to do now was just get in the vicinity of the vine and he would get drunk from it. He was so old and spoke another language that I couldn't tell the difference, but with him sitting there cooking it all day, he must have been wasted.

I came around the corner of the hut he was staying in shortly after waking up after the first night, looked up, saw him sitting there and almost shit my pants! He knew...

Although, our guide, who did drink and has so for over twenty years and assists in the Ceremony but won't admit it, slipped up when we were talking back in town after the Ceremony. A few of us were in his room doing Sapo and I witnessed him making small sucking motions with his mouth from across the room as someone would go under the effects of the toxin.

I asked him what he was doing and he told me that it helps the person because it clears away the negative things that emerge from the person as they are under. He said "yeah, on that first night when you were having such a hard time I was catching all kinds of shit coming out of you while doing this" I guess he saw a worried look in my eyes and quickly said "I mean I didn't actually see what it was you were going through I could tell that it was some rough shit."

Uh huh, sure.

I didn't believe for one minute that he didn't see what I went through.

Although I was embarrassed, I was sure glad that they were all there working hard to take care of me.


--------------------
Absense of evidence is not evidence of absense...

"Religion is a defense against a religious experience"
              Carl G. Jung

 
"So really, ordinary reality is a kind of chemical habit, sanctioned by culture, which says it's okay to use certain drugs, eat certain foods, and have certain sexual behaviors. However, when you transcend all this pre-conditioning by returning to the original wisdom of the animal body, then you discover this immense dimension of opportunity. For some people, it is a frightening risk. To me, that's the psychedelic experience."
Terence McKenna


Edited by schapper (03/23/06 12:46 AM)


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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: VirgilKane]
    #5433152 - 03/23/06 07:15 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)



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Re: Should I do Ayahuasca? [Re: Hippie3]
    #24454309 - 07/03/17 11:18 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Ayuhuasca is a spritual in peru my friend tried it before
and he said all his depression went away. and the ritual lasted
the whole day.
ayuhuasca ritual



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