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DLittle
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WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean?
#5422285 - 03/20/06 12:25 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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The lsd I have had as only come from only a handful of batches, so i havent necisarrily had the best sampling. But from the many experiences I have had off those few batches I really dont understand what the fuck people are talk about acid being "clean" or the trip being "clean". Correct me if I wrong but I think the only differences between batches is the potentcy, the other variations in the trip come from the user and the environment. I really doubt theres some sort of psychoactive adulterants whether they were put there intentionally or through poor manufacturing. Anyone got any input on this subject?
-------------------- "I used to do drugs. I still do, but I used to also." Mitch Hedburg "Keep on dreamin', cuz when you stop dreamin' it's time to die" Blind Melon
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Kerr
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: DLittle]
#5422292 - 03/20/06 12:27 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Im pretty sure that clean means that is was actually LSD and not some other chemical, rc or what not
-------------------- "Easy going and organic thoughts bent on self experimentation and knowledge and growth for the betterment of self and those around us" -Playdo the philosophiser
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DLittle
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: Kerr]
#5422297 - 03/20/06 12:29 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Possibly when the term is used by some people. But I have often heard it used to compare one acid experience to another.
-------------------- "I used to do drugs. I still do, but I used to also." Mitch Hedburg "Keep on dreamin', cuz when you stop dreamin' it's time to die" Blind Melon
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abrad84
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: DLittle]
#5422302 - 03/20/06 12:30 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Just people fooling themselves.
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Yoschie99
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: DLittle]
#5422304 - 03/20/06 12:31 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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there are different purities of acid..
'clean' acid is just a very distinct feeling, i think... it's hard to describe, as it's describing a trip... it's a nice even come-up, steady peak, even come-down w/ the ability to sleep, imo.
yos-
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DLittle
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: Yoschie99]
#5422330 - 03/20/06 12:38 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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What do you mean by purity? Are you saying that somehow, a batch of lsd being more pure therefore more potent will cause a trip that will be different than if you took and larger amount of an less potent batch but still took the same dose?
-------------------- "I used to do drugs. I still do, but I used to also." Mitch Hedburg "Keep on dreamin', cuz when you stop dreamin' it's time to die" Blind Melon
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Kerr
Who else would I be

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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: DLittle]
#5422344 - 03/20/06 12:42 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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I would think so, I am no chemist but I bet if a step in the process was somehow faulty then the product would infact have a different makeup altogether. Maybe I am just talking outta my ass thought
-------------------- "Easy going and organic thoughts bent on self experimentation and knowledge and growth for the betterment of self and those around us" -Playdo the philosophiser
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kaniz
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: Yoschie99]
#5422345 - 03/20/06 12:42 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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There are different purities to LSD. As with ANY chemical synthesis, nothing is ever 100% (or atleast very rarely), and impurities in the materials, correct excution of various steps, or even the steps in the synthesis (you can take different 'routes' to end up at the end result, and these routes can produce products of varying level of purity - this can happen in any chemical synthesis, and not just LSD).
With LSD, there are (or were) different types of LSD crystal. From the "LSD-Crystal to blotter thread" (link)
Quote:
TYPES OF CRYSTAL Needlepoint-very pure(95%) white powerdery crystal,was available in small amount`s. The best of the best White Fluff-Very pure(95%) white light flakes of crystal. Still around and the most sought after. very pure Silver-Good and clean(85-90%)-light greyish crystal. Was an unbelievable amount of this around in the late eighty`s and early nineties. Very good stuff. My first thumbprint was this kind. If you ate acid in the 80-90`s you probably sampled some silver. Amber-Decent(70%?) This crystal varied from a light amber color to an almost dark brown color.Was always available.One batch called quadricept amber was the color of light honey and was very good.Lot`s a people worked with this crystal but I always would use silver instead since it was better and the same price. Lavender-(60-70%?) light purple to almost black colored crystal. Like amber it varied batch to batch. TJ(tornado juice) - purity unknown. I seen this shit in about four different colors and it always scared me. No experiance with it. Champagne-(50-60%) black crystal, nasty stuff IMHO. I worked with it once and swore to never touch it again.
Now, the purity also effects the dosages. However, what accounts for that other say, 30% of substance from say, an Amber crystal?
While these impurities may not have any direct psychedelic effect on their own - I dont think it'd be too much of a stretch to think that it could impact other parts of the trip.
For example, my last batch of LSD - I am 99.99% sure it was 'real' LSD - but, it did have a bit of an 'edge' to it - it still fit the charactersitcs of an LSD trip in terms of come up, peak duration, come down. However, there was a certian 'something' off about it that I cant quite pinpoint. Its as if it had a sinister edge to it, a bit of a chemical-push.
