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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Registered: 06/15/02
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Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve
    #5375556 - 03/07/06 07:10 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

It seems as if everybody I see that engages in debate or that has a strong opinion about something cherrypicks. They cherrypick their statistics and they conveniently ignore any fact or line of thinking that contradicts their point of view.

They also seize upon certain things in an attempt to reinforce their opinions (all the while conveniently ignoring the larger picture). For example, when Hurricane Katrina hit New Orleans ideologues of every stripe came out of the woodwork. The "civil-rights" leaders bitched about how the government didn't care about black people. The racists screamed about how terrible black people acted. The pro-big government people bitched about how the government wasn't big enough to handle the problem. The pro-small government people yelled about how inept the government was and therefore government is not the answer to all problems. And on and on...

Is it just a truism that most people people become set in their ways and are unable to think open-mindedly and critically? Do all of us people who like to think about stuff start to sound like broken records after a while?


Edited by RandalFlagg (03/07/06 07:12 PM)


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InvisibleFreeker
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Registered: 02/09/05
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Re: Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5375653 - 03/07/06 07:51 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Uh.. I was always under the impression that cherrypicking was taking a quick easy shot. For example someone standing under the net in a basketball game tipping in all those easy shots. Or someone in a multiplayer game killing off two players who are engaged in combat. :lol:

As for the post, I have to agree that too many people think close mindedly about so many things. That their affiliations and agendas force them to take a more biased look at it. Of course there are also many people, the englightened, who will always be looking at things from all angles; examining the core without pretense or bias. But I think we are all guilty of it at sometimes. In response to Hurricane Katrina, I think the government is more then qualified to handle situations like this, but that they ignored/dismissed the situation and did not evacuate the city or stay nearby the city to help directly after the disaster. Whether their reason to have handled this situation so irresponsibly is beyond me. Some will say they don't like blacks, but anyone who has been to NO knows its way more then african americans. Was it irresponsibilty? Did they honestly not know? Are they so broke because of this war? Hell if I know  :hehehe:


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Registered: 01/01/05
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Re: Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5375747 - 03/07/06 08:20 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I found myself doing this a lot when I was a libertarian. I would look at some area the government was inept, and act like it proved that all government is inept. Then I learned that the world is a complex place.


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InvisibleDieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
Re: Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve [Re: Silversoul]
    #5375831 - 03/07/06 08:47 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Paradigm said:Then I learned that the world is a complex place.


What caused this change of belief?


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve [Re: DieCommie]
    #5376052 - 03/07/06 10:01 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

DieCommie said:
Quote:

Paradigm said:Then I learned that the world is a complex place.


What caused this change of belief?



Nothing in particular. It was just sort of a gradual realization.


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OfflineLearyfanS
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Re: Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5376060 - 03/07/06 10:03 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I thought this was going to be about basketball. I was with you all the way on that one.

But in reference to the actual subject matter, I'm not offended by it. Everyone sees events from their own point of view.







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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve [Re: Learyfan]
    #5376301 - 03/07/06 11:27 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

I thought this was going to be about basketball. I was with you all the way on that one.




:lol: :thumbup:


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Offlineunbeliever
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Registered: 05/22/04
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Re: Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve [Re: Redstorm]
    #5379072 - 03/08/06 08:09 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I think one reason people may tend to "cherry pick" (or straw man) is because of the medium. While better than just irc or even casual in-person conversation, where facts are generally not immediately at hand, forums are still limited. One simply can not put down a full dissertation in every post and reply.

That said it's usually just because people want to believe in something. Sometimes it's god, sometimes it's a political belief. Sometimes it's as simple as just being right. Scoring a point and thinking they've "won" a conversation is a means to that end.

It's annoying and somewhat indicative of the poster's self-esteem, among other issues.. but there are worse things.


--------------------
Happiness is a warm gun...


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Registered: 06/15/02
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Re: Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve [Re: unbeliever]
    #5382209 - 03/09/06 05:16 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

unbeliever said:
I think one reason people may tend to "cherry pick" (or straw man) is because of the medium.




Cherry-picking and the "straw man" tactic are not the same thing. Although, I have seen them intertwined in arguments before.

Quote:

unbeliever said:
That said it's usually just because people want to believe in something. Sometimes it's god, sometimes it's a political belief. Sometimes it's as simple as just being right. Scoring a point and thinking they've "won" a conversation is a means to that end.




Bingo.


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Offlined33p
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Re: Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve [Re: Silversoul]
    #5382233 - 03/09/06 05:22 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Paradigm said:
I found myself doing this a lot when I was a libertarian. I would look at some area the government was inept, and act like it proved that all government is inept. Then I learned that the world is a complex place.




Im just curious, what do you consider yourself now? Confused lol?

And yea i try to not cherry pick because i grew to hate having to use it in debates even though to prepare you had to do it for both sides. I really loathe the actual sport of debating.

But id say cherry picking is probably the most common intellectually dishonest practice.


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I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve [Re: d33p]
    #5382242 - 03/09/06 05:24 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Im just curious, what do you consider yourself now? Confused lol?



The closest term would be "centrist" or "third way," but neither of them are really accurate.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve [Re: Silversoul]
    #5382262 - 03/09/06 05:28 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

"Third Way"? I have never heard of that label.


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Offlined33p
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Registered: 07/12/03
Posts: 5,381
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Re: Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve [Re: Silversoul]
    #5382265 - 03/09/06 05:28 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Paradigm said:
Quote:

Im just curious, what do you consider yourself now? Confused lol?



The closest term would be "centrist" or "third way," but neither of them are really accurate.




Yea, from what i know of you, that doesn't fit at all at least in the traditional sense of the words. If i had to guess I'd say libertarian realist.


--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5382316 - 03/09/06 05:43 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

RandalFlagg said:
"Third Way"? I have never heard of that label.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_way_%28centrism%29


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InvisibleRogues_Pierre
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Registered: 03/03/06
Posts: 99
Re: Cherrypicking: My latest pet-peeve [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #5384546 - 03/10/06 06:54 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

RandalFlagg said:
It seems as if everybody I see that engages in debate or that has a strong opinion about something cherrypicks. They cherrypick their statistics and they conveniently ignore any fact or line of thinking that contradicts their point of view.

They also seize upon certain things in an attempt to reinforce their opinions (all the while conveniently ignoring the larger picture). For example, when Hurricane Katrina hit New Orleans ideologues of every stripe came out of the woodwork. The "civil-rights" leaders bitched about how the government didn't care about black people. The racists screamed about how terrible black people acted. The pro-big government people bitched about how the government wasn't big enough to handle the problem. The pro-small government people yelled about how inept the government was and therefore government is not the answer to all problems. And on and on...

Is it just a truism that most people people become set in their ways and are unable to think open-mindedly and critically? Do all of us people who like to think about stuff start to sound like broken records after a while?




That's more true in this forum than any other forum I've seen on the internet.


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