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thedudenj
Man of the Woods

Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 14,684
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: DrJ]
#5396634 - 03/13/06 08:58 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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well in dmt extraction the whole thing is DMT freezes and naptha doesnt so they are easy to seperate
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  "You all are just puppets... You have no heart...and cannot feel any pain..."" you may think thats pain you feel but you must have a heart to feel true pain and that pain wont be yours
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Koala Koolio
TTAGGGTTAGGGTTAGGGTTAGGG

Registered: 01/07/04
Posts: 7,752
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: thedudenj]
#5396784 - 03/13/06 09:35 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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*water freezes
It's useful for either. You either want to save the one that freezes, or toss it.
-------------------- You're not like the others. You like the same things I do. Wax paper, boiled football leather... dog breath. We're not hitch-hiking anymore, we're riding!
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Konnrade
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Registered: 09/13/05
Posts: 13,833
Loc: LA Suburbs
Last seen: 8 months, 26 days
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: DrJ]
#5397073 - 03/13/06 10:47 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
DrJ said: Thx. Have a supplier for pure benezene (toulene). He's just being a bit slow at the mo. Think i'll wait and get pure stuff. Just make some resin for now. UK people search in scottland for suppliers (hint,hint) they have different laws to uk and they dont have to ship by air (which is illegal apperently). Thanks for the help guys. Good trips to all.
Dr. J
Benzene is not toluene. Benzene is a cyclic hydrocarbon that also happens to be a potent carcinogen. Benzene is something you want to avoid at all points during your lifetime, if reasonably possible. If you're exposed to a decent quantitiy of benzene, it is very likely to give you cancer.
This is benzene:
this is toluene compared to benzene:
While the toluene clearly contains what is referred to as a "benzene ring", it is nonetheless a completely different chemical. The two should not be confused.
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I find your lack of faith disturbing
Edited by Konnrade (03/14/06 09:16 AM)
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thedudenj
Man of the Woods

Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 14,684
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: Konnrade]
#5398100 - 03/14/06 08:00 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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hmm going back would xylene work for DXM extraction in place of naptha. and what else can toluene be used for is that better for extractions im still pretty new to extractions
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  "You all are just puppets... You have no heart...and cannot feel any pain..."" you may think thats pain you feel but you must have a heart to feel true pain and that pain wont be yours
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Konnrade
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Registered: 09/13/05
Posts: 13,833
Loc: LA Suburbs
Last seen: 8 months, 26 days
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: thedudenj]
#5398184 - 03/14/06 08:47 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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toluene is preferrable to xylene, it's just that xylene is easier to procure. Toluene is an ingredient in TNT, which is one reason to make it harder to get. Also, xylene evaporates more slowly, which for many hardware-type uses makes it preferrable. The two are very similar. In fact my can of xylene says bluntly that it is "similar to toluene" but that it evaporates more slowly.
If you can find toluene, use it. It serves the same purpose but is reported to be better, and I beleive that.
Naptha isn't any one specific substance, however. Like many petroleum distillates it's a mixture of a lot of chemicals. As a result, I really don't have the time to figure out on my own whether toluene would be an acceptible replacement for it. I'm sure somebody can share information about that question based upon experience, however.
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I find your lack of faith disturbing
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,795
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: Konnrade]
#5398242 - 03/14/06 09:12 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Oopsie 
Konnrade, your molecule depicts Styrene, not Toluene.
C6H6 = Benzene C6H5-CH3 = Toluene C6H4(CH3)2 = Xylene C6H5-CH=CH2 = Styrene
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
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Konnrade
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Registered: 09/13/05
Posts: 13,833
Loc: LA Suburbs
Last seen: 8 months, 26 days
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: Asante]
#5398246 - 03/14/06 09:14 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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God damnit... now I knew it was a bad idea to just rely on a google image search, but I did it anyways. Shame on my lazy self 
I'll fix that post up with a proper image. The new image should be right, as long as the person whom I ninja-hotlinked it from wasn't talking out of their ass.
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I find your lack of faith disturbing
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DrJ
Shaman


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 413
Loc: Celtic Isles
Last seen: 16 years, 24 days
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: Konnrade]
#5398287 - 03/14/06 09:28 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Just woke up...glad to see the debate continues. Yes i know how dangerous Toulene is but i have safety equipment. I just worry about purity of Commerical grade chemicals (as opposed to Lab Grade). And what those impuritys mean for the final product ie. quality/safety. I currently use for safety :- Mask, gloves, saftey glasses, lab coats, extractor hood, and for really fummy stages in the extraction WW2 gas masks!!! lol Does anyone have any better suggestions?
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   "Worse?? Or Better?!"
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DrJ
Shaman