The most rescent batch of LSD I have, had a VERY different feel. Much cleaner, cleaner visuals, less body sensation, more lucid, more 'organic' feeling - things felt more warm and fuzzy, and not so much 'part of a machine'
While I suppose there /could/ be a chance the last stuff was an RC. The hits were normal sized, no thicker than normal, and you could trip pretty well with just 1.
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Kerr
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: kaniz]
#5422351 - 03/20/06 12:43 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Well there ya go, thanks Kaniz for clearing that up
-------------------- "Easy going and organic thoughts bent on self experimentation and knowledge and growth for the betterment of self and those around us" -Playdo the philosophiser
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DLittle
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: kaniz]
#5422382 - 03/20/06 12:52 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Im still kinda sketchy about this whole thing. I dont see how the purity the crystal or whatever form it is, would affect the experience. LSD is LSD is it not? Don't you think it is much more possible that the variations you all experience come from your selves not the chemical?
-------------------- "I used to do drugs. I still do, but I used to also." Mitch Hedburg "Keep on dreamin', cuz when you stop dreamin' it's time to die" Blind Melon
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badchad
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: DLittle]
#5422410 - 03/20/06 01:00 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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You are correct. "LSD is LSD".
However, if one were to get "white fluff" they would (according to Maniz's post) get something that is made up of 95% LSD, and 5% "other stuff". This "other stuff" could effect the experience.
-------------------- ...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge. It is an indellible experience; it is forever known. I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did. Smith, P. Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27. ...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely. Osmond, H. Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436
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DLittle
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: badchad]
#5422431 - 03/20/06 01:06 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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The only way that "other stuff" would effect the experience is if it were psychoactive. And if it is than what the fuck is it? I would think that after lsd being around for as long as it has if there were active byproducts from its production they would have been identified by now.
-------------------- "I used to do drugs. I still do, but I used to also." Mitch Hedburg "Keep on dreamin', cuz when you stop dreamin' it's time to die" Blind Melon
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kaniz
That one, overthere.


Registered: 07/23/04
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: DLittle]
#5422442 - 03/20/06 01:09 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Every time I've tripped off of a certian batch of LSD. I have had multipul trips from the same batch. If I was tripping from a different batch every time - then yeah, I could see its just 'varations of the expierence comming from myself and not the chemical'.
And, every time I tripped off of that batch - there were certian characterstics present that were not there in other batches.
And, when you give the same batch to other people - they all report some of the same feelings.
And when, I trip from another batch - those 'other' things are no longer there. And again, you give this batch to other people, who also say "Yes, its better/cleaner, lacking in some of the 'edgy' ness of the previous batch" -- I find it hard to come down to 'simply being a product of set/setting'
Yes, the 'main' expereince from batch to batch to batch generally remains the same. It's like adding a spice to soup - it's still soup, still the same basic soup, still has (most) of the same ingredeints, but that bit of 'spice' flavours the trip in a different way.
The soup is the 70%, the spice is the 30% kind of thing.
You are putting chemicals into your body, your body reacts to these chemicals, if the chemical is slightly different (due to impurities, etc) - your body is going to react a bit differently to it.
Or, say take something like meth : there are different 'quality' levels of meth. Not only in it being cut or uncut with other crap, but also how it was made, the quality of the materials used in making it, and the proccess used to make it.
The high from really pure meth, that was made with pharmaceutical-grade materials, made in a clean lab, with proper equipment, and careful steps followed. Is much different then the high from meth that someone brewed in their bathtub on the weekend using over the counter supplies.
Yes, its still meth, it still jacks you up, but and the high is still a meth high. But, one can be a very clean, euphoric, energetic high, while one may just be a very jacked-up speedy/sketchy dirty feeling high.
Now, maybe you've just lucked out and constantly got good high-quality LSD, hell ? maybe its all crystal from the same batch, its just been distributed through a network where it?s landed on different blotters ? but it?s the same crystal on the blotter. Ie: someone made a bunch of crystal, sold/re-distributed it to different people, those people then re-sold it to different people, then eventually it got laid onto different blotter, of which you happened to buy ? but the source crystal was the same.
But, I still do think that the impurities in LSD which can come from poor synthesis, can affect the quality of the trip. Yes, its still very much an LSD expierence - there is no denying that, but just as a meth high can have a 'clean' or a 'dirty' feeling, so can LSD, or any other drug.
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DLittle
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: kaniz]
#5422459 - 03/20/06 01:14 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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You've definatley made some good points. But its still all very unscientific and I am still skeptical. Thanks for the input bro.
-------------------- "I used to do drugs. I still do, but I used to also." Mitch Hedburg "Keep on dreamin', cuz when you stop dreamin' it's time to die" Blind Melon
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abrad84
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: DLittle]
#5422480 - 03/20/06 01:21 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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These impurities would have to be extremely potent to have an effect on your trip. If you have some acid which is 70% pure then on a 100ug blotter you have 30ug of impurities. I fail to see how this could effect your trip (unless you take a massive dose). I honestly think it has more to do with every trip being different anyway due to se and setting etc.
