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Offlineunbeliever
Yo Daddy!
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Registered: 05/22/04
Posts: 5,158
Loc: Gallifrey
Last seen: 15 years, 21 days
Re: Should we eliminate the president? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #5418401 - 03/19/06 10:54 AM (18 years, 14 days ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Why would you deny the people the right to choose their representatives? That is what term limits do, you know. If you don't think NYC would have been more than happy to keep voting Rudy in you're crazy. But they weren't given the choice. Term limits are anti-democratic.




Getting rid of lobbying entirely, including all corporate campaign donations, would go a long way to making the system more trustworthy. At which point less restrictions on term limits would be acceptable.


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Happiness is a warm gun...

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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 9 months
Re: Should we eliminate the president? [Re: unbeliever]
    #5419328 - 03/19/06 04:36 PM (18 years, 14 days ago)

Why would you want to restrict the right of the people to petition their representatives to enact laws to their benefit? Keep in mind that corporations are owned by......people. Not all lobbying is bribery. Neither is contributing to the campaign fund of people who will represent your interests.


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Invisiblespock
journeyman
Registered: 08/26/03
Posts: 1,165
Re: Should we eliminate the president? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #5419889 - 03/19/06 06:52 PM (18 years, 14 days ago)

the corporations are owned by people sure. those people are a very small minority of people. the money used to petition their representatives to enact laws to their benefit is a majority.

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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 9 months
Re: Should we eliminate the president? [Re: spock]
    #5419912 - 03/19/06 06:58 PM (18 years, 14 days ago)

The largest participants in the ownership of public corporations are working people's pension funds.


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Invisiblespock
journeyman
Registered: 08/26/03
Posts: 1,165
Re: Should we eliminate the president? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #5419971 - 03/19/06 07:13 PM (18 years, 14 days ago)

but who "manages" those funds.
the working people who's money that is are not the ones lobbying.

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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 9 months
Re: Should we eliminate the president? [Re: spock]
    #5420085 - 03/19/06 07:56 PM (18 years, 14 days ago)

One should hope not


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Offlineunbeliever
Yo Daddy!
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Posts: 5,158
Loc: Gallifrey
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Re: Should we eliminate the president? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #5420130 - 03/19/06 08:08 PM (18 years, 14 days ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Why would you want to restrict the right of the people to petition their representatives to enact laws to their benefit?  Keep in mind that corporations are owned by......people.  Not all lobbying is bribery.  Neither is contributing to the campaign fund of people who will represent your interests.




Well I happen to think that granting corporations the rights of a citizen might not have been a good idea.. unless they also could get the death penalty.  :laugh:

But really there is just too much disparity in representation between multinational conglomerates and... me.. or you. Corporations should not be able to lobby. If those people you mention who own the company want to petition, they should be kept to the same level of involvement the average citizen is. Writing letters, creating petitions, voting, maybe trying to organize an interview or meeting them at public events. And etc.

Corporations sending congress critters on free cruises is not in the country's best interest.


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Invisiblenewuser1492
Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 3,104
Re: Should we eliminate the president? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #5420393 - 03/19/06 09:12 PM (18 years, 14 days ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Why would you want to restrict the right of the people to petition their representatives to enact laws to their benefit? Keep in mind that corporations are owned by......people. Not all lobbying is bribery. Neither is contributing to the campaign fund of people who will represent your interests.




Corporations are owned by people but they are not in and of themselves people. A corporation receives the rights of personhood yet few or non of its responsibilities. I have no problem with Corporate lobbying if all corporate welfare is eliminated along with damn near all government restrictions on private commerce.

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Offlinemack_tasticlies
Stranger
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Registered: 02/25/06
Posts: 167
Last seen: 16 years, 6 months
Re: Should we eliminate the president? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #5422202 - 03/20/06 12:03 PM (18 years, 13 days ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Yeah, yeah, yeah (watches Paradigm stroke his......chin). But it does have elected representatives chosen by the people and they should be able to choose pretty much anyone qualified for the job. One thing that should not disqualify someone is previous experience holding the job. Vote 'em in or vote 'em out. Or convict 'em. Prior experience should not be a bar to office holding. Now, if you want to talk term limits for appointees, that's a different pony.




I agree, appointees in particular should be susceptible to rerm limits. Things Like supreme court nominees and judges should definately be voted on. That is the problem with a representational democracy. Our elceted representatives make our decisions for us, only aswering to the various polls and collected ballots come election time.


It seems right to me that if a man or woman runs things right they should be allowed to remain in office as long as the people choose to leave them there.

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InvisibleJonnyOnTheSpot
Sober Surfer
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Registered: 01/27/02
Posts: 11,527
Loc: North Carolina
Re: Should we eliminate the president? [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #5435197 - 03/23/06 05:03 PM (18 years, 10 days ago)

can you imagine how many more people would lose interest in politics without their singing dancing be-all end-all king figure? an average person would lose all interest in the whole process. hmm, that could be a good thing though.

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OfflineMirth
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Registered: 03/04/05
Posts: 334
Last seen: 13 years, 9 months
Re: Should we eliminate the president? [Re: JonnyOnTheSpot]
    #5436113 - 03/23/06 09:53 PM (18 years, 10 days ago)

'My fellow Amphibians. I want to thank you for voting me in as your Steradent for a second worm in office. For that I will be eternally grapefruit. I sit before you to let you know that I have oblitified the Demogorgon John Sherry, and me and my fellow neo-contortionists can do whatever we like....and we intend to. You have given your Decadent a mandible. We lubricated the Girraffi people by turning that country into a cemetery. We rid Afpakistan of Ossama John Lennon, dealt with Colonic Gaddaffi, and we will now lubricate their next door neighbours, West Korean, a country run by the evil Darth Vader."


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The ineffable is not always intangible !

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