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 413
Loc: Celtic Isles
Last seen: 16 years, 24 days
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: thedudenj]
#5398307 - 03/14/06 09:35 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Yea u can wash with water, ammonia, acteone or ether all have advantages and disadvantages (ie. ether is uber flammable for example but evaporates very fast)(but can be easily obtained from a can of starter fuel)
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   "Worse?? Or Better?!"
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Konnrade
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Registered: 09/13/05
Posts: 13,833
Loc: LA Suburbs
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: DrJ]
#5398370 - 03/14/06 09:53 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
DrJ said: Just woke up...glad to see the debate continues. Yes i know how dangerous Toulene is but i have safety equipment. I just worry about purity of Commerical grade chemicals (as opposed to Lab Grade). And what those impuritys mean for the final product ie. quality/safety. I currently use for safety :- Mask, gloves, saftey glasses, lab coats, extractor hood, and for really fummy stages in the extraction WW2 gas masks!!! lol Does anyone have any better suggestions?
you use a WWII gas mask? If I may be so selfish as to ask, did it come with the carrying bag? because the bags used for british WWII gas masks happen to be what Indiana Jones' bag was made out of. I've been itching to get ahold of one, for costume purposes.
On a safety note, did you check ALL of the rubber parts of the mask? On stuff that old, rubber parts can dry rot, which makes them break down.
Come to think of it... where did you get the gas mask? I want one!
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I find your lack of faith disturbing
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DrJ
Shaman


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 413
Loc: Celtic Isles
Last seen: 16 years, 24 days
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: Konnrade]
#5398478 - 03/14/06 10:16 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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LOL...no it didn't come with bag, but i got it from army surplus store and shall go check there for you. I know the bag you mean as am big Dr Jones fam myself! I shall find cost for you asap.
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   "Worse?? Or Better?!"
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Konnrade
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Registered: 09/13/05
Posts: 13,833
Loc: LA Suburbs
Last seen: 8 months, 26 days
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: DrJ]
#5398482 - 03/14/06 10:18 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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I bet they're still pricey, being a collectible.
But damn... it would be cool to have one!
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I find your lack of faith disturbing
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DrJ
Shaman


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 413
Loc: Celtic Isles
Last seen: 16 years, 24 days
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: Konnrade]
#5398493 - 03/14/06 10:23 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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lol.yea. Mask cost only ?45 though.
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   "Worse?? Or Better?!"
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DrJ
Shaman


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 413
Loc: Celtic Isles
Last seen: 16 years, 24 days
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: DrJ]
#5398498 - 03/14/06 10:25 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Make me look quite scary though...can you imagine, me flask in hand, wearing lab coat, gloves and gas mask?! Dr Frankinstein!! lol
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   "Worse?? Or Better?!"
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Konnrade
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Registered: 09/13/05
Posts: 13,833
Loc: LA Suburbs
Last seen: 8 months, 26 days
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: DrJ]
#5398542 - 03/14/06 10:40 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Sounds more like a Chemical Ali to me!
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I find your lack of faith disturbing
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DrJ
Shaman


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 413
Loc: Celtic Isles
Last seen: 16 years, 24 days
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: Konnrade]
#5398567 - 03/14/06 10:46 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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How much are masks there? I imagine they cost more. Here everyones grand dad has one in they're attic!!! Well not quite, but they're not hard to come by. Obviuosly, you can count yourself lucky to find a functional one. I only got it cos it was cheaper than other options...still i worry about safety. Does anyone know of a cheap modern alternative that will protect me against Toluene fumes please?
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   "Worse?? Or Better?!"
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Konnrade
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Registered: 09/13/05
Posts: 13,833
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: DrJ]
#5398593 - 03/14/06 10:52 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Hardware stores carry what is called a "halfmask".
They usually cost about $30 to $40 US.
I doubt the standard filters would do anything about fumes, though. The best option is always good ventilation. I'd say just work outside if you're concerned about fumes.
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I find your lack of faith disturbing
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DrJ
Shaman


Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 413
Loc: Celtic Isles
Last seen: 16 years, 24 days
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: Konnrade]
#5398610 - 03/14/06 10:55 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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yea, i got extractor hood and open windows, i also only cook at night (midnight onwards) to attact as little attention as possible, then by morning its as if nothing happened! hehe
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   "Worse?? Or Better?!"
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Konnrade
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Registered: 09/13/05
Posts: 13,833
Loc: LA Suburbs
Last seen: 8 months, 26 days
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: DrJ]
#5398625 - 03/14/06 11:00 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Well as long as your ventilation is good then your worries are minimal. And as long as your gas mask doesn't have dry rot it should still function. There are plenty of old german submarine rebreathers that are still in working condition. Check the rubber, if it seems cracked or powdery, apply a thin layer of mineral oil to it. That should help supple it back up and extend it's life.
BTW, a rebreather is the choice option for fumes. Vapors are dissolved in air, so are hard to scrub out of it. A rebreather is a closed system, you don't even inhale out of the local atmosphere. Rebreathers are expensive though. You really do not need one unless you plan on being in serious hazmat conditions. I only mention it as a nifty FYI sort of thing.
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I find your lack of faith disturbing
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Konnrade
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Registered: 09/13/05
Posts: 13,833
Loc: LA Suburbs
Last seen: 8 months, 26 days
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Re: Is zippo lighter fuel an acceptable substitue for Toulene? [Re: Konnrade]
#5398636 - 03/14/06 11:02 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Whoops, wierd double post
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I find your lack of faith disturbing
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