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kaniz
That one, overthere.


Registered: 07/23/04
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: DLittle]
#5422503 - 03/20/06 01:27 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Not a problem. Although, you may want to poke at the TiHKAL entry for LSD. Not sure if it will really help you in your answer - but there is alot of info there on LSD, analogs of LSD, etc.
I dont know enough about chemistry to know if some of those could be side-results of improper synthesis/etc, maybe someone with more chem knowledge could pipe in?
Either way - if a substance is only 60% pure LSD - whats that other 40% made up of? Is it stuff that is similar to LSD (analogs/etc) that could also be active? Is it just other 'crap' which dirties the trip?
While it may not have a psychoactive effect (thus, explaining why the basic parts of the trip are the same), it could have other effects on the mind/body - which can lead to that somewhat intangeble feeling of "You know, it's pretty much the same - but there is a certian something that feels different"
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InTheFlesh714
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: kaniz]
#5422635 - 03/20/06 02:02 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Ah, again a nice legitimate answer from kaniz..
back to the subject, there will be pure LSD-25 in the future, you all can thank me later
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Weeded420
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: InTheFlesh714]
#5422654 - 03/20/06 02:08 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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heres a simple thought...
look how small a dose of acid is, if one small calculation or w/e the fuk is involved in the process of sythesizing it can prolly vary the purity of each batch slightly.
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stemmer
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: Weeded420]
#5423098 - 03/20/06 08:02 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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For the sake of putting this idea to rest, that all lsd is the best lsd, or nothing/something else entirely...........
All the discussion I have seen about psychoactive by-products and residues in blotters has focused on known such known products as the 4 isomers of LSD, variations on the anide group, known lysergic amines, etc. The information about these chemicals appears to be based on assays of extraction and synthesis products based on high-quality processes using materials and reagents of pharmaceutical quality. What goes on in illicit drug labs may be an entirely different story. Question: What happens when you substitute the hydrogens on any of the various positions of the lysergic backbone with some other element or compound? How do differences in saturation affect its qualities? If the base molecule is LSD it may still have very high potency, but qualitatively very different (eg: muddled) effects. The mechanism by which LSD alters consciousness is not understood. The fact that only 0.001% of a dose crosses the blood-brain barrier, and it leaves the brain within an hour suggests that it's mechanism of action is very different from most drugs, so generalizations about purity/quality based on other drugs should be used with caution. Perhaps there are phenomena of synchronization, synergy, or resonance in the neural response patterns to LSD that are disrupted or muted by the presence of variants of LSD at LSD receptors (if they exist). We simply don't know, and to pretend we can speak with certainty about such things is to indulge in hubris.
2. The analysis results in lsd.data proves that the vast majority of alleged LSD samples analyzed in 1973 and 1974 tested positive for LSD, and did not test positive for whatever other drugs they were testing for. Relevant questions include: How selective were the LSD identification tests used? and How many other drugs were tested for? In any case, based on numerous reports, I believe most of the acid available during those years was of high quality and was similar if not identical to LSD-25. The consistency of quality didn't start to plummet until the mid-1970s, due in part to restricted availability of chemicals required for synthesis.
SO there could be unwanted lysergic amines in your acid(some of which are biproducts and are very potent unlike the lsa's found in morning glories), or the actual moleculare body of lsd-25 can be altered. That or it could have a small amount of amphetamines, or more likely pcp. Which even in the 70's was not common, but still a reality.
Im sorry to say, all those who seem enthused to inform us all that lsd-25 is lsd-25 or it is something else entirely, you are very wrong. I knew how much certain types of acid reminded me of LSA's before I ever knew why.
Basically anyone who thinks that lsd-25 is either real acid or something else, has no idea what they are talking about.
There Are some links I hope to find and put this silly idea that all "lsd" is the best lsd, to rest.
Even in the 70's it was well documented that there are a variety of synths, many of which were easier to produce that make it into the hands of users. Im just going to go try to find the link that names off about 40 LSD-25-like molecules that have similare actions on the mind, and are as potent or are almost as potent.
A favorite of these drugs was ALD-25 even back in the day. Its a bit like a short cut in the synthesis. Many of these altered versions of lsd could very well be unintentional for a variety of reasons. I think it was leary said it best in his later years. Ill try to find that link too.
Edited by stemmer (03/20/06 08:13 PM)
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kaniz
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Re: WTF is "clean" acid supose to mean? [Re: stemmer]
#5423219 - 03/20/06 08:25 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Stemmer, alot of good info in that post.
However, do you mean ALD-25, or ALD-52? Never heard of ALD-25 before, but have heard of ALD-52.
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